67 replies to this topic

[BodyGuardOfLies]

I have been playing the new Frontline mode and thoroughly enjoying it. I acknowledge there are a few bugs but this is to be expected in a new game and I am sure they will be patched.

 

Frontline has thrown up a few possibilities though. 

 

Frontline has proven that if there is no tier spread the battles at the very least as much fun but in my opinion infinitely better. Also despite all participants being drawn from the same tier the world did not end and the servers did not spontaneously combust furthermore the battles did not lack excitement far from it. Frontline has proven that the tier spread is unnecessary and that it does little more than cause frustration and resentment sucking all the fun from the game as it does.  

 

If all battles were one tier  people would have a reason to keep more tanks in their garage so that they could play enjoyably at any tier rather than being caught in an arms race to reach tier 10 so as not be 2 tiers down most battles. By virtue of the fact that they are playing their tanks they will unlock higher tiers and enjoy doing it instead of the current agony.

 

Another point proven by Frontline is that corridor maps are crap. They are lazy map making and there only to manipulate results. The beauty of the Frontline map is that all tank classes can play to their strengths and are not immediately disadvantaged by terrain. 

 

Finally if Frontline is to become a permanent feature I can buy tier 8 premiums again. I can't be the only one who stopped buying them because I cant see the point in giving Wargaming £40 just to be a punchbag for tier 10 tanks. If you remove the tier spread we can all dust off the tanks we like to play at all tiers and play then again knowing we are not just setting ourselves up to be an xp pinata for stat padders and rerolls. 

 

In conclusion Wargaing please remove the tier spread and corridor maps in randoms or run Frontline at a different tier each month to rejuvenate the game and bring back the fun. 

 

Thank you

[Erwin_Von_Braun]

Yes to all.

Now we play the waiting game.................

[Balc0ra]

BodyGuardOfLies, on 12 May 2018 - 03:40 PM, said:

Frontline has proven that if there is no tier spread the battles at the very least as much fun but in my opinion infinitely better. Also despite all participants being drawn from the same tier the world did not end and the servers did not spontaneously combust furthermore the battles did not lack excitement far from it. Frontline has proven that the tier spread is unnecessary and that it does little more than cause frustration and resentment sucking all the fun from the game as it does. 

 

When you are 30 vs 30 on a map that's 9 times bigger that gives even HT's the luxury of flank fire? Sure. But for 15 vs 15 on 600m to 1km maps, pure tier 8 games shows it's flaws.. As equal tier 8 and X games are atm the worst, and why I don't play my IS-6 and a few other tier 8's I own. Mostly due to the armor meta. As most guns on tier 8 are on 212 to 190 pen, even on HT's. And when most targets have 220 as a "weakspot". As pure tier 8 games are full of premiums, inc Patriots and Defenders still... or the VK 100.01. And you have mostly corridor maps. It's not ideal tbh. 

 

FL showed that equal tier games can work on that tier even with crappy guns if you have the right map to flank wide on it. I mean I played the CDC on FL today and had a blast in it, thought maybe I was wrong about the tank. Played it in randoms to check and got an equal tier game. Then it was trash again. Then again, having the ability to repair the CDC every 120 seconds did help too... vs randoms where you can't. And that aspect is what makes it fun for more ppl. As if they do a mistake. They don't have to suffer for it all game.

 

But... FL is fun. But atm short fun. I doubt many will stick around after they get 3x Prestige. As they need more then one map if they make it permanent if they want to keep it interesting.

 

BodyGuardOfLies, on 12 May 2018 - 03:40 PM, said:

In conclusion Wargaing please remove the tier spread and corridor maps in randoms or run Frontline at a different tier each month to rejuvenate the game and bring back the fun.

 

That could work. Even reduce the map size for mid tier games. But again, like randoms I suspect tier X FL games would be terrible. As based on the current tier X meta. It would be full of 430 U's and 268 4's.

 

 

Edited by Balc0ra, 12 May 2018 - 04:06 PM.

[Ganjalf94]

I kinda like the idea of lower tier frontlines, but you gotta adjust the HP of the final batteries, also take into account usually lower tiers tanks are also slower than higher tiers, so maybe different, smaller maps are required for those. Just a thought.

[Danger__UXB]

You are right.. as in the fact that they were all tier 8 and in my eyes the game actually felt quite balanced.

 

Heavys could 'Bully' due to the fact they feel like they actually have armour and meds/Lights could flank,,TD,S could give actually useful crossfire and form nice kill zones aswell due to the map size..

