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Looking for decent tier VIII medium tank


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Getern #1 Posted 04 June 2018 - 06:45 AM

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Hello there,
I am about to buy one of the tier VIII medium tanks. The most important thing for me is gun handling. Although I can sacriface that for a reliable turret armor.
From whats in the shop I am interested in something along the lines of:
- Pz 58 Mutz - I cant tell how turret performs, gun seems to have decent gun handling. I used to love Indien Panzer but that 30mm on side kind of fights me off since I like to have some occasional sidescrapping;
- FV4202 - Turret seems to be okay, while I tested that one on Test Server but I do not have comparison to other picks. Gun seems to have decent handling, dispersions are a little wierd. Although shoting was quite pleasant;
- Ripper Patton - usually I would go for it, mostly becasue its a Patton. But the turrent at least on paper isnt twice as realiable as Pershng's turret is. Also penetration may cause a lot of gold firing;
- T26E5 Patriot - I know its heavy and I ve never played it but it took my interest. Does it perform as medium mobility wise? 
- T25 Pilot - Not avaliable currently but on paper it seems to have best stats for my kind of player. Great turret, very nice gun handling. I could use american medium for Patton's crew training. Should I wait for it?

I am hoping for opinions from experienced players who values gun handling and hull-down strat just like me.

Edited by Getern, 04 June 2018 - 06:47 AM.


Aim_Away_From_Face #2 Posted 04 June 2018 - 06:57 AM

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Mutz - It's all about maneuverability, turret is okay-ish but I wouldnt rely on it, hull is cheese. Gun is decent but can be a little trolly sometimes.

FV4202 - Probably the best fit for your wants. Great gun with high pen, RoF and handling. Slowish machine but the turret armour makes it good for ridges. 

Patton KR - Garbage in my opinion. Hull and turret get penned by almost anything tier 7 without gold. Depression is good but gun is derpy which makes it just horrible to play, looks cool though. 

T26E5 - Good option. Not medium as you said but its okay on maneuverability. Gun fires APCR standard which is nice for shell velocity but it's not very accurate. Sadly even this has been power crept recently and armour is very unreliable. 

T25 Pilot - Simply not worth the money. There's a reason they literally gave it away in a marathon. Gun is good, turret is junk.despite what numbers might say. 

 

You should be thinking Super Pershing even now mate. It's been pretty immune to power creep thanks to it's armour relying on spaced armour instead of thickness, so all the gold spam just gets eaten up. 



tank276 #3 Posted 04 June 2018 - 07:16 AM

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From the above options, Patriot all the way.

If you want to take a true medium (for missions or such), hmmmmmm , from the 4 choices FV 4202 as a first (u could wait theoratically for Centurion 5/1) and Mutz as second.

I dont have the T25 Pilot, but I hear it is mediocre.



SuperOlsson #4 Posted 04 June 2018 - 07:39 AM

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I don’t recommend any of the above, if you need a medium tier 8, go for lorr 40t or M4 Rev. Though the best imo is progetto, it is faster and has way better gun handling than Mutz, with 720 burst damage on top of that (with the ~same, non-existent armour)

 

Btw Mutz is a very bad tank in current meta, bad gun handling, low hp and no armour, at least it has half-decent mobility but horrible tank traverse speed.


Edited by SuperOlsson, 04 June 2018 - 07:47 AM.


panter22 #5 Posted 04 June 2018 - 08:29 AM

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USSR tanks are the best it was made in russia and by WG OP tanks the rest are garbage

iztok #6 Posted 04 June 2018 - 08:42 AM

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> Looking for decent tier VIII medium tank

Good you asked for a decent one, because a good one doesn't exist. :(



CircleOfSorrow #7 Posted 04 June 2018 - 08:47 AM

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View PostSuperOlsson, on 04 June 2018 - 06:39 AM, said:

I don’t recommend any of the above, if you need a medium tier 8, go for lorr 40t or M4 Rev. Though the best imo is progetto, it is faster and has way better gun handling than Mutz, with 720 burst damage on top of that (with the ~same, non-existent armour)

 

Btw Mutz is a very bad tank in current meta, bad gun handling, low hp and no armour, at least it has half-decent mobility but horrible tank traverse speed.

 

Do you ever find the lack of pen on the Ravioli's standard round troublesome?



Karasu_Hidesuke #8 Posted 04 June 2018 - 09:10 AM

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View Postpanter22, on 04 June 2018 - 07:29 AM, said:

USSR tanks are the best it was made in russia and by WG OP tanks the rest are garbage

 

Well, then there is always the T-54 1st prototype. Don't own one  myself, been tempted though at times.

