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WG "does not consider artillery to be a problem"


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Blue_Badger #381 Posted 12 April 2015 - 03:40 PM

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View PostElement6, on 12 April 2015 - 02:35 PM, said:

Sarcasm?

 

To me it was like crazywest was describing the situation exactly as it is today, and has been for years.

 



RogDodgeUK #382 Posted 12 April 2015 - 03:41 PM

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View PostBlue_Badger, on 12 April 2015 - 02:28 PM, said:

 

No, we meant why is WoT not just an arcade and why WoWP is.

 

Where is the official communication from WG that stat's this or are you getting your information from unofficial sources or are you making this decision as to what constitutes 'arcade' and what doesn't?

Element6 #383 Posted 12 April 2015 - 03:45 PM

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View PostBlue_Badger, on 12 April 2015 - 03:40 PM, said:

 

So you are laughing about the fact that artillery has, for years, actually made you just accpet the situation and deal with a shell or two to shave 2/3 of your HP in one go? Seems a bit odd :)



Hold_The_Door #384 Posted 12 April 2015 - 03:45 PM

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View PostBlue_Badger, on 12 April 2015 - 03:40 PM, said:

 

 

hook line and sinker just too easy haha

Element6 #385 Posted 12 April 2015 - 03:48 PM

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View Postcrazywest, on 12 April 2015 - 03:45 PM, said:

 

hook line and sinker just too easy haha

I hope this takes some of the edge off the fact that you hate it when they bomb you. 

 

Laugh isn't on me dude :)



Sickie79 #386 Posted 12 April 2015 - 04:17 PM

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View PostRogDodgeUK, on 12 April 2015 - 01:41 PM, said:

 

So WG develops a game that has historical tanks that fully function as their historical counter part

 

I just need to ask you one question my friend...

 

Do you honestly, really, truly believe that a real world, early 20th century, indirect firing artillery piece is capable of accurately hitting a single moving vehicle at range whilst out of line of sight???

 

This is your idea of historical accuracy?

 

I'm just curious dude, nothing really to do with the arty thread here, it's just, well, it kind of sounds like that's what you actually think.

 

Forgive me if I'm wrong, perhaps I've just seriously misunderstood what your trying to say, but it does kind of sound like you think it could do that.

 



Blue_Badger #387 Posted 12 April 2015 - 04:23 PM

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View PostRogDodgeUK, on 12 April 2015 - 02:41 PM, said:

 

Where is the official communication from WG that stat's this or are you getting your information from unofficial sources or are you making this decision as to what constitutes 'arcade' and what doesn't?

 

Wait. Is this not what you are doing? I'm still waiting for an explanation. 

Sidney_Snot #388 Posted 12 April 2015 - 05:36 PM

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Having read so many of the posts on this thread it is obvious that everyone agrees arty needs a serious work over. I have played several arty and found it almost impossible to control a game with them, although the FV304 used to be a little better than most because of it's ability to move around the battlefield and use it's ROF & half decent accuracy.

 

I think WG introduced the T5-6-7 Brit arty as an experiment to see if arty which had minimal range and low alpha, but a quick firing (by arty standards) accurate gun was a feasible way to deal with the arty issue. Personally I believe it worked rather well. Unfortunately so many players were unable to understand the need to either keep moving or to find proper cover which could protect them from the FV304's affections and the complainers managed to get the FV304 nerfed, not content with preventing the FV from manouvering it was decided to nerf the accuracy, aim and reload times and now the huge accuracy nerf has for me at least driven the final nail into the coffin. IMO no arty is worth playing now, I sold the M12 several months ago because it was impossible to predict whether it would hit or miss, I don't play lotteries in any form.

 

Wargaming made an exceptionally good game, that took some genuinely skilled and creative people, if those people are still involved they must realise it is time to either fix the issues with arty or simply remove them from the game. I have had some fun playing many of them, however I am now feeling cheated because of the back door methods they have used to finally make them unusable in any tactical way. If you are playing arty and have a noob team the chances are you will be destroyed before getting a chance to fire, let alone hit anything. That is ridiculous, it is every bit as pointless and as much fun as I'd imagine it is using a bot.

