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How to improve my horrible skill?


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bravo229 #1 Posted 22 July 2018 - 07:06 PM

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Hi everyone,

 

So I am not exactly what you would call a good player. My overall WN8 is about 575 at the moment.
( https://nl.wot-life....o229-513377569/ )

Although I did get a lot more blue/purple games in the past when I still played in a clan. I have nearly 10k battles at the moment, but I did make the huge mistake to start grinding for the leopard 1 when I just started playing. So a large part of the low WN8 is still from back in the days. I know my maps, weakspots etc, but I'm somhow still struggling.

 

I play mostly mediums I have the progetto 46, leopard 1, cromwell and very recently picked up the t62a. I do have the is-3, but I kinda struggle with having armour even more then with having absolutely none.

 

I'll upload some random replays of recent matches in a sec. Do you have some tips/comments on how I could try to improve? I feel like I should be able to play better by now.

 

EDIT:

T62A:

http://wotreplays.eu...93cd11c55529b87

Progetto 46:

http://wotreplays.eu...93cd11c55529b87

http://wotreplays.eu/site/4457606


Edited by bravo229, 22 July 2018 - 11:41 PM.


Suurpolskija #2 Posted 22 July 2018 - 07:36 PM

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Those links don't show any replays for me. Are they hidden? 

Geralt_z_Rivii365 #3 Posted 22 July 2018 - 08:19 PM

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Fire more gold ammo only to compensate for the lack of skill.

Isharial #4 Posted 22 July 2018 - 08:56 PM

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View Postbravo229, on 22 July 2018 - 07:06 PM, said:

Hi everyone,

 

So I am not exactly what you would call a good player. My overall WN8 is about 575 at the moment.
( https://nl.wot-life....o229-513377569/ )

Although I did get a lot more blue/purple games in the past when I still played in a clan. I have nearly 10k battles at the moment, but I did make the huge mistake to start grinding for the leopard 1 when I just started playing. So a large part of the low WN8 is still from back in the days. I know my maps, weakspots etc, but I'm somhow still struggling.

 

I play mostly mediums I have the progetto 46, leopard 1, cromwell and very recently picked up the t62a. I do have the is-3, but I kinda struggle with having armour even more then with having absolutely none.

 

I'll upload some random replays of recent matches in a sec. Do you have some tips/comments on how I could try to improve? I feel like I should be able to play better by now.

 

EDIT:

T62A:

http://wotreplays.eu...-bravo229-t-62a

Progetto 46:

http://wotreplays.eu...etto_m35_mod_46

 

ask yourself: are these tanks for me?

 

progetto, crom, leo.. they all require skills, they all require knowledge of your enemy and the map you play on. they also require decent crew skills to play well. (more than TD or heavy would, but less than lights)

 

what crew have you got? equipment? these things make or break it at T8+ and arguably, even T6+ require it almost as much.

 

you play mostly mediums, but are they really for you? what would you say you were? cautious? aggressive? passive? calm? these things show what tanks you'll do well with and those you wont. 

 

 

you recently picked up the T62A? you have so far 10 battles, but only 900 DPG.. that alone suggests you either 1) don't fit mediums, 2) have poor crew and/or 3) haven't set the tank up.

look at it and think "what could I do to make this better?"

at TX, id be looking to use a 4+ skill crew and nothing lower, simply because TX is where the long standing players are. you wont stand a chance with 1 skill and 50% 2nd... 

have you got it set up? equipment, camo etc..?

 

ill play T6 with minimum 2 skills, T7 must be 2-3, t8 must be 3+ and T9 atleast 4 just to put it in perspective. if your running as said, a TX with a 2 skill crew, that wont help you at all

 

personally id stop using the other tanks and try and get the Cromwell damage and winrate up. currently you do 524 DPG, which is terrible for a T6 tank. try and get close to the 1000 mark, and when you can do that often, move up a tier and do it with the comet (so 1.2k~) then T8 etc.. etc..

 

if you try to improve at TX, it'll take you longer, cost you more, and generally wont be very fun for you imo

 

 

I also don't know how you managed to afford 2 TX in 10k games.. if you didn't buy some silver.. you must be running tanks with net + bino's and no other equipment... if so, that's your major problem..

ive only managed to afford 1 in almost 19k games...

 

 

 


Edited by Isharial, 22 July 2018 - 08:58 PM.


UrQuan #5 Posted 22 July 2018 - 09:13 PM

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As you seem to enjoy meds, you could look into the t-34 & t-34-85, they're both strong mediums for their tier & can help you ease into the harder to play medium tanks. The Cromwell is a good one as well, but needs a different playstyle then the two I mentioned (has no armor & the gun handling is worse) & hence more game knowledge needed to make it good.