SuperOlsson #9 Posted 04 June 2018 - 09:25 AM

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View PostCircleOfSorrow, on 04 June 2018 - 08:47 AM, said:

 

Do you ever find the lack of pen on the Ravioli's standard round troublesome?

Haven’t actually played it myself, just recommending it based on opinions of other people and by seeing it on livestreams on twitch ^^

 

But really, 390 alpha with better  gun handling than many 240 alpha meds while having some mobility, how bad can it be? :p


Edited by SuperOlsson, 04 June 2018 - 09:26 AM.


tank276 #10 Posted 04 June 2018 - 09:27 AM

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View PostSuperOlsson, on 04 June 2018 - 08:25 AM, said:

Haven’t actually played it myself, just recommending it based on opinions of other people and by seeing it on livestreams on twitch ^^

 

But really, 390 alpha with better  gun handling than many 240 alpha meds while having some mobility, how bad can it be? :p

 

Yeah dude, and that shell velocity the Ravioli has is just phenomenal.

Lomion_EU #11 Posted 04 June 2018 - 09:32 AM

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View PostSuperOlsson, on 04 June 2018 - 08:25 AM, said:

Haven’t actually played it myself, just recommending it based on opinions of other people and by seeing it on livestreams on twitch ^^

 

But really, 390 alpha with better  gun handling than many 240 alpha meds while having some mobility, how bad can it be? :p

 

No armour to speak of you need to play it with long lines of sight to use the shell velocoty and avoid getting shot back.  Think of it as a Sherman Firefly at tier 8.

Aikl #12 Posted 04 June 2018 - 09:45 AM

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View PostGetern, on 04 June 2018 - 05:45 AM, said:

(...)
- T26E5 Patriot - I know its heavy and I ve never played it but it took my interest. Does it perform as medium mobility wise? 
(...)

 

It's actually much closer to a T8 medium than you might think. The armor lends it far more staying power, but otherwise suffers from the exact same issues as a T8 medium. That includes the penetration. Penetration mechanics means that the Patriot's gun is just about the same as your average 212mm-pen gun in most actual situations (i.e. it's better on flat/near-flat plates, but most plates that you'll shoot at are much thinner than that flat, or angled).

 

Generally wouldn't recommend any T8 premium tank, though. It would be OK if T8 was fun to play. Unless you're really into "diversity" (and by that I mean bending over harder than Germany in 1945), it really isn't.

Even if this is not a lot of money to you, consider whether Wargaming 'deserves' it or not.

 

It's kind of funny if you think about it. You pay €30-40 to grind credits for a grind - a grind where you hardly have any fun ~80% of the time due to matchmaker and the game itself. The credits go towards a grind with a nonexistent 'endgame'. The only 'endgame' is that the top-tier tanks get powercrept every four months or so. It's a rat-race that doesn't pay off.

To top it off, T10 is really overrated. T10-only matches are not a lot of fun, T9/10-matches are quite rare and T8/9/10-matches is just sealclubbing. Funny once in a while, becomes stale quickly.

 

Have fun making credits by feeding BobjectV4s and Type 5s.

 

 

View PostAim_Away_From_Face, on 04 June 2018 - 05:57 AM, said:

(...)

T26E5 - Good option. Not medium as you said but its okay on maneuverability. Gun fires APCR standard which is nice for shell velocity but it's not very accurate. Sadly even this has been power crept recently and armour is very unreliable. 

(...)

 

Shell velocity isn't great either, despite what it looks like. APCR on the Patriot is a balancing parameter. Little else. It gets 1021m/s shell velocity. Quite a few other T8s gets 1000m/s. Workable, sure, but not worth the inferior performance of APCR.

The real kicker is how the premium APCR gets the same shell velocity. I.e. you're stuck without a high-velocity shell, and still kind of crappy penetration. 

 

Of course, it's just fine in this context - this is T8 mediums we're talking about.

 

 

View Postiztok, on 04 June 2018 - 07:42 AM, said:

> Looking for decent tier VIII medium tank

Good you asked for a decent one, because a good one doesn't exist. :(

 

Harr, my thought exactly. Lorraine's pretty dec- oh, darnit.

 

View PostCircleOfSorrow, on 04 June 2018 - 07:47 AM, said:

 

Do you ever find the lack of pen on the Ravioli's standard round troublesome?

