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dysje #81 Posted 19 September 2012 - 05:35 PM

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View PostHibalo, on 19 September 2012 - 12:56 PM, said:

i have only 300w 12v 18a PSu atm.. i need to get a new one to mount almost any new gpu

cheapest 6870 i could find is 159€ and its the dual fan edition

cheapest 7770 prices go around 115-130 and the one thats 115 is OC'd already

Only cards that don't require seperate power connector will work on your current psu yes. 7750 for example, but that thing is overpriced. I Guess you know what to do =)

SastusBulbas #82 Posted 19 September 2012 - 09:00 PM

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View Postdysje, on 19 September 2012 - 05:35 PM, said:

Only cards that don't require seperate power connector will work on your current psu yes. 7750 for example, but that thing is overpriced. I Guess you know what to do =)

Listening to you is probably one of the things he should not do. Below are a few reasons why.

View Postdysje, on 18 September 2012 - 10:51 PM, said:

The amount of stupidity here rivals that of... well, I think this actually sets a new standard.

It was not to bad until you started this tripe below.

View Postdysje, on 18 September 2012 - 10:51 PM, said:

Just to answer basic question: Best FPS in WoT is by going for good CPU. Core i5 works best.

Yet a single 2.8ghz core will manage 120fps max with the right graphics card, and continue to manage that fps max with a midrange card and tweaking of settings. Not that the i5 3570K is not a good processor, many prefer this to the i7 3770K or socket 2011 choices. But a lower CPU will manage decent frame rates with a reasonable graphics card and settings.

View Postdysje, on 18 September 2012 - 10:51 PM, said:

Oh and one last word of advice: avoid the cards with special letters. Just get the cheapest of the cheapest version of the card you are looking for. a HD7770 XXXXALDKJDD twin frozrmarketingtermnonsense dual single triple fan etc. might (best case) be 5% faster or "cooler" than the normal one, while the price is twice as high. Using Catalyst or some nvidia clockspeed program you can get the same 5% out of any cheap version of it and even the cheaper ones won't overheat, cause otherwise they wouldn't be sold.

Hmm, this completely depends on the card you are talking about, sometimes that difference is more than 5% and the noise and cooling alone some find worthwhile, anyone who has played with GPU's know fine well it can increase noise, and heat, and can void a warranty. And the reason most aftermarket overclocked GPU's have those fancy coolers is precisely due to heat. Not all overclocked cards are worth the money, and not all are equal. Like I said, a pre-overclocked variant of the GTX-670 Windforce outperforms a stock GTX-680, only costs £60 more than a stock GTX-670, but less than a GTX-680. Some find that worthwhile. I am not sure where you get the 50% more cost from, as this is variable.

View Postdysje, on 18 September 2012 - 10:51 PM, said:

Oh right, before I forget I run WoT at max settings on my cute little single-slot HD6770. Stop wasting money on extremely high end cards. For those prices you can buy three HD7770 (100 euro!). Most games work extremely well on mid-range cards nowadays and those midrange cards often offer the performance of the previous generations high-end card. Oh did I mention you won't need a PSU for it? (if you go 7750 you won't even need a pci-express power cable, problem solved)

I don't get why everyone must go HIGH END HIGH END all the time. Especially when you work with lower-ish resolution (1600xsomething for example) these midrange things offer great performance at most of the time even max settings.

Some people want high end cards because they outperform old cards, they may offer higher minimum frame rates, or just because they are into those sort of things. I agree with you on resolution, but everyone has different needs and costs they can afford. Not everyone is happy with 25fps, some want as much as possible.

View Postdysje, on 18 September 2012 - 10:51 PM, said:

For those prices you can buy three HD7770 (100 euro!).

See, YOU mentioned crossfire 1st. Or at least infered it, I doub't you meant one HD7770 is as good as a £300 GPU, or that you could buy one and start building another two PC's!
Three HD-7770, three 6 pin connectors, check your PSU, good for up to 450w power draw (Not sure many users of lower end PC's and GPU's have capable PSU's?). Some may like three beer budget GPU's in triple crossfire if there are no issues getting them to work, or with drivers and game compatability etc, others may prefer a reasonable single GTX-670 or HD-7970.