As noted by Isharial, map knowledge & tank knowledge matters alot for mediums, so my advice would be to hang around tier 5 & tier 6, learn the maps & find spots where your tank does well with the team setups in mind (what works as toptier might not work as bottomtier, what works in a medium tank filled game might not work in a TD filled game, etc etc)

Bonus of sticking around tier 5 & tier 6 is that your crew will also be gaining skills & become better, improving your tank as well.

 

Edit: noticed you got the hellcat. While classed as a TD, it tends to play like a paper med, so it does seem you are struggling with paper tanks in general, so perhaps you are missing some knowledge about camo-rating, bushplay & viewrange usage?

I can't really help with that, as my knowledge on that is rather basic, due to my heavy play in HT's. But a general advice I can give is to check out the wiki on those, see if you can learn things about it.

 

PS: can't access your replays, I suspect you got them hidden by accident? Making them public could help us alot in identifying what is holding you back in playing these tanks.


Edited by UrQuan, 22 July 2018 - 09:27 PM.


Cuck0osNest #6 Posted 22 July 2018 - 09:24 PM

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Ok, first, start using RR, it is more informative and balanced. 

Second, just find some interest towards victory, I recommend watching my videos


Edited by Cuck0osNest, 22 July 2018 - 09:40 PM.


kaneloon #7 Posted 22 July 2018 - 09:45 PM

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I'll try some advice :

Watch the map. Every 30s you watch it. Think of where you will have more use. Meds are made for support, for changing places.

Try new places, yours don't seem to work (watch replays or streamers, asking yourself why they went there).

Don't commit suicide : you know that climbing top of a hill at 14min in front of all the enemy team is a bad idea.

Look who the enemy is aiming, if he has fired.

When you success a shot and you are spotted : hide, move, make you forget.

You have to KNOW that everywhere there are enemy hidden tds and arties ready to shoot you : be careful.

Try some snapshots while driving : you'll be surprised how many hits.

If you are tired, have no fun, if nothing works : don't insist, it is not the time to play.



Joggaman #8 Posted 22 July 2018 - 09:55 PM

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View PostCuck0osNest, on 22 July 2018 - 10:24 PM, said:

Ok, first, start using RR, it is more informative and balanced. 

Second, just find some interest towards victory, I recommend watching my videos

 

First I thought :teethhappy: , but then :facepalm:

bravo229 #9 Posted 22 July 2018 - 11:26 PM

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Seems like that was the wrong link. It should work now.

 

View PostIsharial, on 22 July 2018 - 07:56 PM, said:

ask yourself: are these tanks for me?

 

progetto, crom, leo.. they all require skills, they all require knowledge of your enemy and the map you play on. they also require decent crew skills to play well. (more than TD or heavy would, but less than lights)

 

What crew have you got? equipment? these things make or break it at T8+ and arguably, even T6+ require it almost as much.

 

you play mostly mediums, but are they really for you? what would you say you were? cautious? aggressive? passive? calm? these things show what tanks you'll do well with and those you wont. 

 

you recently picked up the T62A? you have so far 10 battles, but only 900 DPG.. that alone suggests you either 1) don't fit mediums, 2) have poor crew and/or 3) haven't set the tank up.

look at it and think "what could I do to make this better?"

at TX, id be looking to use a 4+ skill crew and nothing lower, simply because TX is where the long standing players are. you wont stand a chance with 1 skill and 50% 2nd... 

have you got it set up? equipment, camo etc..?

 

ill play T6 with minimum 2 skills, T7 must be 2-3, t8 must be 3+ and T9 atleast 4 just to put it in perspective. if your running as said, a TX with a 2 skill crew, that wont help you at all

 

personally id stop using the other tanks and try and get the Cromwell damage and winrate up. currently you do 524 DPG, which is terrible for a T6 tank. try and get close to the 1000 mark, and when you can do that often, move up a tier and do it with the comet (so 1.2k~) then T8 etc.. etc..

 

if you try to improve at TX, it'll take you longer, cost you more, and generally wont be very fun for you imo

 

I also don't know how you managed to afford 2 TX in 10k games.. if you didn't buy some silver.. you must be running tanks with net + bino's and no other equipment... if so, that's your major problem..

ive only managed to afford 1 in almost 19k games...

Well, I do enjoy playing medium the most and I struggle even more with heavy tanks so thats why I play them. Also, yes, I did skip a few tanks down the line to the t62a which I kinda hated and didn't really play because of that. I do use equipment obviously and most tanks have at least 2 crewskills. Altough the T65a doesn't have them yet. I'll play tier 6 a lot more from now on.