 

 

Havnt played alot in a good while but i really enjoy what this mode has to offer..WG would be fools to remove this mode and not expand on it by introducing it to the other tiers.

 

 

Looking forward to another late night playing it..its really good fun.

Edited by Danger_UXB_, 12 May 2018 - 04:03 PM.

[Bulldog_Drummond]

No to all

 

FL is just a trick by which competent players can slaughter noobs and get credits

 

The noobs of course lose lose credits

 

WG wins because the noobs end up buying some Tier 8 premiums, in which they continue to lose credits

Edited by Bulldog_Drummond, 12 May 2018 - 04:19 PM.

[BodyGuardOfLies]

Bulldog_Drummond, on 12 May 2018 - 03:18 PM, said:

No to all

 

FL is just a trick by which competent players can slaughter noobs and get credits

 

The noobs of course lose lose credits

 

WG wins because the noobs end up buying some Tier 8 premiums, in which they continue to lose credits

 

How the hell do you lose money at Frontlines?  If you can't make money at frontlines you sure as hell aint going to make any in random battles.

 

As to Frontlines being "a trick by which competent players can slaughter noobs"  what poppycock. Yes those sneaky b'stards at Wargaming have given everybody the same map and made everyone play in the same tier. You are right noobs are much better off 2 tiers down on a corridor map getting farmed. 

 

" the noobs end up buying some Tier 8 premiums, in which they continue to lose credits"  The first thing I did was take the gold ammo off my premium tanks becasue you don't need it but even if I spammed gold like an Arab prince in a nightclub I don't think it would be possible to lose money. 

 

[Balc0ra]

BodyGuardOfLies, on 12 May 2018 - 05:20 PM, said:

 

How the hell do you lose money at Frontlines?  If you can't make money at frontlines you sure as hell aint going to make any in random battles.

 

Well one round lasts for 24 min give or take, IF you manage to push or don't defend all points. Divide that income vs playing a few 6 minute rounds in randoms with a premium, you more or less make as much give or take. Unless you get a monster farm game tho. 

 

And that's why I don't get the rage when you do lose a point on a last chance on the first line right before the timer goes. As then you end up making 50K, sub 1K xp and getting 300 prestige on average. So then you might as well play randoms and get more faster.

[BodyGuardOfLies]

Balc0ra, on 12 May 2018 - 04:27 PM, said:

 

Well one round lasts for 24 min give or take, IF you manage to push or don't defend all points. Divide that income vs playing a few 6 minute rounds in randoms with a premium, you more or less make as much give or take. Unless you get a monster farm game tho. 

 

And that's why I don't get the rage when you do lose a point on a last chance on the first line right before the timer goes. As then you end up making 50K, sub 1K xp and getting 300 prestige on average. So then you might as well play randoms and get more faster.

 

I am averaging well over 100k on Fronyline and no where near that in random tier 8 mediums but that is all by the by because for the first time in a long time I am enjoying the game. 

 

I don't play to fill my credit pool as long as I have enough to buy the next tank I unlock then I don't care. Right now playing frontline earns me more because I don't get cheesed off wit the tier spread and quit. 

 

Oh and something else I have noticed about Frontline is a lot less toxicity because people aren't frustrated at getting rolled over by tanks 2 tiers higher again. 
 

[Bulldog_Drummond]

BodyGuardOfLies, on 12 May 2018 - 04:20 PM, said:

 

How the hell do you lose money at Frontlines?  If you can't make money at frontlines you sure as hell aint going to make any in random battles.

 

As to Frontlines being "a trick by which competent players can slaughter noobs"  what poppycock. Yes those sneaky b'stards at Wargaming have given everybody the same map and made everyone play in the same tier. You are right noobs are much better off 2 tiers down on a corridor map getting farmed. 

 

" the noobs end up buying some Tier 8 premiums, in which they continue to lose credits"  The first thing I did was take the gold ammo off my premium tanks becasue you don't need it but even if I spammed gold like an Arab prince in a nightclub I don't think it would be possible to lose money. 

 

 

I simply put it out there for what it is.

 

I'm an average player and in 5 games of FL with decent premium tanks and very little premium ammo use, I have made a net overall loss.

 

If I can manage that then you can bet that 75% of the player base can also lose money on it.

[BodyGuardOfLies]

Bulldog_Drummond, on 12 May 2018 - 04:41 PM, said:

 

I simply put it out there for what it is.

 

I'm an average player and in 5 games of FL with decent premium tanks and very little premium ammo use, I have made a net overall loss.

