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The new Boot Camp - what to think of it

boot camp 9.19.1

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Poll: Boot camp (26 members have cast votes)

You have to complete 250 battles in order to participate this poll.

What do you think about the new Boot Camp?

  1. Perfect as it is (1 vote [3.85%])

    Percentage of vote: 3.85%

  2. Good, but needs slight tweaking (3 votes [11.54%])

    Percentage of vote: 11.54%

  3. Average, teaches some useful things but ignores quite a few (7 votes [26.92%])

    Percentage of vote: 26.92%

  4. Bad, only tells the broadest basics and lacks most important things (7 votes [26.92%])

    Percentage of vote: 26.92%

  5. Completely lackluster, might as well not play it (4 votes [15.38%])

    Percentage of vote: 15.38%

  6. other (4 votes [15.38%])

    Percentage of vote: 15.38%

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Uebergewicht #1 Posted 20 July 2017 - 12:45 PM

    Second Lieutenant

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So, I gave the new Boot Camp a try to see how it is, and while it does explain a few things, the list of important things it skips is still incredibly long. While there is the official thread for "feedback", it is mostly neglected, so I´m trying to bring this topic to a wider audience.

 

So, Boot Camp teaches players how to drive and aim, which is something most people should figure out in seconds anyway. However it only teaches about penetration mechanics in the sense "shoot when the reticle is green" which is almost completely useless down the line due to angled armor. It does not teach about typical weakspots apart from the extremely broad "sides and back are weaker". It even uses the completely retarded SU76I as an example, a tank with completely broken armor that you cannot even pen from the side flat on and makes it look like getting to the back is the only option. Neither does the boot camp teach how the various shells work or how and why critical hits happen - only that they can happen and that there are consumables for that.

 

It does teach players where the upgrade pannel is and how to research things, but not what to research or why apart from "it makes the tank better". It does not teach to look at the stats of a researchable gun and see how it is different from the one you previously had.

 

It does show that crew skills exist, but not which ones are good for which tank, how important they are, how crew XP in general works or wheter or not you should get new crews for every new tank.

 

It does teach basics about the view range system, but not about the spotting cap, render cap, light tank camo bonus, standing still bonus, how long one stays spotted, or which points on the tank model are actually checked for when the view range is scanned. It pretends that, as long as you are behind a bush and don´t fire, you cannot be spotted.

 

It does teach absolutely nothing about how to use your own armor. Nothing about angling, hulldown or sidescraping. There is even a bug in the final battle where shots that bounce off of you are displayed as if you took damage.

 

Finally, the last battle: First of all, it is on mines. Mines is a horrible map on its own, but it tells the player nothing about it. No common strategy, basically just go out and shoot stuff. And all the tanks there are low tier tanks or same tier, which does not prepare players for the matchmaking reality of mid or bottom tier games. The matchmaker is another thing that is not explained at all; how it works, how to read it, how to act when you´re top and how when you´re bottom.

 

 

So... it may be slightly better than before, but still pretty lacking. Or what do you think about it?


Edited by Uebergewicht, 20 July 2017 - 02:11 PM.


Jigabachi #2 Posted 20 July 2017 - 01:05 PM

    Field Marshal

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Even if it was useful, it comes 6 years too late...

CptBarney #3 Posted 20 July 2017 - 01:17 PM

    Colonel

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not only does it provide limited information which doesn't help the player engage a variety of tanks properly it is also WAY to bloody late for it to be implemented.

 

six years for a sodden tutorial that's hilarious. and I mean a tutorial where they actually try and teach you more than the basics mandatorily.


 

oh well.



Sessine #4 Posted 20 July 2017 - 01:24 PM

    Second Lieutenant

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It's a bit better then the old tutorial but there are so many thing not covered.


 

Maybe it should be bootcamp 1 followed by bootcamp 2-6 which would be tailored to the 5 vehicle classes and shows skills like camping in drawrange for TDs , a bit more on spotting , armor use for heavies etc.


 

It does give new players a tier 2 and 3 with 100% crews and free 6th sense on the tier 3 which is generous.

 

ETA: It also give 10 of the premium consumables but this stays as standard on the tier 3 tank which is not a good idea. I never use prem consumables on those tiers accept passively. For example fit a Large Repair Kit instead of a fire extinguisher on the pz II for the bonus of reduced damage...just remember not to press 6 when you burn.


