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I Am a Ukrainian


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ShrewdOne #41 Posted 02 March 2014 - 02:34 AM

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The world should open their eyes and rekon putin is a dictator DOT

 

hope the ukrainians will kick some russian arse


Edited by Kam7r, 02 March 2014 - 02:34 AM.


Strelok22 #42 Posted 02 March 2014 - 03:03 AM

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I concraduate the people of Ukraine for their patriotic spirit and will to fight the corruption and oppression.

 

But do not be fooled my brothers. The Balkan countries already walked this path and look at them now ... Bulgaria, Serbia, Romania, Greece ...

 

Fight, but be carefull for who and for what are you fighting and what path you will choose next. Your revolution managed to make a difference, but now it is up to you not to give upon the vows of faschist provocators, pro-EU dictators and Russian ULTRA nationalists. Choose your own goverement and your truly own people, otherwise we might might have a new Syria in Europe ....

 

Best wishes, from a slavic brother.


Edited by Strelok22, 02 March 2014 - 03:06 AM.


Achibot #43 Posted 02 March 2014 - 03:24 AM

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View PostStrelok22, on 02 March 2014 - 03:03 AM, said:

I concraduate the people of Ukraine for their patriotic spirit and will to fight the corruption and oppression.

 

But do not be fooled my brothers. The Balkan countries already walked this path and look at them now ... Bulgaria, Serbia, Romania, Greece ...

 

Fight, but be carefull for who and for what are you fighting and what path you will choose next. Your revolution managed to make a difference, but now it is up to you not to give upon the vows of faschist provocators, pro-EU dictators and Russian ULTRA nationalists. Choose your own goverement and your truly own people, otherwise we might might have a new Syria in Europe ....

 

Best wishes, from a slavic brother.

 

If this turns into a European Syria then it turns into World War III. Russia has almost zero choice regarding protecting the Crimea as a strategic resource which is why it is so insane for them to be ratcheting up the pressure like this. They are essentially creating a strategic problem so that they can go and "solve" it. But this isn't Georgia, other Governments actually care about the Ukraine (strategically) and any attempt to annex territory on the borders of Europe will be seen as the most dire of provocations by the Warhawks. It's very troubling to say the least.



LoveAmiga #44 Posted 02 March 2014 - 06:35 AM

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View PostArnold_Judas_Rimmer, on 01 March 2014 - 11:26 PM, said:

What interests me is how we speak of nations being at the root of all these troubles. In reality no nation is to blame.

 

Only a few bad men.

 

 

 

Yeah, the usual Jews run all the banks and Illuminati nonsense. Zzzzzzz...



ustroj_destroj #45 Posted 02 March 2014 - 08:48 AM

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I'm ukrainian.

 

I have read this topic and I see same mistakes as in many other discussions about Ukraine. While describing whole story can take a long time I'll try to give you main ideas in few points:

1) Ukrainian revolution is not about integration with EU. Ukrainian government started to shoot at peaceful people including medics and journalists. Ukrainians have stopped it by removing president Yanukovich from his position. Now integration with EU is not in list of plans of new government cause they have other problems: economical problems, new presidental elections, war with Putin. People at Ukraine are also not sure about EU. People from eastern regions are tend to cooperate with Russia and people from western parts wants to be closer to Hungary and Poland. Meanwhile all these people don't like when they are shooted by special forces. This is the reason of revolution.

2) Revolution in Ukraine is not about replacing one government with other. Simple people stopped to trust politics. There are opposition leaders like Klitchko, Timoschenko and Tahnybok but usual people don't trust them. When Timoschenko came to Maydan(center of revolution in Kiev) people were quite unfriendly to her. When other opposition leaders made some decision people from Maydan discussed it before accepting it or rejecting it. In any case decisions of politics are nothing without acceptance of Maydan/Revolution. If people at Maydan are don't agree with something they just ignore it and continue to do what they really need. Generally, I think people need some type of tools/laws/rules to control their politics always. Now this tool is revolution but something more peaceful is really required.

3) Decisions of Putin and Yanukovich must be considered in context of their personalities only. Yanukovich was twice in jail because of robbery. In the past he has robbed people's hats. Putin is exUSSR KGB officer.

4) Crimea is part of Ukraine starting from 1954. This peninsular has very limited sources of water. Most of water is transported to it by North Crimean Canal. This canal starts at ukrainian territory outside of Crimea. Without this water living in the Crimea will be very hard. Without this water people will have nothing to drink and to use in the fields and gardens. Try not to use water for one day and you will see what it can be. Additionally, tourism is very important for Crimea and most of tourists are from other parts of Ukraine. So Crimea is really dependent from rest of Ukraine economically and declaring independence in this situation is nonsense.

Many people in Russia don't know or ignore these facts and think decision in 1954 was wrong. One of these people is Putin.



OldRat #46 Posted 02 March 2014 - 09:57 AM

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Why don't we BOYCOTT all and any games, YouTube videos and other products from Russia? It is people in Russia that must start pushing Putin!

