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Ribba #1 Posted 02 June 2015 - 01:41 PM

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It's been some time since I've been around, but I know there is a lot of knowledge here that I could need (compared to the car forums I usually attend), so I need some advices.

 

With the vacation money and the tax return is right around the corner, and I have promised myself a new gaming rig for quite some time now to celebrate that event. My original plan was this rig:
NZXT H440 Midi Tower
Corsair RM850, 850W PSU
Intel Core i7-5930K, Socket-LGA2011-3 6-Core,3.5GHz
Corsair H60 Hydro Series 
MSI X99S GAMING 7
HyperX Fury 2133MHz 32GB
Gainward GeForce GTX TITAN X 12GB PCI-Express 3.0
Crucial BX100 250GB 2.5” SSD SATA 6GB/s (OS disc)
Crucial® MX200 500GB 2.5” SSD SATA 6GB/s (game disc)
Seagate Barracuda® 1TB (aux disc)

 

But while I waited and planed and waited some more while planing even more, the GFX980 Ti has arrived. It's almost as powerful as the Titan X, but it as vastly cheaper. This made me do some extra research to what to do.


And what I found out, it is that even if my planed rig that will do very well when it comes to 1080p, the gaming industry is at a crossroad and UHD is starting to emerge. And no current GPU's, Titan X nor the 980 Ti or the 295x2 is powerful enough to reliable handle the current or the future games in 4k. Even dual GPU's isn't strong enough. Fair enough, I did look at a triple Titan X setup, and maybe it could handle it, but it was a bit over my budget. 

 

I know that the if I go for the rig I have planed, even with a 980Ti, I have no worries if I stick to 1080p for the next 4 years (thats the expected life time for my new gaming rig). But I do not currently have a budget to make a gaming rig for the 4k generation. Because even if my budget is flexible enough for a SLI setup with two 980Ti's, I still need some screens for handling 4k. 

 

So as I see it, I'm down to 4 choices, and I need some advices to which to choose.

 

Choices 1: I stick to my original plan (maybe adjust it down a 980 Ti), and stick to care free 1080p gaming for the next 4 years.
Choices 2: I go for the 4k experiences, buy two 980Ti's and a new screen (now or later). 
Choices 3: I go for a future 4k experiences, so that I stick to high end stuff on most components, but save money on a "cheap" GPU (960 or a 970) now, and then go for an GPU upgrade in a couple of years.
Choices 4: I go for an interim PC that is good enough for 1080p, but cut down the life time expectancy to a couple of years and then go for a completely new 4k PC when there is hopeful GPU's that is strong                      enough for 4k gaming. This way I go for mid-end or low high end components and save a bunch of money. I would need a suggestion to such a PC.



Blackcell29_LV #2 Posted 02 June 2015 - 01:48 PM

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If you doesn't use that computer for Rendering and graphic designer work you must be stupid to throw money out :)

 

oh and tip on 4k gaming 2x GTX 970 OC version handle alright :)


Edited by gvidix2, 02 June 2015 - 01:49 PM.


Dr_ownape #3 Posted 02 June 2015 - 01:50 PM

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choice 4. So much is in flux at the moment in PC gaming and in less than year we should see some massive changes.

 

3d screens

DDR4

sprout

Oculus

 


Edited by brownape, 02 June 2015 - 01:53 PM.


SuedKAT #4 Posted 02 June 2015 - 02:10 PM

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View PostRibba, on 02 June 2015 - 01:41 PM, said:

Choices 4: I go for an interim PC that is good enough for 1080p, but cut down the life time expectancy to a couple of years and then go for a completely new 4k PC when there is hopeful GPU's that is strong                      enough for 4k gaming. This way I go for mid-end or low high end components and save a bunch of money. I would need a suggestion to such a PC.

There are GPU's that or rather SLI configs that are strong enough for 4k gaming, but they are a bit pricey, I run Crysis 3 at 4k using 3 Nvidia GTX Titan @ 1340 Mhz.

However if I didn't work in the field I'd settle with way less and even though you might get a really future safe computer in terms of raw performance, but that won't guarantee that it's future safe. Remember a couple of years back when Vista was new, bought my self a killer laptop back then, the performance is great on it even today, but due to lack of support for DirectX 10 and above it's still quite limited, just as an example. I'd build a system which was great for 3 years into the future, ok for 2 years more and then upgrade part by part to gain what you feel you need at the time.