 

Revolvér arguably falls between two chairs when it sees T9/10. It's hardly a scout/flanker. On the other hand, if you're forced into matchmaking where your penetration and armor is worthless the Revolvér is not that much worse than most other T8s. It's not like you even can scout or flank on most maps anyway.



Headless_Rooster #13 Posted 04 June 2018 - 09:59 AM

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View PostBrowarszky, on 04 June 2018 - 09:10 AM, said:

 

Well, then there is always the T-54 1st prototype. Don't own one  myself, been tempted though at times.

 

Mod - 1 has slightly better armour than the T44-100 but I didn't notice it. T44-100 has better gun n view range and mobility, seems far superior in battle.

Somnorila #14 Posted 04 June 2018 - 11:05 AM

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Mutz may be good enough, i don't have any experience with it but if it's anything like Panther 8.8 than no.

Fv4202 is ok but not something i could recommend to spend money on. Patriot is ok too, not my first choice for a HT as i don't really feel that it's as good as the hype made it to be.

I don't know the Ripper Patton but i guess is something like Pilot, a worse image of Pershing. Same gun similar mobility way crappier turret.

 

I for one would propose the Super Pershing. It's good enough, wouldn't be afraid to go against Patriot in it as i feel they are pretty similar in regards of resilience and gun and it's also a MT not a HT. If you compare them you will see differences where Patriot is better but you have to keep in consideration that the armor shown doesn't take in consideration spaced armor and layers. Also the fact that SP has preferential MM and it will be buffed if the preferential MM will be removed.



Somnorila #15 Posted 04 June 2018 - 11:08 AM

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View PostCircleOfSorrow, on 04 June 2018 - 08:47 AM, said:

 

Do you ever find the lack of pen on the Ravioli's standard round troublesome?

 

I don't. But i don't agree with his comparison either as 40t is way above Ravioli, they are not in the same league to be compared.

Somnorila #16 Posted 04 June 2018 - 11:12 AM

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View Posttank276, on 04 June 2018 - 09:27 AM, said:

 

Yeah dude, and that shell velocity the Ravioli has is just phenomenal.

 

If you hit and penetrate... Is not so good for sniping so going mid to close support seems better, to use allies as shell sponges and having your alpha turn enemies in to victims for your allies. Like i said above, 40t is in another league, play style can be somewhat similar but where 40t can get in and out from positions faster, can do better at sniping and can totally destroy enemies as support, hell it can even go scout hunting entirely alone.

vasilinhorulezz #17 Posted 04 June 2018 - 11:13 AM

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Patriot is the best tier 8 medium,

decent mobility, good gun, workable armor.

Loraine is also good,

Lowe is good,

Revolarise is good, because of big alpha with low ammo costs,

FV is decent (gun soft stats make it worse mostly).



Balc0ra #18 Posted 04 June 2018 - 11:26 AM

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View PostGetern, on 04 June 2018 - 06:45 AM, said:

 T25 Pilot - Not avaliable currently but on paper it seems to have best stats for my kind of player. Great turret, very nice gun handling. I could use american medium for Patton's crew training. Should I wait for it?

 

Nooooo. It's the worst one there trust me. Mantle is as strong as the Ripper Patton, but the rest of the turret is butter, and the hull more so. Hull down over a ridge line the Pilots cheeks are 100mm. The Ripper Patton at least pushes 180, same on the hull. So when top tier the armor at least works. That and the power to weight is terrible vs it. So it's slow even tho the top speed is higher. As it has almost 300 HP less on the engine. The common bad thing about both is the slow AP shell speed. So you need to lead much on moving targets. I'll pick the Ripper over that any day. 192 pen might not be ideal, but it's still 2mm more then the Pershing. 

 

4202 is the 3rd tank there I own. I don't have the others. I don't hate it. The issue is that tier 8 meds tier for tier are generally the weakest in a line. And the Cent 1 one such tier 8 IMO, mostly due to the gun. 4202 is the same. Pen is great, and dispersion is good. But dpm vs alpha leaves it below the rest. 230 vs 240 on the US meds. And a slower reload. It's still a decent support med. But in a 1 on 1 you have to rely on your armor and not your dpm. So there it's tbh better off if you have a ride line vs the Patton. In the open on flat ground, you will have to trade most of your HP to get ouf of it sadly. 

 

 



CptBarney #19 Posted 04 June 2018 - 11:30 AM

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The t54 mod 1 isnt so bad but its sluggish and has a low amount of ammo.

WindSplitter1 #20 Posted 04 June 2018 - 12:59 PM

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T-44-100

 

Seriously, I wouldn't get a medium, unless it's a heavy medium.






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