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Russian meds. its just me or really they are OP!

Russian meds

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pudelikael #61 Posted 19 February 2016 - 05:05 PM

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View PostTreicy, on 28 January 2016 - 11:20 PM, said:

Here's my problem. i play this game for one year. when i start play i simply chose one tank and it was leopard1. all nice and cool. i really like it. but after 1 year i see that leopard1 is worst med tank of all nations. Leopard1 lose to every single med in 1vs1 fight. but this fact just lead me to the topic... in game i see these russian meds. starting with ojb140 which is ''most epic'' followed by T62A, ojb 430 and continuing with tier 9 OP russian meds and even tier8. so what i am talking about. basically ojb140/T62A/ojb430 are better in every single stat except aim time.[leopard1 1.9 - ojb140 2.1]. some of u might say - NO! leopard1 is faster. so here i go - think again! on paper leopard have 65 km/h while ojb140 55km/h. but it doesnt show stuff with low letters like ground resistance and so on. If u wanna drage race across the map. ofc Leopard1 win. but its about agile and leopard acceleration is worth coz of weight and ground resistance. so here is link http://tanks.gg/wot/...compare:obj-140 where i compare leopard1 and ojb140.i guess i dont have to mention that ojb have like 5 sec reload while leopard1 as sniper tank with no armor have 7 seconds... yeah i know about dmg difference. but ojb have more reliable dmg than leopard1. coz leopard can even roll 293 dmg. ofc if u roll 488 then lick your fingers coz u are happy guy!  But that not all. most epic of all this is that ojb140 as medium tank can do side scrape. and not just tier10. even ojb416 tier 8 tank did sidescrape on my leopard1. so u think its balanced? 

So my point is - russian meds are so OP coz this game is made by russians or back in days russians really learned how to make agile IS-7 and named ir ojb 140? But they one of biggest enemy - Germany stood same dumb and made paper tanks for ever after!

Might sound - ''here's another leopard1 fan''. well u are right! so basically i want that russian meds are nerfed or leopard1 get like 6 second reload instead so it has atleast a little chance to win other meds. for example Centurion AX who have 10 gun depression while leopard have 9, but leopard1 turret is crapwhile centurion have auto bounce on turret if he use ridge line and gun depression.

 

ofc, this game is Putin game

TRXnMe #62 Posted 19 February 2016 - 08:53 PM

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I just bought the T54-Mod 1 after a clan mate recommended it, By 'eck lad it's worth the money :)

 

I loved the T34-85, didn't like the T43, not yet got the T44, love the LTTB (I know, but it plays close to a medium with that gun).

 

I really don't like the Panther I

 

I adore the Comet

 

I love the Centurion 1

 

I like the Centurion 7/1

 

I have no T10 mediums, but will work on the E50-M and the the Action X this year

 

Some Russian mediums are OP, others are below average, some non-Russian mediums are OP, some are below average, it's how WoT works, if every tank in a research tree was good, why would you spend real money getting free XP in order to skip accelerate the progress?

 

As they have LOTS of Russian players, big surprise for a Russian game eh?  They listen to the Russian players and make tanks they want, no surprise they want Russian tanks is it?



ExclamationMark #63 Posted 19 February 2016 - 09:22 PM

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View Postmaroar, on 28 January 2016 - 11:37 PM, said:

I really don't see what is wrong with this tank or with the Leopard 1 (I dont have it yet).

I really loved the Leo 1 (my most played tank I think), but I hated the Leo PTA... only because of the gun depression.



GoldMountain #64 Posted 19 February 2016 - 11:56 PM

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View Posttajj7, on 29 January 2016 - 11:47 AM, said:

 

lol what?

 

Unangled T-62a hull is like 160-170 effective on UFP an LFP, sides are 80mm, most of which are covered by tracks.

 

What HE pens that?

 

It then has one of the best turrets in the game and -5 gun depression, there are 1000s of spots across the maps to get hull down in a T-62A.

 

Tier 10 Soviet hover meds are two of the most powerful tier 10 you can get, they do everything, they outperform the 'OP' E5 and they are more popular and more played. 

 

 

 

 

 

The t62a gun is incredibly close to the hull, which means that 99.9% of times you cannot aim and shoot at an enemy tank without exposing your hull. And the number of places you can effectively hull down are very rare indeed. 

 

The most crippling thing about russiam meds is the poor gun depression, and it takes a skilled player to effectively work around that. Otherwise you are mostly going to end up being shot long before you can shoot the enemy.

 

They are not OP. They are balanced

 They are very good all round but have a crippling flaw which makes them difficult to use, and can be highly innefective outside of wolfpacks. (Aka, not great when solo)



Element6 #65 Posted 20 February 2016 - 12:26 AM

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View PostCelestia, on 19 February 2016 - 11:56 PM, said:

The t62a gun is incredibly close to the hull, which means that 99.9% of times you cannot aim and shoot at an enemy tank without exposing your hull. And the number of places you can effectively hull down are very rare indeed. 

