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Why is the French TD line considered bad?


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TheBeastGuy #1 Posted 30 December 2017 - 06:50 PM

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Hello! PLEASE BE AWARE THIS IS A "NOOB" QUESTION. I was wondering why the French TD line is considered bad. Sure, their DPM might not be as high, but they surely make up for it with their penetration? I know there is premium ammo and all that, but it makes it very hard to grind lines without a premium account while using APCR ammo. Plus, their premium ammo has insane penetration, the tier 7 probably being able to penetrate all tier 10's with it's premium ammo( I do carry premium ammo in my tanks, though it's not as effective as this lines' ). Yes, the penetration starts to be "bad" starting from tier 9, being the same as the tier 8, but to be honest, at that tier I should definitely be using a lot of APCR. Their autoloader playstyle also seems pretty attractive, being able to 100 to 0 lower tier opponents (you usually get spotted after your first shot in any TD, so might as well make it count quickly then reposition). Their armor is great as well, (although they do have large weakspots on top) allowing the player to play aggressive, while being quite mobile. Please excuse my English and my level of inexperience.

Balc0ra #2 Posted 30 December 2017 - 06:56 PM

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Before they were recently "buffed", they had other major issues that left them unplayable. Now as you pointed out, the tier 7 and 8 have great pen for their tiers. But having the same pen and gun on all tanks at the top is what makes the tier X less then ideal. The pen is not that good that you can penetrate every tier X. If you get the side or rear, sure. But head on? Not really. The tier X has a 6 round map with the same pen as the tier 8. It had close to 300 before, so it's lost a few. So vs most targets head on with AP with a few low pen rolls. You might get 2 damaging shots out of 6 more so then a full clip.  So the rage topics about the new tier X being OP died out fast, and replaced with topics saying you need to spam gold in it due to the pen. Now it's even more rare to see the Foch B now, then the old 155 before the changes.

Edited by Balc0ra, 30 December 2017 - 06:57 PM.


Pandabird #3 Posted 30 December 2017 - 07:01 PM

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They used to have like 40mm side armor and they have big flat sides. Arty used to love shooting these as soon as they lined up sideways.

Edited by Pandabird, 30 December 2017 - 07:02 PM.


SABAOTH #4 Posted 30 December 2017 - 07:03 PM

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Because they have a croissant on the top that is 50% the width of the tank with enough armor to be penned by a tier 2.

 

And since it was too easy to hit they enlarged it so you cannot miss it.



TheBeastGuy #5 Posted 30 December 2017 - 10:06 PM

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View PostBalc0ra, on 30 December 2017 - 06:56 PM, said:

Before they were recently "buffed", they had other major issues that left them unplayable. Now as you pointed out, the tier 7 and 8 have great pen for their tiers. But having the same pen and gun on all tanks at the top is what makes the tier X less then ideal. The pen is not that good that you can penetrate every tier X. If you get the side or rear, sure. But head on? Not really. The tier X has a 6 round map with the same pen as the tier 8. It had close to 300 before, so it's lost a few. So vs most targets head on with AP with a few low pen rolls. You might get 2 damaging shots out of 6 more so then a full clip.  So the rage topics about the new tier X being OP died out fast, and replaced with topics saying you need to spam gold in it due to the pen. Now it's even more rare to see the Foch B now, then the old 155 before the changes.

 

So if I'm only playing to about tier 8-9, is the line worth it?

Spurtung #6 Posted 30 December 2017 - 10:27 PM

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View PostSABAOTH, on 30 December 2017 - 08:03 PM, said:

And since it was too easy to hit they enlarged it so you cannot miss it.

The only visual difference between both tier 10 is the gun, everything else is exactly the same.



Isharial #7 Posted 30 December 2017 - 10:33 PM

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View PostTheBeastGuy, on 30 December 2017 - 10:06 PM, said:

 

So if I'm only playing to about tier 8-9, is the line worth it?