 

Just take arty out of the game, nerfing it to the point it cannot hit anything doesn't help anyone, because it only adds another level of utter frustration to all of us who play the game.

 

Look at my stats below, I was stupid enough to think I would be able to hit things with my FV304, but during the last month since patch 9.6, I have hit almost nothing with it across many tens of games. It isn't just arty either, I am also trying to adapt the way I play all my tanks to compensate for the loss of any accuracy their guns once had. The game seems to be getting worse in every patch, or maybe I'm the only person who thinks this way, I'm certainly finding my games are less fun. Being rolled over by higher tiered heavies because I can't hit weak spots at reasonable ranges enabling them to keep coming forward on full health, there are only so many places a lower tier tank can run.

 

It's not just arty that is a problem, with changes to everything that took some skill to do, the whole game is rapidly becoming more of a lottery and consequently much less appealing.


Edited by Sidney_Snot, 12 April 2015 - 05:51 PM.


amashi #389 Posted 12 April 2015 - 07:36 PM

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at last WG has admitted like an abusing father/Alcoholic/drug addict, that they have a problem with Arty.

 

May GabeN Bless WG and make them stronger for the trial ahead...

 

 

 


Edited by amashi, 12 April 2015 - 07:37 PM.


Asghaad #390 Posted 13 April 2015 - 09:08 AM

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View PostSidney_Snot, on 12 April 2015 - 05:36 PM, said:

... I'm certainly finding my games are less fun. Being rolled over by higher tiered heavies because I can't hit weak spots at reasonable ranges enabling them to keep coming forward on full health, there are only so many places a lower tier tank can run.

 

It's not just arty that is a problem, with changes to everything that took some skill to do, the whole game is rapidly becoming more of a lottery and consequently much less appealing.

 

have you ever considered how that two tiers higher heavy driver feels when some lower tier punk just comes along and puts shot after shot after shot through its FRONTAL armor ?

 

just contemplate for a second the idea that heavies should be the hardest tanks to deal with from the front in the entire game (think E-75, or ST-I) instead theyr armor is full of holes anyone can exploit (and no it doesnt requie any skill, just install hitzone skin pack ... just another way to cheat in this game ...)



pitypanggg #391 Posted 13 April 2015 - 09:38 AM

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View PostAsghaad, on 13 April 2015 - 09:08 AM, said:

 

have you ever considered how that two tiers higher heavy driver feels when some lower tier punk just comes along and puts shot after shot after shot through its FRONTAL armor ?

 

just contemplate for a second the idea that heavies should be the hardest tanks to deal with from the front in the entire game (think E-75, or ST-I) instead theyr armor is full of holes anyone can exploit (and no it doesnt requie any skill, just install hitzone skin pack ... just another way to cheat in this game ...)

 

Although the main problem is not even that, but the part where the accuracy buff before finished active scouting off. And they did not reverse that fully. But I think it would be enough in both cases if only not fully aimed shots would be less accurate, while fully aimed ones could be even more accurate. Same for arty btw, that could help (although arty needs more change, but this one would already be a good start).



Hedgehog1963 #392 Posted 13 April 2015 - 10:24 AM

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View PostSidney_Snot, on 12 April 2015 - 04:36 PM, said:

Having read so many of the posts on this thread it is obvious that everyone agrees arty needs a serious work over.

 

Nope.

 

Didn't read the rest.



rikkelt #393 Posted 13 April 2015 - 10:45 AM

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View PostHedgehog1963, on 13 April 2015 - 10:24 AM, said:

 

Nope.

 

Didn't read the rest.

 

Perhaps you are just not able to see the problem because

you don't play high tiers

you are bad and often die before arty could shoot you

you play mostly LTs.

 

Spoiler

 



gpalsson #394 Posted 13 April 2015 - 11:07 AM

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View PostAsghaad, on 13 April 2015 - 08:08 AM, said:

 

have you ever considered how that two tiers higher heavy driver feels when some lower tier punk just comes along and puts shot after shot after shot through its FRONTAL armor ?

 

just contemplate for a second the idea that heavies should be the hardest tanks to deal with from the front in the entire game (think E-75, or ST-I) instead theyr armor is full of holes anyone can exploit (and no it doesnt requie any skill, just install hitzone skin pack ... just another way to cheat in this game ...)