 

The most crippling thing about russiam meds is the poor gun depression, and it takes a skilled player to effectively work around that. Otherwise you are mostly going to end up being shot long before you can shoot the enemy.

 

They are not OP. They are balanced

 They are very good all round but have a crippling flaw which makes them difficult to use, and can be highly innefective outside of wolfpacks. (Aka, not great when solo)

Are they balanced? On average, all players with an overall WR of 56%+ has a higher WR on the T-62A than they have overall on their account. And this brings up the question; are the stats for those curves mainly from people who toon in it or mainly from people going solo? Would be interesting to know. I'll put my money on a majority of battles being fought solo, but that is just a guess. It doesn't even matter if you set the number of battles to 5000 or 30.000, the curve is mostly the same.

 

The underperformance of bad players seem to be very much the same for the T-62A as it is for the E-50M, so I'm not entirely convinced RU MTs are that much more crippling for the player than the others. Cent. AX sees almost identical underperformance for bad players as the other two, but less overperformance than T-62A, suggesting that tank is at the very least not UP.



shane73tank #66 Posted 20 February 2016 - 09:56 AM

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Tank's in hands of good players appear OP

 

Have been up the Ru meds line as a tomato now doing German , I think its the maps, they currently suit close range brawlers and that's the ru's but I don't think they are massively op at t6 a and t7 other nations are better



thedab #67 Posted 20 February 2016 - 10:39 AM

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View PostExclamationMark, on 19 February 2016 - 08:22 PM, said:

I really loved the Leo 1 (my most played tank I think), but I hated the Leo PTA... only because of the gun depression.

 

I love Leo PTA.it make me look good.

lungustefan #68 Posted 20 February 2016 - 11:02 AM

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Hm,they are not OP at all guys,he's wrong.

 

That's why the obj 140 and t62 a are most favourite tanks in ALL CW battles,and the leopard is never taken in CW.

 

Not to mention t54 with 340 mm HEAT,they are not Op at all.



Grumledunk #69 Posted 20 February 2016 - 11:08 AM

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View Postlungustefan, on 20 February 2016 - 11:02 AM, said:

Hm,they are not OP at all guys,he's wrong.

 

That's why the obj 140 and t62 a are most favourite tanks in ALL CW battles,and the leopard is never taken in CW.

 

Not to mention t54 with 340 mm HEAT,they are not Op at all.

 

Quite right, and the new czech tier 10 autoloader is only so popular with unicums because they love to have a huge challenge. It's totally not op either.

Signal11th #70 Posted 20 February 2016 - 11:48 AM

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View Postlungustefan, on 20 February 2016 - 10:02 AM, said:

Hm,they are not OP at all guys,he's wrong.

 

That's why the obj 140 and t62 a are most favourite tanks in ALL CW battles,and the leopard is never taken in CW.

 

Not to mention t54 with 340 mm HEAT,they are not Op at all.

 

You're mistaking "balanced" for OP. Will agree with the T54 HEAT being OP though.

HundeWurst #71 Posted 20 February 2016 - 01:32 PM

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well first things first:

 

while all the russian mediums are very close to each other there are still bigger differences than one would think.

this should be the rating of the russian mediums by their strengh:

 

1. T22 med. (however we could leave that out as its first not wildy spread and second very well known for its being overpowered)

2. Object 140

3. Object 907

4. T62a

5. Object 430

why in that order you might ask? well for now we ignore the t22 med.

the 140 has everything you need. the 6° gun depression come in VERY handy and are a major advantage over 5° while the difference is just 1°. however what makes this tank stand out the most is its superior hull armor. while its only 100mm on paper the angling of its plate is close to the autobounce angle of 70°. when this tank is using a healthy amoun of its gun depression the upper place becomes an autobounce angle. hence it doesnt really matter if one shoots the upper plate with 375mm penetration apcr shells as they will just bounce off.

the objecct 907 has trollish hull armor as well. the sidearmor is to name here in particular. however it lacks the gun depression and the turret is flat out worse. mobility wise maybe the best of the 4 tanks.

the t62a has the best turret and gun handling of these 4 meds. however the top speed is pathetic and the hullarmor is just good enough to save yourself from he rounds.

at last the 430: while that tank is supposed to be the best armored one it actually isnt. just on paper. the 140 is much better in terms of turret and hullarmor due to the angles and flexibility it gains due to the gun depression. for the on paper strong armor you pay big time with gun handling making it rather underwhelming compared to its counterparts.

 

that being said: most of the russian mediums and i want to highlight the 140 once more have a lot of strongspots however lack any major drawbacks. Compared to the "nato" counterparts they lack weaknesses.

