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Update 9.22 Public Test Feedback - Soviet Medium Tanks

9.22

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Kandly #1 Posted 16 January 2018 - 07:10 PM

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Commanders,

 

Please share your feedback regarding the Soviet Medium Tanks rebalance in Update 9.22's Public Test in this topic.

 

Cheers,

Kandly



Celution #2 Posted 19 January 2018 - 05:05 PM

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Pretty lousy balancing, especially with regards to putting the Object 430 down a tier. Also no improvements to the Object 430 version II at all, that still suffers from poor gun handling for a tank that has a semi-turret and very poor gun depression. Furthermore, the 122 mm D-25-44 featured on the T-44 is still not competitive, and for players wanting to grind the T-44 without using the way superior 100 mm LB-1, and prepare for the gameplay of the 430 and 430U, this gun should be a viable option.

 

Object 430U (Tier X)

Initial thoughts are that the armour on this tank is just way too strong, it needs nerfing.

 

  • Make the cupolas actual weakspots, similar to those on the Object 907 and Object 140.
  • Decrease the thickness of the Upper Front Plate from 160 to 140 mm.

 

Object 430 (Tier IX)

There are a few problems that should be solved, first out all it's pretty damn boring that the tank only features one gun, even lacking the historical 100 mm D-54TS. The fact that it only has one turret may be explained from a historical standpoint, as it is a experimental tank that never went into production. Second, the premium round of the 122 mm D25TSU only features +10 mm of penetration, which is absolutely abyssmal. Also, why does it have such poor engine power?

 

  • Penetration of the 122mm AP Composite-Rigid BR-471PM for the 122 mm D-25TSU Gun increased from 248 mm to 288 mm.
  • Added the 100 mm D-54TS as default gun, characteristics are as follows:
    • Gun elevation angle: 20 degrees
    • Gun depression angle: -5 degrees
    • Dispersion at 100 m: 0.34
    • Rate of fire: 7.5 rounds/min
    • Reload time: 8 s
    • Aiming time: 2.3s
  • Added the 100mm Armor-Piercing UBR-412B shell to the 100 mm D-54TS. Characteristics are as follows:
    • Damage: 320
    • Penetration: 219 mm
    • Shell velocity: 1015 m/s
  • Added the UBR-412PB APCR shell to the 100 mm D-54TS. Characteristics are as follows:
    • Damage: 320
    • Penetration: 264 mm
    • Shell velocity: 1535 m/s
  • Added the 100mm High-Explosive UOF-412B shell to the 100 mm D-54TS. Characteristics are as follows:
    • Damage: 420
    • Penetration: 50 mm
    • Shell velocity: 900 m/s
  • Moved the 122 mm D-25TSU as researchable module after the 100 mm D-54TS, for 59 300 experience.
  • Moved the Object 430U research to behind the 122 mm D-25TSU, and reduced the research cost from 287 000 to 227 700 experience.
  • Hitpoints reduced from 1800 to 1700.

 

Object 430 Version II (Tier IX)

The Object 430 Version II should become a true sniper, featuring a powerful gun that is capable of penetrating armored targets without having to rely on HEAT spam. Also giving the upgraded turret fully traversable capabilities (similar to the STG) will improve the overall comfort of this vehicle. The stock turret still features the semi-turret, though.

 

  • Aiming time of the 100 mm D-54 decreased from 2.9 s to 2.2 s.
  • Dispersion at 100 m of the 100 mm D-54 decreased from 0.38 to 0.35.
  • Gun traverse for the turret "Object 430 Version II enhanced" increased from -90/90 to -180/180.
  • Added the 100 mm D-54TS as researchable module after the 100 mm D-54 for 59 300 experience. Characteristics are as followed:
    • Gun elevation angle: 20 degrees
    • Gun depression angle: -5 degrees
    • Dispersion at 100 m: 0.34
    • Rate of fire: 7.5 rounds/min
    • Reload time: 8 s
    • Aiming time: 2.1s
  • Added the UBR-412PB APCR shell to the 100 mm D-54TS. Characteristics are as follows:
    • Damage: 320
    • Penetration: 264 mm
    • Shell velocity: 1535 m/s
  • Added the 100mm High-Explosive Anti-Tank ZUBK4 shell to the 100 mm D-54TS. Characteristics are as follows:
    • Damage: 320
    • Penetration: 330 mm
    • Shell velocity: 900 m/s
  • Added the 100mm High-Explosive UOF-412B shell to the 100 mm D-54TS. Characteristics are as follows:
    • Damage: 420
    • Penetration: 50 mm
    • Shell velocity: 900 m/s