View Postdysje, on 18 September 2012 - 11:05 PM, said:

Ah you are one of those people that bought a "pre-overlocked card" and is now having doubts. Yes, it's a bad decision. Next time don't do it.

Here we see the value of your opinion start to really shine, what makes you asume such? Why would anyone who bought a better card have doubts? Why is it a bad decision?

I thought of this as nothing more than childish immature trolling.

View Postdysje, on 18 September 2012 - 11:05 PM, said:

And the point about having no guarantee of performance or cooling or longevity? Well by European law they have to work well for at least 2 years. I think thats long enough for what I use em for. You are obviously a victim for some random marketing terms. It's ok, people that blindly spend money and are doing everything to justify it are the most important factor of the world economy.

Another childish ramble. I am sure many retailers will not honour a waranty on a card damaged by overclocking. But a pre overclocked card is guaranteed with that overclock, tested, and provided with a cooler they found sufficient after benching.

Your rambling about "victim" or "blindly spend money" are pathetic. Possibly something you have an issue with? Believe it or not, many people work for money, and are happy to spend it on nice items, fine food or drink, small increases in performane, and it certainly does not equate to them being victims being duped into blindly spending money.

View Postdysje, on 18 September 2012 - 11:05 PM, said:

Oh and a HD6770 you don't need to buy 3x at once, for the same money you can keep replacing it every 1.5 years (or less!) when it becomes outdated. So for the same 300 euro you'll be covered for a lot longer and benefit from solid useful performance for a lot longer too. Don't worry, you don't need to understand. You will at some point though. - think of it this way; you buy a HD7770 and run everything max in one year, next year you run HD8770 and run everything at max, when it becomes too slow, you buy HD9770. All 300 together. If you buy one high-end card now, you'll be on par with the 2nd option a year later and be stuck with a sub-par, midrange performing 300 costing old card that's completely outdated in year 3. I'm up for a brand new card in year 3 while having not spent one cent extra. You were talking about longevity, well there you have it.

No different from buying a better card up front, and getting better performance which may dwindle over the next few years, you will still have your old games running well, as new ones become more demanding, I am sure a better card can be bought if and when required. Sorry, I would rather have a decent £300 card now, than an old £80 card, then add another £80 card later.

A budget card on it's second year is still a budget card when reincarnated, your opinion on "usefull" is irrelevant, as different people have different needs and requirements.

This was the second time you clearly mention crossfire, something dependant on PSU, motherboard, and case. Issues which do not arise with many better single card variants.

View Postdysje, on 19 September 2012 - 01:09 AM, said:

You have trouble understanding things. Go out, take in some fresh air, then maybe, after a year or .. 10, come back. You obviously don't read.

Lol, troll much, after your denial regarding crossfire, and other points above? Lol.

View Postdysje, on 19 September 2012 - 01:09 AM, said:

You just keep buying expensive overpriced stuff, good for the economy. Go ahead, its good for people like me that design and develop and these marketing thingies. You are why I have a job. Thank you.

Another laugh, I buy expensive things? Your opinion? I keep people like you in a job? Care to expand on what you actually do? We know you earn enough to buy a budget GPU and garner an opinion based on such ownership, personally your GPU budget buys a reasonable bottle of single malt, or an evening meal. We all spend money and to some degree keep others in employment, that actually puts you below the consumer, and in service. You as an employee, your boss, the company you work for, you are not who has the power, you serve the consumer market, they own you. People out there will drop 4k on a carbon fiber .50 cal rifle barrel, 14K on a hunting rifle, watches, all manner of things, because they have spending power regardless of others opinions on what they are buying. I am pretty sure your superiors at work spend more than you do on better things.

View Postdysje, on 19 September 2012 - 01:09 AM, said:

Also saying you own a mac, kinda says it all.

