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Optics on Maus?


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Uebergewicht #1 Posted 10 November 2017 - 07:34 PM

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Yeah, bit of a bland question, but I´m actually kinda torn and seek your advice.

 

So, equipment for the Maus - as far as I can say, Rammer and Vstabs are a safe bet. The usual heavy tank setup would be vents, and that´s not too bad. For the Maus, spall liner would probably even be an option to dampen the clickers and the derpers as well. The thing is - I´ve actually been running my German heavy tanks with optics for quite a while. It started with the Löwe, which had great view range for its tier, and I noticed quite a lot how the view range allowed me to collect assisted damage and aid my supporting role, especially as bottom tiers. I later ran the same setup on the VK 100 for the same reasons, and then kinda just went with it for the Mäuschen. For the Maus however I should probably reconsider. It doesnt seem like an outstanding candiate, it surely is no spotter and all the other heavies have the same view range now. And many enemies it fights directly will likely be in close proximity.

But, on the other hand, my experience tells me that view range can make even a slow tank surprisingly useful on maps where it would otherwise be seriously hindered (like wide open maps) and it helps to alleviate the annoying "getting shot by unspotted enemies" thing. The Maus, after all, is often at the front line, closest to the enemy, and can afford to draw lots of fire which often enough diminishes enemy camo. I´ve managed to be a deciding factor in quite few  battles where just pushing in and lighting enemies in my heavy tank won my team the day...

 

So, please tell me, are optics on the Maus a valid and useful choice, or does my thinking lag behind? Maybe camos and crew skills on tier 10 are so great that even an optimized view range on a heavy barely does a thing. Maybe the other options are just flat out superior. Would love to read your opinions on this :)


Edited by Uebergewicht, 10 November 2017 - 07:36 PM.


Phobos4321 #2 Posted 10 November 2017 - 07:56 PM

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i would go with spallliner or vents  thought a toolbox might be an option too

 

since i run Löwe, E75, E100  etc all with spallliners i might do that to  if its a superheavy you might ram sometimes or being rammed, can be around 150-200 less HE damage per hit, you hardly lose crewmembers  and you reduce the stun duration whilethe increased weight shouldnt really pull down your mobility  



spamhamstar #3 Posted 10 November 2017 - 08:19 PM

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@OP

 

I use the spall liner on my Maus & as Phobos says it is quite effective, especially against arty. 

 

However, I chose that set up prior to the arty nerf/fix when they could still do a reasonable amount of damage.  I've noticed now that even tier x arty struggle to have any real effect on it with even the mighty t92 being lucky to do 300 dmg & the BC58 can forget it.  That said, you are an easy to hit priority target for a lot of arty players & even small amounts of damage add up over time.  Which is why I've stuck with the spall liner despite the nerf, but it might be worth trying something else considering arties more limited dmg these days.

 

I agree with your thoughs on the optics & use them on pretty much everything else including heavies.  The Wiki (http://wiki.wargamin...n/Tank:G42_Maus)  suggests using Vents, Spall Liner, Rammer, Toolkit if that's any help.

 

Would be good to know how you get on if you try both & are able to compare your experience.  Was an interesting question, not bland at all.



Uebergewicht #4 Posted 10 November 2017 - 08:38 PM

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View Postspamhamstar, on 10 November 2017 - 08:19 PM, said:

Would be good to know how you get on if you try both & are able to compare your experience.  Was an interesting question, not bland at all.

 

I was somewhat convinced that "Rammer, Vstabs, Vents" is the absolute meta for all true tier 10 heavies (so excluding special cases like the 50B), hence I felt like my question sounded a bit odd.

 

The last tank I used spall liner on was the KV-4, and that ones view range is so poor even optics wont help. My main gripe with the spall liner is that it only useful in specific situations - getting splashed by HE - and the thing is, if said HE shell goes into a thickly armored part it hardly does damage anyways. However in the critical cases where thinner armor is hit - let´s say, arty hits your roof or a Type 5 splashes down on an engine deck - the spall liner doesnt do all that much. Multiplying 60mm of armor by 1,5 means you take a whopping 30 damage less for the shot (as far as I know that´s how it works basically, raw armor thickness is subtracted from the damage roll, and super heavy spall liner gives you 50% extra armor thickness for that). Sure, you get the other benefits like protecting your crew, though I´m not sure how neccesary that is in the age of recharging health kits.

 

View range however is on constantly, and spottin or not spotting an enemy can have quite drastic consequences for the outcome of a battle. It can also make a huge difference in how much assist damage you personally rack up. Vents are also constantly working for you, improving every movement you make, every shot you take, albeit by a very slim margin. However they won´t save you when your enemies stay invisible, and my feelings is that generally, to really make the most of vents and the "small" improvements they grant, you need to be a pretty good player.

 

So, yeah. Still on the fence...



UrQuan #5 Posted 10 November 2017 - 10:23 PM

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I usually pick vents on my superheavies due to the general buffs it gives (along with rammer & Vstabs ofc). Never used superheavy spall liner, because as mentioned, it's situational & mainly works against HE/ramming situations while vents is always active. Did mean old arty could hurt me plenty with a good shot, but that's the tradeoff. So yes, on KV-4 I got the classic setup: Vents, rammer & Vstab; optics on this isn't much of a help due to low viewrange. It can be useful to rack in extra assist damage when you chase 3 marks tho, but imo, vents are more suited, as usually you'll have someone with you who has better viewrange then you anyway.

