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What's Your Opinion On High Tier Auto-Loaders


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TungstenHitman #1 Posted 14 November 2017 - 11:00 AM

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Do you think they are OP?

Do you think they break the balance of the game since you basically eat a years worth of apha in 20 seconds.?

Do you enjoy fighting them?

Do you enjoy playing them?

Do you find their reload a liability?

Would you prefer these tanks in single shooter options too?

Do you prefer the auto-loaders with many rounds but with slow mag reload?

Do you prefer the auto-loaders with few rounds but with fast mag reload?

Do you fear them?

Do you stop going down a corridor or through a part of a city you would otherwise keep going vs a non auto-loader?

 

I'm kinda sitting on the fence here, not sure if I like em or loath em.. I certainly know I loath them if I get caught out vs a top tier French heavy with the bouncy as f*** turret armor in a hull down position, getting perma-tracked and wrecked but of course I love having my wicked way with them when I see they have used all their shots on someone else I can have a good ol 30-40 seconds knocking shot after shot into them. What you guys make of them?



brumbarr #2 Posted 14 November 2017 - 11:18 AM

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View PostTungstenHitman, on 14 November 2017 - 11:00 AM, said:

Do you think they are OP?

Depends on the tank, not the autoloader. But currently I cant think of any OP autolaoder at tier10.

Do you think they break the balance of the game since you basically eat a years worth of apha in 20 seconds.?

No.

Do you enjoy fighting them?

meh, I guess its something different to counter.

Do you enjoy playing them?

Yes.

Do you find their reload a liability?

ofcourse

Would you prefer these tanks in single shooter options too?

No, they would be crap.

Do you prefer the auto-loaders with many rounds but with slow mag reload?

No preference.

Do you prefer the auto-loaders with few rounds but with fast mag reload?

No preference, I can work with both aslong as it doesnt have cancer gunhandling (looking at you BC)

Do you fear them?

yes.

Do you stop going down a corridor or through a part of a city you would otherwise keep going vs a non auto-loader?

Cant tell, depends on the situation, in some case a non autoloader can be more of a threat, in other cases the autoloader will be more of a threat.

 

I'm kinda sitting on the fence here, not sure if I like em or loath em.. I certainly know I loath them if I get caught out vs a top tier French heavy with the bouncy as f*** turret armor in a hull down position, getting perma-tracked and wrecked but of course I love having my wicked way with them when I see they have used all their shots on someone else I can have a good ol 30-40 seconds knocking shot after shot into them. What you guys make of them?

Pls show me what game you are playing, my 50B still has paper for turret armor.

 



TankkiPoju #3 Posted 14 November 2017 - 11:26 AM

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T71 DA vs T71 CMCD.



Thalgardis #4 Posted 14 November 2017 - 11:31 AM

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Personally I think autoloaders contribute heavily to the "arcadish gameplay" and I'm not a fan of that, but I also even as a fan of TDs don't like any of them with bigger alphas then 750.

I  don't fear them and only 3 of them are considered too easy to play in my book atm. (Amx 13 90, Skoda T 50, T 57 Heavy)

I don't enjoy fighting them nor playing them.

I prefer them with few rounds and reasonable mag reload, this way they stay flexible in the game can contribute better to the team effort and don't carry "one-clip potential" like the Amx 50 100.

 

Going down a corridor, has more factors to be considered then auto loader or not.

 

 

 


Edited by Thalgardis, 14 November 2017 - 11:32 AM.


The_Georgian_One #5 Posted 14 November 2017 - 11:33 AM

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I really don't mind them. I don't remember when I was last clipped by one. I do enjoy playing some of them, recently 13 105. Prefer the ones with smaller clip and shorter reload, but I have decent stats also in 50 100.

 

I don't see them as an issue to balancing or detrimental to my pleasure of playing the game. There are other tanks that are far more problematic (Type 5 and 4 khe khe).



brumbarr #6 Posted 14 November 2017 - 11:33 AM

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View PostThalgardis, on 14 November 2017 - 11:31 AM, said:

Personally I think autoloaders contribute heavily to the "arcadish gameplay" and I'm not a fan of that, but I also even as a fan of TDs don't like any of them with bigger alphas then 750.

