Jump to content


If you are planning to get the K-91...... (and why you might want to get it)

a heads up

  • Please log in to reply
58 replies to this topic

Simeon85 #1 Posted 01 June 2018 - 10:22 AM

    Captain

  • Player
  • 1097 battles
  • 2,297
  • Member since:
    04-19-2013

Then grind the Obj. 430 v2 now, as they have butchered it on the latest version of the test for patch 1.0.2.

 

The armour has been nerfed all round, turret has dropped from 248mm to 180mm, frontal armour from 120mm to 80mm and sides from 80mm to 60mm. 

 

So now it might bounce tier 7s and some low pen tier 8 guns but will not be the sidescrape brawler it currently is. 

 

Also the mobility does not seem to have been improved despite it losing all that armour. 

 

You also lose 100 hit points as well. 

 

The gun is better but only marginally, your 'sniper' gun is still less accurate than the more accurate gun on the T-54 (which still has all the armour), dispersion values are buffed, view range is 10m better and you gain some DPM (has around 2.8k base) but it's a big trade considering how powerful armour is in the current meta.

 

You do get 246mm of standard pen so it will be less of a HEAT spammer.

 

--------------------------------

 

As for the K-91 itself, this has received some much needed buffs. 

 

Which have made the tank more worth getting IMO, I wasn't planning on going for the K-91 after playing it on the first test, but they have now fixed the main issue with the tank, the engine power (hp/ton has gone from 11 hp/ton to nearly 19 hp/ton) so I think I am going to grind it. It feels much more mobile now, more like it's fellow Rasha meds. 

 

They have also given the turret more rotation (110 degrees to each side not 90), have given it -9 gun depression over the sides of the tank which is a bit weird and now further buffed the DPM.  These changes don't have much impact on it's playstyle but every little helps.

 

It leaves the K-91 with some unique top stats -

 

  • Effectively the highest DPM of any medium or heavy in the game (as the T57 can't mount a rammer) just with rammer + BIA + food you can get the reload to 5s, which means a sub 5s reload is possible with normal vents. If you use improved equipment (improved vents and improved rammer) it is likely you could get the reload down to like 4.7-4.8s and the DPM would be around 4k. 

 

  • Highest base pen of any heavy tank or medium tank in the game at 276mm of APCR penetration. 

 

  • Highest shell velocity in the game at 1700 m/s (standard rounds mind due to the OP premium round on the Obj. 277)

 

  • Highest base camo of any tier 10 med (I think), with food + BIA + tank camo + full camo crew the stationary camo was over 37% (and remember this thing has 410m view range as well, cos RIP tier 10 lights) 

 

Of course the armour is not great, it might bounce some tier 8s but this is still effectively a medium to long range support tank so bear that in mind. 

 

EDIT: Just went on the test, the maxed out reload is 4.66s, with improved vents, improved rammer, BIA, food and orderly ammo rack directive.

 

That is 4,123 DPM. 


Edited by Simeon85, 01 June 2018 - 10:12 PM.


Aikl #2 Posted 01 June 2018 - 10:27 AM

    Brigadier

  • Player
  • 25167 battles
  • 4,253
  • [-MM] -MM
  • Member since:
    04-13-2011

View PostSimeon85, on 01 June 2018 - 09:22 AM, said:

(...)

It leaves the K-91 Leopard 1 with some unique top stats -

 

  • Effectively the highest DPM of any medium or heavy in the game (as the T57 can't mount a rammer) just with rammer + BIA + food you can get the reload to 5s, which means a sub 5s reload is possible with normal vents. If you use improved equipment (improved vents and improved rammer) it is likely you could get the reload down to like 4.7-4.8s and the DPM would be around 4k. 

 

  • Highest base pen of any heavy tank or medium tank in the game at 276mm of APCR penetration. 

 

  • Highest shell velocity in the game at 1700 m/s (standard rounds mind due to the OP premium round on the Obj. 277)

 

  • Highest base camo of any tier 10 med (I think), with food + BIA + tank camo + full camo crew the stationary camo was over 37% (and remember this thing has 410m view range as well, cos RIP tier 10 lights) 

 

Of course the armour is not great, it might bounce some tier 8s but this is still effectively a medium to long range support tank so bear that in mind. 

