Jump to content


Spotting through solid obstacles

Spotting Physics

  • Please log in to reply
17 replies to this topic

Poll: Spotting through solid obstacles (26 members have cast votes)

You have to complete 250 battles in order to participate this poll.

Do you like/approve the ability to spot an enemy tank through solid obstacles?

  1. Yes (10 votes [38.46%])

    Percentage of vote: 38.46%

  2. No (16 votes [61.54%])

    Percentage of vote: 61.54%

Vote Hide poll

Schoensteiner #1 Posted 04 March 2018 - 11:30 AM

    Private

  • Player
  • 30862 battles
  • 5
  • Member since:
    01-07-2014

I know this is not a tank simulator; however, there is a couple of things in how physics works that I cannot understand after years of playing this game.

One of the most annoying IMHO is the ability to spot an enemy tank even when I don't see it because it's hidden behind an obstacle.

Sometimes the obstacle is a solid rock. Imagine 49 meters of solid rock, you stand behind it, and an enemy driving on the other side of that rock is spotting you.

Firstly, it makes no sense, and secondly, it is a huge advantage for fast, nimble tanks.

It also diminishes the tactics factor in the game. Doesn't allow for surprise flanking maneuvers.

Does anyone know why this solution is in the game?

And what are your feelings about it?



Uebergewicht #2 Posted 04 March 2018 - 11:37 AM

    Second Lieutenant

  • Player
  • 11702 battles
  • 1,070
  • Member since:
    11-15-2015
I´m pretty sure if a tank drove 50m next to me, chances are I would become aware of its presence, even if there was a rock in between. Tanks aren´t exactly silent.

IncandescentGerbil #3 Posted 04 March 2018 - 12:23 PM

    Second Lieutenant

  • Player
  • 35775 battles
  • 1,453
  • Member since:
    11-24-2015

View PostUebergewicht, on 04 March 2018 - 11:37 AM, said:

I´m pretty sure if a tank drove 50m next to me, chances are I would become aware of its presence, even if there was a rock in between. Tanks aren´t exactly silent.

Indeed. I have always imagined it as a noise and vibration issue. Particularly if the other tank is firing. 



Aikl #4 Posted 04 March 2018 - 12:27 PM

    Brigadier

  • Player
  • 26054 battles
  • 4,349
  • [-MM] -MM
  • Member since:
    04-13-2011
It overcomes some features/limitations of the spotting system. As annoying as it can be on some maps (e.g. someone hugging the hill on Mines), on others it's almost a necessity. Maybe it's a bit weird - but it would be weirder to not notice a tank sitting 50m away in a bush. 50m through a rock... call it simplification.

Schoensteiner #5 Posted 04 March 2018 - 12:49 PM

    Private

  • Player
  • 30862 battles
  • 5
  • Member since:
    01-07-2014

I'm OK with the bush scenario; however, when it comes to solid obstacles I have serious doubts.

 

I mean, agree, infantry could hear/feel a tank approaching. However, in the game, the opponent is also in a tank, insulated from the outside with 100+ mm of steel, with own engine running, tracks producing noise and tremble. There is no way any crew member could hear or feel another tank approaching on the other side of the rock or a building.
 

This might only make sense if there is some variance. Let's say that I'm standing still (with my engine off? something like Swedish TD mechanics) and the opponent is moving.



Tom_Deekanarry #6 Posted 04 March 2018 - 12:55 PM

    Staff Sergeant

  • Player
  • 7695 battles
  • 336
  • Member since:
    06-28-2012

View PostUebergewicht, on 04 March 2018 - 11:37 AM, said:

I´m pretty sure if a tank drove 50m next to me, chances are I would become aware of its presence, even if there was a rock in between. Tanks aren´t exactly silent.

 

Unless someone spotted it and reported it or your on silent watch with heads out there is no way you would have a clue if a tank was there, the noise of your own vehicle combined with your crew helmet and intercom completely masks outside noise!

 

And if your battened down, pfff forget it!



Balc0ra #7 Posted 04 March 2018 - 12:55 PM

    Field Marshal

  • Player
  • 67404 battles
  • 17,133
  • [WALL] WALL
  • Member since:
    07-10-2012

View PostSchoensteiner, on 04 March 2018 - 12:49 PM, said:

I mean, agree, infantry could hear/feel a tank approaching. However, in the game, the opponent is also in a tank, insulated from the outside with 100+ mm of steel, with own engine running, tracks producing noise and tremble. There is no way any crew member could hear or feel another tank approaching on the other side of the rock or a building.

