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T44 - Your opinion ?


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OnboardG1 #41 Posted 26 August 2010 - 09:45 PM

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This is the other thing. If a t44 can get you on your own you're properly buggered. However, I swear and curse when the opposing team is in a mutually supporting position because I can't do anything. I've noticed more and more teams getting smart to this.

Arishtat #42 Posted 26 August 2010 - 11:01 PM

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View PostOnboardG1, on 26 August 2010 - 09:45 PM, said:

This is the other thing. If a t44 can get you on your own you're properly buggered. However, I swear and curse when the opposing team is in a mutually supporting position because I can't do anything. I've noticed more and more teams getting smart to this.

This.

Nothing makes me smile like a T-44 going into orbit around a "helpless" teammate as I zero in on his hindquarters with my T-34/85's 100mm cannon.

Belrick #43 Posted 26 August 2010 - 11:05 PM

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View PostArishtat, on 26 August 2010 - 11:01 PM, said:

This.

Nothing makes me smile like a T-44 going into orbit around a "helpless" teammate as I zero in on his hindquarters with my T-34/85's 100mm cannon.


Because the T44 never has any team mates that could be putting a 100mm shell up your own caboose.

N00b

Battledragon #44 Posted 27 August 2010 - 06:04 AM

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Yeah, I started off running around in my T44 as I'd experienced others do to me and I found out fast that this only works if what you bump into happens to be smaller than you, or alone.  If I ran into a group of tanks sooner or later one would track me while I was concentrating on another and I'd get ganked or artied to oblivion. T44 really is best not going to full speed untill battle is joined and hanging back behind other mediums that do not have 12k repair costs!  I can usually break even with it without premium (some profit battles, some loss, more or less equal out) and make a small gain with premium. I found the best equipment for me was rammer and a wet ammo rack to counter it's two main flaws.  The infuriatingly slow reload of the D10T, and the tendancy to explode if anything bigger than a 50mm hits the turret rear.  Looking forward to that 3rd equip slot after the patch so I can put in a stabilizer as well. :)
I call T44 the Marmite tank, you either love it or hate it. (I love it, definately the first tank I go after once the game goes live.)

OnboardG1 #45 Posted 27 August 2010 - 07:38 AM

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I found the AGLD to be useful. Dropping speed a little snaps the reticule right in instantly and you can pull the trigger and hit the gas again in less than a second.

MrKristensen #46 Posted 27 August 2010 - 12:56 PM

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I've been thinking about the T-44.

Now, I've only been in a PzKfpw IV, so I really haven't driven it, but I've been killed by it plenty of times.

To me the T-44 seems like a overpowered light tank, it's fast, it accelerates fast, it's small, just like light tanks/scouts. Furthermore it has armour and firepower, something a light tank/scout doesn't have.

So what you get is a really fast vehicle zooming around, like light tanks, only difference is that these buggers are actually a helluva lot more dangerous, cause they're not the annoying small buggers chipping away your tank, these things actually kill you fast, and if you rip off their belts and make them stop, you can't just turn front and kill'em.

I can handle the Panther, DB and other high level mediums, cause they actually drive and act like mediums, but the T-44's, with their speed/acceleration just make them seem overpowered, on open battlefields at least.

I suppose people who like driving Leopards and alike, would love the T-44.

I know T-44 drivers complain about ammo detonation and bounces, but honestly, I don't know if they're more prone to it? I experience a lot more moduledamage, fire, crewknockouts and detracks in the Pz IV than I did in the Pz III, I feel that's because the Pz III would often just get killed by a projectile than sustain damage, so a tank with a higher HP, would also get more of these module/crew/fire damages, which kind of even the equation compared to lower tier tanks getting one-shot?

rgds

Pravda #47 Posted 27 August 2010 - 03:14 PM

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T-44s really do suffer more ammo rack criticals. Coming from the T-43 there was a very clear difference. Not only does it spontaneously blow up relatively often, but just having the rack go yellow does some terrible things to your reload speed.

The other big downside of the T-44 is that the guns are, to put it simply, bad. The 85 mm (same gun as the one the T-34-85 upgrades to) has acceptable accuracy, but lacks in penetration. The 100 mm on the other hand has poor accuracy but enough penetration to go up against other high-tier tanks. Neither of them deal remarkable damage. And the 122 mm reloads and aims so slowly that it's simply not a reasonable choice for the T-44.

So the T-44 doesn't have the guns for stand-off engagements. Instead it needs to get in close simply to land hits reliably, either from hitting weak-spots with the D5T, or hitting at all with the D10T. Extended sniping duels really aren't to it's advantage - it's armor is decent, as are it's hit points, but the guns just aren't up to par.

If the T-44 wasn't as agile as it is, it wouldn't be worth driving - the other T8 tanks would simply be better. Not to say it isn't a good tank right now, but I wouldn't call it overpowered. It certainly is mean and scary once it's managed to sneak up close though.

