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Courageous Resistance.


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OIias_of_Sunhillow #1 Posted 17 February 2018 - 11:22 PM

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Should the benefits of the, 'Courageous Resistance', bonus, be awarded to every top damage dealer, or exp earner, or even both, on the losing team, regardless of whether they would have won the bonus under current circumstances ?

I think currently, it's only given when you win a 'Hero', medal when on the losing team. Please correct me if I'm wrong.



Erwin_Von_Braun #2 Posted 17 February 2018 - 11:26 PM

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Hmm?

Interesting.

Something needs to be done to incentivize players to fight to the end, regardless of whether or not xvm tells them to.

Maybe a reward for 'Last Man Standing' or something like that?



Homer_J #3 Posted 17 February 2018 - 11:28 PM

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No.

 

We saw what that does to players during the first beta of ranked battles.

 

There should be no incentive to lose.



Erwin_Von_Braun #4 Posted 17 February 2018 - 11:31 PM

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View PostHomer_J, on 17 February 2018 - 10:28 PM, said:

No.

 

We saw what that does to players during the first beta of ranked battles.

 

There should be no incentive to lose.

 

I don't think it's so much an incentive to lose as it is an incentive to not drown yourself like a 'tard at the start of the game just because third party software says you will lose.

Anything that encourages players to fight to the end gets my vote.



Homer_J #5 Posted 17 February 2018 - 11:34 PM

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View PostErwin_Von_Braun, on 17 February 2018 - 10:31 PM, said:

 

 

Anything that encourages players to fight to the end gets my vote.

It doesn't encourage fighting to the end, it encourages reversing until you hit the red line right at the start then farming as much damage as possible while contributing as little as possible.



Erwin_Von_Braun #6 Posted 17 February 2018 - 11:41 PM

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View PostHomer_J, on 17 February 2018 - 10:34 PM, said:

It doesn't encourage fighting to the end, it encourages reversing until you hit the red line right at the start then farming as much damage as possible while contributing as little as possible.

 

And that doesn't happen now?

Jigabachi #7 Posted 17 February 2018 - 11:41 PM

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Hell no. You want rewards? Go win the match, that should be motivation enough. Being a "big" player on the losing team doesn't mean much. It's often those players who actually caused the defeat.

And if this really is about the XVM suiciders - those can simply get banned.

 

Sooo... again: Hell no.



Homer_J #8 Posted 17 February 2018 - 11:47 PM

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View PostErwin_Von_Braun, on 17 February 2018 - 10:41 PM, said:

 

And that doesn't happen now?

 

Exactly, and it happened much more when being top of the losing team meant something.

Erwin_Von_Braun #9 Posted 17 February 2018 - 11:51 PM

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View PostHomer_J, on 17 February 2018 - 10:47 PM, said:

 

Exactly, and it happened much more when being top of the losing team meant something.

 

I don't get it - surely encouraging players to put in max effort is a good thing?

Given the alternative is a sub 3 min game where three or four players commit suicide.



Erwin_Von_Braun #10 Posted 17 February 2018 - 11:52 PM

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View PostJigabachi, on 17 February 2018 - 10:41 PM, said:

Hell no. You want rewards? Go win the match, that should be motivation enough. Being a "big" player on the losing team doesn't mean much. It's often those players who actually caused the defeat.

And if this really is about the XVM suiciders - those can simply get banned.

 

Sooo... again: Hell no.

 

How exactly would you encourage them to put in the effort to win?

Jigabachi #11 Posted 18 February 2018 - 12:09 AM

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View PostErwin_Von_Braun, on 17 February 2018 - 11:52 PM, said:

How exactly would you encourage them to put in the effort to win?

I wouldn't encourage anyone.



Erwin_Von_Braun #12 Posted 18 February 2018 - 12:16 AM

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View PostJigabachi, on 17 February 2018 - 11:09 PM, said:

I wouldn't encourage anyone.

 

Not even if it means extra cookies for everyone?

dimethylcadmium #13 Posted 18 February 2018 - 12:23 AM

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View PostJigabachi, on 17 February 2018 - 11:41 PM, said:

Go win the match, that should be motivation enough.

 

Being a "big" player on the losing team doesn't mean much.

 

It's often those players who actually caused the defeat.

 

inaccurate on so many levels. 

 

don't mix damage farmers and people who actually wear their carry pants

 

https://i.imgur.com/5ToDqnw.jpg

 

this was just a nanometer away from a loss. i was capping the enemy base  with 2 hitpoints while the Lowe helplessly kept chasing me around the cap circle to reset the counter, but to no avail. 