 

View PostUrQuan, on 22 July 2018 - 08:13 PM, said:

Edit: noticed you got the hellcat. While classed as a TD, it tends to play like a paper med, so it does seem you are struggling with paper tanks in general, so perhaps you are missing some knowledge about camo-rating, bushplay & viewrange usage?

Do you mean stuff like driving forwards so the bush becomes transparent so you can spot, drive back and shoot? I do that on a regular basis. I feel like the problem is more in the positioning of my tank. A lot of times I just feel really stuck and can't find other positions that give better opportunities. But at the same time I don't want to sit behind a rock doing nothing half of the game until there's a bit more room to move. It also seems like everyone is shooting at me rather than at someone else so I lose my hitpoints way too fast.


Edited by bravo229, 22 July 2018 - 11:51 PM.


Cuck0osNest #10 Posted 22 July 2018 - 11:32 PM

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View Postbravo229, on 22 July 2018 - 11:26 PM, said:

But at the same time, I don't want to sit behind a rock doing nothing half of the game until there's a bit more room to move. It also seems like everyone is shooting at me rather than someone else so I lose my hitpoints way too fast.

Coverwrapping, rationality of actions. I think in this video i took best moments. 


Edited by Cuck0osNest, 22 July 2018 - 11:36 PM.


kaneloon #11 Posted 22 July 2018 - 11:35 PM

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View PostCuck0osNest, on 22 July 2018 - 08:24 PM, said:

Ok, first, start using RR, it is more informative and balanced. 

Second, just find some interest towards victory, I recommend watching my videos

 

RR is dead, SS is born (Sudden Strike). Some kind of super fast shoot on the move, but only in the air.

TT is building in the back, you can't imagine harder.



Cuck0osNest #12 Posted 22 July 2018 - 11:37 PM

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View Postkaneloon, on 22 July 2018 - 11:35 PM, said:

 

RR is dead, SS is born (Sudden Strike). Some kind of super fast shoot on the move, but only in the air.

TT is building in the back, you can't imagine harder.

oH, I am sorry. RR



TANKOPPRESSION #13 Posted 23 July 2018 - 12:17 AM

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Try a training clan .

 



Balc0ra #14 Posted 23 July 2018 - 03:02 AM

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View Postbravo229, on 22 July 2018 - 07:06 PM, said:

I know my maps, weakspots etc, but I'm somhow still struggling.

 

Then ask yourself this. What are you struggling with? Why do you die? The only way to improve is to learn from your mistakes, and knowing what your mistakes are. But if you don't know what your mistakes are. You can't really improve. Play a tank you feel confident in. Take mental notes of why you got killed. Just find out why you died and learn from it, so you don't do it again that often. But do you want a more aggressive style or are you more a support player? I mean I love my Cromwell. I play it rather aggressively. I play it like a bully flanker or a spotter if need be. I follow the wolf pack and harass anything not aiming at me. Even in a +2 game.

 

View Postbravo229, on 22 July 2018 - 11:26 PM, said:

I feel like the problem is more in the positioning of my tank. A lot of times I just feel really stuck and can't find other positions that give better opportunities. But at the same time I don't want to sit behind a rock doing nothing half of the game until there's a bit more room to move. It also seems like everyone is shooting at me rather than at someone else so I lose my hitpoints way too fast.

 

look at the enemy team list. Know what you are afraid of so you know when to avoid it. Find out what goes where. And after a bit, figure out what's not spotted. And take a guess where they might be. See if your team mates take nasty hits from something that's not spotted, or if the tanks you have yet spotted kills anything near you. If you can do that, you know not to push up that way later once the flank is secure. If you know there are 3 TD's sitting up there, let them sit there and wait for damage. Go back and help where you can instead. 

Erwin_Chan #15 Posted 23 July 2018 - 06:21 AM

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First - sorry if it will become long post, but it seems that I am unable to write anything short :D

 

I was in quite a similar situation. I had like maybe 8K battles but I was red like tomato pasta. I was still active WoW subscriber back then, but I had something like a WoT periods when I was bored by wow so I played tanks all day, and 8K tomato battles were easy to get :D

 

When I became active WoT player, I tried to write something like - heavy tank guide, medium tank guide on YT, and thus I found about existence of unicums, streamers and wn8 statistics. First I started watching lemmingrush, but I think his videos game me only some very basics. After I discovered QB, Jingles, and others, then I started to see everything wrong in my plays and awful noob tomato things I was doing in battles. So I was watching and playing, watching and playing, paying attention to unicums decisions (its even better when they comment why they did certain decision in battle), ... It took me some time, but I was slowly progressing in colors. Now I am blue with some 1600 and 2K recent on various tiers. It was really pain in the EDIT to repair my absolutely terrible stats on my most played tanks like Tigers.