One of the most stupid, retarded comments I have read in a long time, exactly why no one should listen to your opinionated drivle.

Care to expand on what you mean by that comment, what does owning a Mac "kinda says it all" mean? What are you picturing with this comment?

View Postdysje, on 19 September 2012 - 01:09 AM, said:

(point: nobody EVER said anything about sli/crossfire, but you rant about it anyway, good job not reading.)

D'uh, take a look at your previous posts Mr Bright!

View Postdysje, on 19 September 2012 - 12:35 PM, said:

You really have trouble reading. You mentioned crossfire, Not me.

Again, D'uh, look at your previous posts, what are two or three 6770 or 7770 in configuration?

View Postdysje, on 19 September 2012 - 12:35 PM, said:

I have an opinion about your purchasing habits by the way you express yourself about products (mac+"special" graphics cards).

But you do not know my purchasing habits?

I only expressed an opinion many have regarding pre-overclocked graphics cards. You seem to think no one should buy them, because you can make a stock card "special" where it may not suit others.

You have only expressed what seems like bias against Mac, with no explanation on what you are on about?

Therefor you have no real opinon, as you have nothing to form that opinion on. Assuming something due to your own imagination, not sure, but does that equate to an opinion? Is that valid? You have speculated with no explanation, an opinion on my purchasing habits because I have a nondescript Mac?

So again, your opinion and advice possibly not worth a pinch of salt, considering the above manner in which you have speculated.

Care to speculate a little better, with some fact, explanation, and detail, regarding my having doubts, being a victim, blindly spending money, how I keep YOU in a job, what owning a Mac says, and what you imagine someone having a Mac, and thinking some graphics cards are better than others, tells you about purchasing habits?

Are you sure you are not some child living with mum who can only afford a 6770 therefor has to make up stories and belittle anyone who disagrees with what mummy helped you buy with your 1st wage and a bit od extra pocket money? Sorry, that was childish!

Annihilism #83 Posted 19 September 2012 - 10:12 PM

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@OP

If you want to improve your speed there is also a really nice mod that disables some effects that makes your game have low FPS.

I have a GTX670 and even i get sluggish performance sometimes while Battlefield 3 runs on everything with max fine.

It's not a graphics card problem but the coding of the game. 8.0 should fix most of your problems since it will be optimized on many ways.

Btw if you have an intel chipset i'd suggest an Nvidia card as the 7xxx series give problems with the H67/PH67 chipset (ive had this with a 7870 and after alot of research it seems to be a common problem)

If you have an AMD pc you are probably fine though with an AMD HD 6 or 7xxx. It's all about what you prefer really. Usually in the lower segment AMD scores better price/performance wise. When you look at high end (+350 euros) you are usually better off with an Nvidia.

My old card was an HD6790 wich ran the game fine as well I must add.

dysje #84 Posted 19 September 2012 - 10:18 PM

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View PostSastusBulbas, on 19 September 2012 - 09:00 PM, said:

RAGE
tl;dr

You need a girlfriend.

SastusBulbas #85 Posted 19 September 2012 - 11:28 PM

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View Postdysje, on 19 September 2012 - 10:18 PM, said:

You need a girlfriend.

Lol, I am 41 yrs old, with a busy job, more work and toys than I have time for, an attractive wife that looks half her age, with three lovely children. I don't need a girlfriend, I need an empty hotel room and a peaceful nights sleep.

I have put off a new PC for a good few years. But it is not something I need, having a possible budget of £800 for the graphics does not equate to me buying that. I am more interested in it being micro ATX or mini ITX. With high minimal frame rates. My gaming monitor is a BenQ 2420T 120hz jobby.

PS, we mainly use Macs at work, they have uses, it's not all about gaming, some of us work with Macs and PC's too.

TheKroo #86 Posted 20 September 2012 - 02:38 AM

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Guys please keep the discussion clean.
No need to go into off-topic or trolling/personal attacks.

You don't have to agree with other user's opinions, but respect the fact they have the right to have an opinion.