 

not really, there are far better T8/9 TD's out there that:

 

1) have better view range/camo

2) have better pen

3) have more alpha

4) are just as mobile


 

they might be the only autoloading ones, but they are the size of London, have huge weakspots on top of them that T2 tanks can hit and pen very easily, and have overmatchable side and roof armour so that even arty will pen you for full damage


 

stop at the T5, you wont regret it


 

the T6 ARL needs copious amounts of free xp to play properly (you need the tracks before you can even mount anything other than a T3 gun (yes a T3 gun!) )

the T7 ate spinach and steroids and cant hide no matter what you do, its armour is made from butter and its gun has the dispersion and aimtime of a KV-2

haven't played the T8 yet (have to gain the will to buy it) but if its anything like the T7, its going to suck massively

 

 

oh and I should add, you will get killed in less than 10 seconds if you try to play these aggressively on the front line, either by arty, or by a more useful TD


Edited by Isharial, 30 December 2017 - 10:35 PM.


JPKERR #8 Posted 30 December 2017 - 10:56 PM

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I liked the tier 8 before rebalance a lot, i dont know how it is now. Tier 9 Foch is absolutely amazing right now - tier 9 tanks get good MM and Foch does the job against lower tier opponents. Tier 10 Foch B is bad - more sluggish than Foch and meets tougher opponents where pen simply is not enough. If you fire APCR only be ready to lose 100k+ credits per battle even with premium. This gun simply does not work on TD platform at tier 10. T57/50B are all around better than Foch B imo. T57 actually has even more DPM than Foch B and is a much better platform for such low pen gun because of turret and more depression. Id even say it has a better armor since you get some odd bounces on the turret, Foch B gets penned in its colossal weakspots all the time.

TheBeastGuy #9 Posted 30 December 2017 - 11:12 PM

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Can someone recommend me a TD line that is fun? I heard a lot of people that say that TD's are useless at the moment. I should probably mention that I'm at the Jgpz 4 in the Jgpz E 100 line and at the ISU 152 in the Obj.269 line(researched, not bought). I was thinking if French TD's weren't gonna cut it that I would go for the paper German line or maybe the turreted American line, as I'm not really enjoying my 2 current grinds. Any opinions?. 

Pandabird #10 Posted 30 December 2017 - 11:21 PM

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View PostTheBeastGuy, on 31 December 2017 - 12:12 AM, said:

Can someone recommend me a TD line that is fun? I heard a lot of people that say that TD's are useless at the moment. I should probably mention that I'm at the Jgpz 4 in the Jgpz E 100 line and at the ISU 152 in the Obj.269 line(researched, not bought). I was thinking if French TD's weren't gonna cut it that I would go for the paper German line or maybe the turreted American line, as I'm not really enjoying my 2 current grinds. Any opinions?. 

 

If you are looking for unique experiences and "something new", german paper td's all the way. They are all very interesting and different vehicles :)

 

And the t8 Borsig with 12,8 gun is an absolute beast when played right.


Edited by Pandabird, 30 December 2017 - 11:22 PM.


tank276 #11 Posted 30 December 2017 - 11:23 PM

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View PostTheBeastGuy, on 30 December 2017 - 10:12 PM, said:

Can someone recommend me a TD line that is fun? I heard a lot of people that say that TD's are useless at the moment. I should probably mention that I'm at the Jgpz 4 in the Jgpz E 100 line and at the ISU 152 in the Obj.269 line(researched, not bought). I was thinking if French TD's weren't gonna cut it that I would go for the paper German line or maybe the turreted American line, as I'm not really enjoying my 2 current grinds. Any opinions?. 

 

It depends on your playstyle and your idea of fun dude.

I.e. the two german TD lines are very different.

Do you prefer to stay hidden and snipe from 400 m. (Grille line)  or get up close and personal (JP100 line)?

Have finished grind in both german and the turreted US line.

Currently at tier 9 of both soviet, t8 in British and non turreted US and at tier 6 in the French and Chinese lines

 



kaneloon #12 Posted 30 December 2017 - 11:59 PM

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T110e4 line is nice, but with their turrets it is more a heavy gameplay than a sneaky TD gameplay.

Solexi #13 Posted 31 December 2017 - 01:19 AM

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My main reason for disliking and giving up on them is because they're flippin' massive.

XxKuzkina_MatxX #14 Posted 31 December 2017 - 03:21 AM

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View PostTheBeastGuy, on 31 December 2017 - 12:12 AM, said:

Can someone recommend me a TD line that is fun? I heard a lot of people that say that TD's are useless at the moment. I should probably mention that I'm at the Jgpz 4 in the Jgpz E 100 line and at the ISU 152 in the Obj.269 line(researched, not bought). I was thinking if French TD's weren't gonna cut it that I would go for the paper German line or maybe the turreted American line, as I'm not really enjoying my 2 current grinds. Any opinions?. 