 

T-54 first prototype (Tier VIII)

The T-54 first prototype did not need such a buff at all.

 

  • Changed the engine power of the V-44 engine from 520 h.p. to 760 h.p.

 

 

T-44-100 (Tier VIII)

The T-44-100 did not need such major buffs at all. MAYBE the dispersion values during movement and hull traverse could be made equal, but the T-44-100 already has some edges over the T-44 in the form of aim time, turret traverse dispersion, hitpoints and the presence of sideskirts that act as spaced armour.

 

  • Decreased dispersion during movement by 40%
  • Decreased dispersion on hull traverse by 40%
  • Changed the reverse speed from 20 km/h to 23 km/h
  • Changed the engine power of the V-44 engine from 520 h.p. to 760 h.p.

 

T-44 (Tier VIII)

The 122 mm D-25-44 featured on the T-44 is still not competitive, and for players wanting to grind the T-44 without using the way superior 100 mm LB-1, and prepare for the gameplay of the 430 and 430U, this gun should be a viable option. Furthermore, the T-44 did NOT need any other buffs, especially not the engine power buff

 

  • Penetration of the 122mm Armor-Piercing UBR-471 for the 122 mm D-25-44 Gun increased from 175 mm to 210 mm.
  • Penetration of the 122mm AP Composite-Rigid BR-471D for the 122 mm D-25-44 Gun increased from 217 mm to 248 mm.
  • Rate of fire of the 122 mm D-25-44 increased from 3.95 rounds/min to 4.45 rounds/min.
  • Reloading time of the 122 mm D-25-44 decreased from 15.19 s to 13.48 s.
  • Aiming time of the 122 mm D-25-44 decreased from 3.2 s to 2.9 s.
  • Decreased dispersion during movement with the T-44 suspension by 20%
  • Decreased dispersion during movement with the T-44M suspension by 22%
  • Decreased dispersion on hull traverse with the T-44 suspension by 20%
  • Decreased dispersion on hull traverse with the T-44M suspension by 22%
  • Changed the reverse speed from 20 km/h to 23 km/h
  • Changed the engine power of the V-54-6 engine from 680 h.p. to 760 h.p.

Edited by Celution, 19 January 2018 - 07:01 PM.


ndiver #3 Posted 19 January 2018 - 05:12 PM

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I find the rotation speed of both turret and hull of the 430U quite fast, but apparently in the average of other soviets meds TX.

I express like the other players my fears that it will be too efficient compared to the other meds : it has like the 121 the alpha from a heavy, but also with a frontal armor (hull and turret) of a heavy and the mobility of a med.


Edited by ndiver, 19 January 2018 - 08:16 PM.


zeroGUN #4 Posted 19 January 2018 - 07:59 PM

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Great buffs , much needed.  *sarcasm* :sceptic:

Shizuthink #5 Posted 19 January 2018 - 08:05 PM

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And one more time: It seems like the old Object 430 is renamed to Object 430B and stays in your service record with the stats that it has. Here is my question: Why on earth does it have to be removed from the game? Why can't it face the same treatment as FV215B, FV183 and Foch 155 did? It's not a gamebreaking tank in any sense of the word so why can't it stay in the game as a reward vechicle. There is no logic whatsoever in removing it when all you'd have to do would be to rename it and leave it in the garages of the people who already have it. Why can people keep their 183s and 215Bs but other's are getting robbed off their Object 430s? 

