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Fynnegun #1 Posted 07 December 2015 - 11:40 AM

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Hey,

 

Season Two will start next year as you know, here's a few changes we are thinking about after your feedback, please provide constructive thoughts:

  • Like / good.
  • Dislike / not good.
  • Improvements or suggestions about it.
  • Anything other than this.

 

Changes:

  • Auctions
    • Auctions become an alternative mechanism of entering the map instead of "all" provinces.
    • Auctions will work on limited amount of provinces (with minimum income). 
  • Landings
    • Landing provinces will become unprofitable to own.
    • The landing province owner will get into the tournament. 
  • Economy
    • Review of main costs according to results of statistics check. 
    • Divisions' maintaining mechanics changed/removed. 
    • ELO rating recount to increase provinces income.
  • Ransacks
    • Ransacking mechanics re-introduced without changes (like old GM).
  • Combat consumables
    • Removed for rework.

 

Thanks!

 

Decept1on



Monster95alpha19 #2 Posted 07 December 2015 - 12:38 PM

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View PostDecept1on, on 07 December 2015 - 10:40 AM, said:

 

    • Ransacking mechanics re-introduced without changes (like old GM).
  • Combat consumables
    • Removed for rework.

 

Great.This was needed to be done.

 

View PostDecept1on, on 07 December 2015 - 10:40 AM, said:

  • The landing province owner will get into the tournament. 

This is bad.Why a clan that already owns the province gets to defend it by redoing the capturing tournament.The owner should fight only the clan that gets through every other clan from the tournament like it was on the old GM.

 

View PostDecept1on, on 07 December 2015 - 10:40 AM, said:

  • Economy
    • Review of main costs according to results of statistics check. 

hopefully, its more than it was by a great difference, otherwise, the battle will still remain only on key provinces or not at all.

 

Overall: good changes with some little adjustments to be done



The007thDreeson #3 Posted 07 December 2015 - 12:40 PM

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1. By "Combat consumables" if u mean air/arty strinke...don't rework them...remove them totally from game,they r just destroying Clan War battles and make them unenjoyable
2. If u already puted fines for not entering battles than give us back encounter battles or something to delay battles (i think someone ll try to hold at least 4 provinces on global map tier 10...and if someone organize some group clan attack on u...what? u should have every day at least 60 players online at same time for Clan War? i'm not sure does WG know that but players still have life outside this game (like school,jobs,family..etc))..or just remove fines for not entering battles...

 

These two points players require from first day of new global map and u still didnt do anything useful about that.

Now less important thing..

1.Please organize maps on provinces...don't make us play sand river/El halluf in mid of Europe

 

View PostDecept1on, on 07 December 2015 - 10:40 AM, said:

  • The landing province owner will get into the tournament. 

I agree with Titanu about this one..What is point to take province if u have to play for that one every next day all over again.

 

 

 


Edited by EvilPanda_HaxUser, 07 December 2015 - 12:44 PM.


arthurwellsley #4 Posted 07 December 2015 - 12:54 PM

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I presume that the main aim WG has to to get more clans, and thus more players onto the map, and break the stranglehold of some clans on the map. I make this assumption based on a business model of trying to keep more paying customers involved in end game play. With that in mind;

 

Changes:

  • Auctions
    • Auctions become an alternative mechanism of entering the map instead of "all" provinces. = BAD, all provinces should be available by auctions so that clans can pick and chose maps and owners according to how much "influence" that they have.
    • Auctions will work on limited amount of provinces (with minimum income). BAD see above for reasoning.
  • Landings
    • Landing provinces will become unprofitable to own. GOOD = means the owner will be forced to move on, and less likely to try and sit on it, thus freeing it up for others.
    • The landing province owner will get into the tournament. GOOD = means that an owner must fight more to keep ownership, and due to having limited hours to play will not try to hold too many provinces. Trying to get even the best clans to only hold one or two provinces frees provinces for other clans, any mechanic that promotes this is to be encouraged, to widen the CW playerbase.
  • Economy
    • Review of main costs according to results of statistics check. -UNCLEAR - what does this mean for the players? Please be more specific if you want feedback.
    • Divisions' maintaining mechanics changed/removed.  -UNCLEAR - what does this mean for the players? Please be more specific if you want feedback.
    • ELO rating recount to increase provinces income. -UNCLEAR - the clans elo rating will now have something to do with province income? what are you trying to say?
  • Ransacks
    • Ransacking mechanics re-introduced without changes (like old GM). - GOOD produces more dynamic play and movement, and de-stabilises ownership.
  • Combat consumables
    • Removed for rework. - GOOD - produced too much rng/randomness to CW.