Edited by Sessine, 20 July 2017 - 01:31 PM.


Alabamatick #5 Posted 20 July 2017 - 09:23 PM

    Major

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Don't know, veterans  don't get the rewards so why bother looking

Uebergewicht #6 Posted 20 July 2017 - 09:41 PM

    Second Lieutenant

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Well, I for one bothered to see what WG can be arsed to tell new players about their game. You know, the kind of players who will eventually end up either on your or the enemy team. Apparently the answer is "not much".

LCpl_Jones #7 Posted 20 July 2017 - 09:49 PM

    Warrant Officer

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i tried it, can't get pass the research bit, some sort of bug as nothing happens

Schepel #8 Posted 20 July 2017 - 10:04 PM

    Lieutenant Сolonel

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You can't squeeze everything into a tutorial - people would run away screaming. I have worked my way through hardcore flight sims with manuals with tens of thousands of pages, but I am weird that way. Most people are sane enough not to want that or anything like it. In other words, there is such a thing as too much information. Spotting mechanics? Fun, but really, the nuts and bolts are not needed to perform well. There are quite a few unicum players out there who do not fully understand how spotting really works. Apart from the basics, a proper tutorial should introduce people to tactics and basic use of both terrain and armour. The problem is, I think, that the devs themselves don't really understand the tactical aspects of wot. So I don't expect them to ever make a tutorial that will actually help people. Of course, I hope to be proven wrong.

malachi6 #9 Posted 20 July 2017 - 10:40 PM

    Lieutenant Сolonel

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If it attempted to teach everything you suggest it would be information overload for many people.  Most players are very casual and just want pew, pew. Teaching that these things exist is a good start.  All that is required is a link to the wiki and WG's mechanics guides for those who to wish to learn more. 

Uebergewicht #10 Posted 20 July 2017 - 11:22 PM

    Second Lieutenant

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But the Boot Camp doesnt even cover the basics properly. As I mentioned, how to make use of one´s armor is completely absent. And no, I do not think a player who has just done the tutorial and not much else will perform decently in the game.

 

Of course there are other ways to learn and get better. But it still is WG´s job to first and foremost make sure players can get the tools needed to suceed from them. If someone is turned off by a tutorial, said person is even more unlikely to visit a third party website or join a training clan or something. I don´t say you have to front-load all the information into a tutorial, but there have to be better ways than what we currently have. People on these forums complain about the poor quality of the player base all the time so why not think of more ways to help these out? The Boot Camp could be multi-part, each part maybe unlocking after the player has reached certain milestones in the game (first tank elited, first tier III, first tank of a class... first time he bounced five times in a row, first time he got blown up by HE, first time he was killed by an unspotted enemy). The whole process could even be accompanied by missions for live random games (block three shots, get three kills, spot an enemy without getting spotted yourself) and each of these missions maybe comes with a short video guide. Just throwing ideas out, but the status quo is really quite embarrassing.



tuxun #11 Posted 21 July 2017 - 08:49 PM

    Warrant Officer

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the "stay hidden behind the bush!

now, go in the ringing circle!" thing was weird...

what was the point to hide, for go in the only circle warning ennemies than we are in it?

there is no ping nor fps nor minimap before laste battle? I was team damaged ;)

also there is something weird with the crew perk offered: one have two perks, and the other one only:

 

 



Jigabachi #12 Posted 21 July 2017 - 11:03 PM

    Field Marshal

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View Posttuxun, on 21 July 2017 - 08:49 PM, said:

also there is something weird with the crew perk offered: one have two perks, and the other one only:

It's most definitely because of 6th sense.

 

btw: That screenshot is from the WoT version for mobile phones, right?


Edited by Jigabachi, 21 July 2017 - 11:03 PM.


Element6_TheSprout #13 Posted 21 July 2017 - 11:16 PM

    Field Marshal

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View Postmalachi6, on 20 July 2017 - 10:40 PM, said:

If it attempted to teach everything you suggest it would be information overload for many people.  Most players are very casual and just want pew, pew. Teaching that these things exist is a good start.  All that is required is a link to the wiki and WG's mechanics guides for those who to wish to learn more. 

