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Sometimes I just get the feeling that some matches allready have their ending before it even starts and i dont mean that xvm says for example 2% win chance. Im talking about that u often cant win a battle which should be won easy. In such cases u hit nothing with arty u bounce ore suddenly dont deal dmg to some enemys but they hit and pen with every shot. Happend to often to me that when it comes to the fight between the last 6 survivors the fight doesnt depend of skill but of the ending which already planed from the beginning. Suddenly enemy arty onehits one guy then Im not able to take out an IS8 with my elite t95 with the help of an jgtiger and Im not bad i guess I know where to shoot. But this is really weird and it happens quite often. Had anyone the same experience ore was it bad luck?

It's normal. You see, matchmaker and dicerolls are fully controlled by a group of Korean talented people working for WG to make sure you get either a great or frustrating experiences depending on their mood. Next time you have a weird situation try cursing these guys in chat, if they see you found out their secret they might leave you alone... for some time

Yeah i knew it i admit i was sometimes on the good side as well and I was just wondering how this can happen im hiding in bush with mile48 100 meters away with no camo skills and make 4 kills as last one standing without being spotted just rediclious whazs going on sometimes

Random is as random does.

With the last patches Wg has made this game more and more a game of luck than skill.

0 crits, inaccuracy of arty, shots that should kill but leave enemy with 6 to 12 HP, spaced armor, tier 10 guns dinging twice in a row in the rear of tier 5 lights, getting set on fire while being hit in the turret and all the random things I forgot.

By now winning is more luck than skill.
The team that has the least misfortune at the critical moments wins.

 brick128, on 30 August 2012 - 02:05 AM, said:

and thats what they said after the last patches -.-"
come on, 0% hits can be explained often (spaced armor or modules soaking up dmg etc.) and the inaccurary of arty did not change
yes, after the patch witch the new crew perks (i dont know which one it was) those nearly kills increased but i have the feeling that it just feels like they increased because with that patch they included their own OTM so you always see it. i have no real data from that time so i cant tell.

its not all about luck or misfortune otherwise there wouldnt be players with high win percentages.

 brick128, on 30 August 2012 - 02:05 AM, said:

Honestly wrong. Skill plays far more than luck in this game. The thing is, in order to miss a precise shot you need to get it aimed, in order to get penetrated while fully angled in a weird way you need to angle, in order to get bad luck you expect more from yourself in the first place. Do you get what I mean?

The more skill you have, the more luck based this game becomes for you. A bad player will never be "lucky" nor "unlucky", he will just play bad. Get bad spots, aim poorly, position himself poorly, make bad decisions. If you play very well, you get pissed off by the inconsistencies you encounter in the game (0% dmg crits, random occuriencies you'd never expect).

This game is very luck based for skilled people, but skill is very necessary to win. In a competetive play, like CW, where only skilled people play I will agree with you, luck is everything. In randoms however, only skill will get you high.

it's true, sometimes it's more skill, sometimes it's just dumb luck. Game has many inconsistencies which are insanely frustrating but most of the time, i kinda know what to expect

In everything there is an element of luck and element of skill but stupidity is universal.
The one major change thta is affecting the game is the fast progression of new players to higher tiers before they learn how to play well.  Too often mm will put you with a group of inexperienced players who cannot work well as a team and makes stupid decisions i.e. allowing a teammate to be attacked by 3 enemy whilst hiding in a bush or behind a building scared to get involved or not attacking or defending together.
This more than any other factor governs the win or loss outcome of a game.  This coupled with far more gold tanks in matches also increases the randomness of a strong or weak team.  This is not knocking gold tank drivers (as i have some myself for credit farming but my first was after 4,000 battles) but at present you may get a new gold driver with 100 battles or a veteran depending upon mm luck (often with a big influence on result)

If the game was purely luck based as some people think, why in the hell some individuals can achieve more than the "average"? Purely luck based is pretty much rolling a dice: no skill involved, only hope. It's different in this game, you need to know where to go, think and be precise. You basically notice how screwed the game is when you know how to play. It's like tic tac toe: if you play it the first time it looks interesting and competetive but once you understand how it goes you realize it only has couple patterns and you can easily always draw thus it becomes less interesting and you notice the flaws going with it.
Edited by Grabarz19_PL, 30 August 2012 - 03:42 AM.

Most people with high above average stats mostly play random battles in platoons.

