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Seperate statistic for normal players and premium ammo spamming ones?


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trrprrprr #1 Posted 10 April 2018 - 08:43 AM

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Hey, WG....would it be hard to make seperate statistics for premium ammo spammers? It would be more true and competetive, if you would have two types os statistics, so could see whos really better at normal ammo usage and whos at spamming premium shells?!   Its always was a problem, but as it is right now, feels like most tier 9-10 after one bounce change to premium ammo and blast away without much aiming and just kills the whole purpose of beind slow heavy.  Sure you wont take away premium ammo as you earn sh1tloads of cash from that, but atleast it would gimp spammer stats and maby make them learn to aim properly with AP....

HQ65 #2 Posted 10 April 2018 - 08:49 AM

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View Posttrrprrprr, on 10 April 2018 - 07:43 AM, said:

Hey, WG....would it be hard to make seperate statistics for premium ammo spammers? It would be more true and competetive, if you would have two types os statistics, so could see whos really better at normal ammo usage and whos at spamming premium shells?!   Its always was a problem, but as it is right now, feels like most tier 9-10 after one bounce change to premium ammo and blast away without much aiming and just kills the whole purpose of beind slow heavy.  Sure you wont take away premium ammo as you earn sh1tloads of cash from that, but atleast it would gimp spammer stats and maby make them learn to aim properly with AP....

 

Why do you even bother with statistics from other Players. Yours are the only ones that should matter to you.

Ceeb #3 Posted 10 April 2018 - 08:56 AM

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Just for info.

I shoot pure "gold" ammo in my 13 57.  

The the only stats its improved is my Hit Ratio.  From 70.39 to 70.42.  

Feel free to look it up anytime you want.  Does it make you feel better.  Why do you care. ?

LordMuffin #4 Posted 10 April 2018 - 08:59 AM

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View Posttrrprrprr, on 10 April 2018 - 08:43 AM, said:

Hey, WG....would it be hard to make seperate statistics for premium ammo spammers? It would be more true and competetive, if you would have two types os statistics, so could see whos really better at normal ammo usage and whos at spamming premium shells?!   Its always was a problem, but as it is right now, feels like most tier 9-10 after one bounce change to premium ammo and blast away without much aiming and just kills the whole purpose of beind slow heavy.  Sure you wont take away premium ammo as you earn sh1tloads of cash from that, but atleast it would gimp spammer stats and maby make them learn to aim properly with AP....

Premium ammo doesn't make armour useless/irrelevant. 



ThebaldEagle #5 Posted 10 April 2018 - 09:20 AM

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And where do you suggest that players that use both types of ammo should be placed ?????

arthurwellsley #6 Posted 10 April 2018 - 09:23 AM

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Dear OP

 

*edited* Here is the proof = http://forum.worldof...-prize/#topmost


Edited by NickMustaine, 12 April 2018 - 07:39 AM.
Insults


UrQuan #7 Posted 10 April 2018 - 10:36 AM

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Due to the state of the game, removing premium ammo will only help the tanks with broken armor layouts.

Please try hurt my Maus withotu using prem ammo, it'll be a riot (for me & my team, not yours). Tbh, I have far less issues with people spamming prem ammo today then in the past, simply because WG made it much more a necessity to use (no weakspots, more bottomtier play, stronger armor values / armor layouts)

 

But in seriousness, the current status of the game is broken imo. The armor values & layouts of some tanks are simply so strong at their tiers that premium ammo becomes a necessity to pen them, even of those tanks are played badly. And so folks are less shy in bringing out the prem ammo when standard doesn't cut it & hence make it ugly for more balanced armored tanks.

And when the armored tank has a skilled driver? Even prem ammo can get a rough time penning those tanks. Shooting weakspots is an outdated concept on a variety of tanks as they don't have weakspots, or their 'weakspots' are just an excuse to say *under pêrfect conditions, you can pen me here with your AP, providing you are the same tier as me*

 

The current state of the game as armored tank driver is this:

Bottomtier? (in 3-5-7) Hard mode on, you gave up a variety of advantages for your armor & now you can't play it out (unless you drive one of those broken armored tanks that got their bottomtier disadvantage negated by other stats) 

Midtier (mid of 3-5-7 / bottom of 5 - 10): Yay, you can play. Take care still, some bigger tanks around, but if you know your way around armor; you'll have fun. 