Ribba #5 Posted 02 June 2015 - 09:45 PM

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View Postgvidix2, on 02 June 2015 - 12:48 PM, said:

If you doesn't use that computer for Rendering and graphic designer work you must be stupid to throw money out :)

 

oh and tip on 4k gaming 2x GTX 970 OC version handle alright :)

 

Well, we have very different opinions about what is stupid or not. In my world, using money on something you want, or on something you can afford or n something that satisfies the intention you bought it in the first place, it is never stupid.... regardless of how much it costs. On the other hand, using money on something you don't want, on something you cannot afford or on something that don't satisfies the intention to why you bought it, it is a stupid purchase.... regardless how little you purchased it for.

 

The reason why, it's because I'm not a casual gamer, but an enthusiast gamer. Compromises is something that enthusiast avoid if possible. 

 

For instance, you are going to buy a new PC and you have a €5000 budget. There are two alternative PC's, one at €5000 and the other one for €1000. The one at €5000 covers all your needs, while the one at €1000 covers most your needs. If you are a casual gamer, the €1000 PC is the smart choice, but for an enthusiast gamer, it's a stupid purchase, simply because it will not satisfy your needs. So you then uses a thousand euro on something that you really don't want.

So the €5000 PC is the obvious choice for an enthusiast. 

 

And regarding your statement that 970 SLI is good enough for 4k, well, its not. 970 in SLI has about the same power as a single Titan X. And the Titan X don't handle 4k very well, and the Titan X doesn't have the negative effects of SLI or mulitcore GPU's. All power is available to you all the time. Of course, you can play in 4k with both the Titan X and two 970's, but usually you have to do compromises. Either live with poor frame rate (30-40 on big name games), or reduce the level of details and effects. And cards that already are struggling now, they will be obsolete in very short time.

 

But a Titan X (and 970 SLI) do WQHD rather well. But then again, that's a compromise between HD and UHD.



Ribba #6 Posted 02 June 2015 - 10:11 PM

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View PostSuedKAT, on 02 June 2015 - 01:10 PM, said:

There are GPU's that or rather SLI configs that are strong enough for 4k gaming, but they are a bit pricey, I run Crysis 3 at 4k using 3 Nvidia GTX Titan @ 1340 Mhz.

However if I didn't work in the field I'd settle with way less and even though you might get a really future safe computer in terms of raw performance, but that won't guarantee that it's future safe.

Well, I had no intentions on buying a tripple Titan X setup :), but I agree with you that there is no safe buys. 

 

I bought my first PC in 1996. My second PC I bought in 1999. My third one in 2001. Then a new one in 2004, and then again in 2007 and my current one in 2011.

 

My first one was a mid-range PC, but it was absolutely obsolete in 1999, even if I bought a 3dfx Voodoo-card mid-life. The 1999 was a low end PC during the first part of my student years, and it pretty much struggled from the start. I had a good summer job in 2001, and then bought me a decent mid range PC in 2001. But it also was obsolete by the time I bought a new one in 2004. Now that I was working, I could afford a very mid-range PC. But when 2007, that PC was also under-performing. By 2007, I could allow myself bigger budgets, so that PC was my first (low)high end PC. And when 2010 came, it still did it job. So for the first time, I had a PC longer then 3 years. But in early 2011 the motherboard on my backup PC (the one from 2004), so I decided to buy a new one, the one that I have now. it was is also a (low)high-end PC, and it still does it jobs quit well. But there is some massive titles that have arrived the last year that I know will mean adjusting down the level of details. 

 

So even if you cannot be certain what the future brings, you can reduces the risk by investing some extra money. Both my more expensive PC have had a longer life-time expectancy then I predicted (I had given them 3 years), and this time I have increased the budget so that I can get myself a (mid)high-end PC. So I have no trouble believing that if I buy the rig that I have looked at, it will easily do 4 years.... with FHD or QHD-playing that is. But that 4k hype is ruining my plans. :arta: 


Edited by Ribba, 03 June 2015 - 02:53 AM.


SastusBulbas #7 Posted 02 June 2015 - 11:09 PM

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Currently even with three Titan X 4K is not the experience it should be, sure you will get reasonable FPS on the high end titles, but the monitor panels are not the greatest and many still have issues, image scaling, TN panels, stuttering and tearing, if you want 60fps you need DisplayPort 1.2 which displays two 1920×2160 tiles at 60 fps each as HDMI or DisplayPort 1.1 send a single signal up to 3840×2160 at a 30Hz refresh rate.

