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can we have a system that promotes the use of standard ammo to combat Premium ammo spam

gold ammo standard ammo

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Poll: how can we tackle the current prem ammo spam? (264 members have cast votes)

You have to complete 250 battles in order to participate this poll.

how should this be dealt with

  1. add a 1/5% xp bonus per standard ammo pen with bonuses for the use of weakspots (14 votes [5.30%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 5.30%

  2. prem ammo gets a 10-20% damage penalty (89 votes [33.71%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 33.71%

  3. 10% cost increase per prem round fired (6 votes [2.27%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 2.27%

  4. XP penatiy of 1% per premium round fired (2 votes [0.76%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 0.76%

  5. leave it as it is (83 votes [31.44%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 31.44%

  6. limit premium ammo to 10-20% of total ammo (suggestion) (70 votes [26.52%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 26.52%

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haha_ufail #1 Posted 22 October 2017 - 04:20 AM

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i was hoping to take a more reasonable aproch to the way gold ammo is used in World of Tanks as of the recent few patches and make a slightly more constructive post on the matter.

 

i was thinking  of a 1/5% increase in XP for every standard round to pen an enemy tank maybe even add a small bonus for hitting weakspots? At the moment the amount of premium ammo being thown around it getting compleatly out of control in my opinion, they could either promote the use of standard ammo types, or punish the use of premium ammo with:

A. a damage penalty of  -10/-20%

B. every round fired adds +10% to the cost of the premium ammo  4200-4620-5040 etc..

C. after battle XP is droped by 1% per shot of premium ammo

 

im curios on everyone view on this so i added a poll 

 

Edit: Grammar clean up


Edited by haha_ufail, 22 October 2017 - 04:27 AM.


xx984 #2 Posted 22 October 2017 - 04:25 AM

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I'm all for "Limit gold ammo usage!!1!1" or "Nerf gold ammo damagegegeg!1!11!!1!" Until you want to play a tank like the IS-6, WZ-111, T-54-Mod 1 and mostly all tier 8's with lowish standard pen, These tanks struggle against equal tier heavies with standard rounds, let alone tier 9 and 10 heavies, and even some mediums. Especially since the MM is complete sh*t at the moment. 

 

Fix the MM so its not constant bottom tier sh*tfests, Then change premium ammo. Change premium ammo first and alot of iter 8's will be useless in 70% of battles.

 

Using tier 8s as an example, same applies for all other tiers really


Edited by xx984, 22 October 2017 - 04:27 AM.


haha_ufail #3 Posted 22 October 2017 - 04:30 AM

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View Postxx984, on 22 October 2017 - 04:25 AM, said:

I'm all for "Limit gold ammo usage!!1!1" or "Nerf gold ammo damagegegeg!1!11!!1!" Until you want to play a tank like the IS-6, WZ-111, T-54-Mod 1 and mostly all tier 8's with lowish standard pen, These tanks struggle against equal tier heavies with standard rounds, let alone tier 9 and 10 heavies, and even some mediums. Especially since the MM is complete sh*t at the moment. 

 

Fix the MM so its not constant bottom tier sh*tfests, Then change premium ammo. Change premium ammo first and alot of iter 8's will be useless in 70% of battles.

 

Using tier 8s as an example, same applies for all other tiers really

 

true, there is an issue with some tier 8's that have just been left behind in terms of pen and require prem ammo, thats why i added the option of promoting standard ammo rather than punishing prem ammo :B

Gremlin182 #4 Posted 22 October 2017 - 04:49 AM

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The system myself and others came up with in previous threads was reducing the damage.

The APCR shell is a small caliber heavy core surrounded by a softer material.

So the idea was for the damage to be rated according to the actual core size.

As a rough idea a 75mm gun fires an AP shell its classed as 75mm but when it fires an APCR shell its classed as a 57mm shell.

 

The German 75mm L70 gun has 150 pen and 135 damage with AP although the APCR round would have more pen the damage would be quite a bit less.

You Grade the HEAT and HESH shells in a similar way according to how they work

That would give the game 4 or 5 Shell types each with advantages and disadvantages at different ranges and against various armour types.

 



Homer_J #5 Posted 22 October 2017 - 07:47 AM

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As long as it's a choice between no pen with regular and penetrating with premium people will use the premium.  Doesn't matter how much it costs, how little damage it does (unless it does less than HE), or how little exp they get from it.

