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IS-7 "Autoloader"

IS-7 autoloader

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Vlevs #1 Posted 03 October 2013 - 12:50 PM

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This thing.
Posted Image
I can't for certain tell from the picture what it is and how it is supposed to work. By glance, it seems it's a rack holding six shells (with conical end) and propellant cases (larger cylinders), so going by that alone it's a sort of ready ammo rack affixed to gun. Further info would be much appreciated, preferably with sources.

What I do know:
- IS-7 had a "mechanical load-assisting device".
- With that, IS-7 had 6-8 rpm "burst" fire capability.
- IS-7 employed two loaders.
- IS-7 used two-piece ammo (shell + propellant).
- The gun and ammo were inherited from the navy, so theoretically there already were loading assists for it (of which I know nothing).
- The device won't likely be implemented in the game, as it would be "unbalanced".

Posted Image
Cutaway showing two IS-7 design iterations doesn't help much, but suggests ammo stowage was scattered all around the hull. No clear loading mechanism or magazine is visible here. From these pictures it's also hard to determine if it has turret basket.

So, if anyone has good info about this device I'd be glad to hear. Also, if it was actually implemented in the game, how should it work? For now, let's toss balance concerns aside. Historical accuracy and all that.  :blinky:

leggasiini #2 Posted 06 November 2013 - 04:13 PM

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wow, i didnt know that IS-7 had IRL autoloader 0_o
Also, it was able to shoot 6-8 rounds in minute? Cool.  :smile:
I dont get why people is negrepping. lol

Edited by leggasiini, 06 November 2013 - 04:32 PM.


Speed_Of_Pain #3 Posted 06 November 2013 - 04:19 PM

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All I know that it was only good on paper while on tests it showed to be unreliable.

bobyto93 #4 Posted 06 November 2013 - 04:27 PM

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devs already stated that if they add is-7 "historical" values they would need to introduce a new tier like 11 just to fit it in.

dartmaul15 #5 Posted 06 November 2013 - 06:37 PM

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View Postbobyto93, on 06 November 2013 - 04:27 PM, said:

devs already stated that if they add is-7 "historical" values they would need to introduce a new tier like 11 just to fit it in.
DO IT! We could have Leo2 as the tier 11 german med (like both lines lead to leo 11), have crocodil as tier 11 td and so on....

(in case you people don't realize, it's a joke)

FadetoB1ack #6 Posted 06 November 2013 - 07:43 PM

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I remember reading on FTR that if IS7 were given historical values it would have be tier 12.
PS. I knew that it had a loading mechanism (which is also incidentally what it says on the picture) but an auto loader as in like the ones on e.g. 50B? Don't think so but I don't really care enough to go and research this stuff.

gunsrlove #7 Posted 06 November 2013 - 08:47 PM

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That looks like a ready rack to me, for easy shell access, which gets refilled by the loaders when it's out of ammo..It says Mechanism for loading of the gun for the IS-7 tank , but that doesn't mean autoloader.
The IS-7 was supposed to have a load assist mechanism but not an autoloader, so this must be part of it, perhaps to guide the shells in the breach or loading tray. The assembly in the picture has the shape of the rear of the turret as well
It's just a ready rack imo.

6-8 rpm in general, not in burst.

Rewiag #8 Posted 06 November 2013 - 10:43 PM

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actually, the word "autoloader" is wrongly used.
an autolader is what the name says: it automatically loads the shells. one after the another
the ingame so called "autoloaders" are actually magazine or revolver loaders, not autoloaders.
an autoloader removes the used shell from the barrel, pick a new one from the ammo rack, and makes the gun ready to fire.
the loaders only job is to put shells from the secondary/3rd ammo storrage to the primary ammo rack when it runs low, so the autoloader can pick new ones.
a magazine loader only puts new shells from the magazine, but the magazine had to be loaded by hand by the loaders every time it runs out.
imagine a magazine loader like a colt (or revolver with 6 shots): you can shoot 6 times really fast, but then you have to stop and manually load 6 bullets again.
imagine an autoloader like a machine gun with ammo belt: you can fire one shell after another untill the belt is empty.

Edited by Rewiag, 06 November 2013 - 10:52 PM.


Hauptmann_von_ATI #9 Posted 06 November 2013 - 11:01 PM

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russian lines doesnt need autoloaders bcz they are already max buffed and they wont get any in a long time

Edited by levakk, 06 November 2013 - 11:02 PM.


MajorSensi #10 Posted 07 November 2013 - 12:16 AM

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View PostRewiag, on 06 November 2013 - 10:43 PM, said:

actually, the word "autoloader" is wrongly used.
[...]

Posted Image


reminds me of a pepperbox ;)

Sumichobo #11 Posted 07 November 2013 - 01:18 AM

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View Postlevakk, on 06 November 2013 - 11:01 PM, said:

russian lines doesnt need autoloaders bcz they are already max buffed and they wont get any in a long time
Have you played russian tanks? No. Then don't say that they are max buffed. IS-7 is one of the worst tier 10 heavies right now, if not the worst.