 

now to your problem.

 

 I don't want to offend you in any way, but we should not lie each other right.

 

1. Avoid tier 10: Your stats with leopard and T-62 are just bad. 1K damage on tier X mediums is really bad. They have about 2K hp, and 390/320 alpha. That means with leopard do you about 3 shots, and 4 with T62. I think tier X mediums are harder to play than lets say tier6 mediums, and on Tier X in general you should be able to adapt to different situations in battle, know when its good to stay in position and when its good to retreat ... While its ofc good to have good tactical knowledge on every tier, tier IX and X is more punishing.

 

1.1 - If you want to play tier X, I would recommend you grind some heavy tank. Good ol IS-7, chinese WZ is good, Superconqueror, or Derpzilla. Avoid Maus and E100.

 

2. Just stick to tier 5,6,7. There are really good tanks on these tiers to help you with your "playing-learning session". Best examples are tier 5 KV-1, Tier6 I would say soviet T-150 is good because it has decent armor for its tier and good gun, and on tier7: soviet IS, american T29, and Tiger I if you want get better with paper support tanks. Well as you can see, heavies are in general good for learning the game, much better than mostly paper medium tanks, and even if like mediums more, you can still improve your gameplay with heavies, and then apply some positions for example on mediums.

 

3. Take it easy: It easy to watch unicums playing, learning positions they use, ... but its not so easy trying to play like them after you finish watching stream and starting your wot :D . It takes time. Somebody will get better faster, and somebody else need more time and more battles to improve.

 

4. Think more when bottom tier. You simply want to fight tanks you can pen, and that means it's not a bad idea to go support mediums with bottom tier heavy. If you go fighting face to face with +2 tier higher heavy you can't even pen, you just throw away your tank. Some people will click at you and call you idiot if you don't go to so called heavy-line with bottom tier heavy, but these people are stupid, ignore them.

 

5. Ignore would-be superunicorns insulting you with bots, stupid ... :D

 

 

 

Panzer vor.


Edited by Erwin_Chan, 23 July 2018 - 06:29 AM.


UrQuan #16 Posted 23 July 2018 - 08:37 AM

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View Postbravo229, on 22 July 2018 - 11:26 PM, said:

Do you mean stuff like driving forwards so the bush becomes transparent so you can spot, drive back and shoot? I do that on a regular basis. I feel like the problem is more in the positioning of my tank. A lot of times I just feel really stuck and can't find other positions that give better opportunities. But at the same time I don't want to sit behind a rock doing nothing half of the game until there's a bit more room to move. It also seems like everyone is shooting at me rather than at someone else so I lose my hitpoints way too fast.

 

It is what I mean yes. Your comment after does give an insight on the issue tho. In a paper tank it is very important to go to spots where you can also fall back easy from. Stay on the move is a very important mantra in anything paper. Fall back to fight another day. Note: Do NOT stay back & camp/snipe, but rather move to a forward spot, see if you can spot anything from there & if able/ no risk, even shoot stuffs.

When it gets risky, relocate. Doesn't even have to be another flank, moving to the other side of the hill you're on, or simply even the other corner of the building you use helps alot.

 

And yes, when you drive in a paper tank, everyone wants to shoot you, because everyone can pen you, hence you got to pay alot of attention to the minimap, but also to the battle itself. Did those enemies just shoot or not? If so, pop out, shoot pop back. If they didn't shoot, can you pop out safely? (check the direction of their guns!) If pointing at your location, can you relocate to another part & shoot them? Etc.

It is why you never go alone in paper tanks (whom you seem to favour) Some of these tanks are very strong, but only with good game knowledge & play. 

And tbh, you best build that up with tanks that are forgiving to play in the midtiers.

 

Also a good way to improve is watching your own replays, even the bad ones. Watch them, see what hit you & how it happened. Why did you die. If something worked, was it because you had a good location, or did you turn out lucky? (having a good game by using ridges shows more skill, then having a good game while you sat in the open, shooting clueless enemies - the first you can build on & improve, the second was merely being lucky with dumb enemy teams rather then skill)

 

Replays:

Progetto replay 1: Fisherman's Bay

At start on the ridge, the bulldog spots you as you tried shooting the batchat (lead your shots: aim in front of a moving tank, not the tank itself; distance varies by shelltype), but you don't move (I don't see sixth sense popping up? Do you have this perk on the commander? It is a necessity on any paper tank!)