Toptier: You are the biggest, meanest tank around; go to the frontline, make that armor work and either hold the line against superior odds or break their defenses with your armored monster.

This still needs support to work mind you, never go alone. but NEVER camp when you are a toptier armored heavy.

And when the prem ammo starts flying? Take it into account, use that skill & make it bounce & respond in kind.

But due to how MM works, most people don't learn the value of pushing, because face it; 3-5-7 is brutal for any non-toptier armoredtank that tries pushing, so people learn to stand back & wait. And when they get toptier in their armored heavy, they got at most the basic skills for fighting in the front, which doesn't help matters.

 

The fact people refused to get better in armored tanks & rather complain that prem ammo makes armor useless is what led to the current state of the game regarding insane armor & prem ammo. Not helped by the fact that people who use prem ammo keep saying *I kill armored tanks easy when I shoot prem*. I'm sure you do, because most armored tanks don't even know the basics of angling. My KV-4 beats your random TX armored tank in blocked damage 9 times out 10. That should not be happening, but it does... Says enough about the average tank driver.

 


Edited by UrQuan, 10 April 2018 - 11:02 AM.


Jigabachi #8 Posted 10 April 2018 - 10:52 AM

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And where exactly does "spamming" start?
What about the players who use it only on terrain tanks?
And the most important question: Why?

250swb #9 Posted 10 April 2018 - 10:53 AM

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I demand a statistic for players who have bought too many premium tanks and who doesn't play most of them. I reckon that's something I can be a unicum at.

Simeon85 #10 Posted 10 April 2018 - 11:05 AM

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View PostJigabachi, on 10 April 2018 - 10:52 AM, said:

And where exactly does "spamming" start?
 

 

This was my question also, what defines spamming? 

 

I use some premium ammo, I couldn't define for you how much I use or how often because it depends entirely on the game situation, what tank I am using, what tanks I am facing and what tiers I am playing.

 

Is it people only using premium ammo all the time?

 

View Posttrrprrprr, on 10 April 2018 - 08:43 AM, said:

Hey, WG....would it be hard to make seperate statistics for premium ammo spammers? It would be more true and competetive, if you would have two types os statistics, so could see whos really better at normal ammo usage and whos at spamming premium shells?!   Its always was a problem, but as it is right now, feels like most tier 9-10 after one bounce change to premium ammo and blast away without much aiming and just kills the whole purpose of beind slow heavy.  Sure you wont take away premium ammo as you earn sh1tloads of cash from that, but atleast it would gimp spammer stats and maby make them learn to aim properly with AP....
 

 

You now most of what you claim is a complete myth.

 

The amount of players that fire just premium ammo is tiny, most people don't use that much or only use it when they feel they need to. 

 

Plus it doesn't make armour useless in the slightest.

 

Nor does it substantially improve performance, as an example I played a game yesterday in the WZ-111-5A (a tank I see consistently people shooting HEAT in), in an all tier 10 game and managed over 5k damage, penning 95% of my shots fighting other heavies and mediums frontally, add in 5 kills and over 3k assistance damage I heavily carried that game. 

 

I fought against a 49% player in an Obj. 430U who fired nothing but HEAT at me but only managed to pen one shot against me, that player only managed 1.6k damage in the whole game and I took pretty much 80% of his hit points with AP. 

 

I blocked something like 3.5k damage fired at me, the majority of which was from premium ammo, but because I positioned my tank well and only showed strong parts of my armour the premium ammo did not matter. 

 

Penetrating shots and doing damage is just one small part of the game, a much bigger part is the awareness, positioning and decision making that allows you to do that damage without taking that much in return. 

