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TANK CONTINUING TO MOVE WHEN WE DONT HAVE INTERNET ANYMORE

bug 9.16 support

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Baldrickk #41 Posted 20 August 2017 - 12:46 PM

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View Posttuxun, on 20 August 2017 - 10:22 AM, said:

 

sorry, i dont have 350meter ethernet tramway-proof cable

also i dont think 20 to 30 ms is a bad connection, that why i choose it for math test:)

The problem with Wi-Fi is the ping spikes, noise or just signal contention being the main causes.

 

You don't always notice them, and the ping which only checks every second or so will easily miss them.

 

Wired is the way to go if you want a reliable connection. 

 

With all that said, while I have a 30m Ethernet cable that I had draped down two flights of stairs for a while, 99% of the time I'm gaming on Wi-Fi. 



15JG52Brauer #42 Posted 20 August 2017 - 12:59 PM

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I have to say that I thought this sort of thing was just a wierd bug until the other day when our FC got disconnected in an advance in his Maus moving towards the middle on Ruinberg - he just kept on rolling, while we threw tanks in front of him to try to halt him - it was hilarious right up until the arty strike came down on us.....   I'm pretty sure in pre 9.16 (or whenever it was changed) he would have moved forward for maybe 3 or 4 seconds, then the server would have tried to coomunicate to his client, found it couldn't and just stopped so it would not have been a problem - and to be honest that seems like a much more reasonable solution rather than just keep on doing what you were last told - which is going to lead to people driving off to their doom, drowning etc due to connection issues, often outside of their control.

Tr0gledyte #43 Posted 20 August 2017 - 01:16 PM

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By far the most frustrating is when I hold my mouse while reloading (to shoot), release the button because the enemy tank moved or something and a split second later my tank fires anyway even though I clearly took my finger off the button on time..  ugh. That's with a ~50ms ping and the delay between me taking my finger off the button and the tank firing anyway is around 250ms I think. A detectable delay.

Edited by Tr0gledyte, 20 August 2017 - 01:18 PM.


15JG52Brauer #44 Posted 20 August 2017 - 01:55 PM

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View PostTr0gledyte, on 20 August 2017 - 12:16 PM, said:

By far the most frustrating is when I hold my mouse while reloading (to shoot), release the button because the enemy tank moved or something and a split second later my tank fires anyway even though I clearly took my finger off the button on time..  ugh. That's with a ~50ms ping and the delay between me taking my finger off the button and the tank firing anyway is around 250ms I think. A detectable delay.

 

Yep - had that annoying bug quite a few times myself - though I'm no sure if the alternative of a shot not firing because of packet loss would be much better either - you'd need to see how many times you would not shoot vs how many times you would shoot when you didnt want to in order to work out which scenario was better (of couse the best is for neither case to apply, but we're trying to work out which is the "best" worst case scenario, so we'd need to work out which option would cause less issues).

Baldrickk #45 Posted 20 August 2017 - 04:31 PM

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View Post15JG52Brauer, on 20 August 2017 - 12:59 PM, said:

I have to say that I thought this sort of thing was just a wierd bug until the other day when our FC got disconnected in an advance in his Maus moving towards the middle on Ruinberg - he just kept on rolling, while we threw tanks in front of him to try to halt him - it was hilarious right up until the arty strike came down on us.....   I'm pretty sure in pre 9.16 (or whenever it was changed) he would have moved forward for maybe 3 or 4 seconds, then the server would have tried to coomunicate to his client, found it couldn't and just stopped so it would not have been a problem - and to be honest that seems like a much more reasonable solution rather than just keep on doing what you were last told - which is going to lead to people driving off to their doom, drowning etc due to connection issues, often outside of their control.

