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M41 Walker Bulldog op?

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Vadon90 #41 Posted 16 December 2014 - 12:00 AM

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A solid tier 8 light tank if it had a bit more hp and slightly better accuracy with the autoloader.

ustroj_destroj #42 Posted 16 December 2014 - 12:07 PM

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I think M41 should be compared with german TD WFE100. M41 has very good gun and mobility. On the other hand it is big (compare it with t71 or ELC AMX) and it is very visible. Even with camo perk and camouflage it is spotted in most cases. Add low HP to this and you will have visible big sized tank with low HP. Three shots from any nonLT and you are in garage. How can anyone call it OP?

ustroj_destroj #43 Posted 16 December 2014 - 12:13 PM

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View PostVadon90, on 16 December 2014 - 12:00 AM, said:

A solid tier 8 light tank if it had a bit more hp and slightly better accuracy with the autoloader.

 

I agree. 1100-1200 HP and it will be good t8 LT. Now it is good tier 7 LT.

azakow #44 Posted 16 December 2014 - 12:51 PM

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View Postustroj_destroj, on 16 December 2014 - 12:07 PM, said:

I think M41 should be compared with german TD WFE100. M41 has very good gun and mobility. On the other hand it is big (compare it with t71 or ELC AMX) and it is very visible. Even with camo perk and camouflage it is spotted in most cases. Add low HP to this and you will have visible big sized tank with low HP. Three shots from any nonLT and you are in garage. How can anyone call it OP?

Utter nonsense.



Omnichr0n #45 Posted 16 December 2014 - 12:52 PM

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4k dmg done and got second badge with mine yesterday... I guess I could have spotted more of course, but someone is doing very well in this tank these days.

 

Imo. it is too strong as it is.



ustroj_destroj #46 Posted 16 December 2014 - 03:02 PM

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View Postazakow, on 16 December 2014 - 12:51 PM, said:

Utter nonsense.

 

Your opinion is very important to me.

Eila_Juutilainen #47 Posted 16 December 2014 - 04:31 PM

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View Postustroj_destroj, on 16 December 2014 - 03:02 PM, said:

 

Your opinion is very important to me.

 

He is, however, right. The camo rating of the M41 WB is a bit low at 14%, compared to 15-17% on most of the other tier 7 LTs, but it's not that bad. Only Aufkl. Panther has a bad camo rating, namely a mere 10%. M41 WB is perfectly capable of remaining unseen.

ustroj_destroj #48 Posted 16 December 2014 - 05:17 PM

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View PostEila_Juutilainen, on 16 December 2014 - 04:31 PM, said:

 

He is, however, right. The camo rating of the M41 WB is a bit low at 14%, compared to 15-17% on most of the other tier 7 LTs, but it's not that bad. Only Aufkl. Panther has a bad camo rating, namely a mere 10%. M41 WB is perfectly capable of remaining unseen.

 

You are wrong because you are looking at camo rating only. M41 is bigger than other light tanks and in battle it will mean that you can hide ELC in bush or behind building without any problems but you can't do it with M41. Bigger size also means that your enemy have more chances to hit you. Your HP lets you to get 2 hits only (from nonLT). 3rd hit = garage.

 



Eila_Juutilainen #49 Posted 16 December 2014 - 05:42 PM

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View Postustroj_destroj, on 16 December 2014 - 05:17 PM, said:

 

You are wrong because you are looking at camo rating only. M41 is bigger than other light tanks and in battle it will mean that you can hide ELC in bush or behind building without any problems but you can't do it with M41. Bigger size also means that your enemy have more chances to hit you. Your HP lets you to get 2 hits only (from nonLT). 3rd hit = garage.

 

 

It's a little bit high, that's true, but otherwise it's not much larger than my WZ-132. In fact, I think my WZ is slightly longer. The WZ also doesn't have great gun depression but which M41 WB does, meaning it can hide itself in hills much better than the other lights, which have mediocre or even bad depression. So, no. Still not wrong.

