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T71 vs. AMX 13 75 || T69 vs. AMX 13 90


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BlubbsoR #1 Posted 19 December 2012 - 01:35 PM

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Hi there

will step to the topic directly.

T71 vs. AMX 13 75:

Common to both:
- revolver
- almost same HP pool
- no armor
- speed and mobility

Diffenrences:
- T71 has incredible 175mm pen value? WTH, this is higher than AMX 13 90 (Tier 8) Top Gun level with 170...
- T71 has slightly more Dmg
- T71 massively more traverse speed

So what is the point in riding AMX 13 75 now ???
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T69 vs. AMX 13 90:
Common to both:
- revolver
- PW ratio
- gun values
- almost same speed
- traverse speed

Differences:
- T69 has massively more armor
- T69 has more HP

So what is the point in riding AMX 13 90 now ???

BlubbsoR

Bala79 #2 Posted 19 December 2012 - 01:40 PM

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AMX 13 75 is worse than T71, but T69 is not the same really. Its a medium tank, the acceleration is not the same. You cant really switch flank as you could do with AMX. Another thing, T69 have a bigger profile, and thats not good...So i would choose AMX 1390 instead of T69

Serbanutz #3 Posted 19 December 2012 - 01:41 PM

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the whole point is to buy premium and farm new (better) tanks . better atm because later they will be nerfed so they make room for new better tanks.

FatigueGalaxy #4 Posted 19 December 2012 - 02:05 PM

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View PostBlubbsoR, on 19 December 2012 - 01:35 PM, said:


T69 vs. AMX 13 90:
Common to both:
- revolver
- PW ratio
- gun values
- almost same speed
- traverse speed

Differences:
- T69 has massively more armor
- T69 has more HP

So what is the point in riding AMX 13 90 now ???

BlubbsoR
You obviously didn't play T69.
T69 (compared to 13 90):
-smaller drum (that moment when 2 shots of 4 bounce...),
-much slower,
-worse acceleration,
-size,
-bad camo,
-low pen (170mm on medium tank and 170mm on light tank is completely different story)
+faster drum reload (you don't have to run away that much),
+better MM,
+better gun angles,
+better accuracy on the move and aiming time,
+better armour.

13 90 compared to T69:
-less armour (HE sponge),
-long drum reload,
-MM,
-accuracy on the move and aiming time,
+much smaller,
+much faster,
+great camo (doesn't lose camo on the move - can be more sneaky and run away more easily),
+more firepower,
+pen is not a problem because of speed,
+more firepower because of bigger drum - possibility to destroy same tier opponents with one drum, easy piece of cake when they're damaged a little bit (never go vs full hp enemies).

As you see they're completely different and more important - they have different role on the battlefield.
AMX 13 90 can be scout, spotter and later in game - lone hunter who will easily finish damaged tanks.
T69 is great support. Attack the same targets as your team and deal some dmg. Before your team will move, your drum will be ready again. Alone you're weak, even to damaged enemies. Half-HP tier 8 tanks can eat you alive because you won't be able to finish them with 4 shots most of the time. For 13 90, half-HP tier 8 tank are easy meat...

But I agree with T71 - 13 75 part. The are both light tank, both have the same MM and both have the same role on the battlefield. And T71 is better in everything. But it's too easy to judge. I remember when 13 75 and 13 90 were introduced and there were the most dangerous tanks on the battlefield. Later they got nerfed and I think T71 will get a nerf too.

BlubbsoR #5 Posted 19 December 2012 - 03:28 PM

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Alright, I see ppl agree that T71 is currently OP.

Let's take the Pershing vs. T69.

Common:
- both meds
- same armor and HP pool
- same mobility and speed

Diff:
- T69 has a revolver with the same gun values as Pershing.

Any reason to ride the Pershing?

Baske_74 #6 Posted 19 December 2012 - 03:46 PM

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View PostBlubbsoR, on 19 December 2012 - 03:28 PM, said:

Alright, I see ppl agree that T71 is currently OP.

Let's take the Pershing vs. T69.

Common:
- both meds
- same armor and HP pool
- same mobility and speed

Diff:
- T69 has a revolver with the same gun values as Pershing.

