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make Yugoslavian or Serbian tech tree

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Televizija_na_tockovima #1 Posted 30 January 2018 - 09:56 PM

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Hi,

you have lots of players from Serbia, Bosnia, Croatia, Slovenia, Macedonia, Montenegro, so why don't you make Serbian or Yugoslavian tech tree. Put some good Serbian premium heavy like Defender :)

 

you have lots of players from Serbia, Bosnia, Croatia, Slovenia, Macedonia, Montenegro, so why don't you make Serbian or Yugoslavian tech tree. Put some good Serbian premium heavy like Defender :)



jetfirecro #2 Posted 01 February 2018 - 02:59 PM

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yes we need  yugoslavian tech tree

Televizija_na_tockovima #3 Posted 03 February 2018 - 02:04 AM

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Yeah, Yugoslavian tech tree would be cool.  :)

Edited by Televizija_na_tockovima, 03 February 2018 - 02:05 AM.


Meridian112 #4 Posted 02 April 2018 - 02:16 PM

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*edited*


Edited by Daxeno, 13 January 2019 - 05:12 PM.
Wrong language.


Jova55 #5 Posted 02 May 2018 - 12:54 PM

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*edited*

Edited by Daxeno, 13 January 2019 - 05:12 PM.
Wrong language.


WRINKLED_IRON #6 Posted 25 May 2018 - 11:43 PM

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*edited*

Edited by Daxeno, 13 January 2019 - 05:13 PM.
Wrong language.


WinnieANKA #7 Posted 20 December 2018 - 11:29 AM

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*edited*

Edited by Daxeno, 13 January 2019 - 05:14 PM.
Wrong language.


Jigabachi #8 Posted 31 December 2018 - 02:06 PM

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I know, I know... that kind of blind patriotism is quite widespread and all, but if you really think about it, would you even be able to come up with five borderline unique tanks that aren't just boring copies of other tanks?

Ninjasaky #9 Posted 09 January 2019 - 10:20 AM

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View PostJigabachi, on 31 December 2018 - 02:06 PM, said:

I know, I know... that kind of blind patriotism is quite widespread and all, but if you really think about it, would you even be able to come up with five borderline unique tanks that aren't just boring copies of other tanks?

 

Always this dinger donger dingur klan noobers responding on everything and trying to sabotage most proposals.

 

Btw for your info. Most Yugoslav tanks are copies at base but were upgraded to Yugoslavian standards. Just like other countries that have bought licences to copy and produce their own variants of them.



Ninjasaky #10 Posted 09 January 2019 - 10:31 AM

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I vote for the T84 if the developers can get the balancing somewhat right to fit the game but without sacrificing the unique characteristics of this tank. If it one day gets added to this game I will celebrate and promote the game in my country in any way shape or form. Perhaps make it a premium tank or a mission reward tank or maybe a clan battle reward tank. I know that the game company is russian owned and that the T84 was the upgraded copy of the standard T72. But maybe add the T72 to the russian tech tree as well or premium or whatever.

 

In terms of matchmaking in the game, I would propose to make a unique matchmaking system for these type of tanks to be in tier X only games. So as not to drill the salt out of other tier 8 and tier 9 vehicles that get crushed by these tanks.

 

 

Please do take this proposal into consideration and if successful, the whole balkan playerbase community would be very happy and the game would spread even more in balkanic countries, which is a lot of players and potential future players.



M5A1 #11 Posted 09 January 2019 - 10:42 AM

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View PostTelevizija_na_tockovima, on 30 January 2018 - 09:56 PM, said:

you have lots of players from Serbia, Bosnia, Croatia, Slovenia, Macedonia, Montenegro, so why don't you make Serbian or Yugoslavian tech tree. Put some good Serbian premium heavy like Defender :)

I just noticed that your techtree is already in the game:

Spoiler

Another idea would be not requesting a new tech tree, but rather some new emblems and enscriptions for french, US, German and soviet vehicles to make them look like vehicles used by the balkan states (Yugoslavia, Hungary, Romania etc.). This has already been done with the US enscriptions and emblems of Taiwan and I think it would add a nice touch for the game.