 

That said, on Maus, I changed from vents to optics to test it out & have to say, optics really help when you can't rely on people spotting for you & that's usually when things get tight & rowdy. It also helps on the Grand Battle map to spot the pesky basecamping TD's on hill shooting you & your teammates. 

In short; optics do have their use on Maus, especially when you are spearheading an attack/push or when you're on the defensive & want to give your support something to shoot at by spotting those pesky enemies at range.

So for Maus, optics do offer a clear advantage as it helps boost the already nice Maus viewrange.

 

 



gullungen #6 Posted 10 November 2017 - 10:31 PM

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I'm personally using a Rammer, Vents and Spall Liner. The Spall Liner is a must have on a Maus, because once you're spotted, the arties are over you like flies. 

I don't think using a tool box is really worth it as long as you got a repair crew.

A Vertical Stab. is an option i guess, but i wouldn't personally even think about using it, since you're gonna be up front brawling so i never seem to rotate the turret too much.



Uebergewicht #7 Posted 10 November 2017 - 10:38 PM

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View Postgullungen, on 10 November 2017 - 10:31 PM, said:

A Vertical Stab. is an option i guess, but i wouldn't personally even think about using it, since you're gonna be up front brawling so i never seem to rotate the turret too much.

 

Shouldnt the Maus constantly rotate the turret to maximize armor and spend as little time with the turret actually facing the enemy directly? Vstabs seem quite useful for that, even more so than on tanks that can keep facing their enemy.

 

Are spall liners really that effective? As I mentioned before, in theory they shouldnt help that much against the kinds of HE hits that actually hurt, because they don´t boost the effectiveness of the thinner roof and engine deck area that much.



gullungen #8 Posted 10 November 2017 - 10:47 PM

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View PostUebergewicht, on 10 November 2017 - 10:38 PM, said:

 

Shouldnt the Maus constantly rotate the turret to maximize armor and spend as little time with the turret actually facing the enemy directly? Vstabs seem quite useful for that, even more so than on tanks that can keep facing their enemy.

 

Are spall liners really that effective? As I mentioned before, in theory they shouldnt help that much against the kinds of HE hits that actually hurt, because they don´t boost the effectiveness of the thinner roof and engine deck area that much.

 

Well i guess that's true about the turret rotation, but i personally haven't really had a problem with that yet, but then again, i've only played about 20 games in it.

 

I feel like Spall Liners are quite effective to be honest, i tried without for a couple of games, and arty did constantly 400-500 damage, but then i put the Spall Liner back, and they did around 200-300 at most.



Spurtung #9 Posted 10 November 2017 - 11:00 PM

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vents+rammer+spall liner, because who needs vstabs when you hardly move.

_EXODUZ_ #10 Posted 11 November 2017 - 02:02 AM

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My setup:

Really nice to have over 500m of view range. Vstabs aren't that important, gun is quite good by itself.



Uebergewicht #11 Posted 11 November 2017 - 05:07 PM

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View Post_EXODUZ_, on 11 November 2017 - 02:02 AM, said:

My setup:

Really nice to have over 500m of view range. Vstabs aren't that important, gun is quite good by itself.

 

Oh wow. Havent thought about such a combination. How often do you get set on fire?

 

Also, I cant seem to get 500m view range on tanks.gg no matter how I configure the Maus. Do you use some kind of enhanced equipment?


Edited by Uebergewicht, 11 November 2017 - 05:13 PM.


arthurwellsley #12 Posted 11 November 2017 - 05:35 PM

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Completion of HT15 for the STUG replay (so old version of WoT now), but note 2,993 spotting damage. Putting optics on the Maus tends to increase spotting/assisted

http://wotreplays.eu...e/1574460#stats



_EXODUZ_ #13 Posted 11 November 2017 - 05:50 PM

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View PostUebergewicht, on 11 November 2017 - 05:07 PM, said:

 

Oh wow. Havent thought about such a combination. How often do you get set on fire?

 

Also, I cant seem to get 500m view range on tanks.gg no matter how I configure the Maus. Do you use some kind of enhanced equipment?

 

Not often at all. No enhanced equipment, standard as you can see. Commander has recon, radio operator - situational awareness.

Knight_Zao #14 Posted 11 November 2017 - 05:55 PM

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Always optics!!! Always! As an heavy you are usually on the frontline brawling, and usually trading damage on your terms if you are angling, so aim time, accuarcy and reload isnt too big an issue, but what optics give you is the chance to spot TDs or sniping meds that are 445m away. The amount of assistance you can get from this is unreal, so while you are brawling and getting danage for yourself you are also spotting for your team, in my eyes this will both help with MoE and your WinRate.

Edited by Knight_Zao, 11 November 2017 - 05:56 PM.


Uebergewicht #15 Posted 11 November 2017 - 06:43 PM

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View Post_EXODUZ_, on 11 November 2017 - 05:50 PM, said:

 

Not often at all. No enhanced equipment, standard as you can see. Commander has recon, radio operator - situational awareness.

 

Yeah, I see that. Activated it all, brothers in arms, chocolate too, but cant get over 495 on tanks.gg.

 

Anyways, your success speaks for itself. I´ll probably give your setup a try.






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