The007thDreeson #5 Posted 07 December 2015 - 01:13 PM

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View Postarthurwellsley, on 07 December 2015 - 12:54 PM, said:

  • Landings
    • Landing provinces will become unprofitable to own. GOOD = means the owner will be forced to move on, and less likely to try and sit on it, thus freeing it up for others.
    • The landing province owner will get into the tournament. GOOD = means that an owner must fight more to keep ownership, and due to having limited hours to play will not try to hold too many provinces. Trying to get even the best clans to only hold one or two provinces frees provinces for other clans, any mechanic that promotes this is to be encouraged, to widen the CW playerbase.


inexperienced clans have desire to enter map and get some gold,experienced clans have desire to get as much as possible gold per day.

those less experienced clans see those more experienced clans how they farm gold and at this new map they start to think...if we can't outplay them in battle we ll make them not able to play every battle...and again what is point in that,when those same less experienced clans do not have the capacity to play at that level (enough active players per night,tanks and other stuff) but they want more gold because they still see those other clans managing to do it!?

So if u "block" more experienced clans they ll just stop playing CW and turn to ESL.Why? If u have 30 to 45 players online every night for CW what is point to play whole month so 1 player can get like 500 to 1000 gold when u can go and play 2-3h ESL and get 1500 gold per player every 2/3 days.

If u block less experienced clans than they are not able to land on the map,because more experienced clans are holding every possible "
entrance".

So i think somehow u need to reorganize and make better clans with more capacitance to play at tier 8 and let tier8 and 6 for clans that still need some experience to get.

U ll get constant mostly fair fight on the map but if u do something like that than u have new problem. and the main question will be "why all clans can't choose where to fight"
So whatever u do it can't be perfect.
Early days of new global map in my opinion worked fine,evryone was eble to find place on map for themselves,but as I said it had lack of 2 things. (look at my 1st post - 1. and 2. point)

Old map worked 100% fine,it just needed more provinces.


Edited by EvilPanda_HaxUser, 07 December 2015 - 01:25 PM.


RaeudigerRonny #6 Posted 07 December 2015 - 01:28 PM

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What will the gold-income for a cw-player for 1 month be like? If you keep it at the level of Season 1, you will loose a lot of competitive players to ESL/other games. I dont want to play 2-3 Battles/day and at the end of the month not even being able to pay for premium. While im getting 60€ and ~8k gold in the same time, for the same effort in ESL.

The007thDreeson #7 Posted 07 December 2015 - 01:34 PM

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View PostDomstadtkerl, on 07 December 2015 - 01:28 PM, said:

What will the gold-income for a cw-player for 1 month be like? If you keep it at the level of Season 1, you will loose a lot of competitive players to ESL/other games. I dont want to play 2-3 Battles/day and at the end of the month not even being able to pay for premium. While im getting 60€ and ~8k gold in the same time, for the same effort in ESL.

 

Exactly.

fryboy1975 #8 Posted 07 December 2015 - 01:39 PM

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Landings
  • Landing provinces will become unprofitable to own.

 

Will u still get some gold for winning the landing???

 

I feel you should get something for the playing through a tournament, don't get me wrong i do agree with it being unprofitable but i feel you should be rewarded for taking it.....



Azusa_right_in_the_pusah #9 Posted 07 December 2015 - 01:44 PM

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Their argument is that not everyonne can play ESL, or wants to. So therefore the gold income is balanced at a much lower amount

3 years ago I was amazed i got 100 gold from CW, now when people see anywere between 1000 and 1500 they are like : why only this much?