Veka26 #6 Posted 19 January 2018 - 08:07 PM

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If the 430U stays as it is when it goes live, I feel it will break the game. The way I see it after playing it on TS, it is a 113 with better armor, mobility camo and gun. Come on WG

ndiver #7 Posted 19 January 2018 - 08:10 PM

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View PostShizubot, on 19 January 2018 - 08:05 PM, said:

And one more time: It seems like the old Object 430 is renamed to Object 430B and stays in your service record with the stats that it has. Here is my question: Why on earth does it have to be removed from the game? Why can't it face the same treatment as FV215B, FV183 and Foch 155 did? It's not a gamebreaking tank in any sense of the word so why can't it stay in the game as a reward vechicle. There is no logic whatsoever in removing it when all you'd have to do would be to rename it and leave it in the garages of the people who already have it. Why can people keep their 183s and 215Bs but other's are getting robbed off their Object 430s? 

 

WG has a politics that is right now:

- if a TX is downtiered to tier 9, you get both T9 and TX

- if a TX is removed, you keep it and get the new one



GameHunter10 #8 Posted 19 January 2018 - 09:28 PM

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Really wg...many heavys at tier 10 have 140-150mm of upper front armour and this thing (the 430U) has 160 with 113's turret with also...surprise...surprise... better armour :)) You couldn't screw that up soo much even if you tryed wg :))

HunterXHunter8 #9 Posted 20 January 2018 - 07:10 AM

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430u will need nerfs before it goes live, it's essentially t-22 medium with better alpha and dpm

sutyomatic #10 Posted 20 January 2018 - 08:14 AM

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View PostHunterXHunter8, on 20 January 2018 - 07:10 AM, said:

430u will need nerfs before it goes live, it's essentially t-22 medium with better alpha and dpm

 

Except it doesn't have retard proof side armor, has lower DPM then Tier 8 TDs, is inaccurate, has meh mobility due to meh softstats and low engine HP while weighing 42 tonnes. I forgot to mention it doesn't turn worth a damn.

 

For all intents and purposes this is a pocket heavy albeit the WZ-111-5A is probably a better "medium" than this...



bgjudge #11 Posted 20 January 2018 - 09:08 AM

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Hello WG!

How in hell you come up with 430U ??? How do you even compare it to 121 the chinese tank? Are you rly gonna f**ed up that tank again??? You just buff it to -5 deg deprs and now you put the same gun on USSR tank with better LFP and massively better FUP and GODLIKE TURRET. 

WHO IS THAT IMBECILE WHICH WORKS IN THE BALANCE DEPARTMENT? WHO CAME UP WITH THIS STUPID IDEA!!

Consider NERFING 430U and buffing 121, cause YOU ARE MAKING 121 JUST A GARBAGE TANK AGAIN!!! The only unique part of 121 was that 440dmg and 122mm gun which can overmatch 40mm plates. ( dont forget to buff 121 TOP hull (deck) from 15mm to 30mm!!) 

NOW WHO WILL PLAY 121 and WHY ? (when we have 430u).

About the heavy tanks=> good job :) I like all of them ( dont like so much IS M , but when we compare it to french 65t....just LOL, much better new HT ;).

Wont talk about the premium tank buffs, cause...p2w is ur money.

Fix the ffffffing 430U and buff the 121 or it will be FOCH 155 AGAIN!! 



Badmojjo #12 Posted 20 January 2018 - 09:41 AM

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Hi guys,

 

First impression of the soviet tech new stuff: they are good and thank you for bringing something different. It was like every man and his dog were buying only IS 7 and OBJ 140...

 

The more tanks are in the game the harder will be to balance them and make everybody happy. But here's what I think:

 

OBJ 430U:

Awesome idea. I know everybody compares it with 121, but I believe it is a bit more powerful simply because of its armor and slightly lower profile. Thank you for not giving it the obj 140 & co penetration, so players will take more time to aim at weak spots, otherwise it will become too unbalanced.

 

OBJ 705A:

Now this is new. First I thought it was just a reversed IS 7 but it feels different in terms of mobility, besides of what was to be expected from the numbers. The armor is awesome and the high caliber canon / damage canon is quite accurate, I'm not a good sniper but I managed to take a few good snapshots even if it is not means as a sniping gun.