 

If I can manage that then you can bet that 75% of the player base can also lose money on it.

 

i don't know what to suggest to a player that loses money at Frontline.

 

I still don't understand why you are against no tier spread in randoms though particularly given your fixation with credits? 

 

I also fail to see why you would object to fewer corridor maps? Perhaps you just don't like change?

[Bulldog_Drummond]

BodyGuardOfLies, on 12 May 2018 - 05:28 PM, said:

 

i don't know what to suggest to a player that loses money at Frontline.

 

I still don't understand why you are against no tier spread in randoms though particularly given your fixation with credits? 

 

I also fail to see why you would object to fewer corridor maps? Perhaps you just don't like change?

 

It's possible that I am - uniquely - not very good at FL.  It's also possible that the vast majority of the playerbase, who neither read nor post on the forum, are also getting their heads chopped off on FL.

 

Do I have a fixation with credits?  That's news to me.  As I find FL both boring and stupid there would seem not much point playing it except for credits.  And as I can't make credits in it.....

 

Zero MM spreads would be great for statpadders and also unbalance the entire game so be careful what you wish for.  No idea where you are coming from with your corridor maps point.

[250swb]

 Permanent Frontline mode would destroy WOT. 

 

To to start with it would distort progression in the game, anybody with hours to spare no matter how skilled will be able to grind massive credits that don't reflect their ability. So you get 45% noobs with a garage full of tier X tanks with almost no effort. You'd get players avoiding Random battles because it would affect their stats. It would destroy any other novel game mode, you'd have Random, competing with Frontline, competing with ....whatever. Most of all there is no comeback in Frontline mode, if you get killed who cares, you respawn, you don't lose overall stats, you just shoot and giggle, in the long term how satisfying is that going to be? So the player base will become less skilled, there is no jeopardy, you can't actually lose a battle even if the battle is lost because you don't lose anything that is intrinsically valuable to pride, like WR.

 

I can see why Frontline appeals as an 'event', but just because it is fun and frivolous it doesn't mean it is good for the game, I just wish people would think to the survival of WOT and not short term inanity, it would be the end. But on the other hand maybe WOT needs to end, players seem to have no ambitions anymore other than getting easy credits.

[BodyGuardOfLies]

Bulldog_Drummond, on 12 May 2018 - 06:14 PM, said:

 

It's possible that I am - uniquely - not very good at FL.  It's also possible that the vast majority of the playerbase, who neither read nor post on the forum, are also getting their heads chopped off on FL.

 

Do I have a fixation with credits?  That's news to me.  As I find FL both boring and stupid there would seem not much point playing it except for credits.  And as I can't make credits in it.....

 

Zero MM spreads would be great for statpadders and also unbalance the entire game so be careful what you wish for.  No idea where you are coming from with your corridor maps point.

 

 

You may be uniquely bad at Frontlines but as you don't enjoy it the point is moot anyway after all this is a game and should be pleasurable. 

 

I am not sure that zero tier spread would benefit stat padders as much as being 2 tiers higher than most of the opposition. As to corridor maps try coming face to face with an IS7 on Mountain Pass in a tier 8 light and you will see what I mean about corridor maps. At least with maps like Steppes you can fight in a different direction (runaway) but with corridor maps your game is over. 

[Rilleta]

Balc0ra, on 12 May 2018 - 02:58 PM, said:

 

"snip"

 

 

WG had developed a few other maps too. But seems like they did not enter in our current FL iteration.

[Strappster]

No option for "WoT was already fun". I don't expect FL to be a permanent mode but I'd be very surprised if elements from it didn't come into the regular game. Frankly I'm surprised that the arty haters haven't leapt on the artillery consumable before now, same as I'm looking at the smokescreen with avaricious eyes. 

[BodyGuardOfLies]

250swb, on 12 May 2018 - 06:17 PM, said:

 Permanent Frontline mode would destroy WOT. 

 

To to start with it would distort progression in the game, anybody with hours to spare no matter how skilled will be able to grind massive credits that don't reflect their ability. So you get 45% noobs with a garage full of tier X tanks with almost no effort. You'd get players avoiding Random battles because it would affect their stats. It would destroy any other novel game mode, you'd have Random, competing with Frontline, competing with ....whatever. Most of all there is no comeback in Frontline mode, if you get killed who cares, you respawn, you don't lose overall stats, you just shoot and giggle, in the long term how satisfying is that going to be? So the player base will become less skilled, there is no jeopardy, you can't actually lose a battle even if the battle is lost because you don't lose anything that is intrinsically valuable to pride, like WR.