You realize that you just compared arty to a guy with no skill who installed cheat to compensate - right?

Besides being a terrible terrible comparison because they have little to do with each other, it makes no sense.

Covering weakspots is a skill you have to use driving HT, not arty.

If you get punched to bits to tanks 2 tiers lower in you E75, you are doing it wrong.

You can't however, angle your way out of arty.

 

 

If broken arty was fixed, I might start to find the game fun again.

At the moment, as soon as I am considering logging on, I remember how dreadful arty is for the game and start up Steam instead.

It has been almost a month since I last played WoT. I'm just not feeling it at the moment and as AW draws closer to CBT, I am more and more starting to feel like that is the only option to be free of the arty idiocy that WG seems hellbent on forcing on everyone.

It's sad really, because I have a decent garage in WoT, but nothing will make me come back if AW is a bit like WoT but without the broken base clicking.

 

 


Edited by gpalsson, 13 April 2015 - 11:16 AM.


Slyspy #395 Posted 13 April 2015 - 11:15 AM

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View PostSidney_Snot, on 12 April 2015 - 05:36 PM, said:

Having read so many of the posts on this thread it is obvious that everyone agrees arty needs a serious work over. 

 

You read through this thread and this is your conclusion? Strange. I would have thought that a better conclusion would be "no one can agree on what the problem is (or that there is even a problem) let alone what is the best way of tackling the problem (if it exists) to the satisfaction of all in a manner which would be feasible for the operators of the game".

 

Oh, and fast firing arty is the worst type of arty IMO, although in general I have no issue with arty. Just to throw my hat into the ring.



Blue_Badger #396 Posted 13 April 2015 - 01:41 PM

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View PostSlyspy, on 13 April 2015 - 10:15 AM, said:

 

You read through this thread and this is your conclusion? Strange. I would have thought that a better conclusion would be "no one can agree on what the problem is (or that there is even a problem) let alone what is the best way of tackling the problem (if it exists) to the satisfaction of all in a manner which would be feasible for the operators of the game".

 

Oh, and fast firing arty is the worst type of arty IMO, although in general I have no issue with arty. Just to throw my hat into the ring.

 

Dunno man. I thought it was, "just about everyone agrees bar a few folk you can count on one hand."

 

But hey, those few people seem to feel they are qualified to speak for the silent majority whereas the rest of just aren't representative of anything. 

 



Hedgehog1963 #397 Posted 13 April 2015 - 07:57 PM

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View Postrikkelt, on 13 April 2015 - 09:45 AM, said:

 

Perhaps you are just not able to see the problem because

you don't play high tiers

you are bad and often die before arty could shoot you

you play mostly LTs.

 

Spoiler

 

I play a lot of LTs and prefer artillery to be in the game when I'm in one.  Why should other players decide whether artillery should be changed?

 

And it means Snot was wrong from the get-go.


Edited by Hedgehog1963, 13 April 2015 - 07:58 PM.


XPuntar #398 Posted 13 April 2015 - 08:33 PM

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View PostAsghaad, on 13 April 2015 - 09:08 AM, said:

 

have you ever considered how that two tiers higher heavy driver feels when some lower tier punk just comes along and puts shot after shot after shot through its FRONTAL armor ?

 

just contemplate for a second the idea that heavies should be the hardest tanks to deal with from the front in the entire game (think E-75, or ST-I) instead theyr armor is full of holes anyone can exploit (and no it doesnt requie any skill, just install hitzone skin pack ... just another way to cheat in this game ...)

 

Rare are tanks that can actually do exactly that even with "premium ammo".

 

Most of the time lower tiers have extremely hard time to even pen 2 tier higher heavies!

 

And on top of all that Tier 4 is the worst in that regard! TIER 4!

 

At tier 4 there are numerous tanks with quite bad guns yet they are constantly matched against t6 heavies like KV-2, T-150, KV-85, M6, ...

 

It is just a nightmare to get constatnly derped in those weak T4 tanks by those Russian heavies and other TD alpha behemoths, while player has trouble to even pen them from the back!


Edited by XPuntar, 13 April 2015 - 08:40 PM.


