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Video: Explaining Mechanics - Penetration


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Community #1 Posted 06 January 2017 - 11:49 AM

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Knowing how to shoot to pierce through enemy armour is key to victory. Learn all about the penetration mechanics in the game!

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DOCT0R_ #2 Posted 06 January 2017 - 12:15 PM

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One question, why isn't this on front page of WoTLauncher? (apart from text link)
People who check forums and most likely WoT website are the ones who almost certainly informed themselves.
If this is aiming for general non-informed person, why not put it a bit more 'in the face', by placing it for at least day it's written

instead of tank that's on sale?

More people would be raging less, more people stick with game.

At least that's my opinion on this advertisement. 



GH_ROMEL #3 Posted 06 January 2017 - 12:27 PM

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All the credit for the NA staff. Keep up fixing the game and make it better!

 

Is this video a goodbye to the the new ricochet mechanic system?



Cobra6 #4 Posted 06 January 2017 - 12:33 PM

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Explanation: A whopping 1/4 deviation (+/-25% RNJesus) in both directions so very dodgy in terms of penetration unless your minimum roll is higher than the armour thickness of the enemy :D

 

Cobra 6



SSempty #5 Posted 06 January 2017 - 12:36 PM

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so....what i did understand from the video is that u shouldn't critically hit a leopard light tank with the rhm borsing...

Schmeksiman #6 Posted 06 January 2017 - 12:40 PM

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View PostCobra6, on 06 January 2017 - 12:33 PM, said:

Explanation: A whopping 1/4 deviation (+/-25% RNJesus) in both directions so very dodgy in terms of penetration unless your minimum roll is higher than the armour thickness of the enemy :D

 

Cobra 6

 

And the higher the tier, the bigger the difference between penetration rolls which is honestly counter-intuitive.

DOCT0R_ #7 Posted 06 January 2017 - 12:44 PM

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View PostSchmeksiman, on 06 January 2017 - 12:40 PM, said:

 

And the higher the tier, the bigger the difference between penetration rolls which is honestly counter-intuitive.

 

Yeah, rolling from 150 to 250 on T32 makes no sense when you have to penetrate IS-3 frontally.
One can only hope they will replace it with something like absolute system, 30-30 for all tiers.

fighting_falcon93 #8 Posted 06 January 2017 - 12:48 PM

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Nice video WG, +1 :great:

 

Sadly though, in the video you presented 4 different shell types, but for any player with a credits shortage, I'd say APCR and HEAT are a luxary, and not an actual option, due to the rediculous cost of premium rounds. Not to mention these rounds also make armor mostly irrelevant. These shells need to get their penetration and/or damage values nerfed and they should be aviable for the same price as standard rounds, or even better, remove ammo limitation and make ammo a fixed cost after every battle like in WoWs.


Edited by fighting_falcon93, 06 January 2017 - 01:15 PM.


T3zas #9 Posted 06 January 2017 - 01:24 PM

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Good work WG and a very nice video for all players :great: +1 

bunkermad #10 Posted 06 January 2017 - 01:24 PM

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Well, interesting video, and does make you think that all shooting mechanics are very scientifically applied in the game, but in practice they are not.  25% RNG is way too big a variable to keep all these calculations reliable, so you may have math on your side when you take your shot but RNG can make it all irrelevant.  Until WG lowers RNG to 10% or less (like in some other games), there is little point in making videos about penetration mechanics.

 

And whether it is RNG or something else, when an E75 128mm shell BOUNCES OFF a French light tank (like I have had) you know all these calculations are just a facade to hide other types of "calculations".  This video is also helpful at explaining how RNG can severely affect your games: by altering your accuracy it can make your shot land on the worst possible corner of the enemy tank even when you aim carefully at the right spot from the right angle. I have seen that as well.

 

Get rid of RNG and you can talk to me again about penetration mechanics.



ullandon #11 Posted 06 January 2017 - 01:25 PM

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Great video! But yet again 5 years too late. :P

ZorzDePaloma #12 Posted 06 January 2017 - 01:43 PM

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View Postkreso03, on 06 January 2017 - 12:15 PM, said:

One question, why isn't this on front page of WoTLauncher? (apart from text link)
People who check forums and most likely WoT website are the ones who almost certainly informed themselves.
If this is aiming for general non-informed person, why not put it a bit more 'in the face', by placing it for at least day it's written

instead of tank that's on sale?