 

I can see why Frontline appeals as an 'event', but just because it is fun and frivolous it doesn't mean it is good for the game, I just wish people would think to the survival of WOT and not short term inanity, it would be the end. But on the other hand maybe WOT needs to end, players seem to have no ambitions anymore other than getting easy credits.

 

First of all maybe you can help your clan mate Bulldog Drummond out because whilst you claim "anybody with hours to spare no matter how skilled will be able to grind massive credits" he asserts "not much point playing it except for credits.  And as I can't make credits in it....."

 

 "You'd get players avoiding Random battles because it would affect their stats" so what? They have stats based upon random battles what does it matter if the rest of the time they are playing Frontline or Minecraft? 

 

"It would destroy any other novel game mode, you'd have Random, competing with Frontline, competing with ....whatever." So either have a different tier in frontline each month or don't bother with it but get rid of the corridor maps and tuier spraed in randoms.

 

" the player base will become less skilled" I don't think that is possible

 

"So you get 45% noobs with a garage full of tier X tanks"  You already have as Jingles puts it "if you ready up enough times anybody can have a tier ten tank.". However I think you are missing the point which is a lot of people grind tier 10 tanks in the mistaken belief that they will lose less if they are not 2 tiers down. The beauty of no tier spread is that all tiers become relevant again as they are stand alone if they only compete with the same tier. People will hold on to more tanks because they would be able to play them without fear of match making rendering them irrelevant by placing them 2 tiers down on a corridor map where they have no chance of flanking and cannot pen the enemy head on. 

 

" I just wish people would think to the survival of WOT and not short term inanity," As somebody with approaching 100 premium tanks and nearly 80k battles who has been playing since 2011 it is absurd to suggest that I am not thinking of the long term survival of wot. What i do know is the number of players that have left because of the tier spread and because of the corridor maps and if you wanna get into it the RNG, the noob protection and the accuracy nerfs. If wot don't do something to fix it even the ocd players like me will eventually find another game to play. 

 

 

 

"But on the other hand maybe WOT needs to end, players seem to have no ambitions anymore other than getting easy credits."      As a result of the 2 tier spread forcing players to spam gold and grind for tier 10's of course people are fixated on credit grinding. If you removed that element so that people went for tanks that interested them or maybe just to collect them all a lot of the fun would return to the game and that is what it is sorely lacking.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Hinka]

FL is horrible, it puts all the things that are broken in the game are highlighted in this game mode 

Spotting system gets first seat on cloaking device enabled with the aircraft spotting.

The spawn system makes the use of slow tanks a very bad decision with the combination of air strikes and artillery use.

Not to mention the map itself looks like a kid with no skill whatsoever designed the map.

I really hate this game mode and if this is the best wargaming can come up with then the game has no future as it only shows how unbalanced old tanks are compared with new tanks.

[war4peace]

BodyGuardOfLies, on 12 May 2018 - 06:39 PM, said:

Oh and something else I have noticed about Frontline is a lot less toxicity because people aren't frustrated at getting rolled over by tanks 2 tiers higher again. 

 

It's just that if you're matched with no-can-doers in one area, you can switch once you get killed.

One thing I'd like to see fixed:

 

Block Quote

 

Defeat
Battle: Road to Glory 
Vehicles: Rheinmetall Skorpion G, Object 252U, T26E5 Patriot, Progetto M35 mod. 46
Experience received: 0
Bonds received: 5
Credits earned: 0
Battle achievements: Master Striker

Detailed information is unavailable.

 

That's because I tried to use Z+F4 and pressed Alt+F4 in the heat of the battle. Once I reconnected I got the above, presumably because the battle ended  while I was reconnected.

This doesn't happen in randoms unless you specifically quit the battle.

[Junglist_]

Because of the utter garbage tier 10 balancing and the current MM layout the randoms are 90% shitfest so I'm all up for Frontline being permanent.

Each month different tier is a great idea, though don't really play anything below tier 8 unless grinding and more importantly I think the map would be too big for tiers 5-7.

I'd be very happy to see even +/- 1 mm but IMO two tier spread is mostly bussines decision.

I would like to see them make another map since I'm afraid having just one map will become too stale soon.

Fingers crossed that after this event ends WG will improve the mod and we won't have to wait too long for more.

Wouldn't worry about arguing with Bulldog he's just salty  because he's utter shite at anything above tier 5 and is probably too senile to even comprehend what the objectives are in Frontline.