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Detection problems, according to me


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SHAKALL_ #1 Posted 12 December 2017 - 02:21 PM

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Hi all,

I am quite unsatisfied by the actual detection system because i find it frusrating and with errors which should not occur in a "tank simulation" (even if i know that despîte the technical datas, WOT is mostly a tank arcade game).

 

My problems:

- a light moving at full speed in a plain without any bush and being in your viewing arc and in viewing range, can disppear. Harry Potter tank mode on.

- a tank partially hidden by a building at 50/100 meters and of which you can see 20% of the rear part, can disappear. Harry Potter tank mode on.

- a medium/light tank capping in a place without any bush, is not seen at 300 meters. Harry Potter tank mode on.

 

Even if i do not like it, i perfectly understand that a tank hidden behind some bushes is not seen when firing.

But even with a full camo skilled crew, a camo net, ... there as some things to change to get a more real feeling and stop that "abracadabra" feeling you get sometimes.

 


Edited by SHAKALL_, 12 December 2017 - 02:38 PM.


magkiln #2 Posted 12 December 2017 - 03:03 PM

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View PostSHAKALL_, on 12 December 2017 - 02:21 PM, said:

Hi all,

I am quite unsatisfied by the actual detection system because i find it frusrating and with errors which should not occur in a "tank simulation" (even if i know that despîte the technical datas, WOT is mostly a tank arcade game).

 

My problems:

- a light moving at full speed in a plain without any bush and being in your viewing arc and in viewing range, can disppear. Harry Potter tank mode on.

- a tank partially hidden by a building at 50/100 meters and of which you can see 20% of the rear part, can disappear. Harry Potter tank mode on.

- a medium/light tank capping in a place without any bush, is not seen at 300 meters. Harry Potter tank mode on.

 

Even if i do not like it, i perfectly understand that a tank hidden behind some bushes is not seen when firing.

But even with a full camo skilled crew, a camo net, ... there as some things to change to get a more real feeling and stop that "abracadabra" feeling you get sometimes.

 

 

It's already improved quite a bit compared to the older versions where tanks could cross gaps in plain sight without being spotted because of the low rendering rate.

That said, it could certainly be improved. What I would like is a two-stage spotting system. Now a tank is either fully visible, or not at all. I think it would improve if there was a stage in-between, where you can see that there is a tank there, but without information on what tank it is, and instead of a clear red outline only a red dot in the centre. That way a moving light tank would not be completely stealthed, but still a more difficult target than when it's fully visible.



Iscoed1815 #3 Posted 12 December 2017 - 04:46 PM

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Thats like when you track a tank and they disappear, what so the crew quickly jumped out and threw on a cammo net

pecopad #4 Posted 12 December 2017 - 05:11 PM

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I think tanks should be seen all the time, like in other games. Makes no sense to see a tree fall, or a tank disappear...

 

Seen and spotted should be different things. except for arty, but arty should not see the true location of the tank



AliceUnchained #5 Posted 12 December 2017 - 05:33 PM

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View PostSHAKALL_, on 12 December 2017 - 02:21 PM, said:

Hi all,

I am quite unsatisfied by the actual detection system because i find it frusrating and with errors which should not occur in a "tank simulation" (even if i know that despîte the technical datas, WOT is mostly a tank arcade game).

 

My problems:

- a light moving at full speed in a plain without any bush and being in your viewing arc and in viewing range, can disppear. Harry Potter tank mode on.

- a tank partially hidden by a building at 50/100 meters and of which you can see 20% of the rear part, can disappear. Harry Potter tank mode on.

- a medium/light tank capping in a place without any bush, is not seen at 300 meters. Harry Potter tank mode on.

 

Except of course, these are not errors but by design. They're intended. Just because you feel it should be done differently, does not make the current system erroneous as that would mean it's not actually working as intended. While the reality here is, it is not working the way you want it to.

 

View Postpecopad, on 12 December 2017 - 05:11 PM, said:

I think tanks should be seen all the time, like in other games. Makes no sense to see a tree fall, or a tank disappear...

 

It makes sense when you understand it is done server-side, and makes it impossible to create wallhacks as the client doesn't have the required data for it to work.  



CmdRatScabies #6 Posted 12 December 2017 - 05:35 PM

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You need to adapt to the game.  No point asking the game to change to suit you.

Enforcer1975 #7 Posted 12 December 2017 - 05:43 PM

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Well OP i agree that your points are valid but if you actually knew how spotting mechanics work you wouldn't have opened a thread like this...

 



pecopad #8 Posted 12 December 2017 - 05:45 PM

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View PostAliceUnchained, on 12 December 2017 - 05:33 PM, said:

 

Except of course, these are not errors but by design. They're intended. Just because you feel it should be done differently, does not make the current system erroneous as that would mean it's not actually working as intended. While the reality here is, it is not working the way you want it to.

