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British sailing ships

ship history Britain

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Kristyna13 #1 Posted 05 August 2014 - 12:05 PM

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Hi, I need a help with my bachelor thesis. I need to know some opinions of British people about British sailing ships.What do you think about the importance of sailing ships in the history of Britain? Please, is there anyone who would help me?

X101 #2 Posted 05 August 2014 - 12:10 PM

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Better ask here http://forum.worldofwarships.eu/

 

Game is about ships and it's in Alpha there is s small community atm but most of them are Navy enthusiasts. Just log in with your WG account you use for WOT and start a topic.

 

I hope you find what you looking for GL.

 

 



Not_DangerUXB_Thats4sure #3 Posted 05 August 2014 - 12:19 PM

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Search 'Battle of Trafalger' and 'Crossing the T'...this tactic was 'Mabye' first used here ?..

 

!8th and 19th century warships are what made 'Britannia' rule the waves at the time...Very important to Englands history


Edited by Danger__UXB, 05 August 2014 - 02:42 PM.


Gremlin182 #4 Posted 05 August 2014 - 12:56 PM

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Bit of a broad topic but being an island nation ships have always been important to us.  to that end we at one time had a huge merchant fleet and a comparatively small professional navy to guard them.

 

This enabled us to "mostly" beat off the warships of other states even though they often made better ships.

It also helped that our opponents frequently placed a low priority on ships favouring Armies. this saved us more than once


Edited by Gremlin182, 05 August 2014 - 12:56 PM.


CrochetyOldGit #5 Posted 05 August 2014 - 01:26 PM

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I don't know where you're based but there are 3 examples of ships from the Age of Sail I am aware of:

 

HMS Victory in Portsmouth (UK)

HMS Trincomolee in Hartlepool (UK)

USS Constitution (Charlestown, Mass USA)

 

These may be worth a visit to get a 'feel'.



krazypenguin #6 Posted 05 August 2014 - 02:09 PM

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View PostDanger__UXB, on 05 August 2014 - 12:19 PM, said:

Search 'Battle of Trafalger' and 'Crossing the T'...this tactic was first used here and is still used to this day?..

 

!8th and 19th century warships are what made 'Britannia' rule the waves at the time...Very important to Englands history

 

I think it was tried before then by the Admiral that Nelson served under (possibly Lord Howe at the Glorious First of June - I am forgetful and cannot remember) but of course Nelson's implementation was the first major successful use of the tactic and remains one of the most famous examples.

 

OP - Not sure what you are hoping to get from your question.  Most British people would, I suspect, have little to no idea about the value of "British sailing ships", by which I presume you mean the Royal Navy, simply because it's just not something that the British education system really covers.  That said, try reading Peter Padfield's excellent "Martitime" trilogy of books which sums it up pretty well for me.



Not_DangerUXB_Thats4sure #7 Posted 05 August 2014 - 02:34 PM

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Had a quick check in wikipedia and looks like your right???....

 

Quote;

 

The leading British admirals like Howe devoted their thoughts to how to break the enemy’s line in order to bring on the kind of pell mell battle that would bring decisive results. At the Battle of the First of June in 1794, Lord Howe ordered his fleet to steer through the enemy, and then to engage the French ships from the leeward, so as to cut off their usual retreat. This had the effect of bringing his fleet into a melee in which the individual superiority of his ships would have free play.

Nelson's unorthodox head-on attack at the Battle of Trafalgar produced a mêlée that destroyed the Franco-Spanish fleet

Throughout the wars, which lasted, with a brief interval of peace, from 1793 to 1815, British admirals like JervisDuncan and particularly Nelson grew constantly bolder in the method they adopted for producing the desired mêlée or pell-mell action at the battles of Cape St. VincentCamperdown and Trafalgar. The most radical tactic was the head-on approach in column used by Nelson at Trafalgar, which invited a raking fire to which his own ships could not reply as they approached, but then produced a devastating raking fire as the British ships passed through the Franco-Spanish line.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naval_tactics_in_the_Age_of_Sail

 

Was interesting to check anyway??:smile:

 

Oh and just found out that tactic was made obsolete due to Aircraftcarriers??....So no used anymore :bajan:


Edited by Danger__UXB, 05 August 2014 - 02:46 PM.


__MAKO__ #8 Posted 05 August 2014 - 02:53 PM

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It’s important to remember the Royal Navy only became as powerful as it did because of the requirement for protection of the trading ships, It was the trading that Britain did all around the world that forced Britain into creating a powerful Navy.



TrailApe #9 Posted 05 August 2014 - 04:18 PM

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Quote

It’s important to remember the Royal Navy only became as powerful as it did because of the requirement for protection of the trading ships, It was the trading that Britain did all around the world that forced Britain into creating a powerful Navy.