I hope you see where I'm getting at. I believe the amount of gold in T8/6 and 10 should be raised, but clans want to get the most in the end. 

If everyone suddenly started playing ESL the competition would rise there as well and so are the chances to get gold.

 

Maybe bonus gold for top 20ish in a season would be a good addition? We probably won't win it again after that heppens but who knows :D


Edited by Azusa_, 07 December 2015 - 01:46 PM.


The007thDreeson #10 Posted 07 December 2015 - 01:52 PM

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View PostAzusa_, on 07 December 2015 - 01:44 PM, said:

Their argument is that not everyonne can play ESL, or wants to. So therefore the gold income is balanced at a much lower amount

3 years ago I was amazed i got 100 gold from CW, now when people see anywere between 1000 and 1500 they are like : why only this much?

I hope you see where I'm getting at. I believe the amount of gold in T8/6 and 10 should be raised, but clans want to get the most in the end. 

If everyone suddenly started playing ESL the competition would rise there as well and so are the chances to get gold.

 

Maybe bonus gold for top 20ish in a season would be a good addition? We probably won't win it again after that heppens but who knows :D


Well Azusa u have some good points there but about competition in ESL.

Lets talk about adria part (part for balkan players (Croatia;Serbia,Bosnia..etc))
We have most active teams/players looked by sections and what they do by that...if we get more confirmed teams at some cup..next cup we ll get more gold as reward...if we get less confirmed teams next cup we ll get less gold...so,it's not rly "if there is more teams there ll be less rewards"

 

So if we r plaing CW for nothing,there is not rly point to play it.


Edited by EvilPanda_HaxUser, 07 December 2015 - 01:55 PM.


Fynnegun #11 Posted 07 December 2015 - 04:30 PM

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Thanks for your input guys.

What I'm sharing here is just a sketch of what we want to implement and since you asked to be a bit more involved in the development this is why I'm asking your feedback before "it goes live" as a forced change.

I already shared my concerns about the "owner in landing" to devs and the fact that is perceived negatively. They said it should only be for some provinces so I'm waiting to see the "final" form.

 

I understand that it's perceived negatively to have the "owner in landing" because it is then uncomfortable to keep lands but then we try to find some rules to keep the activity running and avoid camping/farming, so if you have any alternative idea, I'm open for suggestion.

 

Apart from the "owner in landing", it looks like the changes are "accepted" so far, is there any change you'd like to see with that season two ?



Wyrda1 #12 Posted 07 December 2015 - 05:01 PM

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View PostDecept1on, on 07 December 2015 - 04:30 PM, said:

I understand that it's perceived negatively to have the "owner in landing" because it is then uncomfortable to keep lands but then we try to find some rules to keep the activity running and avoid camping/farming, so if you have any alternative idea, I'm open for suggestion.

 

Apart from the "owner in landing", it looks like the changes are "accepted" so far, is there any change you'd like to see with that season two ?

 

Why do you want to restrict the "farming/camping" so hard? The best clans on the server should be able to get loooads of gold. After all they deserve it.

For me it was great to see PTS farm shitloads of gold ~2-3 yers ago or later FAME farming 19k gold for one day. And you have to fight for that.

But it is not cool if top clans who want to earn gold have to field 3-4 teams every evening on Tier X front.

 

Another change I'd like is to rework the province upgrade system, if that is not included in the economics. It is stupid that province upgrading is only profitable up to Tier IV.

Adjust the system to make the province tiers profitable up to Tier X for the very best clans on the server.



Endranii_PL #13 Posted 07 December 2015 - 10:27 PM

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View PostWyrda1, on 07 December 2015 - 04:01 PM, said:

Another change I'd like is to rework the province upgrade system, if that is not included in the economics. It is stupid that province upgrading is only profitable up to Tier IV.

Adjust the system to make the province tiers profitable up to Tier X for the very best clans on the server.

