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New Spähpanzer SP 1.C. Thoughts?


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ValiantOverlord #1 Posted 29 June 2015 - 11:56 PM

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So Im sure you guys have seen that there is a new light tank replacing the Aufklärungspanzer Panther.

Just wondering what your guys' thought are on this new light tank? I took it for a spin on the test server and it seems like a fun little tank, even though the stats are not the greatest (compared to some other t7 lights).

 



Tazilon #2 Posted 30 June 2015 - 02:57 AM

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View PostValiantOverlord, on 29 June 2015 - 10:56 PM, said:

So Im sure you guys have seen that there is a new light tank replacing the Aufklärungspanzer Panther.

Just wondering what your guys' thought are on this new light tank? I took it for a spin on the test server and it seems like a fun little tank, even though the stats are not the greatest (compared to some other t7 lights).

 

 

 

Auf P is better and should remain in the game in some way,



Lancasthor #3 Posted 30 June 2015 - 07:47 AM

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Different > Better.

We really dont want new vehicles to overperform the older ones by default.

 

SP 1.C. Seems to have some unique properties and probably worth a spin, maybe a new home for my next campaign reward crew.

Still, just like Taz, i'd like to keep Aufkl. P. because of it's tricky style and challenging but capable potential.



azakow #4 Posted 30 June 2015 - 09:27 AM

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View PostLancasthor, on 30 June 2015 - 07:47 AM, said:

Different > Better.

We really dont want new vehicles to overperform the older ones by default.

 

SP 1.C. Seems to have some unique properties and probably worth a spin, maybe a new home for my next campaign reward crew.

Still, just like Taz, i'd like to keep Aufkl. P. because of it's tricky style and challenging but capable potential.

SPIC will be tricky and challenging aswell.

A PM reward crew might not be sufficient fpr successful gameplay.



tnk_x5000 #5 Posted 01 July 2015 - 12:44 PM

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The SP 1C is slow for a light tank. In the video you call it fast, but I am sure you are not a light tank player yourself. The tank is an armor-less medium, not an actual light tank.

 

On paper it does not look any better that the Auf.Panther:

- non existent armor, compared to the Auf.Panther

- sluggish as hell for a light tank - even the T21 is more mobile, despite the low max. speed

- pathetic view range for the tier - what is this?

+ good, though slow, gun

+ much smaller

+ option for an autoloader

 

I fear, that the replacement will be simply bad, but not as fun as the Recoon Panther. I won't be too mad, if this tank does not get tagged as scout, though.



azakow #6 Posted 01 July 2015 - 02:51 PM

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i found the "slowness" of the SPIC to determine the playstyle alot. Successfull LTing does not always mean to exploit high speed, high RoF or high camo ratings.

not being classified/tagged as scout means +2 MM and would result in borderline OPness, a little like Ke-Ho.

i see the SPIC as armorless, autoloading mobile TD with punch (, but i also see the E-25 as a turretless high RoF LT.)

IMO, the armorless MT approach will not be as successful as on Aufkl. Panther, since most vehicle attributes do not support this kind of gameplay.

the LTing mantra: do not get hit is as important as for ELC gameplay, but two tiers higher.
depending on the location of impact, your engine will burn, your diver will be dead, the gunner or commander buys a farm or the ammo rack will die.
your HP pool will enable you to take two shots moslty, but in addition each shot taken will cause one of the above, rather expensive.

i've played 75 matches on CT server.

leoneazzurro #7 Posted 01 July 2015 - 02:55 PM

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I also have the same perplexities. I played some games on the test server and my thoughts are:

- terrain resistance seems quite bad

- Shell velocity is horrible

- quite slow to aim

+ autoloader

- autoloader has much less clip damage potential than other tanks (Bulldog) even if it has a shorter reload

+ camo seems good

 

 



Eila_Juutilainen #8 Posted 01 July 2015 - 11:02 PM

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SPIC will have it's viewrange buffed to 400m in the next round of testing.

 

 

View Postleoneazzurro, on 01 July 2015 - 02:55 PM, said:

- autoloader has much less clip damage potential than other tanks (Bulldog) even if it has a shorter reload

 

But it also unloads it's clip the fastest of all tier 7 lights with an autoloader. Putting aside dispersion and aiming and whatnot, with 3 seconds between shots it empties in 6 seconds. That's even faster than the AMX 13 57.



