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(Sh)italian "tanks"?


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Landsverk #1 Posted 07 June 2018 - 01:19 AM

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my absolutely worst performing tanks of all tier 2, 3, 4, 5 and 6 are all Italian (and i have played quite a few tanks in those tiers so it cant be a coincidence.. nor just a bad player! :) )

only reason the other tiers worst tank aint italian is most likely because i havent played them yet!!

 

how horrible are other players experience of there italian tanks vs there non italian of same tier i wonder?


Edited by Landsverk, 07 June 2018 - 01:19 AM.


Aconerz #2 Posted 07 June 2018 - 08:23 AM

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The T4 is not bad when played with HE rounds, they work quite well due to the high pen.

 

T5 and T6 weren't fun to play at all.

 

T7 is quite nice so far but I only had a few matches till now.

 

But I don't think they are performing so bad in general, you only have to play them like a medium heavy tank and/or support tank.

I think a minor buff in the accuracy would make them very nice to play as a 2nd line supporter.

 



Shacou #3 Posted 07 June 2018 - 01:09 PM

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Fun begins from T7, it's very mobile and gets V. Stab. T6 has good gun, but thats about it, the platform isn't as good. T5 is very nice at sidescraping and peeking over hills.

Edited by Shacou, 07 June 2018 - 01:10 PM.


Grohpancer #4 Posted 11 June 2018 - 06:13 PM

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View PostLandsverk, on 07 June 2018 - 01:19 AM, said:

my absolutely worst performing tanks of all tier 2, 3, 4, 5 and 6 are all Italian (and i have played quite a few tanks in those tiers so it cant be a coincidence.. nor just a bad player! :) )

only reason the other tiers worst tank aint italian is most likely because i havent played them yet!!

 

how horrible are other players experience of there italian tanks vs there non italian of same tier i wonder?

 

I'll bet that You play with not trained on 100% crew...

Sindragosa_ #5 Posted 15 June 2018 - 08:21 AM

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Tier 4 26/40 is great with HE, and I could see it easily becoming new tier 4 seal clubbing vehicle, because when top tier it also has quite nice armor. That said I dont play to seal club :D , just wanna point out that 50 sloped armor and 70 pen on HE on tier 4 is really stronk.

 

Tier 5 is I'd say quite a mediocre tank for its tier. Its more like a "heavy medium" tank, because its quite slow for a medium (P26/40 from which this prototype comes was designed as heavy tank), but it has 80 sloped hull armor which is slighty more than ye olde KV-1, and 80 armor on top turret. When top tier armor is quite nice and effective against enemy mediums or poor tier4s. To even increase armor effectiveness you can ofc angle and use amazing -10 gun depression over the hills. + Armor can even troll tier6 meds especially on longer range. "Small" problem of this tank is gun selection and its quite awful top gun. DPM is again mediocre, but 118 pen on the top gun is little dissapointing and basic accuracy of 0,41 is just wtf when trying to snipe - but again accuracy in WoT is so RNG based that I had a battle where I managed to hit like 6 snapshots on medium range in a row. Also gun handling of top guns is quite awful. Its OK tier 5 medium with decent armor, but its also nothing super amazing.

 

Tier 6 has Id say only one thing, and that is 240 alpha damage. I think its even more sluggish than P43, and has even worse actual accuracy and gun handling. It also has the same armor like tier5 while being a tier higher, and the shell velocity is so slow that egyptians could build a whole pyramid faster before your shell hits your target. It looks like a good tank on paper but in reality its usable maybe as pizza delivery car.

 

Tier 7 is again id say OK, quite a mediocre medium. Its finally fast, while having decent armor that can bounce when you are top tier (just like with P43 ;)  ).  240 alpha with decent DPM, but gun isnt the best, just like on tier6. Bad shell velocity, bad accuracy. That said tier 7 and tier 8 mediums in general are nothing amazing, but from T7 meds id say Comet is best, if you can spam gold and play it with food.

 

Tier 8 is where the fun starts with the "semi-automatic" guns. I dont yet have pantera, but I have premium spaghetto, and in my opinion its one of best, if not the best tier 8 mediums.

 

I dont yet have t9 or 10, but because of that semi-automatic system you can have more oportunities than standart autoloader, but also less potential to for example clip somebody, because it has 360 alpha damage. Tier10 is also quite large profile (but really handsome tank :D  ) I watched my favourite unicorn driving tier10, and he said thats its OK tank with decent gun, hull armor can bounce shots because it has insane slope but turret is paper, but then he said that to have really good high damage he needed to be lucky and to have long battles.

 

My plan is to keep tier5 because I think its like T34/85 M on tier 5, and then grind tier 10 - but italian tier10 is not on my high tier priority list right now.