 

Just stop grinding the jgpz line because it's crap, the grille too. German tier 10 TD's are not good at the moment, maybe in the future WG will make some changes so they are worth getting.

 

As for recommendations, T110E3 is a beast. You have massive armor, 8 degrees of gun depression, very good penetration. Yes you are slow and you you don't have a turret but most of the situations on most of the maps you will have fun. Not a scared little sniper :)

 

French TD's are not that bad at all (tier 7 is awful though!). Tier 8 is good, tier 9 is the same as tier 10 with 4 shells only and meets tier 7's...LOL, tier 10 i carry only gold so no problem with penetration for me and i enjoy the better shell velocity. Finished TD-15 for the T55a with the Foch B with ease i might say. Don't consider for a minute you have armor though. :)


Edited by XxKuzkina_MatxX, 31 December 2017 - 03:23 AM.


Phobos4321 #15 Posted 31 December 2017 - 04:03 AM

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well i have "fun" with the T8 french now so much fun i normaly dont even play it even when its on my grind list

 

rather large tanks awefull side back roof armor  only thing with something like armor  is the frontal armor  but wait you got some 150mm copula, a giant 150mm rangefinder and if that wasnt bad enough a 30mm mg nest in the back

 

for large fighting distances your guns are rather awefull   aimtime/accurcy  and if you get close it would be hard to miss your weakspots

might get better with getting the 1600 damage autoloader but before that its just giant pain to play it



TheBeastGuy #16 Posted 31 December 2017 - 12:34 PM

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Thanks to everyone who answered! One last thing:penetration. I keep emphasising this stat. I would much rather be in the AMX AC 46 with my 232 base penetration in a tier 9 match-up(90% of the time probably) as my 300 alpha at least deals damage compared to a tank with 200 pen, which won't do anything to a tier 9 heavy.

Radu_Korne #17 Posted 31 December 2017 - 06:03 PM

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View PostTheBeastGuy, on 31 December 2017 - 01:34 PM, said:

Thanks to everyone who answered! One last thing:penetration. I keep emphasising this stat. I would much rather be in the AMX AC 46 with my 232 base penetration in a tier 9 match-up(90% of the time probably) as my 300 alpha at least deals damage compared to a tank with 200 pen, which won't do anything to a tier 9 heavy.

 

2.9 aim time... good luck actually hitting that target. I'd use DCA 45, it has 259 prem round if I ever want to pen stuff frontally.

Isharial #18 Posted 31 December 2017 - 06:05 PM

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View PostRadu_Korne, on 31 December 2017 - 06:03 PM, said:

 

2.9 aim time... good luck actually hitting that target. I'd use DCA 45, it has 259 prem round if I ever want to pen stuff frontally.

 

its like a KV-2 gun, but without stalin to guide it...

if you sat still for 3 seconds to aim the gun, you'll be dead before you fire...


 

its not a good gun...

 



albee9 #19 Posted 31 December 2017 - 06:10 PM

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View PostTheBeastGuy, on 30 December 2017 - 11:12 PM, said:

Can someone recommend me a TD line that is fun? I heard a lot of people that say that TD's are useless at the moment. I should probably mention that I'm at the Jgpz 4 in the Jgpz E 100 line and at the ISU 152 in the Obj.269 line(researched, not bought). I was thinking if French TD's weren't gonna cut it that I would go for the paper German line or maybe the turreted American line, as I'm not really enjoying my 2 current grinds. Any opinions?. 

 

IMO, the American lines are very good, I dont normally enjoy non-turret ATs but the American ATs can troll a lot, the T28 and T95 are good tanks at their tier.

TheBeastGuy #20 Posted 01 January 2018 - 01:28 PM

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Thank you for your answers! I think I'll settle for the American TD line, not sure if turreted or not-turreted, but I'm going through the Wolverine, so I have time to make a choice. I am wondering though, why is no one mentioning the Chinese TD line? It seems to be a great line, with almost invisible tanks(that tier 7) with just enough alpha and penetration, as well as armor for when they are top tier. Am I missing an important detail that makes them bad?




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