Any reason to ride the Pershing?

not really pershing gun has +10 penetration, better RoF, faster aimtime, damage is the same.
comparing the chassis they have similar topspeed and mobility, the main difference while both have around 7 RPM the M26 has a steady rate of fire and the T69 can fire 4 time really fast then 25 sec vunerability, and when push comes to shove i tink M26 has better turret armour and more depression on its gun then T69.

HazyShadeOfCriminal #7 Posted 19 December 2012 - 04:23 PM

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I dont think compering  normal tank with an autoloader has any sense, their playstyles and roles on the battlefield are to different. But yeah AMX 13 75 compered to T71 is a bit... crapy. I have AMX and play it for fun, still like it and it has one massive advantege over T71 - shorter drum reloading time. In one on one fight with T71s it saved me a couple of times. And accually i would rather want to see AMX geting a buff than T71 a nerf :P

DeathByDribbling #8 Posted 20 December 2012 - 03:46 PM

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View PostBaske_74, on 19 December 2012 - 03:46 PM, said:

not really pershing gun has +10 penetration, better RoF, faster aimtime, damage is the same.
comparing the chassis they have similar topspeed and mobility, the main difference while both have around 7 RPM the M26 has a steady rate of fire and the T69 can fire 4 time really fast then 25 sec vunerability, and when push comes to shove i tink M26 has better turret armour and more depression on its gun then T69.

The other important difference is it's much easier for pershing to load a gold shell when required, where as with a drum you've got a very long reload then a very expensive full drum of gold.

azakow #9 Posted 20 December 2012 - 07:29 PM

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Are you asking, on which nations vehicle line you should concentrate your current grinding efforts?
I'm asking, because this topic very much develops to such, rather than to have a proper vehicle comparison.

BlubbsoR #10 Posted 21 December 2012 - 10:30 AM

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View Postazakow, on 20 December 2012 - 07:29 PM, said:

Are you asking, on which nations vehicle line you should concentrate your current grinding efforts?
I'm asking, because this topic very much develops to such, rather than to have a proper vehicle comparison.

Nope!

After a longer "try-on phase" I decided to concentrate on certain tanks, but those are not US  :Smile_Default: I chose from each class a certain target and am grinding the path towards it slowly.

I have not enough time and enthusiasm to play the US line. I played the TD line up to the Hellcat and stopped. Ofc it would be nice to have the T110E4 since it looks like fun. But those tanks in between ... T25/2-> T28Proto->T30 ... are just meh. Slow, sluggisch etc ... not worth it to go through all that pain.

By simple asking if the old tanks in the tree can still compete with the new ones I intended to stimulate peoples mind to find pro/contra aspects. I know how to fight the "old" ones. So if ppl give me their experience and opinion in relation to the old I can figure out how to effectively fight the new tanks in the tree.

Gz BlubbsoR

von_chom #11 Posted 21 December 2012 - 10:42 AM

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t69 is utter shit compared to amx 13 90 even if you cannot compare light with med.

Kam7r #12 Posted 21 December 2012 - 06:50 PM

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View PostBlubbsoR, on 19 December 2012 - 03:28 PM, said:

Alright, I see ppl agree that T71 is currently OP.

Let's take the Pershing vs. T69.

Common:
- both meds
- same armor and HP pool
- same mobility and speed

Diff:
- T69 has a revolver with the same gun values as Pershing.

Any reason to ride the Pershing?

to unlock the awesome patton ?

jasahram #13 Posted 23 December 2012 - 12:47 PM

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the point of playing AMX is getting Lorraine and BatChat. with T71 u cant do that.

Edited by jasahram, 23 December 2012 - 12:47 PM.


Che74 #14 Posted 25 December 2012 - 01:44 PM

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I have to play T69 yet but still I won't compare it to amx 13 90.. different type of tank, they both seems to have their own strenghts and flaws which makes them balanced in the end.

I'm playing T71 and let me say you get tough matchmaking very often (tier VIII and IX, sometimes even X !) where you can easily get oneshotted.
And even against same tier VII you have no armour and get destroyed in no time (25 hull - 22 turret !)
There's always trade off as you can see.

Basically when you say it's OP it means you got (reasonably) owned by a good player and you don't have T71 in your garage.