Edited by Duce_Anchovy_, 15 June 2018 - 08:27 AM.


Landsverk #6 Posted 24 June 2018 - 11:42 PM

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View PostGrohpancer, on 11 June 2018 - 06:13 PM, said:

 

I'll bet that You play with not trained on 100% crew...

 

then i win that bet in case of the Bis, its 67% on the first perk, as for the lower tiers ofc not! (i guess, i havent checked, and it dont matter much bec i dont and wont play them often enough for the crew to become that high skilled... duuuh :) (and the same goes for most of my other tanks of the same tiers so crew % is not really the issue since they are in most ceases even worse trained)



Kothaar #7 Posted 05 July 2018 - 08:22 AM

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The constant reload on the tier 8 tank is a nice gimmick, but it is still a very inaccurate 90 mm gun on a tier 8 tank, when everybody else gets a 105 mm gun as the second choice. Having three - slowly - reloading shots is not that nice when 1 or 2 of those shots always miss and with an unlucky roll damage from a single shot may go under 200 points.

Just what is this tank meant for? It cannot snipe, at close range it is penetrated by every shot, it can be killed by 3 shots from other tier 8 tanks while it needs from six to nine penetrating shots to destroy others.


Today I surprised a T92 arty: it has 500 hit points. Needed three shots to destroy it.


Edited by Kothaar, 05 July 2018 - 08:25 AM.


geoff99 #8 Posted 09 July 2018 - 01:46 PM

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View PostKothaar, on 05 July 2018 - 07:22 AM, said:



Just what is this tank meant for? It cannot snipe, at close range it is penetrated by every shot, it can be killed by 3 shots from other tier 8 tanks while it needs from six to nine penetrating shots to destroy others.

 

I agree its not an easy tank to play. Its upsides are its speed, reasonable view range, reasonable accuracy and burst damage. Downsides are armour (none), meh gun depression and mediocre alpha.

 

So how do you make that work?

 - keep your distance, don't brawl

 - don't snapshot, wait for gun to fully aim

 - use food if you can afford it

 - you'll get ammo-racked a lot. you'll need to be patient and hide/snipe to make sure your repair kit is back on line before you venture out again

 - try not to get spotted; make sure you use bushes and only fire 15m behind them, only fire when you have hard cover or a ridge to fall behind; don't wait for SS to go off, retreat as soon as you've fired

- keep an eye on reload to maximise effective damage

- use your speed to relocate regularly; make sure you retreat as soon as there's any risk of being over-run or flanked

- either snipe or act as a support medium; don't scout aggressively if there's a risk you might be isolated

- protect your hp in early/mid game so that you can take the odd hit late game to eliminate isolated red tanks with 700 or fewer hp

 

 

 

 



Veka26 #9 Posted 14 July 2018 - 01:25 PM

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I enjoyed playing Italians, skipped to tier 6 with free xp. I also used free xp to get the best guns on tiers 6, 7 and 8, 9 was perfectly grindable with stock gun which is same as the Progetto 46 gun.

I would never call the line crap, in fact it was one of the easiest grinds for me in this game.

Tier 6 is a bit slow but great alpha for tier 6 MT and ok DPM make it fun.

Tier 7 was very fun for me, great mobility and viewrange, decent gun.

Tier 8 is for sure the best 230-250 alpha T8 MT I played

Tier 9 is amazing, just a better version of Leo PTA which was one of my favorite tanks, but with better gun handling and autoreloader which makes it fun to play and more worth to risk exposure in this paper tank since you can do a burst of 1080 DMG. Highest WR and DPG of all my tier 9 tanks.

 

Looking forward to playing tier 10 later, just bought it.



Steeleye_Spam #10 Posted 21 July 2018 - 06:53 PM

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not sure what you were doing wrong with the T4 - its going to be my best tank at that tier (and that's something taking into account the Chinese TD and the Matilda). Low tier you have a good enough AP cannon, top tier you can just murder everything with HE.

Nemenyi #11 Posted 22 July 2018 - 03:44 PM

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How do you play the T10 Prosecco 65?

It has a burst damage of around 1400. However, using this once will lead you into an extremely long reload for all shells and your DPM will drop significantly. I am often at a point, where I need to decide 'shoot' or 'wait'. This makes the Prosecco quite difficult to play.

On the other hand, I am wondering whether to use optics or vents (having rammer and vstab set). Currently I use optics with 465m view range,  but I am frequently struggling with the long reload. Vents would improve that, but view range would drop to 420m.

Lanrefni #12 Posted 22 July 2018 - 07:33 PM

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Everything up until T8 is trash.