More people would be raging less, more people stick with game.

At least that's my opinion on this advertisement. 

 

This. Anyone visiting forums, wiki and your YT channel already knows this (more or less). What you need to do is to promote it ingame. Put it in map loading, like "wanna get better - check our video tutorial" or something like that. Keep your new players informed. In a same way you inform us about new premium tank offers and asking for money, you can put these in same pop-ups and inform players about new tutorial. More better players = better community = better battles = more people satisfied = more money investment in wot. When you put some x5 during weekends it is VERY HARD to play. 



cowtapult1 #13 Posted 06 January 2017 - 01:45 PM

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Wonder why u need make false vids ? U are in such money issues u need lie more about game mechanics?

 

Lets see hwo it actually work.

 

U can have 100 or les mm armor and be bounced head on from close range (0-50 meters) by monster shells like one from jgpze100 or fv.  And we are talking about head on shots in frontal armor.

 

Or u can be shot for example in bat chat from close range in back of your turret and bounced.

 Same with amx 13-90.

 

This is something u fucked up on purpose as u made code rigging every battle. 

 

First thing u do is u have mm which is completely fucked up and coders making it should be shot on sight.

For example u get one team with 10-12 meds and tds (usualy there is or 1-2 heavy tanks in low tier with 1- 2 lights) and other team gets up to 10 heavies 1 td and 1 med in top tier 1-2 lights and few more tds or meds in low tier. So teams ae unbalanced completely.

Ofc team with shitload of meds and tds is filled with players ranging from 1800 wn8 and over  and other team is best player approx 1700 wn8 and rest are averae of 900 wn8 *yes its pathetic.

 

What happens is next  - u can have perfect shots on enemy tanks that will bounce or just be ignored by server. There are holes on tanks - frontal armor / hatch/ back of tank but even in game battle results there wll be empty space next to it as server just decided it cant be killed. Its called RNG. Your team gets 2-3 tanks being amo racked with frst hit and at least one more burns to death as both shels he was shot from 300 meters turn him on fire and he is shot for example in turret both times.

 

If there is soemthing unexpected going on in battle - and it usually does as those bots in first team are usually sniping and have no clue how to play close combat - so your team starts wrecking them server and RNG turn into 5th gear rigging battle and suddenly enemy tanks start dissapearing while they drive in full speed on open ground in front of u (for whole team they just dissapear) on 50-100 meters and nothing in btw to block view , not even bush, and when u hit em u bounce no matter how good shots are placed. U can have tank literaly coming over hill on u exposing his bottom plate fully and u can bounce him from 90 degree angle (and u pen him always from head on shot in bottom plate  under steep angle) as server DECIDED SO. It happens because SERVER is rigging all it can. Gives tanks basic immunity for short period of time, makes enemy team worst possible rng for short periods of time and similar. 

 

So what is written about game mechanics is pure crap. In game u have for each tank stats - tehy play crap. If server decided u are to be killed with first shot that is it u cant do anything about it. There are rare occasions where u manage to beat server and its because players in enemy team simply [edited]up things completely. They crash, drown, ram into heavy tanks with meds and die. Or they not manage to use server boost period as they are scared to play offensive way and then  tehy die in end. But its rare occasion as battles usually last 3-4 mins even in tier 10s cause most players are idiots in terms of tactics, map / tank knowledge and basic play skil.

 

So plz if u want to make things as u put on vid u first need remove current battle rigging lines of code so we are all equal in game and pure skill  comes to play.

 

Simpliest of all is to decline server ability to make your under 100 meter range shot disperse more then its stated in garage for gun. If it ca disperse .35m on 100 meter range there is no way for shell to drop in ground half way towards tank or fly wild over it. Fix those things first as they are all from RETARD MM and RNG CODE which always favours one of teams.