WolfHack #12 Posted 09 January 2019 - 11:06 AM

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Six years ago, it was a story of putting one line of tanks in which there was not only Yugoslavia but a few others. 
Today, this has been left to the story. 
They put Czech, Polish, Italian, Swedish.
Why not us?

Edited by WolfHack, 09 January 2019 - 11:07 AM.


Jigabachi #13 Posted 09 January 2019 - 11:59 AM

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View PostNinjasaky, on 09 January 2019 - 10:20 AM, said:

Always this dinger donger dingur klan noobers responding on everything and trying to sabotage most proposals.

Which proposal? Most of them look the same: "HURRDURR, gimme mah cuntry tenks because muh contry tenks are bestest! Respekt meh countrey!"

Adressing obvious problems with certain proposals isn't called sabotage. It has to do with common sense. But feel free to show me a few threads with very elaborate and important proposals that got sabotaged by anyone of us or any active forumite.

 

Block Quote

Btw for your info. Most Yugoslav tanks are copies at base but were upgraded to Yugoslavian standards. Just like other countries that have bought licences to copy and produce their own variants of them.

Sooo... that's a "no" as an answer to my question then. Thanks for agreeing with me.



M5A1 #14 Posted 09 January 2019 - 12:35 PM

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View PostWolfHack, on 09 January 2019 - 11:06 AM, said:

Six years ago, it was a story of putting one line of tanks in which there was not only Yugoslavia but a few others. 
Today, this has been left to the story. 
They put Czech, Polish, Italian, Swedish.
Why not us?

 

Obviously because the Czech, polish, italian and swedish army each had an own tank development programm and did not just use existing tanks from other countries.

WolfHack #15 Posted 09 January 2019 - 01:08 PM

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Tank m84 was completely made in Yugoslavia.240 factories and 1000 accompanying factories produced this model of the tank. It has all the information to go on google, it's easy.

captainpigg #16 Posted 09 January 2019 - 01:11 PM

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View PostWolfHack, on 09 January 2019 - 12:08 PM, said:

Tank m84 was completely made in Yugoslavia.240 factories and 1000 accompanying factories produced this model of the tank. It has all the information to go on google, it's easy.

 

Just a T-72 variant, so just a copy and WAY too new for this game.

M5A1 #17 Posted 09 January 2019 - 01:13 PM

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Perhaps. But it has not even been planned in the time period that is covered by WoT.

This game would need at least two more tiers (if not more) to balance such a tank and even then one single tank would not be enough for a whole techtree. A tank like this would rather be a premium vehicle in the soviet tree, like the Turan III or the MTLS.

World of Tanks doesnt have modern MBTs in the game and it will stay like this.

 

EDIT: This was an answer to WolfHacks comment. I don't see the problem in it being a T-72 copy because it actually seems to have a lot of yugoslavian development in it. The problem is rather that a tank like this simply does not fit into the game at all. It's like requesting a railway gun in WoT.


Edited by M5A1, 09 January 2019 - 01:15 PM.


WolfHack #18 Posted 09 January 2019 - 01:20 PM

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View Postcaptainpigg, on 09 January 2019 - 12:11 PM, said:

 

Just a T-72 variant, so just a copy and WAY too new for this game.

t72 IS NOT VARIOUSLY, ONLY THE LICENSE IS OBTAINED AND BASED ON A T84 WITH 60% OF IMPROVEMENT

12:25 Added after 4 minutes

View PostM5A1, on 09 January 2019 - 12:13 PM, said:

Perhaps. But it has not even been planned in the time period that is covered by WoT.

This game would need at least two more tiers (if not more) to balance such a tank and even then one single tank would not be enough for a whole techtree. A tank like this would rather be a premium vehicle in the soviet tree, like the Turan III or the MTLS.

World of Tanks doesnt have modern MBTs in the game and it will stay like this.