CuteGargoyle #47 Posted 02 March 2014 - 10:07 AM

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Putin isn't a president.

He is an Emperor.

 

My thoughts and wishes are with you.



Valvalecia #48 Posted 02 March 2014 - 10:36 AM

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View Postustroj_destroj, on 02 March 2014 - 10:48 AM, said:

Spoiler

 


Doubt that's hardly new for anyone here. Still the new "facisti" government as some say, has already risen to power. You can't really do anything about it anymore really. They're sending you to Crimea and you really have no choice unless you want Russians in your [edited].
The Crimea situation as I see it, is that the people there want more control for themselves/or be part of Russia. Ukraine doesn't "want" this. Russia wants to free/protect the russian people of Crimea. Now the problem here is that Ukraine can't try to compromise at all to the cirmeans/russians as EU/West doesn't want to Russian gain ground so close to Europe. and Russia/Putin doesn't take no for an answer.

And I still don't get why these western people find russians so evil or so. I'd say the "situation"(politics,economy,control) there is almost like in the US but just more open. And (I know, you can't start a sentence with "and"...) this boycotting (or whatever is the proper term) bs that EU/US is shooting is just plain nonsense. Russia/China could crush the World/Western economy if some major boycott would happen.



Tintor #49 Posted 02 March 2014 - 11:04 AM

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By crushing the World/Western economy they would crush their own economy as well. Russians like to use word "Fascism" a lot. Anyone who doesn't agree with them is called like that.

I'm from one of Baltic countries and I live next to Russians every day. There are good people among them, but majority is kinda.. well.. bad. They wont respect anyone's else traditions or culture. 

They only acknowledge they`r own language and traditions. There was video made by some Russians in in USA city where majority of people are Russians, I think it was called Brighton beach or something like that.

They was asked do they need English if they are living in USA, majority answered "No". Yet they still don't understand why none wants to be friendly with them.

 

I really hope that this can be resolved without army interference, because this makes me very uneasy too. Ukraine has ~17% Russians, we have 25%. Its matter of time before something like that happens here. Fifth column here active.

The situation of Crimea is engineered by local Russians there. Nobody would have touched them there, but they started rioting since Pro-russia government was tossed out. If one can believe wiki then Yanukovich has been convicted 3 times:

  1. Assault/robbery
  2. Assault
  3. Fraud

 

Now he has billion worth estate and bursting bank accounts, and governments money is no where to be found. How can even local Russians tolerate such thing?

 

Hopefully trough diplomatic pressure this can be solved. I hear that Japan is siding with NATO. Maybe that will force Putin into submission, since Japan is major power as well, and he cant hope to win war against such power against him.

But hopefully it wont come to that.



icykurt #50 Posted 02 March 2014 - 11:20 AM

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Jessssussssss.......... It's like Munich '38.

 

Will we have Chamberlin / Daladier, or Churchill / DeGaulle ?

 

Still, I guess Hitler didn't have Nuclear weapons :(

 

 



Valvalecia #51 Posted 02 March 2014 - 11:42 AM

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View PostTintor, on 02 March 2014 - 01:04 PM, said:

Spoiler

 


I was comparing russians living in Russian, and americans in US. I don't know the video but that situation is pretty much the same in any major in place where majority of people are from same foreign country/culture. I read a article that said the same but it was just about Turks or so, in Berlin, that they only spoke their own language at schools etc. as they had really no need to learn german as they worked for people from same culture, bought services and supplies from the etc.

I'd say you'd need not to worry unless "west" takes action against Russia as Crimea is autonomous rule with majority of russians. From what I've gathered even the russians in Crimea hated Janukovitch/Yanukovich and the reason they uprised was that the gov. was formed only of pro. EU, ex.opposition members. (not sure about this tho.)

We have to remember, that there's people in east.Ukraine that get their basics of life from Russia. If the country moves to EU and away from Russia these people will lose the basics of their life for undefined amount of time and with the pressure from the west on Ukraine so I really doubt they've choice but to fight.



ustroj_destroj #52 Posted 02 March 2014 - 11:42 AM

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View PostBreitenfeld1631, on 02 March 2014 - 10:36 AM, said:

Spoiler

 

 

Well it is good example of Russian government's point of view. Problem with it is that it is very far from reality.

 

1)New ukrainian government consists of many political parties. All of these parties have central or right-central political ideas. There is no ideas of fighting against russians, jews, gipsies or anyone else. Their enemies are Yanukovich (old president) and his representatives because of their criminal activities. One of the first thing they started is lustration process that will remove all criminals from state government. One political party don't like communists and wants to prohibit this party at Ukraine but even this can't be counted as fascism.

2)I have not seen any information about any man in Crimea that need to be protected. New ukrainian government doesn't move any additional troops or special forces to Crimea. New government did not created any new laws against people of Crimea. There is no reasons for fear or panics. The only persons who should worry are local Crimea government who are from Yanukovich clan and who seems like made several illegal actions. I have no proves of it so I'm careful with my words. If it is so then they are trying to set Crimea as independent state and be secured from Ukraine investigators and police.