Yeah, it would be like reading a 50 page EULA before signing it...you don't, you just press 'OK'.



DaSmith #14 Posted 21 July 2017 - 11:59 PM

    Corporal

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I went into the new Bootcamp, I am at the Random Battle stage now. 
Gosh, this is actually really hard here. Teammate bots are retarded as f. The AI is totally useless, they just sit ducks in later stages of the battle. Now I am here on 5hp 1k dmg and 8 kills in the american t3 against a half hp LTP that I can almost not pen anywhere and a full hp hidden t2 td. And I have a t2 td camping in the back afk, cuz the AI is cr*p... How is your average newb keybordlicker supposed to win this? Maybe I broke the AI playing agressive??

Ok, second try I did not push the hill so much, now I won with 13 kills and 1235dmg. But still, as the bot teammates die or sit useless I really wonder ho hard it is for a newb to win this. LTP is a bit*h...
 

Edited by DaSmith, 22 July 2017 - 12:12 AM.


Balc0ra #15 Posted 22 July 2017 - 12:11 AM

    Field Marshal

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Issues is that they use the worst gun for each tank. So the SU-76i, or even the LTP is a "beast" if you don't hit it right as you have no pen at all. As they really want to "force" you to look for the green aim. The 2nd mission when they want you to cap. I almost fell of my chair laughing. After killing everyone, I decided to see if it was possible to help our base before the other one did cap. The second I left base, I got the most angry tutorial voice I've ever heard. Basically screaming "NO go back and cap". I got the SU-76i. But with the gun they gave you, I had zero chances vs that B1. And the AI did win by "cap".

 

Tho as a staging area to test mods, or let your kid play around for a bit. It's rather good.



DaSmith #16 Posted 22 July 2017 - 12:19 AM

    Corporal

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View PostBalc0ra, on 22 July 2017 - 12:11 AM, said:

Issues is that they use the worst gun for each tank. So the SU-76i, or even the LTP is a "beast" if you don't hit it right as you have no pen at all. As they really want to "force" you to look for the green aim. 

LTP kills you one on one. You can barely pen even its side, it spots you through bushes and has good aim. Good luck trying to hit the small LFP without getting shredded. I cuould only take it out at the Random Battle stage when teammates slowly brought it down to 2 shot hp and I got in 2 lucky shots as it was fleeing.



EggyTheGumGumChewer #17 Posted 22 July 2017 - 12:33 AM

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Much better than the previous one, I am just afraid this came all too late.

Baldrickk #18 Posted 22 July 2017 - 10:51 AM

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View PostBaldrickk, on 14 July 2017 - 01:34 AM, said:

It... Could be better. 

 

It focuses on some different things than the old one. 

 

I mean, at one point, it tells you to flank. 

 

And then by the time you have done that, the bot tanks have driven off, and at no point does it say anything about armour mechanics. 

The closest it gets is to get you to drive around a TD, and that is to stay away from its gun, instead of anything to do with shooting in the sides or rear. 

 

Another thing it lost was the "how to lead targets"  when it does tell you to shoot at range, it is at targets that are stationary or moving towards you. 

 

It doesn't say anything at all about spotting mechanics

It doesn't say anything at all about the armour mechanics for penetrating and defence, beyond "red reticule = bounce"

It doesn't say anything about the different classes available in the game.

 

It's shiny, but I actually think the old one was better. This is just padded out, without having even as much content as the old one (we already had a garage tutorial I believe, so that part of it was pretty unnecessary)

 


Baldrickk #19 Posted 22 July 2017 - 10:53 AM

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View PostJigabachi, on 21 July 2017 - 11:03 PM, said:

It's most definitely because of 6th sense.

 

btw: That screenshot is from the WoT version for mobile phones, right?

Nope, it's just low res (and there is less shown on the screen in the garage in bootcamp mode)



Baldrickk #20 Posted 22 July 2017 - 10:54 AM

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View PostBalc0ra, on 22 July 2017 - 12:11 AM, said:

Tho as a staging area to test mods, or let your kid play around for a bit. It's rather good.

The other one was better for testing mods.  I usually use a replay though.

 

Saying that, I have no mods, and haven't for a while.







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