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Amount of arty in a team, random game.


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Poll: How many spg's per team is best? (49 members have cast votes)

You have to complete 250 battles in order to participate this poll.

How many spg's per team? There will be no zero choice as arty haters opinions are irrelevant to me.

  1. 1 (20 votes [40.82%])

    Percentage of vote: 40.82%

  2. 2 (23 votes [46.94%])

    Percentage of vote: 46.94%

  3. 3 (6 votes [12.24%])

    Percentage of vote: 12.24%

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HeidenSieker #21 Posted 15 April 2018 - 09:41 PM

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Dunno. I have opened a support ticket to ask (3 times). Each time I have been given the answer to a completely different question ("How the Matchmaker works" ) . I am unsure how to proceed re getting an answer.

Edited by HeidenSieker, 15 April 2018 - 09:42 PM.


Darth_Clicker #22 Posted 16 April 2018 - 05:41 AM

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View Postmpf1959, on 15 April 2018 - 12:38 PM, said:

 

No, sorry, but I do play a lot of games, my avg is over 50 a day, and it'd be something like hard work to take a note of the games, but maybe thats why I see so many 3 arty games?

We had a discussion about arty numbers in battles a few months ago here http://forum.worldoftanks.eu/index.php?/topic/647898-spg-numbers-in-your-games-stats/page__pid__14910849#entry14910849 

The way I kept my results was very simple.  On a notepad, I had 3 horizontal columns, one each for 1 arty, 2 artys and 3 artys on the enemy team.  Since I am an arty only player due to the boring and simple play style of tanks :trollface: I never have a battle with 0 arty...therefore no 0 arty column.  I also kept track of what tier arty I was playing.  Since I only have tier V and up I had vertical columns for each tier. This resulted in a chart of squares, one square for tier V 1 arty, one for tier V 2 artys etc.   Each battle I would simply place a small mark in the corresponding square for that arty count/tier.  It was easy and only required making a single mark each battle.

I play a lot each day like you.  Most of my playing time is in the afternoon, but some days in the morning and several hours on Saturday and Sunday.  Very rarely in the evening.

Here were the results when I decided to stop compiling.  Orkbert also shared his data in the thread.  These battles were after stun was added to arty, so I think the numbers would be very similar currently.

               

1 SPG:     218       32%  of battles

2 SPGs:   294       44%  of battles

3 SPGs:   164       24%  of battles

 

I would definitely be interested in seeing your results after at least 100 battles


Edited by Darth_Clicker, 16 April 2018 - 05:42 AM.


5_InchFl0ppy #23 Posted 16 April 2018 - 06:18 AM

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0 arty.

mpf1959 #24 Posted 16 April 2018 - 01:14 PM

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View PostDarth_Clicker, on 16 April 2018 - 05:41 AM, said:

We had a discussion about arty numbers in battles a few months ago here http://forum.worldoftanks.eu/index.php?/topic/647898-spg-numbers-in-your-games-stats/page__pid__14910849#entry14910849 

The way I kept my results was very simple.  On a notepad, I had 3 horizontal columns, one each for 1 arty, 2 artys and 3 artys on the enemy team.  Since I am an arty only player due to the boring and simple play style of tanks :trollface: I never have a battle with 0 arty...therefore no 0 arty column.  I also kept track of what tier arty I was playing.  Since I only have tier V and up I had vertical columns for each tier. This resulted in a chart of squares, one square for tier V 1 arty, one for tier V 2 artys etc.   Each battle I would simply place a small mark in the corresponding square for that arty count/tier.  It was easy and only required making a single mark each battle.

I play a lot each day like you.  Most of my playing time is in the afternoon, but some days in the morning and several hours on Saturday and Sunday.  Very rarely in the evening.

Here were the results when I decided to stop compiling.  Orkbert also shared his data in the thread.  These battles were after stun was added to arty, so I think the numbers would be very similar currently.

               

1 SPG:     218       32%  of battles

2 SPGs:   294       44%  of battles

3 SPGs:   164       24%  of battles

 

I would definitely be interested in seeing your results after at least 100 battles

 

I can do that idea with a notepad, I will do that and post the results. I also noticed I get to play a couple of no arty games on the occasions I take a tank out. I'll try and remember to note them too!

Darth_Clicker #25 Posted 16 April 2018 - 03:17 PM

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View Post5_InchFl0ppy, on 16 April 2018 - 06:18 AM, said:

0 arty.

 

If you had a hard drive instead of a floppy, you would probably have a different opinion.

Edited by Darth_Clicker, 16 April 2018 - 03:17 PM.


mpf1959 #26 Posted 18 April 2018 - 12:34 PM

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I have done 105 battles over the last 2 days, all of them on both days between the hours of 4 pm till 1:30 am and here are the results for the whole 2 days.

