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What is the point of TD's without turrets?


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Squirting_Elephant #1 Posted 21 June 2017 - 05:36 PM

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Having problems again with turretless TD's. The AT7 has mostly the same problems the Jagdtiger has for me. Here are some issues I don't understand:

 

  1. My armour get's penned by light tanks shooting gold
  2. Some, if not most, of those non-premium TD's are so slow. Slow tanks = fail in current meta
  3. Some of those TD's have worse alpha than a light tank
  4. They may not even have any form of decent camo
  5. They have no turret so get circled and such
  6. They still lose vs autoloaders. Like a T50 Skoda facetanking my Jagdtiger head on, I deal 450 damage, he does 900 back... He basically wins and this is the strongest position for a TD. God forbid it an Emile 1 shows up because he has enough ammo to 100 --> 0 my AT7's hp and with gold ammo he can pen me on my strongest parts. Yes this happened.
  7. I shot close at max spot-distance at a heavy with my AT7, he spotted me after I fired and yes I have camo net (useless!)...
  8. Medium high tier mediums having on par DPM & pen and alpha compared to some high tier TD's...
  9. Can't shoot around corners like most tanks. Even my AT7 with all weak spots hidden and only gun around corner gets wrecked. Hiding after shot is better but... no turret... no mobility..

 

Man I can't wait to get my hands on the deathstar. Getting about 25k xp per day so it's still gonna be a week or two...


Edited by Squirting_Elephant, 21 June 2017 - 05:37 PM.


JuliusCheddar #2 Posted 21 June 2017 - 05:37 PM

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To Kemp bush

Squirting_Elephant #3 Posted 21 June 2017 - 05:39 PM

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Many maps have no good bush-spots. On top of that those LT's & mediums spot you so fast, especially if you shoot due to meh camo. And on top of that your viewrange is usually not enough so you NEED a teammate scouting for you. You can't rely on that in current battles where everyone is selfish.

 

Another 3 problems with bush-camping (I assume from outside of enemy spot range):

1. If your team facerolls you get 0 damage. You are too slow to move from bush to the fast advancing frontlines

2. if your team gets facerolled you probably get off 2 shots before you die from bumrush (okay in some maps you actually get off a lot of shots but its rare)

3. your ally who spots for you may go to another part of the map or just die right away or is in the bush next of you, making you nearly useless

 

I just keep failing all those turretless TD's.


Edited by Squirting_Elephant, 21 June 2017 - 05:42 PM.


lord_chipmonk #4 Posted 21 June 2017 - 05:41 PM

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TDs without turrets have been crap for some time now. 

CoDiGGo #5 Posted 21 June 2017 - 05:53 PM

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Camp red line and blame others for defeat

Balc0ra #6 Posted 21 June 2017 - 05:55 PM

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Only two ways to play them. Either in a support role using the high pen, alpha or DPM to support the push, either behind bush cover, or at range so you won't get spotted. Or use the armor to get in their faces in a corridor map with support. As they don't fight well alone. So waiting for the team to fail a flank is not ideal. Like many do in them sadly. And as was pointed out above me.

 

As for point 5... never go alone in an open space. And never go in the open unless you know where the enemy is. So if you are alone, and you know there is a medium coming. Don't wait around for him. Find a wreck, building, anything that is bigger then you are to back up against. So he can't fully circle you if he is alone. Thus you can either push him into it, or give you time to turn around when goes behind it.

 

I've recently found joy in playing the T95 again after the speed buff, and usually play it in a mix of support and in your face tactics. Not played the armored mid tier UK TD's in ages. But I had fun back in the day with them.  And some of the more mobile turretless TD's like the E25, Archer and Stug are still tanks I take out to play often due to the camo and mobility. So I don't find them as useless as most want them to be.


Edited by Balc0ra, 21 June 2017 - 05:59 PM.


Squirting_Elephant #7 Posted 21 June 2017 - 06:08 PM

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AT7 can't get up and close due to it's MASSIVE weak spots + whenever I'm in a city my allies often leave me alone... to die... They just go so far ahead and I can't keep up... Then a scout comes, I die...

 

This is how slow the AT7 for example is. I'm in in spawn while they already have hill:

https://pasteboard.co/2gWt8rlMB.jpg

https://pasteboard.co/2h1WHHE7W.jpg (can't even get to battle in time... either my team is dead or enemy team is dead, either way it's bad for me)

There is one map that is even worse due to terrain, can only move at 7 km/h....What a joke.

 

Also lost a few matches today because I was among the last 2-3 survivors on my team but I got circled. Nothing I can do and my teammates refuse to remain near me... They are all greedy and die. If I had a turret... Yeah then I would have won those.

 

E25 is op as hell and is one of those exceptions (it's premium and VERY VERY mobile!) It does not belong in this topic at all..

 

Regarding DPM, well again, your DPM is usually better than those of heavies but either your alpha sucks or an autoloader comes around the corner and says hi and you can't go back around the corner because, slow, no turret... And there are heavies & mediums with turrets, better camo, etc. that just have almost equal DPM, pen and alpha so that's not really an advantage.


Edited by Squirting_Elephant, 21 June 2017 - 06:17 PM.


qpranger #8 Posted 21 June 2017 - 06:08 PM

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Push through or hold corridors, support attacks, plenty to do and deal damage if your team plays coherently.

OP, despair not, AT 15 is better.



Squirting_Elephant #9 Posted 21 June 2017 - 06:25 PM

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View Postqpranger, on 21 June 2017 - 05:08 PM, said:

OP, despair not, AT 15 is better.

God I hope it's better. Very soon AT15.