 

what should be done? currently the accuracy system is screwed up. leopard 1 i.e. is supposed to have a super laser accurate gun. however compared to the gunhandling of the t62a it is just pathetic. same goes for the e50m and some other tanks.

also current map design favors brawler mediums much more than sniper/support mediums.

what could be done?

i would decrease the gun performance of the russian mediums quit a bit and also would make accuracy more imporant. let the russian mediums keep their "accuracy stat" which is currently displayed in the game however nerf the aimtime into areas of ~2.5 seconds. also massively nerf their gun handling. they should all have gunhandling the same compared to the 430. or with other words: they should have the worst gunhandling of all the tier 10 mediums.

 

at the same time buff the accuracy of "sniper tanks" mainly e50m and leo1 massively: something like 0.2 accuracy spread of 100 meters for both tanks as well as a buff to gunhandling by ~33% till 50%. they after all sacrifice quit a few other stats for getting supposingly "laster accurate guns". dont only make them look like that on paper. nope actually make them laser accurate and give them a super good gunhandling.

--> exact numbers need some serious thinking

TL;DR:

after nerfs:

russian mediums: strongspots: armor and mobility, weakpoints: gun(handling)

sniper tanks: strongspots: gun and either armor or mobility, weakspot: either mobility or armor



lungustefan #72 Posted 20 February 2016 - 01:37 PM

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View PostPfooogel, on 20 February 2016 - 01:32 PM, said:

well first things first:

 

while all the russian mediums are very close to each other there are still bigger differences than one would think.

this should be the rating of the russian mediums by their strengh:

 

1. T22 med. (however we could leave that out as its first not wildy spread and second very well known for its being overpowered)

2. Object 140

3. Object 907

4. T62a

5. Object 430

why in that order you might ask? well for now we ignore the t22 med.

the 140 has everything you need. the 6° gun depression come in VERY handy and are a major advantage over 5° while the difference is just 1°. however what makes this tank stand out the most is its superior hull armor. while its only 100mm on paper the angling of its plate is close to the autobounce angle of 70°. when this tank is using a healthy amoun of its gun depression the upper place becomes an autobounce angle. hence it doesnt really matter if one shoots the upper plate with 375mm penetration apcr shells as they will just bounce off.

the objecct 907 has trollish hull armor as well. the sidearmor is to name here in particular. however it lacks the gun depression and the turret is flat out worse. mobility wise maybe the best of the 4 tanks.

the t62a has the best turret and gun handling of these 4 meds. however the top speed is pathetic and the hullarmor is just good enough to save yourself from he rounds.

at last the 430: while that tank is supposed to be the best armored one it actually isnt. just on paper. the 140 is much better in terms of turret and hullarmor due to the angles and flexibility it gains due to the gun depression. for the on paper strong armor you pay big time with gun handling making it rather underwhelming compared to its counterparts.

 

that being said: most of the russian mediums and i want to highlight the 140 once more have a lot of strongspots however lack any major drawbacks. Compared to the "nato" counterparts they lack weaknesses.

 

what should be done? currently the accuracy system is screwed up. leopard 1 i.e. is supposed to have a super laser accurate gun. however compared to the gunhandling of the t62a it is just pathetic. same goes for the e50m and some other tanks.

also current map design favors brawler mediums much more than sniper/support mediums.

what could be done?

i would decrease the gun performance of the russian mediums quit a bit and also would make accuracy more imporant. let the russian mediums keep their "accuracy stat" which is currently displayed in the game however nerf the aimtime into areas of ~2.5 seconds. also massively nerf their gun handling. they should all have gunhandling the same compared to the 430. or with other words: they should have the worst gunhandling of all the tier 10 mediums.

 

at the same time buff the accuracy of "sniper tanks" mainly e50m and leo1 massively: something like 0.2 accuracy spread of 100 meters for both tanks as well as a buff to gunhandling by ~33% till 50%. they after all sacrifice quit a few other stats for getting supposingly "laster accurate guns". dont only make them look like that on paper. nope actually make them laser accurate and give them a super good gunhandling.

--> exact numbers need some serious thinking

TL;DR:

after nerfs:

russian mediums: strongspots: armor and mobility, weakpoints: gun(handling)

sniper tanks: strongspots: gun and either armor or mobility, weakspot: either mobility or armor

 

totally agree with this mate,and im glad  a FAME guy decided to clear this out.

the game is so wrongly designed it favours the 140 so massively



Maki711 #73 Posted 20 February 2016 - 04:19 PM

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USSR meds are op.

_Iwasawa_ #74 Posted 20 February 2016 - 06:29 PM

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Russian meds are the most overpowered vehicles in the game. Its a FACT. Anyone who denies it doesnt know crapabout the game. I think i could play a russian med with minimap only. They are SO DAMN OP. But nobody seems to care.