 

Why does this seem eerily familiar if I change one tank name?



Simeon85 #3 Posted 01 June 2018 - 10:36 AM

    Captain

  • Player
  • 1097 battles
  • 2,297
  • Member since:
    04-19-2013

View PostAikl, on 01 June 2018 - 10:27 AM, said:

 

Why does this seem eerily familiar if I change one tank name?

 

The Leo actually needs similar treatment. 

 

DrOolen was suggesting on another thread and I 100% agree that the Leo should be getting better dispersion values, high pen, high shell velocity, better accuracy etc. and it should get higher alpha with lower DPM.

 

You'd then have the K-91 as the low alpha/high DPM sniper tank and the Leo 1 as the high alpha/low DPM, whilst both have higher accuracy, pen and shell velocity than any of the other meds. 

 

Sadly the current Leo has none of those things, it's pen and shell velocity is no better than most other tier 10 meds, it's camo is average and it's DPM is below par.  

 

The K-91's gun is much better than the Leo's gun -

 

Posted Image

 

Only base accuracy and alpha are in the Leo's favour and the K-91 has even more DPM than that after the buff. 

 

 


Edited by Simeon85, 01 June 2018 - 10:40 AM.


Dava_117 #4 Posted 01 June 2018 - 10:42 AM

    Major

  • Player
  • 18568 battles
  • 2,751
  • [B-BAS] B-BAS
  • Member since:
    12-17-2014

View PostSimeon85, on 01 June 2018 - 10:36 AM, said:

 

The Leo actually needs similar treatment. 

 

DrOolen was suggesting on another thread and I 100% agree that the Leo should be getting better dispersion values, high pen, high shell velocity, better accuracy etc. and it should get higher alpha with lower DPM.

 

You'd then have the K-91 as the low alpha/high DPM sniper tank and the Leo 1 as the high alpha/low DPM, whilst both have higher accuracy, pen and shell velocity than any of the other meds. 

 

You can't really buff Leo1 alpha a lot... 400 is already a 120mm alpha...

Simeon85 #5 Posted 01 June 2018 - 10:54 AM

    Captain

  • Player
  • 1097 battles
  • 2,297
  • Member since:
    04-19-2013

View PostDava_117, on 01 June 2018 - 10:42 AM, said:

 

You can't really buff Leo1 alpha a lot... 400 is already a 120mm alpha...

 

Alpha's are all over the place, WG just make them up. Like 120mm have 400, but a 122 has 390 on lowet tiers then 440 on higher tiers, 2mm more but 40 more alpha? 

 

The Badger has a 123mm with 480 alpha, Panzer VII has a 128mm with 560, but other 128mms have 490, and then a near 140mm gun on the Conway only has 40 more alpha than a 128mm gun on a Jagtiger.

 

The Rhm. Panzer has a 105 on tier 10 with 320 as well and the Italian tanks have 360 alpha for a 105mm. 

 

Plus IRL gun power wasn't really about the calibre it was more about the round being fired.

 

Basically there is no gun calibre to alpha consistency anymore so they could easily make it like 450 or 440 or something, or at least 420 alpha, it wouldn't really matter it's about balance for the tank.

 

 



Suurpolskija #6 Posted 01 June 2018 - 10:59 AM

    Lieutenant

  • Player
  • 18692 battles
  • 1,642
  • [URHO] URHO
  • Member since:
    01-26-2016

Boo-yah they finally nerfed the armor of that Object 4 what ever! THIS MAKES ME SO HAPPY!!!

 

...

 

wait... what? They nerfed THAT object? :hiding:



Jumping_TurtIe #7 Posted 01 June 2018 - 10:59 AM

    Warrant Officer

  • Player
  • 6100 battles
  • 824
  • [T-D-U] T-D-U
  • Member since:
    02-26-2015

View PostSimeon85, on 01 June 2018 - 10:22 AM, said:

Then grind the Obj. 430 v2 now, as they have butchered it on the latest version of the test for patch 1.0.2.