 



Enforcer1975 #11 Posted 10 April 2018 - 11:09 AM

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View PostLordMuffin, on 10 April 2018 - 08:59 AM, said:

Premium ammo doesn't make armour useless/irrelevant. 

This.

I had so many muppets spam premium ammo at me and they didn't pen. Especially APCR bounced a lot on my paper armored tanks because of the impact angles where they would have penned if they had used AP. 



trrprrprr #12 Posted 10 April 2018 - 01:45 PM

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View PostHQ65, on 10 April 2018 - 07:49 AM, said:

 

Why do you even bother with statistics from other Players. Yours are the only ones that should matter to you.

 

Dont get me wrong, ive never been a stat hoarder and almost all this type of games ive been just a bit over average.  But all the stat hoarding kills this game day by day. You all see this in games, where lights camp behind everyone/where superheavy as a top tier sits at base and snipes, or other meds with good camo value dont even bother helping cos they better get not hit than help a teammate....and examples like could write all day long. Same goes with premium ammo - and yes, i know, there is just a few tanks in this game in middle to close to top tiers who just doesnt have any chance to pen in frontal assault as they lack accuracy/aim time or all the above, but seeing that even top tiers dont even bother aiming at so many weakspots of Type 4 heavy cos its alot easier to swap to gold and shoot without thinking.  And didnt have any problem with type 4 heavy 12cm gun too with AP and its accuracy...it just make this game fun. But when it comes to tanks like this, all you have is armor - cos you are 3x larger than most tanks, slowest - full of weakspots...so only way would be to angle and work armor....but premium ammo nullifies ANY point in playing these types of heavys as all you need is fast moving/agile tank that spams premium ammo with autoaim.

 

So after seeing that many just try too hard for wn8, they forget to learn the game and purpose of played tank type.    So the least hurfull thing would be - make separate statistics.



trrprrprr #13 Posted 10 April 2018 - 01:50 PM

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View PostThebaldEagle, on 10 April 2018 - 08:20 AM, said:

And where do you suggest that players that use both types of ammo should be placed ?????

 

Just all damage/miss/bounce while using gold goes in to seperate stats.  Or atleast in current stats, make more infor on whos using premium ammo and how much.

Simeon85 #14 Posted 10 April 2018 - 01:50 PM

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'Weakspots of the Type 4' :D

trrprrprr #15 Posted 10 April 2018 - 01:58 PM

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View PostSimeon85, on 10 April 2018 - 12:50 PM, said:

'Weakspots of the Type 4' :D

 

Whats funny? Even without watching some weakspot pics, just by playing - every tier 8TD pens lower plate from 400m range without much problems, as soon as you angle, there is pretty big weakspot on the side of the hull and then there is tumor on turret. But again - load premium and weakspot is most of the front of this tank.

trrprrprr #16 Posted 10 April 2018 - 02:00 PM

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View PostEnforcer1975, on 10 April 2018 - 10:09 AM, said:

This.

I had so many muppets spam premium ammo at me and they didn't pen. Especially APCR bounced a lot on my paper armored tanks because of the impact angles where they would have penned if they had used AP. 

 

Super heavy is made for close combat and its only reasonable that retard with small calibre premium wont pen in most shots(and those are alot in game), but as soon as you are in close combat, all swith to premium, just for the sake of snapshotting without aiming(cos why you should learn to aim, if you have sh1tload of money tu support that noobish ammo?)

Simeon85 #17 Posted 10 April 2018 - 02:09 PM

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View Posttrrprrprr, on 10 April 2018 - 01:58 PM, said:

 

Whats funny? 

 

The fact that the Type 4 has no real weakspots against most of what it faces, hence why it and all who drive it deserve all the premium ammo in the world spammed at it.

 

The weakest point of the Type 4 frontally is a tiny hatch that is like 240mm effective which puts it out of reach of pretty much all tier 8 guns and many tier 9 guns, whilst being a 60/40 for most tier 10 guns, and that is that tiny spot, the rest is like 250-270 effective everywhere at worst, with some areas being way more meaning pretty much all of the Type 4 frontally is sub 50/50 chance to pen against tier 10 guns. 