Edited by dimethylcadmium, 18 February 2018 - 12:25 AM.


Homer_J #14 Posted 18 February 2018 - 12:56 AM

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View PostErwin_Von_Braun, on 17 February 2018 - 10:51 PM, said:

 

I don't get it - surely encouraging players to put in max effort is a good thing?

Given the alternative is a sub 3 min game where three or four players commit suicide.

They don't put in max effort to winning, they put in max effort to coming top of the losing team.  And this is not even guesswork since we saw exactly what happens when you reward losing during the first ranked battles beta season.

 

I have never seen three or four players commit suicide at the start but if you do that then you will lose more often and losers are losers in the current system.  Sometimes you see one person give up before they started and it's generally someone you didn't need anyway.

 

View PostErwin_Von_Braun, on 17 February 2018 - 10:52 PM, said:

 

How exactly would you encourage them to put in the effort to win?

By giving the best rewards to the winners.

 

Play to win, win more, profit.

 

Just like it is.  In fact I would scrap courageous resistance, it's not in keeping with the win more - profit ethos.



NUKLEAR_SLUG #15 Posted 18 February 2018 - 08:12 AM

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No thanks, we don't need rewards for "Best Loser". If you want to be rewarded do better.

Erwin_Von_Braun #16 Posted 18 February 2018 - 10:05 AM

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View PostHomer_J, on 17 February 2018 - 11:56 PM, said:

They don't put in max effort to winning, they put in max effort to coming top of the losing team.  And this is not even guesswork since we saw exactly what happens when you reward losing during the first ranked battles beta season.

 

I have never seen three or four players commit suicide at the start but if you do that then you will lose more often and losers are losers in the current system.  Sometimes you see one person give up before they started and it's generally someone you didn't need anyway.

 

By giving the best rewards to the winners.

 

Play to win, win more, profit.

 

Just like it is.  In fact I would scrap courageous resistance, it's not in keeping with the win more - profit ethos.

 

I've had a good few courageous resistance rewards - only because I fight to the end and I can tell you I deserved every single one of them.

Never gave up, never drowned myself & was rewarded for my effort.

Never got into ranked, so maybe I'm just not seeing the problem you're seeing.

Granted suicides don't happen at the start of many matches although, anecdotally, the record I have personally witnessed is FIVE (no replay I'm afraid, it was quite some time ago).

Usually the suicides come towards the end of a game, when defeat is inevitable - that's where I think this would help.

Maybe I'm being naïve, who knows - all I do know is that it would be good to incentivise players to put in max effort even if XVM tells them they are going to lose - and that is one thing I have never understood - why a player would let third party software dictate the game for them?

Until that changes, I don't think any amount of rewards would make those kind of players change their ways:(



vasilinhorulezz #17 Posted 18 February 2018 - 01:12 PM

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It wouldn't stop suiside, it wouldn't promote active gameplay,

the only thing it would get as a result, would be more red-liners,

to farm enough damage to be top on xp.

When people realize it's a lost game, and you can pretty much figure it out from the start,

even if you don't use XVM, you just see the team deployment and you know, how it will go.

 



Homer_J #18 Posted 18 February 2018 - 08:45 PM

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View PostErwin_Von_Braun, on 18 February 2018 - 09:05 AM, said:

 

I've had a good few courageous resistance rewards - only because I fight to the end and I can tell you I deserved every single one of them.

 

I've had my share, and yes I fight to the end but I wouldn't say one caused the other or that I deliberately played to get courageous resistance.  And lets face it, the medals are designed so pretty much anyone will at some time get something shiny to cheer them up.  They are mostly obtained at random.

 

I would much rather have the win though, and having some XVM user camping the redline so he could be top loser would be much more annoying than some loser driving into the lake so he can click battle again twenty seconds earlier.



Erwin_Von_Braun #19 Posted 18 February 2018 - 09:18 PM

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View PostHomer_J, on 18 February 2018 - 07:45 PM, said:

I've had my share, and yes I fight to the end but I wouldn't say one caused the other or that I deliberately played to get courageous resistance.  And lets face it, the medals are designed so pretty much anyone will at some time get something shiny to cheer them up.  They are mostly obtained at random.

 

I would much rather have the win though, and having some XVM user camping the redline so he could be top loser would be much more annoying than some loser driving into the lake so he can click battle again twenty seconds earlier.

 

Not so sure which one I would rather have, so I tend to treat them both with equal contempt.

At least you know where you stand with suicide scum I suppose.






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