Edited by Eila_Juutilainen, 16 December 2014 - 05:42 PM.


Obsessive_Compulsive #50 Posted 16 December 2014 - 05:58 PM

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View PostMkH, on 18 November 2014 - 02:21 PM, said:

 

http://ftr.wot-news....-1410444155.jpg

 

 

In my opinion it should be compared to t8, because it is matched as a t8. Previously arty used to have similar matchmaking.

 

And I don't see it winning t8 tanks in 1 vs 1.

 

circle of death king tiger soup anyone?

ustroj_destroj #51 Posted 16 December 2014 - 06:53 PM

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View PostEila_Juutilainen, on 16 December 2014 - 05:42 PM, said:

It's a little bit high, that's true, but otherwise it's not much larger than my WZ-132. In fact, I think my WZ is slightly longer. The WZ also doesn't have great gun depression but which M41 WB does, meaning it can hide itself in hills much better than the other lights, which have mediocre or even bad depression. So, no. Still not wrong.

 

If we are talking about hiding behind hills using gun depression then I don't see big advantages of M41. It has 8 degrees vertical depression angle while T71 has 7 and T49 has 10 degrees. So M41 has average parameters here and it can't be compared with t29/t32/t34 'family' famous by their hulldown tactics. Maybe comparably to LT of other nations we can see advantages in gun depression of M41 but we are not discussing nations. So, yes. You are still wrong.



Eila_Juutilainen #52 Posted 16 December 2014 - 07:10 PM

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View Postustroj_destroj, on 16 December 2014 - 06:53 PM, said:

 but we are not discussing nations.

 

Actually, we were. What we weren't discussing was heavy tanks. So, you're wrong. Even more than before.

 

I only brought up gun depression to illustrate that Walker Bulldog is capable of hiding itself in terrain where other light tanks can't, because they don't have gun depression. Add in the fact that it's camo rating, while the third-lowest of tier 7 LTs, is not sub-par and that the size is pretty okay except maybe the height but again that's fixable with depression.

So, Azakow and I are right, and you're not. QED.



ustroj_destroj #53 Posted 16 December 2014 - 09:00 PM

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View PostEila_Juutilainen, on 16 December 2014 - 07:10 PM, said:

I only brought up gun depression to illustrate that Walker Bulldog is capable of hiding itself in terrain where other light tanks can't, because they don't have gun depression. Add in the fact that it's camo rating, while the third-lowest of tier 7 LTs, is not sub-par and that the size is pretty okay except maybe the height but again that's fixable with depression.

So, Azakow and I are right, and you're not. QED.

 

I know why you have told about gun depression and I have shown that this depression is not unique. All comparable american LT have same depression and T49 has much better depression. So T41 have no advantages here and it can't hide itself better than other tanks. Its camo rating is far from good and it is biggest LT.

 

So Azakow and you are wrong and I am right.

 

btw, if you still think we are talking about nations here then try to read topic title.



Eila_Juutilainen #54 Posted 16 December 2014 - 09:25 PM

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View Postustroj_destroj, on 16 December 2014 - 09:00 PM, said:

 

I know why you have told about gun depression and I have shown that this depression is not unique.

 

It kinda is? T71 comes close at -7, AMX 13 has only -6 and a rear turret . WZ-131 is down to -5 and LTTB closes with a piss poor -3. Walker Bulldog has -8 on the autoloader and -10 on the single-shot gun, which is a lot better than the rest.

 

View Postustroj_destroj, on 16 December 2014 - 09:00 PM, said:

All comparable american LT have same depression and T49 has much better depression.

 

"All comparible American LT" is literally just one vehicle, T71. T49 has better or equal depression depending on which gun M41 uses, but it's got atrocious aim time that leaves it wide open. Also, it's a tier 8 and thus I have no idea why you're adding it, when you apparently refuse to compare to the other tier 7 LTs.