 

 

It makes sense when you understand it is done server-side, and makes it impossible to create wallhacks as the client doesn't have the required data for it to work.  

 

Do you have any info that says that the client has no info? I never saw any disclosure of this type of information, but anyway this isn't my point.

 

I don't think this feature is due to wall hack prevention,but its due to game mechanics. Maps and distances are much smaller than they should be for a tank simulation, hence the need to make tanks disappear.

 

Maybe someday we can get a WoT version that does not need to resort to this mechanics



Enforcer1975 #9 Posted 12 December 2017 - 05:51 PM

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View Postpecopad, on 12 December 2017 - 05:45 PM, said:

 

Do you have any info that says that the client has no info? I never saw any disclosure of this type of information, but anyway this isn't my point.

 

I don't think this feature is due to wall hack prevention,but its due to game mechanics. Maps and distances are much smaller than they should be for a tank simulation, hence the need to make tanks disappear.

 

Maybe someday we can get a WoT version that does not need to resort to this mechanics

 

Vision mechanics are actually a good thing because it doesn't suffer from players lowering their details to a point where they can see tanks behind bushes or buildings because there is a game master ( the server ) in between that tells them what they see and what not. The game is built entirely around that system. Removing it would basically make it into another WT and if you want to play that just go and play it.



CmdRatScabies #10 Posted 12 December 2017 - 05:52 PM

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View Postpecopad, on 12 December 2017 - 05:11 PM, said:

I think tanks should be seen all the time, like in other games.

 

So you can zoom out and spot every tank on the map?

pecopad #11 Posted 12 December 2017 - 05:59 PM

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View PostCmdRatScabies, on 12 December 2017 - 05:52 PM, said:

 

So you can zoom out and spot every tank on the map?

 

On other FPS's, the ability to spot is different than the ability to see... You always see objects and enemies...

 

There are also no contours when the enemies are on your sights, which I think also helps immersion..

 

But in the end, maybe my version would be no fun.. so I kind of understand why they do it like this...



CmdRatScabies #12 Posted 12 December 2017 - 06:00 PM

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View Postpecopad, on 12 December 2017 - 05:59 PM, said:

 

On other FPS's, the ability to spot is different than the ability to see... You always see objects and enemies...

 

There are also no contours when the enemies are on your sights, which I think also helps immersion..

 

But in the end, maybe my version would be no fun.. so I kind of understand why they do it like this...

 

Your version wouldn't be WoT.

pecopad #13 Posted 12 December 2017 - 06:05 PM

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View PostCmdRatScabies, on 12 December 2017 - 06:00 PM, said:

 

Your version wouldn't be WoT.

 

Agree... But I value immersion a lot.

Playability is also very important... There has to be a compromise, so I understand why WoT is like this.

But game engines and computers have evolved a lot since WoT was made,so maybe now a more immersive game can be made..

 

 



AliceUnchained #14 Posted 12 December 2017 - 10:09 PM

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View Postpecopad, on 12 December 2017 - 05:45 PM, said:

Do you have any info that says that the client has no info? I never saw any disclosure of this type of information, but anyway this isn't my point.

 

I don't think this feature is due to wall hack prevention,but its due to game mechanics. Maps and distances are much smaller than they should be for a tank simulation, hence the need to make tanks disappear.

 

Maybe someday we can get a WoT version that does not need to resort to this mechanics

 

It's inherent to the system implemented; as the server does all the calculations, the client will only receive this data once the server has calculated and determined something should become visible. Whether this server-side implementation was done in order to prevent (or at the very least reduce) hacks and cheats, I honestly can't say. It is quite likely this design choice was based on other aspect first and foremost. And it's not a feature, it's not due to game mechanics, it simply is the game mechanic. Map size (and thus distances) was the direct result of Big World game engine limitations (oh the irony).

 

Even with larger maps, if all tanks would be visible (e.g. drawn) all the time and left up to each to client to determine if and when to draw it on screen for each respective player it would be fairly simple to create 'wall'hacks. After all, each client would already know where all vehicles are. Out of curiosity, are you familiar with wallhacks in older FPS games?



JaffaStar #15 Posted 13 December 2017 - 06:04 AM

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This game is not an Tank simulator ... This game had nothing to do with tanks , except how this vehicles look ... everything else is pure fantasy ... do not ask for things that will not be implemented ever ... This is arcade / fantasy tank game ... If they implement a real tank simulator battle , very few will play it because it will be extremly hard ... think about it : no invisibility , no cloacky bushes , no super speeds , no auto aim ... and so on ... 

Edited by JaffaStar, 13 December 2017 - 06:05 AM.





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