Erm no.  The behaviour hasn't been changed



tuxun #46 Posted 20 August 2017 - 04:32 PM

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View PostBaldrickk, on 20 August 2017 - 04:31 PM, said:

Erm no.  The behaviour hasn't been changed

 

source code or this doesnt exist ;)

I also had a case where I shooted an ennemy, my shell doesnt leave my gun for 50ms which was just the time for a t10 to get between my gun and the ennemies. then my gun shooted.

 

Also i use server dot, and this maybe doesnt occurs (same for bouncng turret) if you dont. (but who dont?)

 

View Postthiextar, on 20 August 2017 - 11:51 AM, said:

Dude, are you seriously confused by the fact that the servers dont recieve you letting go of the button when there is NO INTERNET CONNECTION.

 

nope i'm confused cause the tank on my computer lag, it is on my own computer :D

Also, definition of ping is: between two ping you have no internet connection


 

Baldrickk #47 Posted 20 August 2017 - 04:44 PM

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View Posttuxun, on 20 August 2017 - 04:32 PM, said:

 

source code or this doesnt exist ;)

I also had a case where I shooted an ennemy, my shell doesnt leave my gun for 50ms which was just the time for a t10 to get between my gun and the ennemies. then my gun shooted.

 

Also i use server dot, and this maybe doesnt occurs (same for bouncng turret) if you dont. (but who dont?)

Source: 2 years in student halls with dodgy internet, leading to many temporary disconnects.



15JG52Brauer #48 Posted 20 August 2017 - 05:12 PM

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View PostBaldrickk, on 20 August 2017 - 03:31 PM, said:

Erm no.  The behaviour hasn't been changed

 

well - I am sure before that a tank wouldnt keep driving no matter what if it DC's - it would eventually stop , while our FC's tank just kept on going and going - maybe that would have happened before , but I haven't seen it in 6 years like that...

gunslingerXXX #49 Posted 20 August 2017 - 06:15 PM

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So many 'smart' answers and not a single one (I think, quick read because cannot be bothered) to ask how the hell he manages to push the button exactly 100 ms twice in a row?

Guess not alot of guys who are 'practically smart' play WOT



fishbob101 #50 Posted 21 August 2017 - 04:56 PM

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Welp, my full HP IS drowned because of this. Worse part was still being in the battle,  mashing S to no avail as my tank went deeper into the middle of Live Oaks....

I don't have shoddy internet so its kinda weird that this happened but I can imagine it being extremely annoying to people with bad internet.



tuxun #51 Posted 22 August 2017 - 04:46 PM

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View PostgunslingerXXX, on 20 August 2017 - 06:15 PM, said:

So many 'smart' answers and not a single one (I think, quick read because cannot be bothered) to ask how the hell he manages to push the button exactly 100 ms twice in a row?

Guess not alot of guys who are 'practically smart' play WOT

You forgot to mention that i was looking at ping at the same time ;)

 

Dont bait me: https://github.com/N...ood/HoodLoader2 (this librairie can emulate a keyboard)

 

You have the same problem than support: you want replay of an hypothetical situation. (but from what I read it may be more than hypothetical)

 

bug of today: even furiously hitting "go left" key: my tank didnt turn. so i gave up. then my tank made a 180° rotation in...

less than 1 FRAME!

(i guess i was going faster than light speed :) )


 

Zodiac1960s #52 Posted 23 August 2017 - 02:13 AM

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How can this possible be an issue for you?  Either get a stable connection or quit playing.  

It's quite bizarre what people manage to complain about.  



tuxun #53 Posted 25 August 2017 - 04:20 PM

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View PostBlind_Hate, on 23 August 2017 - 02:13 AM, said:

How can this possible be an issue for you? Either get a stable connection or quit playing.

It's quite bizarre what people manage to complain about.
 

 

and isnt a 20 or 30ms ping a stable connection? you seems smart, dude, you should understand that i can decrease noise between my router and my ap, but not on the rest of internet itself?