DizzyNATOR93 #12 Posted 07 November 2013 - 01:49 AM

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pah "autoloaders are special for the french nations to make them unique" was said in the beginning by wg then Usa became one now u want to give russians also one? great understanding of unique. give the t-25 an autoloader like it had and its not such an good tank is7 is ok doesnt need buff in any way maybe mobility but not gun ore something

PengBumm #13 Posted 07 November 2013 - 03:15 AM

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View PostDizzyNATOR93, on 07 November 2013 - 01:49 AM, said:

pah "autoloaders are special for the french nations to make them unique" was said in the beginning by wg then Usa became one now u want to give russians also one?
You forgot the new german "autoloader" or revolvergun :)

Pfuf #14 Posted 07 November 2013 - 10:37 AM

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View PostSumichobo, on 07 November 2013 - 01:18 AM, said:

Have you played russian tanks? No. Then don't say that they are max buffed. IS-7 is one of the worst tier 10 heavies right now, if not the worst.

I might play a different game but thats crap. The IS-7 is a stronk tenk!

For me the IS-7 seems to be balanced and a RoF of 6-8 would be totally OP!

Vlevs #15 Posted 07 November 2013 - 12:11 PM

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I posted this because of historical interest, rather than any wish to change the tank. I have IS-7 and IMHO it is balanced as it is.

View Postgunsrlove, on 06 November 2013 - 08:47 PM, said:

That looks like a ready rack to me, for easy shell access, which gets refilled by the loaders when it's out of ammo..It says Mechanism for loading of the gun for the IS-7 tank , but that doesn't mean autoloader.
The IS-7 was supposed to have a load assist mechanism but not an autoloader, so this must be part of it, perhaps to guide the shells in the breach or loading tray. The assembly in the picture has the shape of the rear of the turret as well
It's just a ready rack imo.

6-8 rpm in general, not in burst.

I named the thread "autoloader", because that's how I came to know of it. IS-7 having a literal autoloader seems to have become a bit of an urban legend among some WoT players, probably more so in the US forum. "Autoloader" probably is a translation artifact, and I wanted to clear the confusion and find out what the thing is mechanically. Thanks for your input.

I understood that 6-8 rpm is in effect when there are shells in ready rack. When it runs out, loading should slow down considerably, especially that blueprints show ammo scattered everywhere around the fighting compartment. After that, it's a choice between refilling ready rack, interrupting firing for some time, or going for lower 'sustained' RoF.

View PostRewiag, on 06 November 2013 - 10:43 PM, said:

actually, the word "autoloader" is wrongly used.
an autolader is what the name says: it automatically loads the shells. one after the another
the ingame so called "autoloaders" are actually magazine or revolver loaders, not autoloaders.
an autoloader removes the used shell from the barrel, pick a new one from the ammo rack, and makes the gun ready to fire.
the loaders only job is to put shells from the secondary/3rd ammo storrage to the primary ammo rack when it runs low, so the autoloader can pick new ones.
a magazine loader only puts new shells from the magazine, but the magazine had to be loaded by hand by the loaders every time it runs out.
imagine a magazine loader like a colt (or revolver with 6 shots): you can shoot 6 times really fast, but then you have to stop and manually load 6 bullets again.
imagine an autoloader like a machine gun with ammo belt: you can fire one shell after another untill the belt is empty.

That's a bit hard distinction to make. Guns using revolver magazine are as much autoloaders as ones with stack magazine, carousel magazine or belt feed as long as they can load shells in magazine without human intervention. Any kind of magazine (or box or drum...) must be refilled manually at some point. To further an analogy; are assault rifles (30-rd mag) auto-loading or not? What's the limit?

IS-7's mechanism, however, doesn't seem to fill any autoloader's criteria; as far as I can tell, loading itself must be done by hand for every shell, mechanism described here helps that process. Quite different from French tanks, where no crew intervention is needed while magazine has shells.

Vlevs #16 Posted 07 November 2013 - 12:26 PM

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View PostT90_TANK, on 06 November 2013 - 07:43 PM, said:

I remember reading on FTR that if IS7 were given historical values it would have be tier 12.

I've come across that same claim, and I've wondered what it's based on. IS-7 is quite a nebulous vehicle, and credible and accurate info is a bit hard to come by. I'm curious how much of it is urban legend of STRONK, and how much is actual tank. Never getting adopted certainly adds to the legend. Supposedly the tank's design spec wasn't met again until T-64 came some 20 years later, which needed much more advanced technology to achieve it.

Skillezzzz #17 Posted 07 November 2013 - 01:51 PM

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BUFF IT ! is-7 has a very low Hp for a heavy tank and a very very poor acurrancy not to tell that the damage is nothing special.

TheKroo #18 Posted 07 November 2013 - 03:00 PM

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RL IS-7 had something like semi-autoloader.
Not a real auto loader per say. Something more similar to mechanical loading assistant as the shells were quite heavy.

The tank utilized quite a few technologies considered advanced for the period of its development.

Vlevs #19 Posted 07 November 2013 - 04:59 PM

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View PostHunter1911, on 07 November 2013 - 03:00 PM, said:

RL IS-7 had something like semi-autoloader.
Not a real auto loader per say. Something more similar to mechanical loading assistant as the shells were quite heavy.

The tank utilized quite a few technologies considered advanced for the period of its development.

Any specifics?

TheKroo #20 Posted 07 November 2013 - 05:28 PM

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View PostVlevs, on 07 November 2013 - 04:59 PM, said:

Any specifics?

Will try to dig out some specs :)




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