Hasn't the Czech MT line taught you anything?



Kothaar #13 Posted 24 July 2018 - 09:03 AM

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Example of the "quality" of P.44 Pantera from today: fight starts well, I destroy an overly aggressive T34 with four shots (other shot at it too of course). And then: the gun simply stops performing. Out of 11 subsequent shots nine hit with ONE penetration, on a Progetto 46. Five dings on Strv S1 when normally that tank is easy to destroy, even with tier 6 medium tank guns. Hit on the side on a T-10 - no damage. Pretty frustrating. Ordinarily when the RNG starts acting up the cure is to shoot HE so you at least cause some damage. But the 90 mm gun in the Pantera is useless with HE.

Edited by Kothaar, 24 July 2018 - 09:03 AM.


geoff99 #14 Posted 24 July 2018 - 01:48 PM

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I've just finished my p44 grind. I think the tank is ok but it can't carry and is affected by the mm and is very team dependent. I had an amazing loss streak in the second half of the grind and there was nothing I could do about it. T9 meds don't have this problem and are much more resilient.

 

I'm now on the standard b. I have the top gun and turret so far and hope to have tracks and engine by the weekend. Tank curves suggest this tank is very strong so I'm looking forward to playing lots more games with it.



Kothaar #15 Posted 24 July 2018 - 05:29 PM

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Pantera and the previous tier tank have very  clearly been designed as repair kit eaters. They usually receive a critical hit on ammo or track from the first hits in the battle, and after that you are either fighting in a very slowly loading and moving tank or you have to burn a repair kit.

Edited by Kothaar, 24 July 2018 - 05:29 PM.


Kothaar #16 Posted 24 July 2018 - 05:34 PM

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I actually had the lowest win rating ever in any tank after a decent number of battles in P. 43 ter, winrate dropped down to 39 %. The tank itself cannot win battles, and when you get a streak of teams where peoples idea of winning the battle is sending one tank forward while keeping 14 tanks behind to shoot anything that one tank happens to spot, you are having a pretty bad time.

I was playing with extra exp, premium time etc. and calculated that the crap luck streak lengthened my agony of playing that tank for couple of days at least. It felt like a present from heaven when I finally got a few wins and the tank suddenly earned couple thousand exp from a single battle.

Edited by Kothaar, 24 July 2018 - 05:34 PM.


Desyatnik_Pansy #17 Posted 29 July 2018 - 12:48 AM

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View PostKothaar, on 24 July 2018 - 09:03 AM, said:

Five dings on Strv S1 when normally that tank is easy to destroy, even with tier 6 medium tank guns.

 

Pantera can't overmatch the Strv as it uses a 90mm, so that's not surprising. You can overmatch his cupola (but lol good look hitting that unless you're facehugging it) or actually penetrate the whole of his tank pretty much if he overangles himself, though basically if he's pointing towards you at all, that's not going to happen and is so almost never going to work in most situations. Dunno what Tier VI Medium tank guns you're going on about since none of them have the calibre to overmatch anyway, with the only ones really being able to really pen it frontally being the M4A3E2/E8 Using the 105mm or the VK 30.01 (P) Using the 10.5cm, since they can use HEAT, but they then don't have the pen to reliably go through it anyway.



Kothaar #18 Posted 29 July 2018 - 11:00 PM

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View PostDesyatnik_Pansy, on 29 July 2018 - 12:48 AM, said:

 

Pantera can't overmatch the Strv as it uses a 90mm, so that's not surprising. You can overmatch his cupola (but lol good look hitting that unless you're facehugging it) or actually penetrate the whole of his tank pretty much if he overangles himself, though basically if he's pointing towards you at all, that's not going to happen and is so almost never going to work in most situations. Dunno what Tier VI Medium tank guns you're going on about since none of them have the calibre to overmatch anyway, with the only ones really being able to really pen it frontally being the M4A3E2/E8 Using the 105mm or the VK 30.01 (P) Using the 10.5cm, since they can use HEAT, but they then don't have the pen to reliably go through it anyway.


I gather you are shooting at tanks frontally. Bad idea.

Kothaar #19 Posted 29 July 2018 - 11:01 PM

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Just got the tier 9, first impression: finally a gun that will penetrate reliably. At least by the standards of this game.

Desyatnik_Pansy #20 Posted 30 July 2018 - 02:54 PM

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View PostKothaar, on 29 July 2018 - 11:00 PM, said:

I gather you are shooting at tanks frontally. Bad idea.

 

I gathered that's what you were doing given the alleged dings. The only two other explainable reasons for them would've been that, instead of hitting the actual side, your shots were hitting the front plate from the side or you were hitting the side still angled at like 70 Degrees.






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