 

So only make it so the one standing still can spot the one driving past him on the other side of a rock? As if it was "real" the commander could even open that hatch to see it or hear it. Again, something you can't do in this game either to increase your view if you will. And if you want to use sound, you should be able to spot a lemming train miles away if you stood still, as a group of 10 tanks on the same road is not exactly low key in terms of sounds either. But you can't. And since it's an arcade game. It's the same rule for both, standing still or moving on a proxy spot. As not to make it more confusing for the casual player more so then most mechanics already are.

 

As If a car drives past you on the other side of a building, you will know it's there by sound alone even tho you can't see it. So why not a tank?

 

 


Edited by Balc0ra, 04 March 2018 - 12:57 PM.


RamRaid90 #8 Posted 04 March 2018 - 01:04 PM

    Lieutenant General

  • Player
  • 22435 battles
  • 6,682
  • [D0NG] D0NG
  • Member since:
    12-14-2014

The solution here is simple.

 

Stop camping behind rocks.

 

And don't let anyone get within 50m of you.

 

To be honest, the proxy spot rule is rarely an issue as in the vast majority of cases you are spotted without the need for it.



arthurwellsley #9 Posted 04 March 2018 - 01:29 PM

    Lieutenant Сolonel

  • Player
  • 52152 battles
  • 3,198
  • [-B-C-] -B-C-
  • Member since:
    05-11-2011

View PostSchoensteiner, on 04 March 2018 - 10:30 AM, said:

I know this is not a tank simulator; however, there is a couple of things in how physics works that I cannot understand after years of playing this game.

One of the most annoying IMHO is the ability to spot an enemy tank even when I don't see it because it's hidden behind an obstacle.

Sometimes the obstacle is a solid rock. Imagine 49 meters of solid rock, you stand behind it, and an enemy driving on the other side of that rock is spotting you.

Firstly, it makes no sense, and secondly, it is a huge advantage for fast, nimble tanks.

It also diminishes the tactics factor in the game. Doesn't allow for surprise flanking maneuvers.

Does anyone know why this solution is in the game?

And what are your feelings about it?

 

Spotting RangeEdit

Spotting Range is the maximum distance at which you will detect/spot an enemy tank if you have line of sight.

Minimum Spotting RangeEdit

You will always spot any vehicle that comes within 50m of you, regardless of line of sight. Because you do not need line of sight, this is also called proximity spotting, and can be used on certain maps to spot enemies going past a choke-point without actually being exposed to them.

 

source = http://wiki.wargamin...nics#Visibility

 

As above posters have said (a) if a tank is within 50 metres of you you would know about it, (b) it overcomes certain game limitations.

 

 



Tom_Deekanarry #10 Posted 04 March 2018 - 01:34 PM

    Staff Sergeant

  • Player
  • 7695 battles
  • 336
  • Member since:
    06-28-2012

View Postarthurwellsley, on 04 March 2018 - 01:29 PM, said:

 

Spotting RangeEdit

Spotting Range is the maximum distance at which you will detect/spot an enemy tank if you have line of sight.

Minimum Spotting RangeEdit

You will always spot any vehicle that comes within 50m of you, regardless of line of sight. Because you do not need line of sight, this is also called proximity spotting, and can be used on certain maps to spot enemies going past a choke-point without actually being exposed to them.

 

source = http://wiki.wargamin...nics#Visibility

 

As above posters have said (a) if a tank is within 50 metres of you you would know about it, (b) it overcomes certain game limitations.

 

 

 

Arthur I can tell you here and now you can't hear crapin an AFV, you would not have a clue unless your on silent watch!

Orkbert #11 Posted 04 March 2018 - 01:41 PM

    Lieutenant

  • Player
  • 25942 battles
  • 1,785
  • Member since:
    08-29-2013

View PostMajor_Madfokker, on 04 March 2018 - 01:34 PM, said:

 

Arthur I can tell you here and now you can't hear crapin an AFV, you would not have a clue unless your on silent watch!

 

But I would because the immaterial gun barrels sweeping unhindered through rocks, buildings and even other tanks create a quantum disturbance which can be easily noticed.

Not to mention that all tank commanders can view the surroundings as if they were hovering invisibly above the tank.