Also you seems complain that i complain that something which was working before isnt anymore :)
 

View PostNishi_Kinuyo, on 19 August 2017 - 11:04 AM, said:

Afaik, the behaviour you mentioned has been a common feature for hundreds of online games since the mid-90s (barely any online games prior to that).

You play the game; your client gets input, client sends input to server, connection is lot, server doesn't get told of input changes and continues performing according to the last input received. Internet gaming basics, really.

 

Game version has nothing to do with it.

 

Well that dont tell why the client doesnt move tank anymore on client... even receiveing keystroke, which it was doing before 9.17 :) (whats you call mid 90s)

Previously the server where sync'ed with client when packet arrived. now the client is sync'ed with server. but maybe its too hard to understand for the wg support team ;)


 

Kartoshkaya #54 Posted 25 August 2017 - 05:36 PM

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View PostBlind_Hate, on 23 August 2017 - 02:13 AM, said:

How can this possible be an issue for you? Either get a stable connection or quit playing.

It's quite bizarre what people manage to complain about.

 

Yeah, this thread is a total nonsense. What are you guys waiting for exactly ? You want WG to provide you better connection ?



tuxun #55 Posted 26 August 2017 - 05:54 AM

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View PostKartoshkaya, on 25 August 2017 - 05:36 PM, said:

 

Yeah, this thread is a total nonsense. What are you guys waiting for exactly ? You want WG to provide you better connection ?

 

nope, we want they fix the bug of tanks rotation/movements depending of ping instead of keypress duration.

 

(also if they could fix the not working ping indicator first 30s of game and whenwe are dead it would nice.)

 

other suggestion: instead to make a red dot for lag near ping text, put text of ping in red or green.

 

You know, if people not understanding something  did say "this is a nonsense cause i dont understand", or  "you can trust bindly toyota or volkswagen cause its how it works" when bug of year 2000 (and else) occured, you may couldnt be here today ;)

 

2KY bug:

https://en.wikipedia...cumented_errors

 

toyota:

http://www.safetyres...spaghetti”-code

 

volkswagen:

https://www.nytimes....ed.html?mcubz=1

 

there is no bug only feature:

https://journal.thri...edf3#.yf80wpjy5

 

 


Edited by tuxun, 26 August 2017 - 06:07 AM.


jabster #56 Posted 26 August 2017 - 06:41 AM

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View Posttuxun, on 26 August 2017 - 04:54 AM, said:

 

 

nope, we want they fix the bug of tanks rotation/movements depending of ping instead of keypress duration.

 

(also if they could fix the not working ping indicator first 30s of game and whenwe are dead it would nice.)

 

other suggestion: instead to make a red dot for lag near ping text, put text of ping in red or green.

 

 

The problem is it's not a bug in the traditional sense, it's the way it's intended to work. What your saying is a bit like complaining that your post isn't delivered at exactly the same time everyday - true but why would you expect it to be. If you want to take it even further the duration of the physical key press won't exactly match what the client uses. Do you think that's a bug as well? 



tuxun #57 Posted 27 August 2017 - 02:07 PM

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View Postjabster, on 26 August 2017 - 06:41 AM, said:

 

The problem is it's not a bug in the traditional sense, it's the way it's intended to work. What your saying is a bit like complaining that your post isn't delivered at exactly the same time everyday - true but why would you expect it to be. If you want to take it even further the duration of the physical key press won't exactly match what the client uses. Do you think that's a bug as well? 

 

<< it's the way it's intended to work>> NOW, not before, i want an annoucement saying that tanks doesnt move just according your keypress but also taking account ping, which it was doing differently before. also, i want the tank on my client move according my keypress, and not according the server ack, cause, yes wg, we feel this delay! when we shoot or move, it doesnt shoot ON CLIENT before server say OK! (when it doesnt send mates tanks in your line of fire before ack the shoot)

 

(and yes i think its a bug, if refer to the "press 100ms left then 100ms right" test, your tank doesnt rotate same angle, even in client.)