I  don't fear them and only 3 of them are considered to easy to play in my book atm. (Amx 13 90, Skoda T 50, T 57 Heavy)

 

The 13 90 and skoda are one of the hardest to play, especially the skoda.  So not sure wtf you are talking about.



TungstenHitman #7 Posted 14 November 2017 - 11:38 AM

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View Postbrumbarr, on 14 November 2017 - 10:18 AM, said:

 

 

Oops, no I meant the Kranvagn, that Swedish bouncy turreted mother fokker and that Foch TD with bouncy front to a lessor extent but at least that's a TD without a turret so you get in behind that guy most the time.

 

https://tanks.gg/tank/kranvagn/model

 

 

 



Xaneleon #8 Posted 14 November 2017 - 11:38 AM

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View PostTungstenHitman, on 14 November 2017 - 10:00 AM, said:

Do you think they are OP?

- Nope, they require a different skillset than regular loaders.

 

Do you think they break the balance of the game since you basically eat a years worth of alpha in 20 seconds?

- In 20 seconds, the object 907 can fire effectively 5 times, which is 1600 damage. A batchat does 1950 on average.

  I get your point, but you vastly over-exaggerate the clip times, so I figured I wouldn't bother with a real answer.

 

Do you enjoy fighting them?

- Yes, luring them out to shoot your track, instantly repairing your track and make them waste their second shot as well.

  This is one of the most satisfying things left in the game.

 

Do you enjoy playing them?

- My absolute favourite are the batchat and the AMX 13 90. With high skill comes even greater rewards when playing autoloaders.

  Mistakes get punished harder and opportunities are more rewarding, not my fault you peek sideways and get your side clipped.

 

Do you find their reload a liability?

- You have to look at it differently, you now have the ability to reposition without losing damage, because you already unloaded.

  That said, I often feel like the batchat has a 7 second too long of a reload in order to be really competitive in close quarters.

  But hey, that's a drawback I gladly live with.

 

Would you prefer these tanks in single shooter options too?

- Hell. No. That would make both my favourite tanks absolutely useless on the battlefield, they NEED that clip to prey on people.

  If you can't see that, then I think you should stop reading here.

 

Do you prefer the auto-loaders with many rounds but with slow mag reload?

- I prefer 4 shot and faster reload over 5 shot and slower reload. Just because I feel like I can do more in less time.

 

Do you prefer the auto-loaders with few rounds but with fast mag reload?

- See above.

 

Do you fear them?

- I laugh at all of them, they're nothing to me. They are not hard to play against at all.

  If I get clipped, I know it's all my fault for being in a position like that in the first place.

 

Do you stop going down a corridor or through a part of a city you would otherwise keep going vs a non auto-loader?

- That highly depends on the situation, what tank I am in, what clipper is in front of me. What part of what city we're talking about. Enemies left alive, friendlies too. Map control. My HP versus theirs. Do I have a repair kit?

  Too many factors to give a single answer.

  Yes and no.

 

I'm kinda sitting on the fence here, not sure if I like em or loath em.. I certainly know I loath them if I get caught out vs a top tier French heavy with the bouncy as f*** turret armor in a hull down position, getting perma-tracked and wrecked but of course I love having my wicked way with them when I see they have used all their shots on someone else I can have a good ol 30-40 seconds knocking shot after shot into them. What you guys make of them?

 

The most versatile tank in the game with the most rewarding gameplay, the batchat. I think that says enough for my love of autoloaders.



Matcorr #9 Posted 14 November 2017 - 11:40 AM

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They're only OP if they're in capable hands, I'd say practise on the Skoda t25, the tier 6 Czech tank, fun little beast that it is.

SlyMeerkat #10 Posted 14 November 2017 - 11:40 AM

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Im indifferent about it all really

Thejagdpanther #11 Posted 14 November 2017 - 11:57 AM

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It's just a problem of "quantity", just like any other type of vehicle.

(it feel more easy to fight a type4 than a bat ap os similar... for me)



leggasiini #12 Posted 14 November 2017 - 12:02 PM

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View PostTungstenHitman, on 14 November 2017 - 12:00 PM, said:

Do you think they are OP?