 

If I'm facing your super heavy then I want to hurt you.  I can hunt around for weakspots I will probably miss - meaning 0 damage.  I can vainly hope for a high roll - meaning 0 damage, if I can swap my 400 damage shell for a 200 damage shell but be pretty sure of doing 200 damage.  Which one am I going to choose?  If it earns me 0 exp but I still get the satisfaction of hurting you I'm still going to use it.  If I have to buy another Fort Knox to finance it I'm still going to use it.

 

And if they are using it when they don't need to then what is the freeking problem!


Edited by Homer_J, 22 October 2017 - 08:29 AM.


ZlatanArKung #6 Posted 22 October 2017 - 07:52 AM

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Option 6: Damage from prem rounds increase credit income for the battle by 10% per prem round fired.

That should solve any issues regarding premium rounds, because everyone can go full prem round load out.

Or

Option 7: Remove premium rounds because it is stupid, and rework armour models for almost every tank.

leggasiini #7 Posted 22 October 2017 - 08:01 AM

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Gold ammo should indeed be reworked or just flat out removed, but before you can do that you have to do something to:

 

- superheavies and in general tanks with no weakspots

- MM

- preferential MM tanks

- maps (less corridor fests)

 

You just cannot nerf the gold ammo anyhow as long as we have the Maus and Type 5 with their current armor layouts.



shane73tank #8 Posted 22 October 2017 - 08:02 AM

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View PostZlatanArKung, on 22 October 2017 - 06:52 AM, said:

Option 6: Damage from prem rounds increase credit income for the battle by 10% per prem round fired.

That should solve any issues regarding premium rounds, because everyone can go full prem round load out.

Or

Option 7: Remove premium rounds because it is stupid, and rework armour models for almost every tank.

Not good for wg, increased income means less need for premium tank/account to pay for the spam , however I see where you are going 



iztok #9 Posted 22 October 2017 - 08:25 AM

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> Premium ammo spam

Prem ammo is a consequence of imballanced game. Until this imballance is resolved, prem ammo will be used extensivelly, at least by me (some 40% "gold" ammo loadout on almost every tank).



Pansenmann #10 Posted 22 October 2017 - 09:12 AM

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now that is an interesting poll.

 

 

 

I voted for status quo.


Edited by Pansenmann, 22 October 2017 - 09:13 AM.


AliceUnchained #11 Posted 22 October 2017 - 09:58 AM

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View Postxx984, on 22 October 2017 - 04:25 AM, said:

I'm all for "Limit gold ammo usage!!1!1" or "Nerf gold ammo damagegegeg!1!11!!1!" Until you want to play a tank like the IS-6, WZ-111, T-54-Mod 1 and mostly all tier 8's with lowish standard pen, These tanks struggle against equal tier heavies with standard rounds, let alone tier 9 and 10 heavies, and even some mediums. Especially since the MM is complete sh*t at the moment. 

 

Pretty much this. As always people crying about gold spam and how it ruins the game see little beyond that hit log of theirs showing premium was used against them and understand very little about the connection between various game elements. You cannot just simply isolate one aspect, make changes, without also grasping how it will effect other elements.

 

View PostGremlin182, on 22 October 2017 - 04:49 AM, said:

The system myself and others came up with in previous threads was reducing the damage.

The APCR shell is a small caliber heavy core surrounded by a softer material.

So the idea was for the damage to be rated according to the actual core size.

As a rough idea a 75mm gun fires an AP shell its classed as 75mm but when it fires an APCR shell its classed as a 57mm shell.

 

Which sounds fine, until you take into consideration those Tier VIII mentioned above by xx984. Your system will ruin those Tier VIII even more. It will basically be a nerf to every lower Tier facing a higher Tier. Your system creates more imbalance, rather than restore it or 'fix' anything. So without making changes to other elements of the game, the above system will make matters worse.

 

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for lower damage sub-caliber rounds. Which would then include the Tier X medium standard APCR rounds (and all other vehicles which have APCR as standard round), and these vehicles would get higher damage AP(HE) rounds as additional tactical option. But before that, there are far more impacting game elements which should be addressed first. Namely map design and vehicle balance (both horribly weak and under-performing vehicles, as well was no-weakspot monstrosities and vehicles overall better than equal Tier counterparts). 