 

If you pedantics insist on picking a single aspect of the game as unrealistic the please don't stay silent about the even more unrealistic ones.



jabster #12 Posted 04 March 2018 - 01:44 PM

    Field Marshal

  • Beta Tester
  • 12598 battles
  • 24,096
  • [WSAT] WSAT
  • Member since:
    12-30-2010

View Postarthurwellsley, on 04 March 2018 - 12:29 PM, said:

 

Spotting RangeEdit

Spotting Range is the maximum distance at which you will detect/spot an enemy tank if you have line of sight.

Minimum Spotting RangeEdit

You will always spot any vehicle that comes within 50m of you, regardless of line of sight. Because you do not need line of sight, this is also called proximity spotting, and can be used on certain maps to spot enemies going past a choke-point without actually being exposed to them.

 

source = http://wiki.wargamin...nics#Visibility

 

As above posters have said (a) if a tank is within 50 metres of you you would know about it, (b) it overcomes certain game limitations.

 

 

 

(a) is true if you don’t happen to be in a tank yourself. If you are it’s a very different story.



Tom_Deekanarry #13 Posted 04 March 2018 - 02:07 PM

    Staff Sergeant

  • Player
  • 7695 battles
  • 336
  • Member since:
    06-28-2012

View PostOrkbert, on 04 March 2018 - 01:41 PM, said:

 

But I would because the immaterial gun barrels sweeping unhindered through rocks, buildings and even other tanks create a quantum disturbance which can be easily noticed.

Not to mention that all tank commanders can view the surroundings as if they were hovering invisibly above the tank.

 

If you pedantics insist on picking a single aspect of the game as unrealistic the please don't stay silent about the even more unrealistic ones.

 

Lol Ork, that was rather my point!

Homer_J #14 Posted 04 March 2018 - 02:21 PM

    Field Marshal

  • Beta Tester
  • 29705 battles
  • 31,448
  • [WJDE] WJDE
  • Member since:
    09-03-2010
Proximity spotting is needed to prevent tanks appearing 10m away.  If you invent a more perfect internet then the distance could possibly be reduced.

TacticusMK2 #15 Posted 04 March 2018 - 03:00 PM

    Warrant Officer

  • Player
  • 17742 battles
  • 728
  • [DUAL] DUAL
  • Member since:
    02-09-2014

View PostUebergewicht, on 04 March 2018 - 11:37 AM, said:

I´m pretty sure if a tank drove 50m next to me, chances are I would become aware of its presence, even if there was a rock in between. Tanks aren´t exactly silent.

 

Really? Even if the tank stands still? You can smell the diesel or petrol in it's fuel tank? Perhaps if it was moving, but even when you sit still you get spotted through buildings.

HeidenSieker #16 Posted 04 March 2018 - 03:38 PM

    Brigadier

  • Player
  • 10046 battles
  • 4,652
  • Member since:
    03-26-2016

View PostOrkbert, on 04 March 2018 - 01:41 PM, said:

If you pedantics insist on  ...

 

"Pedants". HTH :)

kaneloon #17 Posted 04 March 2018 - 03:46 PM

    Lieutenant

  • Player
  • 28731 battles
  • 1,934
  • [OBLIC] OBLIC
  • Member since:
    11-18-2011

Realism in wot is not the issue, the issue is to have fun in a game. If it was not there, you could hide forever in your stealth tank, or your tank in strange place.

 

Proxy spot is needed for the gameplay, you have to learn to use it.



Bordhaw #18 Posted 04 March 2018 - 04:29 PM

    Major

  • Player
  • 12058 battles
  • 2,838
  • Member since:
    01-29-2017

View PostSchoensteiner, on 04 March 2018 - 10:30 AM, said:

I know this is not a tank simulator; however, there is a couple of things in how physics works that I cannot understand after years of playing this game.

One of the most annoying IMHO is the ability to spot an enemy tank even when I don't see it because it's hidden behind an obstacle.

Sometimes the obstacle is a solid rock. Imagine 49 meters of solid rock, you stand behind it, and an enemy driving on the other side of that rock is spotting you.

Firstly, it makes no sense, and secondly, it is a huge advantage for fast, nimble tanks.

It also diminishes the tactics factor in the game. Doesn't allow for surprise flanking maneuvers.

Does anyone know why this solution is in the game?

And what are your feelings about it?

 

The games have a time limit for many reasons not least because people don;t have an hour to waste on one game to hunt the last light tank...




1 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users