Consider this a friendly warning before actions.

Merquise #87 Posted 20 September 2012 - 03:34 AM

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View PostPzSniper, on 17 September 2012 - 08:45 PM, said:

i'm running GTX 680.... a 700€ card and trust me, WOT doesn't make it shine... i just get 44-90 avg FPS...not GPU fault for sure i can run Battlefiels 3 on ultra settings without problem, BUT WOT it's still slow...

Same problem here.
Core i7 980, GTX590, around 90fps but sometimes weird fps drops.
In arty godview mode I sometimes get 20fps... no idea why.
I'm using Eazytoolz which made the game run smoother, but compared to Xrysis 2 on ultra or BF3  on Ultra ... WoT just has a horrible horrible engine.

I also got an old Athlon FX55, one of the fastest single core CPU's made, and WoT runs really smooth on that, albeit with lower overall FPS.
That thing is like 8 years old. My CPU/GPU is 1 year old.

I really hope they sort out the engine.

Hibalo #88 Posted 25 September 2012 - 12:47 PM

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Got my list done of what im going to buy ;

GPU : HD 5850
CPU Athlon II X3 450 3,2 Ghz
PSU : 500W cant remember the name atm but its enough
a new motherboard too to support the cpu, cant remember name


i will guess/hope that this brings me much more power than my current set

CPU: amd 64x 2x +4400 2,3 ghz
Gpu: hd 3800
psu: 300w
some crap  old OEM motherboard

Edited by Hibalo, 25 September 2012 - 12:48 PM.


dysje #89 Posted 25 September 2012 - 07:39 PM

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You're better off with a low end intel chip actually. AMD is only really good right now at serious multitasking stuff (FX chips) the rest... not so much.

Consider options like Intel Pentium G850 (or even G630), those are around the same price as the athlon II, but a LOT faster. Even though they are just dual core. (take a look at this; http://www.anandtech...-g620t-tested/3 ) Considering you can most of the time get a G850 for the price of a x3 anyway.... (note that this goes mostly for WoT, as WoT is 100% single threaded, results will vary in multithreaded programs)

Note that the HD5850 is rather old. We are at the 7 series now already, so the 5850 is quite an older model. Current midrange chips that do not require a seperate power connector already get close to the 5850. So be careful not to spend too much on such an old card. (anything over 130 euro is too much).

Hibalo #90 Posted 26 September 2012 - 12:31 PM

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View Postdysje, on 25 September 2012 - 07:39 PM, said:

You're better off with a low end intel chip actually. AMD is only really good right now at serious multitasking stuff (FX chips) the rest... not so much.

Consider options like Intel Pentium G850 (or even G630), those are around the same price as the athlon II, but a LOT faster. Even though they are just dual core. (take a look at this; http://www.anandtech...-g620t-tested/3 ) Considering you can most of the time get a G850 for the price of a x3 anyway.... (note that this goes mostly for WoT, as WoT is 100% single threaded, results will vary in multithreaded programs)

Note that the HD5850 is rather old. We are at the 7 series now already, so the 5850 is quite an older model. Current midrange chips that do not require a seperate power connector already get close to the 5850. So be careful not to spend too much on such an old card. (anything over 130 euro is too much).

5850 has MORE power than 7770 and the cheapest 1 i could find is 115€ and the 5850 that im buying is 85€ hell it has almost the same power as 7850 and thats 180-220€  http://www.gpureview...=614&card2=678#

edit : oh and i forgot to mention, i can unlock the 4th core of the Athlon II X3 450 3,2 Ghz and turn it to a AMD Phenom II X4 B55 which makes it faster than pentium 850 and probably faster than i-3 2100 too

Edited by Hibalo, 26 September 2012 - 12:53 PM.


dysje #91 Posted 26 September 2012 - 04:35 PM

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View PostHibalo, on 26 September 2012 - 12:31 PM, said:

5850 has MORE power than 7770 and the cheapest 1 i could find is 115€ and the 5850 that im buying is 85€ hell it has almost the same power as 7850 and thats 180-220€  http://www.gpureview...=614&card2=678#

edit : oh and i forgot to mention, i can unlock the 4th core of the Athlon II X3 450 3,2 Ghz and turn it to a AMD Phenom II X4 B55 which makes it faster than pentium 850 and probably faster than i-3 2100 too

There's no guarantee unlocking core 4 works. It might backfire, but go ahead and try if you like of course. You will however Not see an increase in performance in WoT because this game is completely single threaded. Even if you unlock a million more cores in it, it will perform less in WoT than any intel offering. AMD is awesome, don't get me wrong. This is just based on how WoT sucks at multithreading.

On the graphics card section, the site you link to has raw data on the cards. The pipelines in the 7850 are completely different, so is just about everything else on the thing. This is what makes the 7850 almost twice as fast than the 5850 in most situations. Stop linking specs you do not understand.

Read articles like this; http://hexus.net/tec...-clocks/?page=5
And this; http://www.guru3d.co..._review,17.html (Doesn't include 5850, but the 6850 is an optimized version of 5850, so take about 5% off 6850 and you got your numbers) Need I note that 7770 is actually sometimes as fast as 6850? Which means it has about the same power (in a lot of situations) as the 5850? And that the 7770 has 50% of the power consumption of the 5850 is of course a nice bonus too!

Again, don't get me wrong, if you can get an awesome deal (like you have) on 5850, go for it. But don't come around with specs you don't understand ranting about stuff that's completely bull. We have enough of those people around already.

Hibalo #92 Posted 26 September 2012 - 07:50 PM

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Could there be any chance of cpu bottlenecking gpu?

dysje #93 Posted 27 September 2012 - 12:10 AM

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View PostHibalo, on 26 September 2012 - 07:50 PM, said:

Could there be any chance of cpu bottlenecking gpu?

No, not chance.

It will happen. That's the whole bloody point. However you will most likely Only have this problem with WoT and only until they (if they ever) implement a multithread system for the engine.

But this is only tied to WoT. Most other games won't have a problem, and if they do, they are usually old enough for them to not suffer from this issue anyway, as you can max em with half your new system. So if you only play WoT or mostly play WoT, you may be better off with a chip with better performance per core, however if you do a lot more with it... don't bother. But you will clearly notice a difference in WoT. I know, because I have a similar problem with my system, however I don't play all that much anyway, so I'm not bothered and I won't switch out stuff for it.

Hibalo #94 Posted 08 October 2012 - 09:21 PM

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Ok, total cost of my components 226€

Sapphire HD5850 = 85€
Asrock n68c-gs fx = 47 €
AMD athlon II 3x 455 = 67€
2 x 2gb ddr3 1600mhz memory = 27€

in WoT fps went from 15-20 lowest
to
20-50 maximum

and i can run every game max minimum 30 fps ( most of them over 60 )

so all and all not bad investment :Smile_great:

Edited by Hibalo, 08 October 2012 - 10:36 PM.


XxXSpottedYouXxX #95 Posted 09 October 2012 - 03:29 PM

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680 is not worth the extra tiny % get a gtx 670 and overclock it and you have a slightly more powerful 680 at a cheaper price :).

Hibalo #96 Posted 10 October 2012 - 01:14 PM

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View PostDerRizerPin, on 09 October 2012 - 03:29 PM, said:

680 is not worth the extra tiny % get a gtx 670 and overclock it and you have a slightly more powerful 680 at a cheaper price :).