Yep the cost of getting the prov on the 10lvl should be around at most 4.5-6.5K as not only you can lose it while losing the lvl of the province but also from time to time the map is wiped, and guess what we doesn't get the refund of influence for the province upgrading we hade done before the event.

 

As for playing one t10SH you only get 120-140inf at avarage so it gives you at least 35 battles on t10 SH for upgrading the prov to 10lvl if we say that you need 4500inf to do so, you also have to get in mind that we don't win all the battle and it gets even worse. 



wallsh #14 Posted 08 December 2015 - 03:37 AM

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The most fun time of the CWs i think when the clans try to conqueror lands unfortunately in the past it was too effective to make a lot of allinance and sit on already owned lands and farm a lot of gold whitout a real battle.  Most of the people like CW's because of the memorable fights,rivalries and the gold income just the little extra motivation. The ransack option tryes to courage people to attack but i think in the end this is too little and holding the lands is more profitable in the long run. This situation is the ultimate stagnation and i think nobody really enjoyed it. Whit a few expectation everybody had a same goal. Conquer as much land as possible and hold as long as possible.

We need other mechanic which force people to move constantly for better income. I propose 2 new mechanics which inspire clan leaders to organize their clans for constants active game play on the global map.

 

I. Income degeneration(prevent farming)

Basically the newly conqueror province will provide the first day 100% of the province income. After the 2nd day this income will start to shrink by a little margin like 5 or 10% dayly (it can reach 0). It will be less and less profitable to hold and more and more profitable to move to the next province. To avoid back and fort province trades between alliance clans there will be a cool down mechanics which will restrict an income for several days from a lost province but only for the previous owner. This will inspire clans to move and fight continuously.

 

Explanation whit an example:

If "A" clan conqueror a province the income in the first day will be like 600 gold, the second day will be 540 3rd day 480 4th day 420. In the 5th day "A" clan lost this province and the province get a 7 day cool down only for the "A" clan. If "A" clan acquire it back in the next day it will not generate income until the 7 day cool down holds. B clan which win against the "A" clan for this province get the full 600 gold on the 6th day(B clans first day on the province) but if they lost it to C clan in the 7th day the B clan also had a cool down for this province for 7 more days after they lost it.

 

 

II.Capitol regions

There will be several Capitols in the CW map. This provinces has increased income. The Capitol  province has the largest income. Each will be surrounded whit a few connected provinces. If a clan able to hold  one of the Capitol province and all surrounding provinces they will be credited a one time bonus price (like 5-20k gold, will be reseted every season). There will be several capitol in the map each whit different map pool surrounding province number and bonus price. If a clan can hold a capitol and all the  surrounded provinces for 3 consecutive days they will be earning an extra bonus. If a clan can prevent it they will get the half of the bonus like a bounty.

(If somebody reach the stage when they hold the capitol and all the capitol's provinces the assault stage begin. A Capitol's surrounded provinces become landing province so every clan able to challenge the owner.)

 

Explanation whit an example:

Berlin is a capitol city. It has 3 surrounding province. All capitol province is hold by NPC. A clan acquire Berlin and the 3 surrounding province in the first day. They get 20k gold (like a misson "Acquire Berlin" or something similar). They get a mission for holding Berlin and the 3 surrounding city for 3 more days for another 20k gold(Misssion "Holding Berlin" . This is the bounty. The next day all 3 sorrounding province become landings and every other clan get a mission for bounty  "Attack Berlin" bounty 20k/2=10k gold.

In the 3rd day unfortunately "A" clan lost one of the surrounding province to B clan. "B" clan get the bounty 10k gold. The surrounded provinces change back to normal provinces.

 

This two mechanics maybe providing continuouschallenges between top clans and inspire every clan to fight for new lands and more gold every night.

Edited by wallsh, 08 December 2015 - 03:38 AM.