 

 

Pfff, and I hate it already as it is ... 60k xp to go

 

Hated it a few years ago when going for the 430 and hating it now getting xp for the 91 ...



signal11th #8 Posted 01 June 2018 - 11:00 AM

    Major General

  • Player
  • 35429 battles
  • 5,477
  • [T-D-U] T-D-U
  • Member since:
    07-14-2011
It's a Russian Leo and nobody really plays the German Leo because of plenty of reasons so why would I bother with a Russian version. 

Simeon85 #9 Posted 01 June 2018 - 11:02 AM

    Captain

  • Player
  • 1097 battles
  • 2,297
  • Member since:
    04-19-2013

View Postsignal11th, on 01 June 2018 - 11:00 AM, said:

It's a Russian Leo and nobody really plays the German Leo because of plenty of reasons so why would I bother with a Russian version. 

 

Because it's better? 

 

  • More pen
  • More DPM
  • More shell velocity
  • More camo
  • Similar mobility now
  • Same view range
  • Smaller and lower profile target
  • More likely to bounce and has some bully armour for lower tiers. 


signal11th #10 Posted 01 June 2018 - 11:05 AM

    Major General

  • Player
  • 35429 battles
  • 5,477
  • [T-D-U] T-D-U
  • Member since:
    07-14-2011

View PostSimeon85, on 01 June 2018 - 10:02 AM, said:

 

Because it's better? 

 

  • More pen
  • More DPM
  • More shell velocity
  • More camo
  • Similar mobility now
  • Same view range
  • Smaller and lower profile target
  • More likely to bounce and has some bully armour for lower tiers. 

 

So what? the Leo is very bad and this being better just makes it bad so... it's still bad I watched a few people play it and it just looks pretty mediocre. Basically sit at the back and snipe until you get spotted then you're dead. Oh and I forgot it looks S5it.

Edited by signal11th, 01 June 2018 - 11:07 AM.


Simeon85 #11 Posted 01 June 2018 - 11:21 AM

    Captain

  • Player
  • 1097 battles
  • 2,297
  • Member since:
    04-19-2013

View Postsignal11th, on 01 June 2018 - 11:05 AM, said:

 

So what? the Leo is very bad and this being better just makes it bad so... it's still bad I watched a few people play it and it just looks pretty mediocre. Basically sit at the back and snipe until you get spotted then you're dead. Oh and I forgot it looks S5it.

 

1. The Leo is not that bad.

 

2. The K-91 is quite a bit better than it and with these buffs is probably up there with the middling pack of tier 10s.

 

3. I find playing tanks that are a bit different and have a different playstyle more interesting than playing the same old meta OP tanks.

 

4. Why the hell are you even bothering commenting when you have no interest in the tank and haven't even played it? 



TankkiPoju #12 Posted 01 June 2018 - 11:23 AM

    Lieutenant General

  • Player
  • 20014 battles
  • 6,192
  • Member since:
    05-20-2011
I just don't want to grind yet another Russian tier 10 medium tank...

signal11th #13 Posted 01 June 2018 - 11:29 AM

    Major General

  • Player
  • 35429 battles
  • 5,477
  • [T-D-U] T-D-U
  • Member since:
    07-14-2011

View PostSimeon85, on 01 June 2018 - 10:21 AM, said:

 

1. The Leo is not that bad.

 

2. The K-91 is quite a bit better than it and with these buffs is probably up there with the middling pack of tier 10s.

 

3. I find playing tanks that are a bit different and have a different playstyle more interesting than playing the same old meta OP tanks.

 

4. Why the hell are you even bothering commenting when you have no interest in the tank and haven't even played it? 

 

what exactly is different about it playstyle wise? Why not use any of the other 100 Russian meds that enable you to use every playstyle not just one or two? Seriously I'm getting bored of Russian tanks or the amount of them when so many other lines need looking at.

Edited by signal11th, 01 June 2018 - 11:30 AM.