  • Skoda T 50 is probably bit too good I would say (its bigger brother TVP was also 1.5 years ago but powercreep + armor buffs has indirectly bit toned it down, its still great ofc). Other than that, nope.

Do you think they break the balance of the game since you basically eat a years worth of apha in 20 seconds.?

  • Not really. They are arguably somewhat "broken" (read: broken, NOT OP), but not too badly and there are way more broken things in the game.

Do you enjoy fighting them?

  • Depends. On average I would say that they are bit trickier to fight against than non autoloaders, but on other hand, you can punish them during their reload.

Do you enjoy playing them?

  • Depends. Some of them are fun, but some of them are awful to play. There are so many different autoloaders now that its hard to say as whole.

Do you find their reload a liability?

  • Yes, most of time. Among with that, they often have other downsides like poor gun handling, poor accuracy, poor ammo capacity or poor survivability, often many of those.

Would you prefer these tanks in single shooter options too?

  • I am not sure what you exactly mean, but I assume its "autoloading tanks getting access to single-shot guns". If the question is that, then I say yes, some of them could use a non-autoloading option. For example, I would like to see the Kranvagn getting a 145 or 150 mm (both historical) single-shot high alpha gun. French TDs, Czech MTs and BC 155 58 could also use a non-autoloading gun option. However, I think that French lights, MTs and HTs, as well as the tanks on the American autoloader line, should have just autoloaders as thats their sole special feature.

Do you prefer the auto-loaders with many rounds but with slow mag reload?

  • I personally like short, fast magazines more than large, slow magazines.

Do you prefer the auto-loaders with few rounds but with fast mag reload?

  • See above.

Do you fear them?

  • Yes, obviously. It depends but generally they have fear factor because of fast damage potential.

Do you stop going down a corridor or through a part of a city you would otherwise keep going vs a non auto-loader?

  • Typically, not really.


TungstenHitman #13 Posted 14 November 2017 - 12:30 PM

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View Postleggasiini, on 14 November 2017 - 11:02 AM, said:

Would you prefer these tanks in single shooter options too?

  • I am not sure what you exactly mean, but I assume its "autoloading tanks getting access to single-shot guns". 

 

Yes this is what is meant by that question. You'll remember before the light tank patch(I think was that patch) the Bulldog came with such an option. You could go for either a really good auto-loader or a single shooter with better pen, accuracy and just better gun handling characteristics overall. However since the bulldog was a fast light tank and the mag on it's auto-loader was huge this made the auto-loader a no brainer choice for most players since the you could basically ambush or support a teammate by using the light tanks amazing mobility and agility to race in behind and circle an enemy heavy tank, wreck it with an entire mag, then have the light tanks speed and agility to get away to safety to reload again without being punished during the reloading phase, very nice and we all did it.

   That said, there are many higher tier auto-loaders that are not light tanks and obviously do not have this speed and agility to do what a light tank auto-loader can do so my question was, would players prefer if those tanks came with the OPTION of a single shooter gun, and like the bulldog at the time, get improved gun handling and pen and accuracy, or would you feel these tanks would not go well without being exclusively and auto-loader? For Example, take take the Kranvagn I mentioned, would you prefer a tank like this if it had a single shooter option with better gun handling or absolutely not?



TankkiPoju #14 Posted 14 November 2017 - 12:34 PM

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View PostThalgardis, on 14 November 2017 - 11:31 AM, said:

I  don't fear them and only 3 of them are considered too easy to play in my book atm. (Amx 13 90, Skoda T 50, T 57 Heavy)

 

You have zero games in all these tanks.
 

View Postbrumbarr, on 14 November 2017 - 11:33 AM, said:

The 13 90 and skoda are one of the hardest to play, especially the skoda.  So not sure wtf you are talking about.

 

AMX 13 90 is a tricky beast, but at least it has burst firepower to actually hurt people... if you can pen them...

 

Very fun to play IMHO, especially as top tier.


 

Derethim #15 Posted 14 November 2017 - 12:39 PM

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View PostTungstenHitman, on 14 November 2017 - 11:00 AM, said:

Do you think they are OP?

T57 might be a tiny bit OP, imo. But it's not game-breaking, it's just really good. A good player in the T57 is the bane of your team's meds.