 

I had planned 4k this year too, either three AMD 290's, or two Nvidia 980's, or two AMD 390's, but simply find too many compromises and the power requirements and pricing for current ability not good value. I am putting it off another year or so to see how it pans out. Not really enough game or movie 4K content I want at the moment anyway.



Ribba #8 Posted 03 June 2015 - 02:39 AM

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View PostSastusBulbas, on 02 June 2015 - 10:09 PM, said:

Currently even with three Titan X 4K is not the experience it should be, sure you will get reasonable FPS on the high end titles, but the monitor panels are not the greatest and many still have issues, image scaling, TN panels, stuttering and tearing, if you want 60fps you need DisplayPort 1.2 which displays two 1920×2160 tiles at 60 fps each as HDMI or DisplayPort 1.1 send a single signal up to 3840×2160 at a 30Hz refresh rate.

 

I had planned 4k this year too, either three AMD 290's, or two Nvidia 980's, or two AMD 390's, but simply find too many compromises and the power requirements and pricing for current ability not good value. I am putting it off another year or so to see how it pans out. Not really enough game or movie 4K content I want at the moment anyway.

 

Yeah, but my current PC has had a hard life and has earned its right for an easier existence as a backup PC or as a PC for a non-gamer. And it's not strong enough for the tougher titles any more even in 1080p. So I need a new PC this year.

 

So what would you recommend then, choices 1, 3 or 4?



Sixense #9 Posted 03 June 2015 - 03:01 AM

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It would help if you posted your current rig, but my choice would be No. 4. Why?

 

Skylake coming later this year or early next, can't quite remember, and Radeon 3XX series coming this year, but next or after 2 years we should see 4XX and uh, something like GTX 1080? :D which might be near the performance of Titan X for like half the price?

 

I'd say get a 4690K or 4790K with Z97 and a GTX 970, and save the cash for Xmas 2016. Might as well get a H110i or a custom loop for extra 400~ EUR and OC that hardware into space.



ammarmar #10 Posted 03 June 2015 - 03:19 AM

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If you plan to play in 4K, you will find out that it is surprisingly hard to find a decent 4K monitor with a reasonable price. Cheaper ASUS and Samsung screens are all TN and are simply... bad.

It's kind of strange, since there are so many good 4K TVs available...

 

Personally, I went for GTX 970. Everything more is overkill. What's the point, if every bloody game is designed to work on consoles first, so you can forget better textures and details?



aikin9 #11 Posted 03 June 2015 - 05:33 AM

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this is the wrong forum for this kind of thread..

Ribba #12 Posted 03 June 2015 - 07:21 AM

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View PostSixense, on 03 June 2015 - 02:01 AM, said:

It would help if you posted your current rig, but my choice would be No. 4. Why?

 

Skylake coming later this year or early next, can't quite remember, and Radeon 3XX series coming this year, but next or after 2 years we should see 4XX and uh, something like GTX 1080? :D which might be near the performance of Titan X for like half the price?

 

I'd say get a 4690K or 4790K with Z97 and a GTX 970, and save the cash for Xmas 2016. Might as well get a H110i or a custom loop for extra 400~ EUR and OC that hardware into space.

 

My current and almost obsolete PC:
MSI X58A-GD65, Socket-1366
Corsair HX 1000W PSU
Intel Core? i7 Quad Processor i7-950
Corsair XMS3 DDR3 1600MHz 12GB CL9
ZOTAC GeForce GTX 570 1280MB PhysX CUDA
Western Digital VelociRaptor® 300GB
Western Digital Caviar® Black 1TB
Windows Ultimate 7
 

Besides, the 980Ti has almost the power of the Titan X at almost half the price. And I'm not much of an over clocker. I prefer running pretty much stock, mostly because I prefer a care free gaming experience.  

 



Thunderbird_Two #13 Posted 03 June 2015 - 08:24 AM

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I would go for a suitable x99 board so I could use a  samsung xp941 M.2 pcie drive with approximately 2x the performance of the ssd you are looking at.

I would also go for the 980 ti and go SLI at a later date if needed.

 

ps you might want to look at extra wide format screens instead of 4k too. 