1 spg = 17 = 16.2%

2 spg = 48 = 45.7%

3 spg = 41 = 38.1%

 

Day 1 I played 58 battles all my spg's from T2 right through to T9. I did the 2x on all of them, plus some additional games on the GWP, M44, Bishop, FV304 and the BC 155 55.

This resulted in a percentage of:

1 spg = 10 = 17,2%

2 spg = 27 = 46.6%

3 spg = 21 = 36.2%

 

I did the 2nd day I did 47 battles, but exclusively in the GW Panther, and these were the results:

1 spg = 7 = 14.9%

2 spg = 21 = 44.7%

3 spg = 19 = 40.4%

 

To me, the figures are fairly consistent with the feeling I had that 3 arty games were numerous and not just occasional, though I was surprised at how high the figure was for 3 arty games.

 



Darth_Clicker #27 Posted 18 April 2018 - 02:13 PM

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View Postmpf1959, on 18 April 2018 - 12:34 PM, said:

I have done 105 battles over the last 2 days, all of them on both days between the hours of 4 pm till 1:30 am and here are the results for the whole 2 days.

1 spg = 17 = 16.2%

2 spg = 48 = 45.7%

3 spg = 41 = 38.1%

 

Day 1 I played 58 battles all my spg's from T2 right through to T9. I did the 2x on all of them, plus some additional games on the GWP, M44, Bishop, FV304 and the BC 155 55.

This resulted in a percentage of:

1 spg = 10 = 17,2%

2 spg = 27 = 46.6%

3 spg = 21 = 36.2%

 

I did the 2nd day I did 47 battles, but exclusively in the GW Panther, and these were the results:

1 spg = 7 = 14.9%

2 spg = 21 = 44.7%

3 spg = 19 = 40.4%

 

To me, the figures are fairly consistent with the feeling I had that 3 arty games were numerous and not just occasional, though I was surprised at how high the figure was for 3 arty games.

 

 

You definitely have had more 3 arty battles and less 1 arty battles.  Interesting.  Could it be because of the mission to get the Italian tank?

mpf1959 #28 Posted 18 April 2018 - 04:46 PM

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View PostDarth_Clicker, on 18 April 2018 - 02:13 PM, said:

 

You definitely have had more 3 arty battles and less 1 arty battles.  Interesting.  Could it be because of the mission to get the Italian tank?

 

Could be, but I have always had the feeling I play loads of 3 arty game i dint think it was quite that many, but ive always felt I had more 3 than 1. 



Orkbert #29 Posted 22 April 2018 - 08:28 PM

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In the meantime I have started (once again) to count the SPGs in my games, in which I didn't choose an arty for myself, since mpf's percentages seem to indicate that there has been a shift in how many players choose SPGs for their battles.

 

Of course, Darths and my data collection started shortly after the arty rework, so there could have been the ragequitters influencing the numbers, whereas by now they have rediscovered the boon that the increased splash radius is and the 3/5/7 MM actually kinda counteracting the penetration nerf, so now they have flocked back.

 

Although it will be a while until I'll have gathered enough battles to start presenting.



HeidenSieker #30 Posted 23 April 2018 - 08:52 AM

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View PostOrkbert, on 22 April 2018 - 08:28 PM, said:

In the meantime I have started (once again) to count the SPGs in my games, in which I didn't choose an arty for myself, since mpf's percentages seem to indicate that there has been a shift in how many players choose SPGs for their battles.

 

Perhaps you (or anyone else) can think of a way to get Support to answer the question. I asked:

 

Hi, this is a question ticket.

Can you tell me, please, the number of games on average, in percentage terms, that have 0, 1, 2 or 3 SPGs in them? If you cannot tell me, any pointers on how to find out will be much appreciated!

Regards,

 

The reply I got was:

 

Thank you for contacting us regarding your matchmaking concerns.

We are aware that entering a battle and seeing that your team looks weaker than the enemy team or that you are in the bottom tiers of the battle can be discouraging, but please note that this is not the only factor affecting the outcome of a battle, as tactics and teamplay can often overcome single player skill.

You can view all about the matchmaking system in (snip snip snip)

 

The answer did not seem to address the question.

 

So, can you think of better wording? Also, I can't find a suitable alternative to "Matchmaking issue", any ideas?



Darth_Clicker #31 Posted 23 April 2018 - 11:15 AM

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View PostHeidenSieker, on 23 April 2018 - 08:52 AM, said:

 

Perhaps you (or anyone else) can think of a way to get Support to answer the question. I asked:

 

Hi, this is a question ticket.