Do you think they break the balance of the game since you basically eat a years worth of apha in 20 seconds.?

Nope.

Do you enjoy fighting them?

I do fear them quite a bit, but they are fun to fight. You have to dodge the magazine and count and if you don't know the tank well/ miscalculate, you die. It's pretty awesome if you think about it.

Do you enjoy playing them?

Not the french light tanks, otherwise yes.

Do you find their reload a liability?

Yup.

Would you prefer these tanks in single shooter options too?

The Swedish Kranvagn could get the historical single-shot, just like legga said. It'd make it played more often.

Do you prefer the auto-loaders with many rounds but with slow mag reload?

I absolutely loathe and hate those, hence why I hate the french lights.

Do you prefer the auto-loaders with few rounds but with fast mag reload?

I wuv these.

Do you fear them?

Only a few of them and only up-close.

Do you stop going down a corridor or through a part of a city you would otherwise keep going vs a non auto-loader?

I speed towards it, because they're generally paper.

 

 


Edited by Derethim, 14 November 2017 - 12:46 PM.


brumbarr #16 Posted 14 November 2017 - 12:43 PM

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View PostDerethim, on 14 November 2017 - 12:39 PM, said:

 

 

Legaslini proposed the kranvagn single shot gun ,not me.

And btw, the french lights dont have big clips with long reloads, they have small clips with short relaod. So not sure why you dont like them.



DangerMouse #17 Posted 14 November 2017 - 12:45 PM

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Lets be honest, there is only one truly OP Auto-Loader

 

The mighty Chi-Ri

 

DM



maroar #18 Posted 14 November 2017 - 12:47 PM

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Artillery and the swedish TDs are still far more crapto play against.

Yeah I am looking at you too you freakin camp mobiles that dont lose their insane camo (or camo net bonues or binoc bonus) when turning in siege mode, especially at all those [edited]climbs where there are also bushes it bloody retarded.



Derethim #19 Posted 14 November 2017 - 12:47 PM

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View Postbrumbarr, on 14 November 2017 - 12:43 PM, said:

 

Legaslini proposed the kranvagn single shot gun ,not me.

And btw, the french lights dont have big clips with long reloads, they have small clips with short relaod. So not sure why you dont like them.

 

Sorry, just woke up :D

The Czech ones have shorter reloads, besides, the 12t is just ... awful. Bad. I hate that thing.

*shot* miss *shot* miss *shot* critical hit *shot* miss. This thing couldn't hit a Type 5 if it was next to it.


Edited by Derethim, 14 November 2017 - 12:54 PM.


leggasiini #20 Posted 14 November 2017 - 12:48 PM

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View PostTungstenHitman, on 14 November 2017 - 01:30 PM, said:

For Example, take take the Kranvagn I mentioned, would you prefer a tank like this if it had a single shooter option with better gun handling or absolutely not?

 

Depends, probably not in many cases, but that is partially due to many autoloaders have bad platforms and thus are designed and balanced with autoloaders in the mind. For example, the AMX 50 B would need an absolutely insane gun in order to make the tank even remotely viable with a single shot option. Same for T57, as it has just flat out worse platform than Super Conqueror (which already has a very good gun) or even the E5. TVP would essentially be a Russian medium except without any armor and that is at least 25% taller.

 

Simply said, having an autoloader is an advantage. It has its flaws, but the clip potential almost always makes up for it.. However, I don't see autoloaders being too good - because like I already said, most autoloaders have in way or another worse platforms than non-autoloaders, as they are well...balanced around autoloaders. That, or the other gun stats are worse (autoloaders almost always have worse DPM and quite often poor gun handling or penetration). Because of the fact the autoloader tanks are most of time balanced around the autoloaders, the single shot version would need to be very, very strong. I mean, its probably doable...but it is necessary? For some, it would be done, but I would much rather see a bit different kind of gun as an option. Kranvagn is a good example - a single shot 14.5 / 15 cm boomstick as an option VS autoloader with approtiate gun stats would be quite unique and certainly a better and more interesting option than for example, a single shot 120 mm.

 


Edited by leggasiini, 14 November 2017 - 12:50 PM.





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