Cowutters #15 Posted 25 December 2012 - 04:14 PM

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the 13 75 leads to the 13 90 thats why i choose the french light tank line

Exocet6951 #16 Posted 25 December 2012 - 04:35 PM

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I can objectively say that the T71 > AMX 13 75, due to a better gun and much better gun depression/elevation. Sure the drums reload slower, and the shells withing the drum fire too quickly to fully aim, essentially wasting the RoF when at long distance....but the massive, MASSIVE differences in guns and everything related to it, such as the VStab and gun depression, make the T71 simply superior.

The T69 is any other thing all together, and saying it's better than the AMX 13 90 would be silly. First off, it can't be an improvised scout due to it's size and camo. It can't flank the same way a 13 90 can either, and has 2 less shells per drum.
On those grounds alone, despite some of the undeniable qualities it has, it cannot be deemed objectively better in any given circumstance.

Che74 #17 Posted 25 December 2012 - 11:39 PM

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View PostExocet6951, on 25 December 2012 - 04:35 PM, said:

I can objectively say that the T71 > AMX 13 75, due to a better gun and much better gun depression/elevation. Sure the drums reload slower, and the shells withing the drum fire too quickly to fully aim, essentially wasting the RoF when at long distance....but the massive, MASSIVE differences in guns and everything related to it, such as the VStab and gun depression, make the T71 simply superior.

The T69 is any other thing all together, and saying it's better than the AMX 13 90 would be silly. First off, it can't be an improvised scout due to it's size and camo. It can't flank the same way a 13 90 can either, and has 2 less shells per drum.
On those grounds alone, despite some of the undeniable qualities it has, it cannot be deemed objectively better in any given circumstance.

I have now 138 battles with T71, it's already something to get more or less an idea (played the french line too up to Lorraine).
Of course I had duels with amx 13 75 too in many occasions and I can say based on my encounters the tank is not superior to Amx 13 75.
The difference in avg dmg is not huge (150 vs 135) and counterbalanced by the worst accuracy and less overall HP for T71 which are factors to consider too.
There's higher chance of a missed shot with T71 because the worst accuracy and terrible gun dispersion while moving, that would make a big difference in a fight.
T71 has more pen.. yes but that's irrelevant as matter of fact the amx 13 75 can equally pen T71 with 'every hit' because the very poor armour.
As you can see penetration is very unlikely going to make a difference here in 1 vs 1.
I can agree only about gun depression although until now it never gave me an edge over the amx, in case of a duel in the end it will be really decided by the players skills/performance.

Exocet6951 #18 Posted 26 December 2012 - 09:20 AM

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View PostChe74, on 25 December 2012 - 11:39 PM, said:

snip

My argument was on overall strength in a random battle, not a duel between the two tanks, because it mostly about luck if it comes down to a duel between similar tier autoloader tanks that take high module damage.

Bustergroove #19 Posted 26 December 2012 - 09:46 AM

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I have driven the AMX13 75 in the past and currently have a T71. My thoughts as a very average player:

I enjoy both tanks immensely and have a reasonable record in both; not unicum in any way but a winning record and, for me, high average experience.

One on one the AMX has the edge, it's just that bit tougher and a lot of the advantages of the T71 gun are negated in a duel like that.

In normal randoms there is little to choose between them but I think the T71 just has the edge for me due to, what feels like, its extra mobility; it just seems to turn more quickly and have a little more acceleration. This allows for more effective "ridge riding" and general active scouting. The gun has that little more pen as has been said before and that really helps when staying at distance.

Having said that, it would be interesting to drive the AMX 13 75 again now I have experienced the T71 and see if any of the lessons I have learned driving the US go-kart could be transferred over to the French light.

I didn't get on so well with the AMX13 90 but, to be honest but I think that was due to my lack of skill and knowledge of the maps/game rather than any inherent weakness with the tank. That extra tier seemed to take me out of my comfort/skill zone.

I have not yet got to the T69 - I will get it when I do - but having looked at it and met some in game I would say that whilst the T71 and AMX 13 75 are a good match and very similar, the T69 and AMX 13 90 have so little in common (beyond the autoloader system) that I don't think you should really compare them.

HEADD #20 Posted 27 December 2012 - 08:15 PM

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T69 have also 300mm penetration with prem ammo...Amx 13 90 have only 248...
Both T71 and T69 are far better than 13 75 and 13 90..

Edited by HEADD, 27 December 2012 - 08:16 PM.