Slyspy #399 Posted 13 April 2015 - 10:00 PM

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View PostBlue_Badger, on 13 April 2015 - 01:41 PM, said:

 

Dunno man. I thought it was, "just about everyone agrees bar a few folk you can count on one hand."

 

But hey, those few people seem to feel they are qualified to speak for the silent majority whereas the rest of just aren't representative of anything. 

 

 

There are entrenched positions on both sides of the discussion and none of them are worth a damn.

_CHAPMAN__2 #400 Posted 13 April 2015 - 10:41 PM

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View PostSidney_Snot, on 12 April 2015 - 05:36 PM, said:

Having read so many of the posts on this thread it is obvious that everyone agrees arty needs a serious work over. I have played several arty and found it almost impossible to control a game with them, although the FV304 used to be a little better than most because of it's ability to move around the battlefield and use it's ROF & half decent accuracy.

 

I think WG introduced the T5-6-7 Brit arty as an experiment to see if arty which had minimal range and low alpha, but a quick firing (by arty standards) accurate gun was a feasible way to deal with the arty issue. Personally I believe it worked rather well. Unfortunately so many players were unable to understand the need to either keep moving or to find proper cover which could protect them from the FV304's affections and the complainers managed to get the FV304 nerfed, not content with preventing the FV from manouvering it was decided to nerf the accuracy, aim and reload times and now the huge accuracy nerf has for me at least driven the final nail into the coffin. IMO no arty is worth playing now, I sold the M12 several months ago because it was impossible to predict whether it would hit or miss, I don't play lotteries in any form.

 

Wargaming made an exceptionally good game, that took some genuinely skilled and creative people, if those people are still involved they must realise it is time to either fix the issues with arty or simply remove them from the game. I have had some fun playing many of them, however I am now feeling cheated because of the back door methods they have used to finally make them unusable in any tactical way. If you are playing arty and have a noob team the chances are you will be destroyed before getting a chance to fire, let alone hit anything. That is ridiculous, it is every bit as pointless and as much fun as I'd imagine it is using a bot.

 

Just take arty out of the game, nerfing it to the point it cannot hit anything doesn't help anyone, because it only adds another level of utter frustration to all of us who play the game.

 

Look at my stats below, I was stupid enough to think I would be able to hit things with my FV304, but during the last month since patch 9.6, I have hit almost nothing with it across many tens of games. It isn't just arty either, I am also trying to adapt the way I play all my tanks to compensate for the loss of any accuracy their guns once had. The game seems to be getting worse in every patch, or maybe I'm the only person who thinks this way, I'm certainly finding my games are less fun. Being rolled over by higher tiered heavies because I can't hit weak spots at reasonable ranges enabling them to keep coming forward on full health, there are only so many places a lower tier tank can run.

 

It's not just arty that is a problem, with changes to everything that took some skill to do, the whole game is rapidly becoming more of a lottery and consequently much less appealing.

 

It's a shame fv304 got nerfed although you have to admit it felt OP in the right hands and not because of the arty itself but because of the people that didn't know how to deal with it when it was in the enemy team. 

I remember back when i used to play it that i had this poor is3 which i kept tracked while i slowly sucked the whole 1450 hp points out of his tank.  He begged me to stop, he started to curse when he saw i had no intentions to stop but it was the most he could have done. He couldn't even defend himself or find himself a cover, it was just me deciding whether to let him survive or not.  

Back then fv304 reloaded in about 10 seconds, had very high arc shooting over houses , rocks and other tall obstacles and it also featured probably the best accuracy any arty has ever had. The aim circle was so small that you could've picked which part of the tank to shoot at. Engine , tracks, cannon , you name it, hardly fail at hitting the desired spot. 

Was it fair for whoever had to endure its punishment after falling into the trap? Nope , not really because like i said there was NOTHING to be done that would save a tank out of fv304 rain of shells. 

Now i'm playing the fv3805 with the fv207 gun and it is somehow balanced as an arty. I can get that lucky shot that deals 1200 hp damage , or i can have an average 400-500 hit or even a complete miss while being fully aimed.  It gets frustrating but you also have to remember the moments when you had those unexpected high rolls hits. 

It's the ConquerorGC that looks OP but i'll know better when i'll have it(unless they nerf it by that time).






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