And we all know that a platoon greatly increases your win chance, at least if they are skilled.
Almost always will win from three random equally skilled players.

Good communication is everything in this game, and a shitload of luck.

Bon problème arty bizarre.
Suis sur carte  un  peut dangereuse pour les arty me positionne en ville je tire un obus crack me prends un contre arty derrière le bâtiment alors que les tank son devant moi.
bon je veux bien il avez penser que je serais dans cette zone!
Me déplace de 100m a 150 m tire un obus re contre arty dead.
on étais que 2 arty lui et moi.
Ca sens DAR a point nommer! l'adons qui te spot quand tu tire arty mais la plus vicieux car a chaque tire tu prends du contre arty.
Autre chose quelqu'un peut m'expliquer pourquoi mon 12.8 mm du ferdinand ne perce pas un tigre de face a 150m alors que mon 88/71 de mon vk perce a tous les coup.
Pourquoi mon 88/71 de mon vk 4502a ne perce pas le e50m 7 tir on na pas perce le blindage essaye plaque basse,plaque frontale,tourelle!!
Je fais quoi je lui jette des cailloux!!
Pourquoi depuis la mise a jour le 12.8 avec 244 de pénétration ne perce plus le blindage supérieur a 180 mm sauf a bout portant.
Pourquoi depuis la mise a jour mes tiers VIII ne rencontre plus que des tiers IX ou X les seul inférieur sont les arty gwtiger gxpanther ob212 pour les nommer.
Pourquoi le 88/71 de mon tiers VIII et plus puissant que ce celui de mon tiers VII.
Pourquoi mon 12.8 ne fait que 300 de dégat a 400 en moyenne sur un amx13/75.
Pourquoi le fouloir de mon 88/71 et plus rapide sur un tiers VII que sur mon tiers VIII
Pourquoi mon 12.8 ne perce pas le jagdtiger  8.8 en plaque frontale mais perce le jadgtiger 12.8
plein de question comme ca.
Sherabar.

 sherabar, on 30 August 2012 - 04:49 AM, said:

Seems you ment to write in the french section or something, this is the english section of the forum, and i dont understand a word you said

@sherabar ... not to write in english in an english forum ... damn, that's more then arogant!

@OP ... right, this game highly favors auto-aim and luck-shot noobs :(
Foch155 aiming the middle of the tracks of an IS-3 at 90deg ... AND BOUNCES!
IS-3 luck-shot with auto-aim at full speed the Foch which perfectly angels his front with hull down ... AND DESTROY GUN ... OR HIT AMO-RACK!

Stuff like this happens to me every match :(.

I play my E75 .. face and enemy E75 ... I aim like mad to hit his weak spots and .. bounce bounce bounce 0-dam-crit bounce.
He uses auto-target and don't stop for a milli second but ... damage damage crew-hit damage engine-hit burn damage.

 Grabarz19_PL, on 30 August 2012 - 03:41 AM, said:

Basically you can devide game into two parts, strategic: reading the map, picking own position, patience, killing off the rushing reta...let's call em "less talented ones"...
However it also has some elements of dumb luck (it's poor rnd number generation and not so well working spot mechanisms but lets leave the wg blaming out for a sec),
ever been shot by an Jagdtiger sitting in the middle of the field from 150m without spotting him? I know I have, several shots in a row. The funny thing was I even knew where the shots came from.

The other part is the combat: choosing targets, reading the enemy angles, picking weakspots, successful peek-a-boo...
Aaand then comes the basic dumb luck again. Each one-on-one with a decent player is 95% luck,
because the shell exchange is just flipping few coins, get good accuracy roll, good pen roll, good dmg roll etc.

So you both have valid points I would say, but the element of luck could be imo less. But I suppose WG doesn't want too large gaps between players.
On the other hand this game might be played by 5 year old Johnny with poop in his pants, on the other hand it might be played by 60 year old retired tank crew member James. (I picked those names randomly)

 brick128, on 30 August 2012 - 02:05 AM, said:

These.. Every friggin day.. All day...

 DizzyNATOR93, on 30 August 2012 - 01:34 AM, said:

i agree

( i typed a post with about 500 characters but browser crashed - now i am pissed, sorry)

Most luck based is still arty u really have no influence on that. I could always punsh in my monitor when i miss a standing maus with my fully upgrade gwe with a crew wit the second skill close to 100%. Just a shame that the real crew skill stops to get better after reaching the normal 100%