 

And where the ships went, the merchants followed -  you want to make sure you get a good deal at source.

 

And then the Government thought about taxing the merchants and so sent the Army to 'protect' them.

 

And before you can say "Imperialism" you look around and you gone and got yourself an Empire.

 

In the immortal words of Eddy Izzard "Do you have a Flag?"

 

The advancement out of wood/sail technology into wood/metal/sail and then into metal/steam technology could all be driven by the lack of resources to easily replace our merchant and RN sailing stock. In the 19thC Britain was not known for it's huge forests of Oak (Cuthbert Collingwood, the 2nd in Command at Trafalgar would often plant acorns when out for walks when he was ashore - they were worried about resources even then) or massive pine forests, so there was no vested interests to hold back the move into ironclads and steam.

 

Something to explore possibly?

 



DB2212 #10 Posted 05 August 2014 - 11:57 PM

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View PostDanger__UXB, on 05 August 2014 - 01:19 PM, said:

 

 

!8th and 19th century warships are what made 'Britannia' rule the waves at the time...Very important to Englands Great Britain's history

I fixed that for you :smile:

 

OP, without sailing ships there would not have been an Empire. The Navy spread Britain's might throughout the world and we "ruled the waves"

Sail prevented invasion from the French and Spanish, it led to trade in spices, tea, wool etc which improved the average life in Britain.

 

Ships, both sail and steel were what made Glasgow the secomd city of the Empire. The Clyde was home to so many ship-builders that at one time, one fifth of all ships afloat were made in Glasgow - around 30,000 of them.

These ships traded all sorts from slaves, tea, cotton through to the steam trains that ran throughout the Empire. I believe there are still some Glasgow made steam trains running in various parts of the world!

 

Even now, the Jubilee Sailing Trust http://jst.org.uk/ab...-sailing-trust/ runs 2 square-rigged ships, the newer of the 2 launched in 2000. Maybe a slightly different slant on the thesis?

 



M1tchy #11 Posted 06 August 2014 - 10:12 AM

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Don't forget some of the explorers ships such as Cook's Endeavour http://en.wikipedia....i/HMS_Endeavour, or Shackleton's Endurancehttp://en.wikipedia....ance_(1912_ship)..

 

Tea clippers such as the Cutty Sark.  http://en.wikipedia....wiki/Cutty_Sark



TrailApe #12 Posted 06 August 2014 - 12:50 PM

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Just thinking about it, did the need to acquire the oak/pine to keep the huge merchant and RN stock going effect the foriegn policy of Britain and thus therefore effect todays map of Europe?

M1tchy #13 Posted 06 August 2014 - 07:16 PM

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View PostTrailApe, on 06 August 2014 - 12:50 PM, said:

Just thinking about it, did the need to acquire the oak/pine to keep the huge merchant and RN stock going effect the foriegn policy of Britain and thus therefore effect todays map of Europe?

Not too sure, but I believe some forests such as the New Forest were planted to help continue supplying timber for ship building, not just as hunting grounds for the King or upper classes.



Not_DangerUXB_Thats4sure #14 Posted 07 August 2014 - 12:30 PM

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View PostTrailApe, on 06 August 2014 - 12:50 PM, said:

Just thinking about it, did the need to acquire the oak/pine to keep the huge merchant and RN stock going effect the foriegn policy of Britain and thus therefore effect todays map of Europe?

What i do know is that at the time 'Priority' was given to the ship building industry due to the prevailing lack of 'Oak'??...

 

Oak was used also in the erection of most buildings at the time (Was used as the super-structure) but due to 'priorites'they actually started to use 2nd hand oak in the buildings...this oak was 'recycled' from the masts

of old or decomissiond ship masts/decking etc..I have seen this first hand in many buildings from the period (15th to 18th century) ...i even seen it in an old 'jacobean' building in Lymmington here in the UK..(Lymmington)

is mentioned in the 'Doomsday book)...So thats how far back the 'Oak problem' went?..

 

To this day the rareity continues as we we actually use American oak now,..We used to use French oak up until the 2nd world war but we had to stop using it as all there was a problem with the amount of bullets 

in the trees due to 2 world wars...Strange but true!! :smile:



DB2212 #15 Posted 07 August 2014 - 11:20 PM

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View PostTrailApe, on 05 August 2014 - 05:18 PM, said:

 

 

 

 

The advancement out of wood/sail technology into wood/metal/sail and then into metal/steam technology could all be driven by the lack of resources to easily replace our merchant and RN sailing stock. In the 19thC Britain was not known for it's huge forests of Oak (Cuthbert Collingwood, the 2nd in Command at Trafalgar would often plant acorns when out for walks when he was ashore - they were worried about resources even then) or massive pine forests, so there was no vested interests to hold back the move into ironclads and steam.

 

 

 

http://www.woodlandh...-forest-of-dean

 






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