 

View Postiztok, on 22 October 2017 - 08:25 AM, said:

> Premium ammo spam

Prem ammo is a consequence of imbalanced game. Until this imbalance is resolved, prem ammo will be used extensively

 

Exactly. 

 


Edited by AliceUnchained, 22 October 2017 - 09:59 AM.


RamRaid90 #12 Posted 22 October 2017 - 09:59 AM

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I believe the current system already promotes the use of standard over premium.

 

FIre premium, lose money. Don't fire it, make money.

 

Good enough for me.


Edited by RamRaid90, 22 October 2017 - 10:03 AM.


Thejagdpanther #13 Posted 22 October 2017 - 10:31 AM

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A rework of prem ammo involve also a rework of recent armor upgrades and new premium tanks.

Noo_Noo #14 Posted 22 October 2017 - 10:52 AM

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WG have tried to balance the game round both premium and standard rounds. Not easy!!

The premium ammo always come from players that have played super heavies and get penned by them. Problem is what choice does their opponent have? none whatsoever normally. Corridor maps only exaggerate the issue. 

For me its a tool to be used in the game. There's already a penalty for using premium ammo - the cost. Little consolation to the player getting hit but at the end of the day if you're getting hit and taking damage then you're doing something wrong, even in a super heavy unless of course you're happy to be a HP trading situation That's the fundamental issue that people need to understand. 

Uebergewicht #15 Posted 22 October 2017 - 11:24 AM

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Didnt they nerf premium round damage by a flat 15% in WoT Blitz? How did that work out?

Bucifel #16 Posted 22 October 2017 - 12:40 PM

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best solution is to nerf damage of shells what have increased penetration with SAME procentual value !

 

i.e. 

if a standard shell have 100mm pen value and gold 150mm..that means prem shell have 50% more pen

due to this, that prem. shell should have 50% LESS damage in compensation for 50% more pen

 

and of course, STANDARD price for all !

 

so simply !

that neans balance ! Advantages equals with disadvantages !

 

*15% from Blitz version is far too less when pen values are increased with around 50% compared with standard pen...but its a good start !


Edited by Bucifel, 22 October 2017 - 12:48 PM.


JCD3nton #17 Posted 22 October 2017 - 12:51 PM

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"Leave it as it is [52.50%] Votes"

 

As long as the community remains this stupid, WG will keep on robbing all of us with its unbalanced game.

 

Premium ammo should either be removed or get a damage reduction. Also "deathpoof" armor meta has to change. All tanks should have weak spots no matter big or small. Players' game knowledge and skills should be rewarded, instead of their wallets.


Edited by JCD3nton, 22 October 2017 - 02:47 PM.


RamRaid90 #18 Posted 22 October 2017 - 12:55 PM

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View PostJCD3nton, on 22 October 2017 - 11:51 AM, said:

"Leave it as it is [52.50%] Votes"

 

As long as the community remains this stupid, WG will keep on robbing all of us with its unbalanced game.

 

Premium ammo should either be removed or get a damage reduction. Also "deathrpoof" armor meta has to change. All tanks should have weak spots no matter big or small. Players' game knowledge and skills should be rewarded, instead of their wallets.

 

Most played tank = Skorpion G....

 

 

Perhaps your masses of game knowledge are why you are a below average player?


Edited by RamRaid90, 22 October 2017 - 12:56 PM.


douglarse #19 Posted 22 October 2017 - 01:08 PM

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Thing is premium ammo being available for credits as it is at the moment is much fairer than it used to be when it could only be bought with gold. Everyone can use it.

 

In the past I have been opposed to prem ammo but over time I have seen it as just part of the game, and at times essential considering where WG has been taking the game in the last few years, E5 (overbuff), Maus (overbuff), Type 5 Heavy (bullsh1t), Defender etc etc.

 

I assume players have been penetrating the OPs Maus and he`s not happy

 


Edited by douglarse, 22 October 2017 - 01:08 PM.


Cobra6 #20 Posted 22 October 2017 - 01:09 PM

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- Limit the amount of premium ammo to 5%=>10% of the total ammo capacity of the vehicle (5% for vehicles with high ammo count, 10% to vehicles with low ammo count).

- Reduce the damage by 25% to simulate the lighter projectile weight.

- Cost kept exactly the same as now or even increased.

 

Premium ammo should be a last ditch resort to get yourself out of a messy situation, not used liberally.

 

Cobra 6

 







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