Tazilon #9 Posted 02 July 2015 - 06:47 AM

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View PostEila_Juutilainen, on 01 July 2015 - 10:02 PM, said:

SPIC will have it's viewrange buffed to 400m in the next round of testing.

 

 

 

But it also unloads it's clip the fastest of all tier 7 lights with an autoloader. Putting aside dispersion and aiming and whatnot, with 3 seconds between shots it empties in 6 seconds. That's even faster than the AMX 13 57.

 

So you compare it to the worst Tier VII Scout and want us to think it is good?

azakow #10 Posted 02 July 2015 - 08:02 AM

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0.9.9 CT server:

Stock view range 370m, top turret view range 400m



Eila_Juutilainen #11 Posted 02 July 2015 - 08:30 AM

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View PostTazilon, on 02 July 2015 - 06:47 AM, said:

 

So you compare it to the worst Tier VII Scout and want us to think it is good?

 

...not really? No idea where you're getting that from. I'm merely pointing out that the downside of low clip damage is offset by an upside of a quick unloading time. It really ticks me off when people drool on M41WB's 1500 damage per clip, without realizing just how long the thing needs to expose itself to actually do it.

 

Also, no idea where you're getting that it's the weakest tier 7 LT, it seems to do okay statistically; about middle of the pack. A lot of players like it from what I know.


Edited by Eila_Juutilainen, 02 July 2015 - 08:33 AM.


leoneazzurro #12 Posted 02 July 2015 - 09:03 AM

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View PostEila_Juutilainen, on 01 July 2015 - 11:02 PM, said:

SPIC will have it's viewrange buffed to 400m in the next round of testing.

 

 

 

But it also unloads it's clip the fastest of all tier 7 lights with an autoloader. Putting aside dispersion and aiming and whatnot, with 3 seconds between shots it empties in 6 seconds. That's even faster than the AMX 13 57.

Yes, it is true, even if shells on AMX are much faster and this helps in some cases. Moreover, if a shot goes wide, you lose in this case 1/3rd of the clip. Anyway, that's a mere comparison with Bulldog, and Bulldog is indeed quite OP in the autoloader clip department.

 

View PostTazilon, on 02 July 2015 - 06:47 AM, said:

 

So you compare it to the worst Tier VII Scout and want us to think it is good?

I find the AMX13/75 quite worse than the 13/57, but it could be only me. Anyway, for me it was quite fun, I also used it in team battles with fair results.

 

View Postazakow, on 02 July 2015 - 08:02 AM, said:

0.9.9 CT server:

Stock view range 370m, top turret view range 400m

 

Yes, now I feel the tank being much better that in the first iteration. Yesterday, first battle and aced. It seems also the terrain resistance is improved as the tank feels much more nimble, even if is still not the best at acceleration. Also the shell velocity and gun handling seem improved a little. In this iteration I feel it's not yet the Bulldog, but it is anyway a good tank.

Eila_Juutilainen #13 Posted 02 July 2015 - 09:09 AM

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View Postleoneazzurro, on 02 July 2015 - 09:03 AM, said:

Yes, it is true, even if shells on AMX are much faster and this helps in some cases. Moreover, if a shot goes wide, you lose in this case 1/3rd of the clip. Anyway, that's a mere comparison with Bulldog, and Bulldog is indeed quite OP in the autoloader clip department.

 

Yeah, missing a shot carries a higher waste potential, though if the tank carries enough of them I probably wouldn't care to much. And let's not forget that SPIC has the best penetration for an autoloader. In fact, second-best penetration amongst it's peers entirely, beaten by 1mm by WZ-131's 100mm gun, which to my knowledge has worse depression accuracy and aimtime.

 

Maybe it's just because I hate doomsaying, but the SPIC is starting to look like a decent damage-oriented light tank to me.



azakow #14 Posted 02 July 2015 - 10:37 AM

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View Postleoneazzurro, on 02 July 2015 - 09:03 AM, said:

 Also the shell velocity and gun handling seem improved a little.

I agree, shells feel different now. Gun handling I did not notice.

 

View PostEila_Juutilainen, on 02 July 2015 - 09:09 AM, said:

Maybe it's just because I hate doomsaying, but the SPIC is starting to look like a decent damage-oriented light tank to me.