Can you tell me, please, the number of games on average, in percentage terms, that have 0, 1, 2 or 3 SPGs in them? If you cannot tell me, any pointers on how to find out will be much appreciated!

Regards,

 

The reply I got was:

 

Thank you for contacting us regarding your matchmaking concerns.

We are aware that entering a battle and seeing that your team looks weaker than the enemy team or that you are in the bottom tiers of the battle can be discouraging, but please note that this is not the only factor affecting the outcome of a battle, as tactics and teamplay can often overcome single player skill.

You can view all about the matchmaking system in (snip snip snip)

 

The answer did not seem to address the question.

 

So, can you think of better wording? Also, I can't find a suitable alternative to "Matchmaking issue", any ideas?

 

I think they normally answer with the most relevant canned response based on keywords....in other words, no-one actually reads the ticket unless you respond with a follow up question such as "you answer did not address my question."  I am pretty sure that if you do this, at least you will get an answer from an actual person. Now whether or not that person reads and understands your question and answers relevantly is a whole other issue.

HeidenSieker #32 Posted 23 April 2018 - 08:58 PM

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View PostDarth_Clicker, on 23 April 2018 - 11:15 AM, said:

I think they normally answer with the most relevant canned response based on keywords....in other words, no-one actually reads the ticket unless you respond with a follow up question such as "you answer did not address my question."  I am pretty sure that if you do this, at least you will get an answer from an actual person. Now whether or not that person reads and understands your question and answers relevantly is a whole other issue.

 

 

Humph. I opened a ticket, and got the response ("signed" ) . I opened another one, saying:

 

Hi, this is a re-opening of ticket ID: NNNNNN1. Apologies for the new ticket; I can't see how to re-open the old one.

 

Unfortunately the answer received in NNNNNN1 does not address the question at all.

 

The question was:

 

"Can you tell me, please, the number of games on average, in percentage terms, that have 0, 1, 2 or 3 SPGs in them? If you cannot tell me, any pointers on how to find out will be much appreciated!"

 

This is a specific question, and not one about how the matchmaker works.

 

Regards,

 

The response was identical - from the same support person. Again, trhe ticket was closed, and I could not see how to re-open it. So, I had another try No. 3 ) :

 

Hi, this is NOT a MM "concern". I know roughly how the MM works, and I am not worried about it. This is NOT a complaint. It is NOT about 3-5-7.

Mr YYYYYY, who I'm sure is trying to be helpful, has answered the wrong question, twice now. If you are Mr. YYYYYY, please will you look again? If you are not Mr YYYYYY, for reference the previous tickets are NNNNNN1 and NNNNNN2.

 

The response again came from the same support person, and again it was identical to the first and second responses.

 

So, I'm feeling rather stymied.

 

Perhaps I ought to open a ticket in an inappropriate place (which I am loath to do) and hope it gets transferred appropriately.


Edited by HeidenSieker, 23 April 2018 - 09:00 PM.


Darth_Clicker #33 Posted 24 April 2018 - 05:34 AM

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I just started a thread on the vBaddict forum suggesting that number of arty per battle would be an interesting statistic to be included.  I don't know if it is possible to do from their replays or not.  I think this statistic might be interesting to both the arty player and the arty hater.  Maybe if enough people indicated support in the forum it might get traction.  I know that there have been problems there since Phalynx turned ownership/control over to a new person, but maybe...just maybe...

 

http://www.vbaddict....24564#post24564



Orkbert #34 Posted 24 April 2018 - 04:12 PM

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Also let's not forget the current battle loading issues for those who have a HDD drive.

 

I myself am one of the affected players, especially moreso since I play light tanks the most, and coming 10~30 seconds too late to every match is devastating (at Prokhorovka I already found out that I basically can't reach any sensible spotter bush anymore, thankfully one can still do a bit there with active spotting but it still irks me)

Now my second most played class is... artillery, which is much more tolerant with such delays (heck, the GWE 100 ain't even loaded after 30 seconds) so as this does influence me which tank type to choose for a battle (hence the delay on my data about how many SPGs in battles in which I choose other tanks) so it probably does influence others as well.

 

So dear arty haters, I wholeheartedly suggest that you start bugging the support about fixing the goddamn battle load times for HDD drives, there will probably a bit less arties in the game once the players get into battle on time again. It will certainly make me use my non-arty tanks more often again.



Orkbert #35 Posted 27 April 2018 - 05:57 PM

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And while I'm at it, I also do count my arty battles now (separate of course from those in which I choose non-SPGs myself) to check if my percentages will converge with mpf's report.

It had more to do with how I will label all those replays when I store them up to keep track.

 

In the meantime, more for lulz my current countings of my non-SPG battles.