 

EDIT: This was an answer to WolfHacks comment. I don't see the problem in it being a T-72 copy because it actually seems to have a lot of yugoslavian development in it. The problem is rather that a tank like this simply does not fit into the game at all. It's like requesting a railway gun in WoT.

No modern?

It's obvious here that we do not talk about the same game or you are not sufficiently informed. 
The game has many modern tanks, mostly IX and X. Look at the google a tank that made it.

I agree with you that it would not be bad to put it like a premium tank

Edited by WolfHack, 09 January 2019 - 01:25 PM.


Ninjasaky #19 Posted 09 January 2019 - 01:28 PM

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View PostM5A1, on 09 January 2019 - 10:42 AM, said:

I just noticed that your techtree is already in the game:

*Quoted picture removed by Ninjasaky for sarcastically blocking half the screen due to historically uneducated ignorance*

Spoiler

Another idea would be not requesting a new tech tree, but rather some new emblems and enscriptions for french, US, German and soviet vehicles to make them look like vehicles used by the balkan states (Yugoslavia, Hungary, Romania etc.). This has already been done with the US enscriptions and emblems of Taiwan and I think it would add a nice touch for the game.

 

FOR REAL NOW!

 

To a Yugoslav this sounds like what it wound sound like to a German if someone said or wrote that Germany did not have its own tank production which is stupid uneducated ignorance at its best.

 

The final assembly facility/factory of the Yugoslav designed and produced M-84 in this case, aside from the T55, was just in the city where I personally come from. So let me educate you on this topic so you don't disgrace yourself by your lack of uneducated facts. Which in turn makes me even laugh harder by looking at your forum profile signature, which translated from German to English reads - Through education to perfection.

 

Development and production

The M-84 is based on the Soviet T-72 but with several modifications, including a domestic fire-control system, improved composite armor, and a 1000-hp engine. The M-84 entered service with the Yugoslav People's Army in 1984. The improved M-84A version entered service a few years later.

There were about 240 Yugoslav factories which directly participated in the production of the M-84 and about 1,000 others which participated indirectly.[citation needed]

The latest Serbian version of the M-84 is the M-84AS, unveiled in 2004. It features a new fire control system, Kontakt-5 ERA armor, AT-11 Sniper anti-tank missiles, Agava-2 thermal sight, and the Shtora defensive suite. It is very similar to the Russian T-90S, both in appearance and in capability.

About 150 M-84 tanks were exported to Kuwait. The disintegration of Yugoslavia in the 1990s prevented further exports of the M-84.

 

There were about 240 Yugoslav factories which directly participated in the production of the M-84 and about 1,000 others which participated indirectly.

 

 

1. Yugoslavia did have its own domestic tank production that introduced new tanks. One of them is the M-84. On a side note it had the best ground resistance mobility characteristics, especially in deserts and sandy terrains and was the best exported tank to Kuwait due this. Its engine is a special and well known V46 multi fuel engine which can run on not only diesel but also on petrol and kerosine. Parts of the tanks were produced all across the SFR of Yugoslavia and it largely differs from the Soviet T-72.

 

Fun fact: This tank in real life is easily modifiable, it has a speed governor that can be removed thus making it go to a top speed of 120 km/h, and that even on uneven surfaces because of it excellent ground resistance!

 

2. Tank Brigades of former Yugoslavia that mainly used the M-84

Former operators

 Yugoslavia
  • The Yugoslav People's Army operated about 450 M-84s in M-84 and M-84A versions. The M-84 was intended to fully replace the T-34, M4 Sherman and M47 Patton tanks then held in storage as well as some of the older T-55 units. Most JNA tanks were passed to the successor state - FR Yugoslavia, while a number was also captured by Croatia, Bosnia and Herzegovina and Slovenia in the war.
    • 1st Armored Brigade of 14th Corps at Vrhnika.
    • 4th Armored Brigade of 10th Corps at Jastrebarsko.
    • 211th Armored Brigade of 21st Corps at Niš.
    • 252nd Armored Brigade of 37th Corps at Kraljevo
    • 329th Armored Brigade of 5th Corps at Banja Luka
    • 51st Armored Brigade of 24th Corps at Pančevo.
    • 243rd Armored Brigade of 41st Corps from Skopje.
    • 265th Armored Brigade of 32nd Corps at Varaždin.