One thing that I noticed especially in grand battle games where there are a lot of tanks: the winning team has a lot of surviving 705A's maybe because it is a new tank and players are not used to aim at it but maybe it's because it is a side-scraping monster with huge armor stats :)

 

 



asari79 #13 Posted 20 January 2018 - 10:30 AM

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I am not a big fan of the obj 430U. Many ofcurse compare it with the 121 cus same alpha but I think the 121 is better beacuse of the terrible dispersion of the obj 430U.

I think the obj 430U can bounce alot if you camp in it. But it will not hit many shots if it camps and if it play aggresiv everyone will pen it lower plate.

 

I think you can nerf the upper plate a bit if you buff the disperssion. For russian meds the obj 140 is better then the 430U overall.

 

If you don´t buff the dispersion you need to buff the lower plate of the 430U.

 

I have only played like 5 games of the obj 430U so far and I did ok but in gernal I see they die fast and most of them do under 2k damage.



gunslingerXXX #14 Posted 20 January 2018 - 11:06 AM

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These changes are not OK. Can't you see you are ruining the game? 

Doigenunchi #15 Posted 20 January 2018 - 02:32 PM

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430U - sounds like 121, looks and kinda performs like 113 - but it's better than both. GG

asari79 #16 Posted 20 January 2018 - 04:03 PM

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Block Quote

430U - sounds like 121, looks and kinda performs like 113 - but it's better than both. GG

 

I sometimes understand why WG make bad decisions when players are lying to them.

 

The 430U is not better then 121 or 113 but it is diffrent from them.

 

So lets start with the 113. They have simular armour even if the 430U have a bit better upper plate armour. The 113 have better disperssion but worse aim time but disperssion is alot more importent then aim time om tanks like these. The 113 have better power/weight and 300 more HP and it have better DMP.

 

I think some better armour and some better aim time is not worth the dps, disperssion, HP and power/weight loose. I understand that some might think that but saying that the 430U is overall better then the 113 is just wrong.

 

So lets compare it with 121. Here is the armour on the upper plate alot better on the 430U and it also have better aim time. But it have worse disperssion,dpm and top speed.There are ofc some other diffrence to but they are small. I would say the 430U is better if you can find a spot realy close to the enemys where you kind hide your lower plate. If you want to camp there is better tanks then mediums to play. If you want to be aggresiv I still think the 121 is better. So I think it´s a matter of playstyle.

 

With all this said I do not mind if they nerf the armour on the 430U but then they need to buff other stuff beacuse othervise it will be realy bad.



TheSargon #17 Posted 20 January 2018 - 06:38 PM

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Object 430U is perfectly balanced, lower plate is 160 mm effectire armour, gonna be penetrated easily by tier 8s. TBH i'd make it thicker from 105mm to 120mm

 

430U is not and won't be an issue

 

The only russian medium that has issues is 907, its better in every aspect than t62-a and object 140. I'd fix that by buffing both object 140 and t62-a. And i think dpm buff would be enough



xXxMeanMachinexXX #18 Posted 20 January 2018 - 06:43 PM

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t54 mod 1 engine buff was much needed 

nikitovich #19 Posted 20 January 2018 - 06:50 PM

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hello !
I think need make a bit buff for 430U , accuracy 0.40 ---> 0.38 , tier 10 medium tank with 0.40 acc its very very bad , 

also 430 on tier 9 need buff , ( a bit accuracy and gold penetration ) gold ammo from 248mm APCR ---> ~280mm APCR ! 


Edited by nikitovich, 23 January 2018 - 10:26 PM.


Abdico #20 Posted 20 January 2018 - 08:53 PM

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The Object 430U feels like an upgraded version of the 113. There is pretty much no reason to keep the 113 in the game to be honest. Yes, it has 2 more degrees of gun depression, 300 extra hitpoints, 54 more DPM and 0.03 less dispersion but everything else is just worse. That's a very bad tradeoff.

Edited by Abdico, 20 January 2018 - 08:53 PM.






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