 

0 SPGs encountered:    4 matches

1 SPG per side:           11 matches

2 SPGs per side:           3 matches

3 SPGs per side:           7 matches

 

Seemingly there is a lack of double arty games (even less than arty-free ones) though that of course is mainly attributed to the current low battle count (25, this means a single match accounts to 4%) and as my other observations (drowning tanks, matchmaking, and the old how many SPGs in your battles) have shown me it is perfectly possible to have an odd week with a seemingly weird accumulation of something specific, but just as likely (or rather even more likely) you can get the very opposite.

It's just confirmation bias that lets people notice more when something they don't like happens but completely fail to notice when it doesn't (admittedly when something does not happen that can be overlooked rather easily, since it didn't happen after all)

 

You know, when I was new in the game (when the scouts still had their +4MM) it seemed to me that my 38nA would never get into a tierIV battle and even tierV battles seemed rare and few in between. then scouting grew on me, and when I finally liked those battles when my little tierIV scout was pitched against tierVII and VIII tanks I then started to notice when my scouts were matched as toptier (or getting the lowest MM they could)

 

Pic related:



Darth_Clicker #36 Posted 28 April 2018 - 04:53 AM

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Ok, I have also started back with the battle data counting: this is fresh data and doesn't include my previous data.

 

It is interesting that my experience has been markedly different from Orkbert's....when they were similar previously.  I only have tier V-X, and I am arty only.  Therefore, all battles have at least one arty...no zero arty battles....I don't like "easy mode" :trollface:

                                                                           arty tier played

1 SPG:      13       20%  of battles                       V: 0,  VI: 0.  VII: 1,  VIII: 9,    IX: 1,    X: 2

2 SPGs:    33       52%  of battles                       V: 0,  VI: 1.  VII: 1,  VIII: 13,  IX: 13,  X: 8

3 SPGs:    18       28%  of battles                       V: 0,  VI: 0.  VII: 3,  VIII: 14,  IX:  0,   X: 1

 


Edited by Darth_Clicker, 28 April 2018 - 05:00 AM.


HeidenSieker #37 Posted 29 April 2018 - 11:02 PM

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I started ploughing through my replays, but it's extremely tedious. Is there a way of using "WoT Replay Analyser"?

Orkbert #38 Posted 30 April 2018 - 01:58 PM

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View PostDarth_Clicker, on 28 April 2018 - 04:53 AM, said:

Ok, I have also started back with the battle data counting: this is fresh data and doesn't include my previous data.

 

It is interesting that my experience has been markedly different from Orkbert's....when they were similar previously.

 

 

Some of the possible reasons for why now the percentages are different have already been mentioned.

 

But now I got a reasonable chunk of new arty battles as well, so let's take a look at the numbers now (and here as well, my previous data from January won't be counted either)

 

1 Arty          11 battles (22%)

2 Arties       27 battles (54%)

3 Arties       12 battles (24%)

 

So yes, it is different from our old survey, but again our numbers do converge after all and mpf's numbers ain't that far off either, and he sure does show the same trend (most battles are Double Arty while Single Arty games are the least often for an arty player)

 

 

As for my battles which i played with a non-SPG myself: the data for that might be a bit slower due to the already mentioned issues.



Darth_Clicker #39 Posted 01 May 2018 - 05:01 AM

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View PostOrkbert, on 30 April 2018 - 02:58 PM, said:

 

Some of the possible reasons for why now the percentages are different have already been mentioned.

 

But now I got a reasonable chunk of new arty battles as well, so let's take a look at the numbers now (and here as well, my previous data from January won't be counted either)

 

snip

 

 

Ok.

Here are my updated totals:

                                                                          arty tier played

1 SPG:      38       27%  of battles                       V: 14,  VI: 0.  VII: 1,  VIII: 9,    IX: 1,    X: 13

2 SPGs:    74       52%  of battles                       V: 16,  VI: 1.  VII: 1,  VIII: 13,  IX: 15,  X: 28

3 SPGs:    29       21%  of battles                       V: 6,    VI: 0.  VII: 3,  VIII: 14,  IX:  0,   X: 6

 


Edited by Darth_Clicker, 01 May 2018 - 05:04 AM.


Gremlin182 #40 Posted 01 May 2018 - 07:41 AM

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Ok setting aside what the current arty capabilities are. ignore damage pen current aiming method the stun ability forget all of that for one moment.

 

Is it important to have some form of indirect fire in this game.

If we do not have it will we get impossible situations where some tanks in some map positions will be pretty much invulnerable.

 

If that happens will there then have to be changes in maps and those tanks to reduce the chances of this happening because otherwise it will happen all the time.

 

If it causes major problems that cannot easily be fixed will they have to bring arty back again or create some other mechanic.






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