 

These were all the brigades that operated the M-84.

 

3. You clearly dont know that during WW2 Yugoslavia did not existed as a country but as a kingdom, during those times it clearly did not have its own tank production, thus relied from support from the allies.

 

4. There are still a lot of Yugoslavian tank projects and documentation of tanks that were in planning and development that have not been officially released to the public since it is a former country of republics.

Which reminds me to start digging it up since I know lots of people who formerly worked not only for but in the former Yugoslav police, military and secret service institutions, etc. Which only someone like me which is most likely can obtain these documents. And whoever doesn't believe, you dont have to since documents like these were never published to the public, it was all top secret. Just like you will never hear that Yugoslavia was developing its own Supersonic fighter jet in the 80s or that it developed the apollo space programme which was later sold to the United States, in top secret due to the need of a stronger economy and not to be racing for the moon against other countries since Yugoslavia minded its own business. Unless you start digging google about it.

 

Designer Military Technical Institute Belgrade
Designed 1979‒1983
Produced 1984‒1991 (Yugoslavia)
1991‒2003 (Croatia)

 

Here a list of all the factories and final assembly and testing facility, in this case the M84 which was the Yugoslavian main battle tank:

 

 

These were and most of them to the same day are the main parts factories.

 

And here my favorite modder which makes most of the M-84 variants. About the final factory Djuro Djakovic located in todays Croatia in the city of Slavonski Brod. Why dont you just give them a call and inform yourself. Here is the contact information of the factory: +385 35 / 21 88 22

 

http://www.ddsv.hr/d...A4_engleski.pdf

 

 

 



M5A1 #20 Posted 09 January 2019 - 02:58 PM

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Still, modifying a tank that is way too modern for WoT does not count as a tank development program. The "modern" tanks you are talking about are mostly from the 50s, some examples from the 60s. 

 

If you want to discuss new WoT vehicles, you need to look at the time period from 1925-1955 and it is a fact that Yugoslavia did not develop a single tank in this time. Yes, they did develop a tank design based on a Russian tank and used it widely, but this has no relevance for the game.

A techtree for Yugoslavia would look like this:

 

Renault FT -> Pz II -> Pz III -> Pz IV -> [filler tank] -> Panther -> Panther II -> two filler tanks, probably E-50 and E-50M

an additional line could ben like this:

Renault FT -> T-26 -> BT-7 -> T-28 -> T-34/76 -> T-34/85 -> T-43 -> T-44 -> T-54/T-55 -> T-62A 

 

So I repeat myself: if you want to drive Yugoslavian tanks, then just use the already existing tech trees. A Yugoslavian tech tree öde add nothing new to the game.

Your comparison with German tanks is bad because I can list you a lot of vehicles designed by Germans from scratch and produced by Germans in Germany in the time of 1925-1955 and then used by German soldiers in the German Army.

Same goes for the british, soviet, american, french, czech, swedish, polish, japanese and to some extent even to the chinese techtree. But you can't name a single tank that has been developed in Yugoslavia in this time period and you can't name a single tank that has been designed from scratch and produced at all.

So sorry for hurting your patriotism but WoT is still a game based on history and these historic facts don't change just because you want them to.

 

I still think that yugoslavian emblems for the tanks in use (or maybe even all tanks) would be a good idea. It's just that a whole tech tree would not make any sense because there are no tanks to fill it.

Also, you don't have to yell at me. I would prefer it if you try to keep the discussion civilized.

 

 

EDIT: Regarding your point 3: A kingdom is a country. Sweden is a kingdom and a country. Oh, and they also had a king during WW2 AND their own tank production as well. Oh my...


Edited by M5A1, 09 January 2019 - 03:00 PM.






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