It is decent and dmg oriented.

 

 

The only challenge remaining is the 3x autoloader.

During a usual attack run on other autoladers, i.e. AMX 1390 I will fire about three shells, seldomly 4 and very rarely 5+.

This will always give you a chance to react to surprises, because you have 2-3 shells left in you clip.

My hit rate is 78% on AMX 1390.

 

I found, that to take out SPG9/10 mostly three shells are required.

Hence my metric to attack any targets is, less than 450 HP in order to anticipate the one shot missing and a possible low dmg roll.

 

I also found, that if you kill a target with your 1st shell and you cannot immediatly shoot other targtes, then it is best to reload.

The reload time will enable me to assess the current battle situation and to disapear from the opponents radar, maybe even relocating as well.


Edited by azakow, 02 July 2015 - 10:39 AM.


Tazilon #15 Posted 04 July 2015 - 03:26 AM

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View Postleoneazzurro, on 02 July 2015 - 08:03 AM, said:

Yes, it is true, even if shells on AMX are much faster and this helps in some cases. Moreover, if a shot goes wide, you lose in this case 1/3rd of the clip. Anyway, that's a mere comparison with Bulldog, and Bulldog is indeed quite OP in the autoloader clip department.

 

I find the AMX13/75 quite worse than the 13/57, but it could be only me. Anyway, for me it was quite fun, I also used it in team battles with fair results.

 

 

Yes, now I feel the tank being much better that in the first iteration. Yesterday, first battle and aced. It seems also the terrain resistance is improved as the tank feels much more nimble, even if is still not the best at acceleration. Also the shell velocity and gun handling seem improved a little. In this iteration I feel it's not yet the Bulldog, but it is anyway a good tank.

 

 

If you compare the 13 75 top the 13 57 side by side, you will discover the 13 75 has better hard stats.



UNARMOURED #16 Posted 04 July 2015 - 08:34 AM

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I've only just bought the AufPanther on the way to the Leopard. I didn't realise they were replacing it.

I see the trend to make all high LT damage dealers continues.

leoneazzurro #17 Posted 04 July 2015 - 03:15 PM

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View PostTazilon, on 04 July 2015 - 03:26 AM, said:

 

 

If you compare the 13 75 top the 13 57 side by side, you will discover the 13 75 has better hard stats.

 

Depends, terrain resistance is much better on 57, so it is more manouverable and this helps a  lot.

Tazilon #18 Posted 04 July 2015 - 07:58 PM

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View Postleoneazzurro, on 04 July 2015 - 02:15 PM, said:

 

Depends, terrain resistance is much better on 57, so it is more manouverable and this helps a  lot.

 

Terrain resistance is offset by 17% less horsepower.  Neither have good agility

Edited by Tazilon, 04 July 2015 - 07:59 PM.


leoneazzurro #19 Posted 04 July 2015 - 08:11 PM

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Yes, it has lower HP but nevertheless the TR is so low that it is more agile than its brother on most terrains. Not that is lightning fast, just a little more nimble and this you can really feel. Still nowhere near the LTTB or Bulldog, but somewhat better.

 

http://www.tanknumbe...75&config=elite

 

http://www.tanknumbe...75&config=elite

 

Also the 57 version has better turning speed (48 d/s  vs 40 d/s)


Edited by leoneazzurro, 04 July 2015 - 08:13 PM.


Tazilon #20 Posted 05 July 2015 - 06:45 PM

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View Postleoneazzurro, on 04 July 2015 - 07:11 PM, said:

Yes, it has lower HP but nevertheless the TR is so low that it is more agile than its brother on most terrains. Not that is lightning fast, just a little more nimble and this you can really feel. Still nowhere near the LTTB or Bulldog, but somewhat better.

 

http://www.tanknumbe...75&config=elite

 

http://www.tanknumbe...75&config=elite

 

Also the 57 version has better turning speed (48 d/s  vs 40 d/s)

 

 

I have them both.   The 13 75 is the worst normal Tier VII Scout.   The 13 57 is just as bad,  I'm not saying they aren't fun to play.  I'm just saying they are not good compared to the other Tier VII Scouts.


Edited by Tazilon, 06 July 2015 - 04:42 AM.





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