DOCT0R_ #14 Posted 06 January 2017 - 02:01 PM

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View Postbunkermad, on 06 January 2017 - 01:24 PM, said:

Well, interesting video, and does make you think that all shooting mechanics are very scientifically applied in the game, but in practice they are not.  25% RNG is way too big a variable to keep all these calculations reliable, so you may have math on your side when you take your shot but RNG can make it all irrelevant.  Until WG lowers RNG to 10% or less (like in some other games), there is little point in making videos about penetration mechanics.

 

And whether it is RNG or something else, when an E75 128mm shell BOUNCES OFF a French light tank (like I have had) you know all these calculations are just a facade to hide other types of "calculations".  This video is also helpful at explaining how RNG can severely affect your games: by altering your accuracy it can make your shot land on the worst possible corner of the enemy tank even when you aim carefully at the right spot from the right angle. I have seen that as well.

 

Get rid of RNG and you can talk to me again about penetration mechanics.

I in M103 an Foch bounced off AMX 13 90. And it all falls under calculation, because we didn't have enough for 3-caliber rule and we hit under strange angle.

 

Accuracy as such MUST exist for HT to viable, or for difference between russian(inaccurate) and german(accurate) guns. 
Is it best thing? Likely not, but it's good system, so I don't care too much. (Not talking about +/-25% on penetration).



DOCT0R_ #15 Posted 06 January 2017 - 02:04 PM

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View Postcowtapult1, on 06 January 2017 - 01:45 PM, said:

Spoiler

 

Wow, that's rather big tinfoil hat you have on you.
Can't remember what's called, but the most plausible theory is the one that has least variables. "O... cutter".
Basically, what I'm saying is that you should think before writing.



SlyMeerkat #16 Posted 06 January 2017 - 02:37 PM

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I always like watching these kind of videos, its always nice for a little refresh on game mechanics, good stuff :)

Edited by SlyMeerkat, 06 January 2017 - 02:37 PM.


Homer_J #17 Posted 06 January 2017 - 02:38 PM

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View Postcowtapult1, on 06 January 2017 - 12:45 PM, said:

 

U can have 100 or les mm armor and be bounced head on from close range (0-50 meters) by monster shells like one from jgpze100 or fv.  And we are talking about head on shots in frontal armor.

 

I don't know why I'm bothering but.....

 

Replay or it didn't happen.



2f45ls6 #18 Posted 06 January 2017 - 03:18 PM

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I need a penetration buff.

Wolfsbane1 #19 Posted 06 January 2017 - 03:23 PM

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Having read through the posts for this topic (laboring through the bad English, and bad language!) a lot of salient points are made. Like some players for this topic, I too have used high caliber guns (E100/75, Maus, and Lowe) and have had shells "bounce/ricochet” on shots that should according to your video “cut the little blighter in half!”. I tend to specialize in T.D’s so fire ”at range” and use AP/HEAT/and HE as required depending on range and vehicle type at the time of engagement, and fire when I am reasonably certain I have a better than average chance of hitting and damaging my target. My personal engagement parameters are 1/ Tgt Visual, 2/ Firing angle of approx’ 90 +10⁰, 3/ right type of shell, and 4/ let the sights settle for minimum dispersion; yet damage caused does not fall in line with your video explanation. If it did with a 63% hit rate my damage stat’s would be considerably better than they are. When using a gun with a penetration of 185-308mm (St’d AP shell) and getting game feedback “we failed to penetrate their armour/ricochet) when firing on armour between 60-90mm thick, I have to concur with the other posts, the game mechanics are “screwing the players” and like some “mod’s” negates player skills.

So as someone has already said, stop the game mechanics jiggery pokery, match the tanks and their equipment more to the historic parameters, get the tier matching issues properly sorted (I still see tier III/IV tanks in tier VIII games etc), reduce (or better still stop server battle rigging), so increasing the value of player skill which in turn results in 1/ better battles, 2/ better fun, 3/ encouraging more people to play, 4/ which in turn could increase Wargaming revenue.

But even with all it’s faults, WoT can still be a lot of fun, and you do meet some great people in the “Community”.

Have fun everybody and remember at the end of the day it is still just a game, all be it a very frustrating one at times!!!  :-)



Maki711 #20 Posted 06 January 2017 - 03:46 PM

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OMG !!!

 

Reduce the retarded RNG from 25% to 10% !!!






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