 

If you don't like premium ammo being spammed at your Type 4, don't drive a broken tank that has no real frontal weakspots. 

 

I find if I drive something like a T-10 or Conqueror a lot less premium ammo is spammed at those tanks, probably because those tanks have actual frontal weakspots that even tier 7s can pen. 



Balc0ra #18 Posted 10 April 2018 - 02:11 PM

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Would it really help tho? As most spam gold on stock grinds like there is no tomorrow. As they can't pen anything on their own tier and up with it until they get the 2nd or the best gun. Like the 175 pen T-54. 201 is not great either. But 175 really don't help vs anything in a tier 9 game. As I'm sure we all have done on at least a few grinds.

 

View Posttrrprrprr, on 10 April 2018 - 08:43 AM, said:

 but atleast it would gimp spammer stats and maby make them learn to aim properly with AP....

 

Don't come here and tell me you are 100% pure. None of us are. As I suspect you don't spam AP in your JT 88 vs 250mm effective armor super heavies? Flanking is a luxury you don't always have either.  And then all the proper aiming in the world with AP don't help you. As I'm not ashamed to say it. I don't mind pressing 2 then if I have zero chance to pen it head on anywhere with AP. It's like my IS-6 vs the VK 100.01. All the aiming in the world will not make the 175 pen AP round do damage to the 220mm weakspots.

 

View Posttrrprrprr, on 10 April 2018 - 08:43 AM, said:

Sure you wont take away premium ammo as you earn sh1tloads of cash from that, but atleast it would gimp spammer stats and maby make them learn to aim properly with AP....

 

How pays actual gold for their ammo these days? I've never used a single cent on it. Never will either. But then again considering half your tier 8's can't even pen most of the recent tier 8 HT's head on with AP, even on their weakspot. I suspect most gold whiners would be back to as for an AP buff rather fast as they can't pen anything head on in this super heavy meta. Or even as for an armor nerf. That or you would be back to whine about MM. As none of you can win if the enemy has a 3 man Type 5 platoon. Removing gold ammo will only fix one issue. But create 5 more. As when 90% of the old tanks are not balanced for a super heavy meta? Well. I

 

View PostSimeon85, on 10 April 2018 - 02:09 PM, said:

 

The fact that the Type 4 has no real weakspots against most of what it faces, hence why it and all who drive it deserve all the premium ammo in the world spammed at it.

 

That was the issue with it. And why I think it's a crap tank overall. He can't even pen himself with the 14cm AP gun head on. Even if you aim at the weakspots. It's not a 100% sure thing. It's 48% or something. Angle it and it drops to 28%. It's like the Chrysler K. Even he can't deal with himself head on.

Edited by Balc0ra, 10 April 2018 - 02:17 PM.


LordMuffin #19 Posted 10 April 2018 - 02:12 PM

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View Posttrrprrprr, on 10 April 2018 - 01:58 PM, said:

 

Whats funny? Even without watching some weakspot pics, just by playing - every tier 8TD pens lower plate from 400m range without much problems, as soon as you angle, there is pretty big weakspot on the side of the hull and then there is tumor on turret. But again - load premium and weakspot is most of the front of this tank.

 

Such weakspots much wow.

All the yellow sections are ~60% chance to pen for a 268 pen gun.

 

So, if cupola is a weakspot, then entire frontal turret is a weakspot, and the lfp and the flat ufp area.

 

in fact, the only non-weakspot parts of the tank is the purple areas  and the cheeks (red areas)...



ThebaldEagle #20 Posted 10 April 2018 - 02:16 PM

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View Posttrrprrprr, on 10 April 2018 - 01:50 PM, said:

 

Just all damage/miss/bounce while using gold goes in to seperate stats.  Or atleast in current stats, make more infor on whos using premium ammo and how much.

 

So insted of WG focusing on fixing all bugs and other misshaps in the game, you mean they should divert some persons to make a totally usless stat focusing on prem users so that you can be happy and look at who shoots årem ammo at you.

sorry to say but keep dreaming or get a life






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