 

 

View Postustroj_destroj, on 16 December 2014 - 09:00 PM, said:

Its camo rating is far from good and it is biggest LT.

 

It's camo rating is fine when the others have only 1-2% more and it's not the largest LT, that's Aufklahrungspanzer Panther. Which is quite a big margin larger, and is the only tier 7 LT that has bad camo rating.

 

View Postustroj_destroj, on 16 December 2014 - 09:00 PM, said:

btw, if you still think we are talking about nations here then try to read topic title.

 

I don't see why the topic title matters? The subject is Walker Bulldog being OP or not, and to determine that you need to compare it to other tanks. And if we're to discuss only the M41, then why do you bring up other tanks yourself? Not to mention the ELC AMX is not exactly an American tank...

 

View Postustroj_destroj, on 16 December 2014 - 09:00 PM, said:

So Azakow and you are wrong and I am right.

 

No, we're quite definitely right and you're just grasping at straws to try and dismiss logical arguments. And even at that you fail, because you're saying things that are just flat-out wrong.


Edited by Eila_Juutilainen, 16 December 2014 - 09:31 PM.


ustroj_destroj #55 Posted 16 December 2014 - 10:59 PM

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View PostEila_Juutilainen, on 16 December 2014 - 09:25 PM, said:

 

No, we're quite definitely right and you're just grasping at straws to try and dismiss logical arguments. And even at that you fail, because you're saying things that are just flat-out wrong.

 

You are completely wrong in all your statements. I don't even hope you will be able to understand my arguments cause you for some reason don't want to see obvious facts and ignore reality. It is nonsense to repeat all facts again because I pretty sure you can't or don't want to get it. It is your choice but I'm absolutelly right and you are wrong.



Eila_Juutilainen #56 Posted 17 December 2014 - 12:07 AM

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View Postustroj_destroj, on 16 December 2014 - 10:59 PM, said:

 

You are completely wrong in all your statements. I don't even hope you will be able to understand my arguments cause you for some reason don't want to see obvious facts and ignore reality. It is nonsense to repeat all facts again because I pretty sure you can't or don't want to get it. It is your choice but I'm absolutelly right and you are wrong.

 

Wow, even after I point out all the things wrong and contradictive in your posts you're still going on like this? The only person ignoring reality here is you. It's sad to see how much you try to twist things just to try to be right, that you've even run out of actual arguments and need to try to insult me. You even try to claim that rock-hard facts like size and camo comparisons are wrong, in what twisted reality do you live?


Edited by Eila_Juutilainen, 17 December 2014 - 12:11 AM.


MetalManiac69 #57 Posted 17 December 2014 - 12:19 AM

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give it up. he's either a troll or another waste of WG's server resources...

Vadon90 #58 Posted 17 December 2014 - 12:46 AM

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View Postustroj_destroj, on 16 December 2014 - 11:13 AM, said:

 

I agree. 1100-1200 HP and it will be good t8 LT. Now it is good tier 7 LT.

Let me rephrase that:

It would be a solid tier 8 light tank if it had more hp and is currently overpowered like hell compared to other tier 7 lights.

This tank is better than the t71 and the t71 was the best tier 7 light tank before this was released...



Inkarnadine #59 Posted 17 December 2014 - 10:01 AM

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Would a slight nerf to the accuracy and aimtime maybe defuse the super-damage potential of the M41 WB?

 

Like it does on the Tier 6 US Light tank T21, that in theory has the same dpm as the T37 but really does not reach it because of its poor accuracy and aimtime (for a scout) as well as a reduced penetration.

The M41 WB could still dish out heavily, more so than most Tier 8 meds, but it would require more care and closer ranges as it would be fitting for scouts (even though new map designs tend to make that difficult).

 

 



azakow #60 Posted 17 December 2014 - 11:31 AM

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View Postustroj_destroj, on 16 December 2014 - 03:02 PM, said:

 

Your opinion is very important to me.

What excatly makes my opinion important to you?







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