 

Enjoy spending your giant pile of cash :)

 



KRUPP__STEEL #14 Posted 03 June 2015 - 11:13 AM

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spend what you feel, I paid well over 2000 pounds for mine and my graphics card was 800 pounds. but its great to have a pc that can handle anything with ease, like with most things you get what you pay for, and if you have the funds handy go for it,

KRUPP__STEEL #15 Posted 03 June 2015 - 11:15 AM

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and the titan x is the best graphics card I have ever owned, and I have had loads, its a monster.

signal11th #16 Posted 03 June 2015 - 11:19 AM

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Humm I'm still running a Core 2 Duo and I can run every game (Witcher 3 , GTA 5 ) at 1920 on high/ultra anyway, There's casual gamers,enthusiast gamers and then there's clever gamers, You really don't need a 5k rig to run anything. My rig cost me 600 quid (ebay, second hand stuff) and still performs.

Edited by signal11th, 03 June 2015 - 11:19 AM.


Strange_Neighbour #17 Posted 03 June 2015 - 12:03 PM

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You just gave me a hard on...

But I still don't think I'd ever spend that sort of money on a PC.

Maybe on WoT tho... :rolleyes:



Amkal #18 Posted 03 June 2015 - 12:15 PM

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Imo, noone will ever need gpu with 4k support, not on PC anyway. So OP may still go for 'regular' gtx970. Also not sure why would a gamer need more the quad core cpu. i5 should be plenty for any game in the foreseeable future. Might invest in good cooling/power supply for oc purposes  and this rig will still be viable after 4-5 years.

Sixense #19 Posted 03 June 2015 - 12:19 PM

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View PostRibba, on 03 June 2015 - 06:21 AM, said:

 

My current and almost obsolete PC:
MSI X58A-GD65, Socket-1366
Corsair HX 1000W PSU
Intel Core? i7 Quad Processor i7-950
Corsair XMS3 DDR3 1600MHz 12GB CL9
ZOTAC GeForce GTX 570 1280MB PhysX CUDA
Western Digital VelociRaptor® 300GB
Western Digital Caviar® Black 1TB
Windows Ultimate 7
 

Besides, the 980Ti has almost the power of the Titan X at almost half the price. And I'm not much of an over clocker. I prefer running pretty much stock, mostly because I prefer a care free gaming experience.  

 

 

Wow, I was looking in the fleaBay for 2nd hand parts similar to this :D

 

I'd still say wait till Xmas next year, and for this year get a Xeon X5650 (£60) ~ X5670 (£100) and a 970, should be plenty of power for 1080p. Also invest in a SSD for OS and keep VC for games. The Xeons are cheap 6-core CPUs that pack a punch, add a AIO cooler on it, or even a 212evo for £25 and look up OCing those things (they run way cooler than i7).

 

That will keep you till end of next year by spending like £500 and you can transfer the 970 and your hard drives to the uber rig when you get it. Skylake should come down in price by then, or we might even have something like Skylake-E by then.

The main concern is Skylake, first batches will probably be crap anyway, better wait a bit to let Intel sort themselves.



mirri_maz_duur #20 Posted 03 June 2015 - 12:31 PM

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View PostRibba, on 03 June 2015 - 06:21 AM, said:

 

My current and almost obsolete PC:
MSI X58A-GD65, Socket-1366
Corsair HX 1000W PSU
Intel Core? i7 Quad Processor i7-950
Corsair XMS3 DDR3 1600MHz 12GB CL9
ZOTAC GeForce GTX 570 1280MB PhysX CUDA
Western Digital VelociRaptor® 300GB
Western Digital Caviar® Black 1TB
Windows Ultimate 7
 

Besides, the 980Ti has almost the power of the Titan X at almost half the price. And I'm not much of an over clocker. I prefer running pretty much stock, mostly because I prefer a care free gaming experience.

 

 

Mine is sort of similar, which I built in Nov. 2009.

GA-EX58-Extreme skt 1366.

Corsiar HX1050 (was HX1000 but died)

Intel i7 920 - default.

Corsair Dominator 1600Mhz - 6GB

Gigabyte 6870OC in CF (originally 4870 X2 in CF)

WD 300GB Velociraptor - Vista Ult. 64bit

WD 300GB Velociraptor - Windows 8.1 64bit.

WD 1TB - backup clone of Vista.

Samsung F3 - backup clone of Windows 8.1

Seagate 1TB USB - storage.

Samsung T220 - 22" monitor - 1680 x 1050

Dell 2408WFP - 24" monitor - 1920 x 1200

etc..


 

Lack of funds doesn't allow me to build a new one unfortunately, unless I win the Lottery. :)


 

Still works for me, and usually manage 30-35fps with WoT. Not brilliant I know, but at least I can play - badly. :)


 


 


 


 


Edited by Trillock1945, 03 June 2015 - 12:36 PM.





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