You got shot by the T28 prot (who remains unseen, as he uses the bulldog to shoot you with impunity)

After that comes a better part, you relocated to the hilly bush, shoot & pull back: good. Then you chase the enemy batchat going behind the lines & kill him with help: good but with one remark: when chasing enemies, keep objects between you & possible enemies in rear to avoid unneeded damage (in this case: should have stayed behind the ridge to avoid damage from centurion)

After that, you immediately go back to the bushy hill & promptly get shot. this is because you are either still lit up from the batchat chase, or simply the bulldog spotting you & enemies get free damage on you.  (still no sixth sense pop up, so I suppose you don't have it -> get it asap!)

After that, you play pretty okay imo, you shoot, pop back, relocate. The moment the skorpion hit you (but dinged: this was luck, in a paper tank assume everyone pens you everytime) , it was a hint that the west flank needed spotting/ligthing up.

But the moment those reds came charging in, was the moment you should have pulled out, you are a paper tank, you cannot win a brawl with multiple enemies, especially not an armored tank like the approaching T28 prot.

 

What would I do differently? I personally would never use that ridge with the road: you got to expose too much of your tank to use it & when you have to fall back because being spotted, you stay exposed too long, allowing enemeis to get good shots on you. The bushy hills on either side of that road ridge would be more my spots, as they allow you to peek with the turret & not expose your hull. Switch between those to keep the enemy guessing.

Oh and get 6th sense on your commander. That perk is a real lifesaver & will help you learn maps & stuff alot faste by showing what spot works & which one not in regards of being seen.

 

Progetto replay 2: Erlenberg

At the beginning of the game, it seems you tunnelvision when you're scoring some damage, completely missing out on the minimap that reds are coming to shoot you. Pay attention to the minimap! Relocate when you notice reds are coming (or at the very least, turn your attention to the immediate threat rather then the easy damage)

The moment you ran, it was actually already too late, but you got very lucky when the borsig hit your tracks for 0 damage & didn't detrack you. But you stayed in the area, despite the minimap showing that the enemy was overrunning that flank. The proper course would have been to keep running away to the forest in rear/join another flank: you are a paper tank, your companions are paper tanks too (progetto & strv). You cannot win a brawl with superior numbered enemies, so you have to relocate to a safer spot to fight them from range.

 

What would I do differently here? If going to same flank as you: pay attention to minimap, when reds get lit up, either shoot them or if too many: pull back to safety (behind ridges) & then, based on additional info from the minimap: run like hell: too many enemies & not enough friendlies on that flank to stop them + nothing with armor to stall them.

 

Note, people more experienced in meds will be able to give much better advice regarding those matches. But my strongest recommendation will be similar to them: get sixth sense on your commanders, always & ever in your paper tanks.

Also, on the first Progetto replay, I did saw good things too, you did relocate pretty easy & that is an important thing to do. You also didn't fall for the trap of 'must empty clip!' that often either. Treat the Progetto as a single-shot tank & only use the clip in emergencies & good opportunities. So I don't doubt that when you learn the game more, you'll get better as well. Just keep in mind that playing paper tanks like you do is playing WoT on the hard setting.

The main issue you seem to have is map/battle awareness (read the battle /minimap flow), you don't seem to pay enough attention to the battle when you shoot enemies (tunnelvision, it's a common thing & can even get the best of us) + no sixth sense, a really needed perk when playing at T8 with a paper tank imo.

Best way to combat tunnelvision would be to glance at the minimap every few seconds & pull back when you notice an unknown red appearing & assess if he is a threat or not & requires relocation.


Edited by UrQuan, 23 July 2018 - 08:49 AM.


bravo229 #17 Posted 23 July 2018 - 10:35 AM

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I don't have sixth sense on my progettto yet, it's on 97% right now. Sixth sense usually has top priority.

Thanks for your detailed analysis! I didn't really know what to do differently in those games. Especially on fisherman's bay.

TANKOPPRESSION #18 Posted 23 July 2018 - 02:48 PM

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You wont get better than going to a training clan .

Also be aware that most streamers are just selling stuff and the game to you .



RedlineSnieperTom #19 Posted 23 July 2018 - 07:06 PM

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When I had like 6k games my wn8 was around 600 I guess. So I was very bad. What I basically did to improve was watching streams and youtube videos. One of the key points to do lots of dmg is positioning. You can learn those positions from streamers and youtubers(Qb, skill4ltu, shishx etc.). The next thing I did was joining a clan and get the opportunity to play with better players and learn from them in platoon.

As you might see I'm still far from being decent, but it's better now. It just takes time and effort to become a better player, but it's worth it.

But keep it fun, thats the main rule to become better.






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