Why buy a GTX 670 for 400-500€ when you can buy for example AMD HD 6870 for around 150-180€ and you can run probably all games +60 fps if you do slight OC'ing
why would you need an higher end GPU if you are just gaming?

edit : i have a small OC on my hd5850 that costed 85€ (used one) and AMD athlon II 3x 455 3,3ghz @ 3,6GHz OC'd (65€) (35-56c max temp stock cooling)

skyrim all maxed out steadily 30-40 fps, on some random spots drops around 20'ish
mechwarrior online around 30-40 fps maxed
League Of Legends maxed, fps doesnt drop below 115
borderlands 2 maxed lowest fps 55 usually 65-80
Furmark 1.10.2 preset 720 : 3080-3120 score

Edited by Hibalo, 10 October 2012 - 01:25 PM.


i486DX #97 Posted 10 October 2012 - 06:38 PM

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View PostHibalo, on 10 October 2012 - 01:14 PM, said:

Why buy a GTX 670 for 400-500€ when you can buy for example AMD HD 6870 for around 150-180€ and you can run probably all games +60 fps if you do slight OC'ing
why would you need an higher end GPU if you are just gaming?

edit : i have a small OC on my hd5850 that costed 85€ (used one) and AMD athlon II 3x 455 3,3ghz @ 3,6GHz OC'd (65€) (35-56c max temp stock cooling)

skyrim all maxed out steadily 30-40 fps, on some random spots drops around 20'ish
mechwarrior online around 30-40 fps maxed
League Of Legends maxed, fps doesnt drop below 115
borderlands 2 maxed lowest fps 55 usually 65-80
Furmark 1.10.2 preset 720 : 3080-3120 score

Why not

Hibalo #98 Posted 10 October 2012 - 07:20 PM

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View Posti486DX, on 10 October 2012 - 06:38 PM, said:

Why not

well if you have the money to blow then sure

edit still think that AMD is better at mid-high range gpu's

nvidia is overpriced and overrated

Edited by Hibalo, 10 October 2012 - 07:37 PM.


i486DX #99 Posted 10 October 2012 - 07:55 PM

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Fanboys everywhere.

TapChan #100 Posted 15 October 2012 - 12:33 PM

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I'm also going
to change my PC.
And going to switch from AMD to Intel. It's not like I feel bad, but it's pissin me off when loosing FPS at WoT. Of course I have Drax's HD textures, but after the patch i just can't fit settings to work slight and look fine. In the areas where my screen is filled by trees i'm suffering FPS drops from 61 to 20-23... But with all those max settings i'm playing at 16-25 fps!

Current PC:
CPU: AMD Phenom II X6 1090T Black Edition 3.2GHz (3.8GHz OC)
Mainboard: Gigabyte MA770T-UD3
GPU: Gainward GTX 460 GS! 2048MB
RAM: 4x 2GB 1333 MHz DDR3 CL9 DIMM with heatsink Nanya Elixir
Case:  CoolerMaster Elite 335U Mid Tower
Sound Card:  Creative Sound Blaster X-Fi Titanium
PSU: be quiet! Straight Power E9 CM 580W
CPU Cooling: Scythe Mugen 3 Rev.B
HDD:  old Western Digital 2500JS 250GB SATA2 (with system)
and WD Caviar Green WD10EARS 1TB 64MB SATA 2 (with WoT)
Additionally 2 fans: Enermax Cluster + Enermax TB Silence.

And it's gonna look like:
CPU: CORE i5-3570K 3.4GHzBOX 6M LGA1155
Mainboard: ASRock Z77 Extreme4
GPU: Gigabyte GTX670 OC 2048MB GDDR5 256
RAM: 4x 2GB DDR3 OCZ Platinum 1600MHz CL6 LV
Case:  CoolerMaster HAF922
Sound Card:  Creative Sound Blaster X-Fi Titanium
PSU: be quiet! Straight Power E9 CM 580W
CPU Cooling: Scythe Mugen 3 Rev.B
HDD:  Kingston 120GB HyperX 3K SSD (with system and WoT)
+ Western Digital 2500JS 250GB SATA2
+ WD Caviar Green WD10EARS 1TB 64MB SATA 2
Additionally 2 fans: Enermax Cluster + Enermax TB Silence.
Hope I'd get stable 50+ fps with this crap. Otherwise i'm gonna burn it in fire!

Edited by TapChan, 15 October 2012 - 12:34 PM.





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