But I worry about Tortoise, I saw it in a match and it also has 20km/h capped speed while also having paper armor again for it's tier and then there is that FAT cupola so even if only your upper part sticks out, you are guaranteed to get penned. And it's alpha is horrible (only 10 more than IS3 which is 1 tier lower and a heavy!). Yay it has good DPM but with that speed, no turret, no armor, HUGE weakspot on a bad spot and same pen as Scorpion G which is tier8. Okay pen is good when you spam gold but I gotta farm 215000xp in that horrible thing...


Edited by Squirting_Elephant, 21 June 2017 - 06:25 PM.


TungstenHitman #10 Posted 21 June 2017 - 06:34 PM

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When they get the right map of which there are only a few and a decent team that can show the enemy without dying in seconds then turretless TDs are a thing of beauty but getting one of those TD maps is a low percentage thing and so will typically do battle on the other maps which are too busy or city map so the turretless tank is a heavily restricted, clumsy and mostly ineffective fighter, don't forget very frustrating.

 

The only valid turretless TDs that I have in my collection at higher tier are the siege mode Swedes which are imo, how a TD should be, mobile, high camo, high accuracy and pen.. all the others are only meh.. the most fun and capable turretless TDs are actually to be found at lower tiers from 3-5 with my personal favorite and greatest turretless TD of all, on any map, any situation, the derp meister that is the Hetzer. 

 

Actually that reminds me, I played it a few days ago and picked up a rather odd medal I've never seen before, the De Langlade's Medal.. actually come to mention a bit later another TD(turreted though), the HC, bagged me another medal I've never seen before, the Dumitru's Medal.. don't really care but nice I suppose, can't tell the difference between some of the requirements for the killing arty medals, they all look the same

 

Spoiler

 



veso_vn #11 Posted 21 June 2017 - 06:37 PM

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the problem for this TD`s are the maps.... they are too small . the idea of this tanks is to destroy targets from big distance here is not possible 

Scabolcz #12 Posted 21 June 2017 - 06:38 PM

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I actually think that stealthy/fast ones are actually pretty decent, namely the SU-100, SU-122-44 and E-25... You can work with them, and can be quite fantastic

Warzey #13 Posted 21 June 2017 - 06:54 PM

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If you want to get your hands on a TD that's actually good, I suggest you start grinding Swedish TD line. Strv 103B can shred both Maus and Type 5 fairly quickly without using premium ammo.

 

The grind itself is not particularly hard, the only stinker on the line is at T7 and UDES on T8 is bad until you upgrade the gun, but after that it's smooth sailing 'till T10.



Suurpolskija #14 Posted 21 June 2017 - 06:58 PM

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What's the purpose of light tanks that are worse spotters than mediums?

 

What's the purpose of frontally foolproof heavy tank that can hit you where ever for 500dmg without much aiming?

 

What's the purpose of having a ton of armor when your opposition has even more penetration?

 

Oh, I dunno. Turretless td's shoot things that are in front of them. I guess some of them are historically accurate, too. Why anyone would play turretless td over a turreted one? I really don't know.



jack_timber #15 Posted 21 June 2017 - 07:06 PM

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View PostSquirting_Elephant, on 21 June 2017 - 04:36 PM, said:

 

Man I can't wait to get my hands on the deathstar. Getting about 25k xp per day so it's still gonna be a week or two...

Deathstar, can be a one trick pony. Yes it can hit hard when fully aimed, mind u is slow to aim, then boom. If it does hit you can shave 1200+ hp off on a good day and miss on a bad one. Then u hide for 25 seconds while it reloads.... That with fully trained crew, rammer, gun laying and vents. Yes it's fun but if u use HESH all the time it will cost u  bucketfullsI of silver, I tend to use AP.

I am not saying it's bad but it's slow, not AT7 slow, on a hill the speed plummets...

Give it a go I have one and only use it occasionally I actually prefer the Jagdtiger or the Swedish TD line.

I play turretless TDs 90% of the time and u know what I love em. They are not the easiest to play takes some getting used to but u are right about being flanked so u have to keep 1 eye on minimal....  Talk about multitasking I am a man according to her indoors I struggle with that concept:)

 

 

 


Edited by jack_timber, 21 June 2017 - 07:11 PM.


250swb #16 Posted 21 June 2017 - 07:10 PM

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Play the Obj. 704 and then ask such a stupid question.



panter22 #17 Posted 21 June 2017 - 07:19 PM

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All of the TD without turrets are complete garbage useless why when the TD without turret moves on the spot left ore right you instantly lose camouflage and Binocular spot bongs  when Turning TD turrets don't lose nothing but the problem is the WG is so retarded they don't see that

Edited by panter22, 21 June 2017 - 07:20 PM.


lord_chipmonk #18 Posted 21 June 2017 - 07:26 PM

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View Post250swb, on 21 June 2017 - 07:10 PM, said:

Play the Obj. 704 and then ask such a stupid question.

 

I do and hate it. More fun than the ISU I grant you, but then so is shoving hot pokers in my eyes. 

Edited by lord_chipmonk, 21 June 2017 - 07:26 PM.


RockyRoller #19 Posted 21 June 2017 - 07:30 PM

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whats the point of any tank with no roof? it lets the rain in and the crew get wet, catch cold and go off on sickies.

RockyRoller #20 Posted 21 June 2017 - 07:35 PM

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Far as I gather, TD were either get to the front fast, fire then run away. The turret tanks.

Whilst the germans/russians were locate, camo, then sniper. no turret low profile

Other tanks, medium and heavy were troop support and lights were scouts for advance troop recon.

Italian tanks were more about civilian control than actual war. Whilst the French tanks were made stylish for the military catwalks

 

thats the theory, but its a game so play the one you like the looks of


Edited by RockyRoller, 21 June 2017 - 07:37 PM.





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