Also i think its bug cause no network can make a stable 20ms ping, it always move a bit.

THAT, its the way its intented to works! (so when you see a 20ms ping for first 30s of game its just actually not refreshing for 30s this 20ms ping)

 

what wasnt maybe unclear in my point is : if support (or you) tell me that using the client dot instead of the server one, its works like 9.16, i'll stop complain, cause i initially use server dot for solve my ping/wifi noise issues since 1 year!


Edited by tuxun, 27 August 2017 - 02:18 PM.


jabster #58 Posted 27 August 2017 - 02:18 PM

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View Posttuxun, on 27 August 2017 - 01:07 PM, said:

 

<< it's the way it's intended to work>> NOW, not before, i want an annoucement saying that tanks doesnt move just according your keypress but also taking account ping, which it was doing differently before. also, i want the tank on my client move according my keypress, and not according the server ack, cause, yes wg, we feel this delay! when we shoot or move, it doesnt shoot ON CLIENT before server say OK! (when it doesnt send mates tanks in your line of fire before ack the shoot)

 

(and yes i think its a bug, if refer to the "press 100ms left then 100ms right" test, your tank doesnt rotate same angle, even in client.)


Also i think its bug cause no network can make a stable 20ms ping, it always move a bit.

THAT, its the way its intented to works! (so when you see a 20ms ping for first 30s of game its just actually not refreshing for 30s this 20ms ping)

 

 

 

Well actually you client does render the shot when you press fire before the server actually decides where the shot really goes.

 

It seems the solution you want is a set of quantum entanglement keys.

 



Slyspy #59 Posted 27 August 2017 - 02:21 PM

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View Posttuxun, on 27 August 2017 - 02:07 PM, said:

 

<< it's the way it's intended to work>> NOW, not before, i want an annoucement saying that tanks doesnt move just according your keypress but also taking account ping, which it was doing differently before. also, i want the tank on my client move according my keypress, and not according the server ack, cause, yes wg, we feel this delay! when we shoot or move, it doesnt shoot ON CLIENT before server say OK! (when it doesnt send mates tanks in your line of fire before ack the shoot)

 

 

 

The way the game handles disconnects, lag and packet loss has AFAIK not changed. Further, how do you propose WG change the game from server to client side? Why would they do that?



tuxun #60 Posted 27 August 2017 - 03:20 PM

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View Postjabster, on 27 August 2017 - 02:18 PM, said:

 

Well actually you client does render the shot when you press fire before the server actually decides where the shot really goes.

 

when its doesnt wait something else. so i dont know what it wait, but it wait :) also its doesnt looks like as the server dot should work, cause server confirm your turret movement
 

View PostSlyspy, on 27 August 2017 - 02:21 PM, said:

 

The way the game handles disconnects, lag and packet loss has AFAIK not changed. Further, how do you propose WG change the game from server to client side? Why would they do that?

 

 that doesnt really explain why tanks now keeps moving on server when lag, or the dancing turet, which it wasnt doing before...

 

also i think these replay are interesting: http://forum.worldof...ate-ramming-me/

 

if you read the link about the toyata case above it say something like: a loop main was controling throttle but wasnt checking if the throttle was modified by other portion of code...

 

I have spoted another changment recently which i have to check again:

before:

press forward

press enter to go to chat

release forward

youre in chat and your tanks keep moving.

press enter again: game got you quit the chat and your tank start to go slower before it stops.

 

now:

 

press forward

press enter to go to chat

release forward

youre in chat and your tanks keep moving.

press enter again: game got you quit the chat but keep your tank throttling around map.

 

 

The only fact than when i wrote dancing turett i am not alone to see what it means prove there is something wrong;) )

 

:O and i wonder if

"2017-08-14 00:52:22.612: WARNING: [WARNING] (scripts/client/gui/battle_control/matrix_factory.py, 76): Entity of vehicle is not found to given location (26574946, 3)" in the python logs speak about that...


 





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