_Chavez #75 Posted 20 February 2016 - 07:10 PM

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I don't understand how some players here argue that tanks that have to avoid confrontation and let others fight half the battle - only to come out later on so they can pick off low health leftovers - aren't bad but rather 'specialized'. How does that work? Any tank can fulfill this role. In fact, in random battles this is the kind of playstyle that turns the battle in favor of your enemy.

tajj7 #76 Posted 20 February 2016 - 10:59 PM

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Basically what Pfoogel said the T-62A, the 140 and 907 should have the gun handling of the 430, like how the STB-1 has the poor gun handling compared to the Fatton or Leo but the much better turret armour, that is how you balance them, so they have the armour, other meds have the gun handling. 

TRXnMe #77 Posted 21 February 2016 - 09:22 PM

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T34-85 at T6 is a bit over performing.

 

I can't think of any T7 Russian Meds that are OP, certainly no the T43, I'm grinding it, I do OK in Comet, Cromwell, Centurion I, Rudy and the T54-Mod 1 but cannot make that tank work well, OK yes, but well, no.... :(

 

At T8 there are Russians that are OP, same at T9 and T10, but I'll offer that T7 Russians are balanced, although it is pretty pee poor balancing on the tree compared to the British or German lines, but the game is Russian so.....



Neandramathal #78 Posted 21 February 2016 - 11:20 PM

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Let's not forget the advantage that incredible camo and extremely small profile bring you - combined with their good turrets the russian T10 mediums can hull down behind pretty much any bump or rock, in craters or behind rubble, the small profile also means the entire side is covered in track, which eat a lot of shells. The gun depression may be lacking on paper but with that small size they can still keep their tank hidden in a lot of cases that higher gun depression tanks can't, Fiery Salient mid ridge for instance, a tank like the CAX or Fatton is so tall that when it tries to go up to snipe it's side armor is clearly visible to snipers from the 1-2 line, something the soviet meds don't suffer from. Sure in that case they can't shoot down at the other side of the ridge so well, but they have much safer shots at anything on that road.

 

Gun depression is very handy, but generally only if the turret/UFP is strong, IS-7's gun depression is frequently enough for it because the enemy has to overexpose in order to shoot it's LFP regardless of how much depression they have, while it can blast away at turrets without showing it's LFP, the mediums are the same. Especially as most hills or bumps in this game seem to be either requiring -15 or -5 with very little in between. I enjoy playing tanks with good gun depression, but in the past year or so as I have improved, I have found that tanks capable of going properly hull down on flat ground (i.e, not requiring to use their full gun depression to create an auto-bounce, but instead just relying on existing angle/thickness) perform far better simply because they can function in more situations, maps aren't exactly flooded with -10 hills.

 

Good dpm, good camo, good speed, good turret armor, troll hull armor, great gun handling ... gun depression is the only thing they really lack. Only one I'd put on their level tbh is the Batchat due to it's autoloader, pump out 2k then feck off into the distance, as long as its got 1hp left it's still capable of killing a tank before it can turn around.



Yosef1 #79 Posted 22 February 2016 - 06:33 AM

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View Posttajj7, on 29 January 2016 - 01:47 PM, said:

 

lol what?

 

Unangled T-62a hull is like 160-170 effective on UFP an LFP, sides are 80mm, most of which are covered by tracks.

 

What HE pens that?

 

It then has one of the best turrets in the game and -5 gun depression, there are 1000s of spots across the maps to get hull down in a T-62A.

 

Tier 10 Soviet hover meds are two of the most powerful tier 10 you can get, they do everything, they outperform the 'OP' E5 and they are more popular and more played. 

 

 

 

 

 

Once you say this kind of statements you basically starting a war against large amount of ppl on the forums who will defend it with thier lives on it:P



tajj7 #80 Posted 22 February 2016 - 09:41 AM

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View PostNeandramathal, on 21 February 2016 - 10:20 PM, said:

Let's not forget the advantage that incredible camo and extremely small profile bring you - combined with their good turrets the russian T10 mediums can hull down behind pretty much any bump or rock, in craters or behind rubble, 

 

This is pretty key IMO, they are an absolute complete paint to fight if there is any bit of terrain cover because all you see is a turret, or occasional highly angled front plate at most, then they can just keep popping out and snap shoting you. 

 

Quite often in locations where you think they would need gun depression they can peak up sideways and they show very little side for such a brief moment that you have to be lucky to hit them.

 

At any range, a peeking engagement against a T-62A, 140 or 907 is pointless because you just won't hit them. 

 

Much like the IS3 shouldn't have good snap shot ability or mobility, the Soviet meds can fight close range and can take hits way more easily than most NATO meds so their accuracy and gun handling is just far too good, they should be poor at that to balance it out handing back the gun advantage at medium and longer ranges to the NATO meds. 

 

 







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