3)Putin is not Russia. Ukraine has conflict not with Russia but with Putin. Most of russian and ukrainian people are friends and are speaking on similar languages and praying in similar churches and have common history and culture. There is no conflict between nations. There is conflict between Putin and nation that shown example of democratic victory. Events at Ukraine can be good example for opposition in Russia and Putin worries about it. He don't want to loose his power. This is why he tries to kick Ukraine while it is not stable. Other reason is feeling of Crimea movement to Ukraine in 1954 as unfair as I said earlier.

4)People from western parts of Ukraine do not hate russians. The only problem of russian visitor of western ukrainian city is language barrier. Meanwhile, people older than 35-40 years can speak russian and generally friendly to other nations including russian.



Tintor #53 Posted 02 March 2014 - 12:08 PM

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I'd say you'd need not to worry unless "west" takes action against Russia as Crimea is autonomous rule with majority of russians. From what I've gathered even the russians in Crimea hated Janukovitch/Yanukovich and the reason they uprised was that the gov. was formed only of pro. EU, ex.opposition members. (not sure about this tho.)

 

I need to worry at both cases. If west takes action it can spark war, if they don`t means that might as well not help us in case Russia makes move, since Ukraine has treaty with west.

 

What about non Russians living in Crimea? The Ukrainians and Tatars? They don't want Russia and they are ~40% of people living there.

Living in country that isn't your`s, its only normal that country will take direction that the natives want and not what immigrants/etc want.

 

Even in Russia people are protesting against war today, but they are quickly arrested. Seems like little Napoleon of Russia really wants it.. but West cant step back and show weakness against Russia.



Steffenkbh #54 Posted 02 March 2014 - 12:10 PM

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Soldiers from one country, crossing the border of another country, without any legal right = invasion.

In effect Ukraine and Russia are now at war.

 

 



Tintor #55 Posted 02 March 2014 - 12:21 PM

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Ukraine has treaty with Russia that allows them to use ports in Crimea for military purposes. Treaty stated number of soldiers, ships, planes etc. that can be stationed in Crimea.

Not sure if Russia has gone over the limit of treaty yet.



Valvalecia #56 Posted 02 March 2014 - 12:32 PM

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View PostTintor, on 02 March 2014 - 02:08 PM, said:

Spoiler

 

I doubt Russia has gone to this crazed warmonger mode all of a sudden, so I really don't think you have anything to worry unless this sparks in to some bigger event when every neighbor of Russia has something to worry about including Finland.

The russians in Crimea are as well citizens of it as are the ukrainians and the tatars. and nobody wants "this" war it just might the only way, as you said: neither the west nor Russia can't step back on this.

@ustroj_destroj   It's always the governments who start the wars and from that sparks the hate and anger between the people and throw in little propaganda there and voilà.
 



ustroj_destroj #57 Posted 02 March 2014 - 12:41 PM

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View PostTintor, on 02 March 2014 - 12:21 PM, said:

Ukraine has treaty with Russia that allows them to use ports in Crimea for military purposes. Treaty stated number of soldiers, ships, planes etc. that can be stationed in Crimea.

Not sure if Russia has gone over the limit of treaty yet.


Treaty is about base of russian fleet in Sevastopol city. Blocking airports, military bases, government buildings and passage to the other parts of Ukraine is far over limit of this treaty.



Hungarian_Patriot #58 Posted 02 March 2014 - 12:45 PM

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Do not be fooled by propaganda.

http://www.globalres...nge-ngo/5370072

 

These poor bastards have the choice of either being exploited by the EU/USA/Israel, or quasi being the part of the Russian empire. No good choice there. Due to historical reasons, it is not hard to make Ukrainians "fight against Russian oppression", but what they don't realise is that their current supporters are just as bad as the Russkies.


Edited by Hungarian_Patriot, 02 March 2014 - 12:51 PM.


Tintor #59 Posted 02 March 2014 - 12:54 PM

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True there, but one cant stay neutral else they can take beats from both. EU/USA just seems more liberal and better choice. 

 

@ustroj_destroj. They can tell its like military training.. + Crimean Minister President has asked for help from Russia. More than likely he was elected at gunpoint.



Danger__UXB #60 Posted 02 March 2014 - 12:57 PM

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View PostHungarian_Patriot, on 02 March 2014 - 11:45 AM, said:

Do not be fooled by propaganda.

http://www.globalres...nge-ngo/5370072

 

These poor bastards have the choice of either being exploited by the EU/USA/Israel, or quasi being the part of the Russian empire. No good choice there. Due to historical reasons, it is not hard to make Ukrainians "fight against Russian oppression", but what they don't realise is that their current supporters are just as bad as the Russkies.

People arnt ready for the truth??


Edited by Anti_NWO, 02 March 2014 - 01:08 PM.





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