_SAVIC_ #15 Posted 08 December 2015 - 10:25 AM

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View Postwallsh, on 08 December 2015 - 02:37 AM, said:

I. Income degeneration(prevent farming)

Basically the newly conquerorprovince will provide the first day 100% of the province income. After the 2nd day this income will start to shrink by a little margin like 5 or 10% dayly (it can reach 0). It will be less and less profitable to hold and more and more profitable to move to the next province. To avoid back and fort province trades between alliance clans there will be a cool down mechanics which will restrict an income for several days from a lost province but only for the previous owner. This will inspire clans to move and fight continuously.

 

Explanation whit an example:

If "A" clan conqueror a province the income in the first day will be like 600 gold, the second day will be 540 3rd day 480 4th day 420. In the 5th day "A" clan lost this province and the province get a 7 day cool down only for the "A" clan. If "A" clan acquire it back in the next day it will not generate income until the 7 day cool down holds. B clan which win against the "A" clan for this province get the full 600 gold on the 6th day(B clans first day on the province) but if they lost it to C clan in the 7th day the B clan also had a cool down for this province for 7 more days after they lost it.

 

 

 

Stopped reading after this and I think there is not a single post on all the feedback threads that I have not read...



pmakins #16 Posted 08 December 2015 - 10:29 AM

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View Post_SAVIC_, on 08 December 2015 - 10:25 AM, said:

 

Stopped reading after this and I think there is not a single post on all the feedback threads that I have not read...

 

I was just about to say that...

pmakins #17 Posted 08 December 2015 - 10:56 AM

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  • Auctions
    • Auctions become an alternative mechanism of entering the map instead of "all" provinces.
    • Auctions will work on limited amount of provinces (with minimum income). 

 

Better approach to the solution, we will see what it will bring :)

 

 

  • Landings
    • Landing provinces will become unprofitable to own.
    • The landing province owner will get into the tournament. 


The unprofitable to own part is good as long as there is enough gold on other regions. After all, in the previous global map, all the landings were either 240 gold in Europe or 72 gold in Africa. They should represent the strategical importance, not the economical importance.
The owner getting into the tournament, just pure stupidity if I can be honest. I play for something, win something, and then get treated the same way as someone who screams in randoms he shoots me behind double bushes and not get spotted, he has to be a cheater! :facepalm: 

 

 

  • Economy
    • Review of main costs according to results of statistics check. 
    • Divisions' maintaining mechanics changed/removed. 
    • ELO rating recount to increase provinces income.


1st  We need more info on that to say if it's good/bad/ok

2nd Not something that was asked  (as far as I know) but it is still a welcomed addition (if removed of course). If changed, again, we need more info on it to judge it. :)
3rd  Just decrease the amount of influence needed to upgrade a single region by a huge margin (currently it's like 30k right? I agree with Endrani on that matter, it should be maximum 5000 influence for tier 10 province or just increase the amount of gold you earn per level. Here we have an exponential growth in influence per tier, and a static function for gold.  ;)
If you had something different in mind, tell us! :D

 

  • Ransacks
    • Ransacking mechanics re-introduced without changes (like old GM).
  • Combat consumables
    • Removed for rework.

 


Maaaan, I miss the ransack! It made moving like a horde a lot more fun! :)

 

The more they are removed for "reworking" the better.

Or maybe just remove the air/arty strike, they are complete game breakers (if not for the RNG, they would be a tactical addition, but like this, it's just tooo dependendant on luck in a competitive game mod. ) 

Also what I do agree on, is to rework the other modules. They are currently just useless (except the air reconnaissance and the engineer module if you wanted to migrate fast)

 

 

I think I've covered all xD

 

 

 

 



Fynnegun #18 Posted 08 December 2015 - 12:05 PM

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Thanks pmakins (and others) :)

pmakins #19 Posted 08 December 2015 - 02:19 PM

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View PostDecept1on, on 08 December 2015 - 12:05 PM, said:

Thanks pmakins (and others) :)

 

Don't mention it ^^

 

Edit: Decept1on, do you check private messages on forums? :)


Edited by pmakins, 08 December 2015 - 02:22 PM.


Fynnegun #20 Posted 08 December 2015 - 02:55 PM

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Yes, most of the time.




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