Balc0ra #14 Posted 01 June 2018 - 11:30 AM

    Field Marshal

  • Player
  • 64429 battles
  • 15,448
  • [WALL] WALL
  • Member since:
    07-10-2012

Tbh, I hate the current 430 II. I loved the 416 one tier down due to the support role it can do. 430 II they wanted to be a brawler with a rear turret and 201 pen if you wanted DPM. That works on the T-54, less so when you have limited turret traverse too. So the armor that is mostly rendered useless in most fights. As it's rear turreted, and if the ground is never 100% flat vs your target, or there is a ridge line. That lower or upper plate will take a few hits before you even get your gun on target. I feel it's not working for the style I want to have in aggressive med tanks. As it's more like a Lowe that can hold a corner with it's side armor vs pushing it. But not many med lines have those. So mine spends more time reversing up aiming over it's side to use the turret armor, then attacking head on. 

 

Don't get me wrong. The armor has saved me vs even a HT head on at times when on low HP even. But not that many times I would take it over the higher pen and a support/bully role the 416 exceled at. So.. if it now works as a support med, and has great pen, losts some armor due to it. I'll take it. But I had hoped for a mobility buff due to the lower armor values, as that's what it needs to do said role. 



ExistanceUK #15 Posted 01 June 2018 - 12:43 PM

    Corporal

  • Player
  • 14438 battles
  • 149
  • Member since:
    08-29-2015

If you buff the Leo 1's gun you'd need to change all the other L7 105 derived guns on many other tanks as well (not a bad thing given the general power creep) e.g. the tier 9 and 10 Centurions need some love as well (they swap mobility for a bit of unreliable turret armour Vs the equivalent Leo). 

 

On the 430-II I really like it, yeah sometimes the turret and lack of gun depression are a pain but most of the time you can play around it. Many times I have gone to the heavy brawling spot, side scrapped and bounce like a boss. If you didn't like it now then the changes to it aren't going to make it any better, if anything it loses what advantages it had and didn't really gain anything in return. 

 

 



FluffyRedFox #16 Posted 01 June 2018 - 01:32 PM

    General

  • Player
  • 22619 battles
  • 8,109
  • [LEWD] LEWD
  • Member since:
    12-05-2012
I quite like the new obj430ii, although I do wish that they gave it a similar gun depression buff to the sides of the tank like the K-91, it still feels like its -3/-4 and is even more awkward to play thanks to the worse armour.

Simeon85 #17 Posted 01 June 2018 - 01:44 PM

    Captain

  • Player
  • 1097 battles
  • 2,297
  • Member since:
    04-19-2013

View Postsignal11th, on 01 June 2018 - 11:29 AM, said:

 

what exactly is different about it playstyle wise? Why not use any of the other 100 Russian meds that enable you to use every playstyle not just one or two? Seriously I'm getting bored of Russian tanks or the amount of them when so many other lines need looking at.

 

It's a tier 10 Obj. 416, probably one of the most unique mediums in the game.

 

Also like STB-1, Fatton, Cent AX and 30b are all different nations but very similar tanks. 



Element6_TheSprout #18 Posted 01 June 2018 - 01:52 PM

    Field Marshal

  • Player
  • 29043 battles
  • 10,356
  • [T-D-U] T-D-U
  • Member since:
    01-06-2013
Thanks for the heads up, about 130k to go. It's time to bring out those reserves again.

Jumping_TurtIe #19 Posted 01 June 2018 - 01:58 PM

    Warrant Officer

  • Player
  • 6100 battles
  • 824
  • [T-D-U] T-D-U
  • Member since:
    02-26-2015
Any idea when that patch is going live ?

Simeon85 #20 Posted 01 June 2018 - 01:59 PM

    Captain

  • Player
  • 1097 battles
  • 2,297
  • Member since:
    04-19-2013

View PostFluffyRedFox, on 01 June 2018 - 01:32 PM, said:

I quite like the new obj430ii, although I do wish that they gave it a similar gun depression buff to the sides of the tank like the K-91, it still feels like its -3/-4 and is even more awkward to play thanks to the worse armour.

 

I'm fine with the changes to the 430v2 to make it more like the 416 and K-91 for this 'line familiarity' WG seem obsessed with but to so heavily nerf it's armour and then only get little DPM, aim time and penetration buffs seems a crappy trade. 





Also tagged with a heads up

1 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users