Battledragon #48 Posted 27 August 2010 - 03:40 PM

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Yeah, the guns are a problem, I had the D10T on mine, it's probably the best choice as it's the only one that gives it a realistic chance against the larger heavies. It absolutely MUST have a rammer for this gun though. and as said above it's not accurate at long range. circling usually requires you to put your faith in auto aim too as it's very hard to concentrate on keeping out of the enemy firing line and keeping your own gun on target at the same time.  T44 is an artillry magnet too, a lot of arty drivers really hate T44s so if you loose a track, even with skilled repair crew it's usually not going anywhere ever again.  The rear end is another weakness, no idea why but the T43 is actually stronger from behind. leads to a lot of engine damage if someone hits it from behind, and a half power T44 never lasts long.  A PZ3 can cripple your engine if you give it a chance.

Dark_MadMax #49 Posted 27 August 2010 - 06:28 PM

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T44 is great tank, I wouldn't call it OP though.   As it stands  tier 8 mediums are owned by tier 8+  heavies, something like IS7 can destroy -3-4 T44 all on its own. And KT can handle 2 no problem. Yeah T44 eats alive anything tier6 and below, but so are other high tier tanks

Destroid #50 Posted 27 August 2010 - 07:01 PM

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View PostDark_MadMax, on 27 August 2010 - 06:28 PM, said:

T44 is great tank, I wouldn't call it OP though.   As it stands  tier 8 mediums are owned by tier 8+  heavies, something like IS7 can destroy -3-4 T44 all on its own. And KT can handle 2 no problem. Yeah T44 eats alive anything tier6 and below, but so are other high tier tanks

This is pretty much correct.  It really depends on your match up.  It's also worth noting that the auto-matcher ranks a T-44 below a Panther and also below a Tiger/IS, so the heavy tanks get a buff above their tier for being heavy I guess, even though a T-44 can pretty reliably kill a Tiger 1v1 (I wouldn't bet against the IS thought).

The auto-matcher values are getting played with next patch anyway, so no need to worry about them till after that, and the T-44 and Panther are getting a slight horsepower nerf.

OmegaAngel #51 Posted 27 August 2010 - 08:00 PM

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View PostWhiteHyena, on 26 August 2010 - 08:46 PM, said:

As a Tiger1 driver I always hated going up against T-44s because their speed was that much better, they could just run rings around you all day. If you could take out their tracks/engine before they had a chance it wasn't so bad, although I did always used to bounce a lot of shots off them, even when aiming at the wheels which was.. odd  :Smile-hiding:


likewise as a jagdpanther user.. having a t43 bounce off 2 golden 105mm rounds and 1 AP was pretty shocking to me(had a ton of gold saved up and wanted to try the gold bullets out). = 70 percent of games I've seen t43/t44's be successful. but at times they would get taken out easy-thats if they decide to lone wolf 3-4 tanks.

I've actually find that anything T34 through T44, more trouble to kill due to bounced or deflected shots. I guess it is the slopped armor that helps alot.
Any german tank in the med line is pretty much easy prey.

Benaulim #52 Posted 27 August 2010 - 08:39 PM

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View PostSirMoric, on 27 August 2010 - 12:56 PM, said:

I've been thinking about the T-44.

Now, I've only been in a PzKfpw IV, so I really haven't driven it, but I've been killed by it plenty of times.

To me the T-44 seems like a overpowered light tank, it's fast, it accelerates fast, it's small, just like light tanks/scouts. Furthermore it has armour and firepower, something a light tank/scout doesn't have.

So what you get is a really fast vehicle zooming around, like light tanks, only difference is that these buggers are actually a helluva lot more dangerous, cause they're not the annoying small buggers chipping away your tank, these things actually kill you fast, and if you rip off their belts and make them stop, you can't just turn front and kill'em.

I can handle the Panther, DB and other high level mediums, cause they actually drive and act like mediums, but the T-44's, with their speed/acceleration just make them seem overpowered, on open battlefields at least. (...)

Please keep in mind that the production of the PzKfpw IV startet in 1937 (8500 units until 1945), that of the T-44 in 1944 (150 units until 1945). In other words the latter one technically was far more advanced not to mention it never really appeared on the battlefields of WWII. It's just logical that a T-44 prevails over a PzKfpw IV. Then again nobody ever said World of Tanks would restrict its choice of vehicles to those historically accurate and limited to 1939-1945. To the opposite as a short look into the complete tech trees easily proves.

That said all the current discussions about overpowered tanks wether the T-44 or others (!) are kind of obsolete. Can't wait for people's reactions to the T-54, for instance. No, wait ... I can.

EndlessWaves #53 Posted 27 August 2010 - 10:45 PM

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View PostSirMoric, on 27 August 2010 - 12:56 PM, said:

To me the T-44 seems like a overpowered light tank, it's fast, it accelerates fast, it's small, just like light tanks/scouts. Furthermore it has armour and firepower, something a light tank/scout doesn't have.

So what you get is a really fast vehicle zooming around, like light tanks, only difference is that these buggers are actually a helluva lot more dangerous, cause they're not the annoying small buggers chipping away your tank, these things actually kill you fast, and if you rip off their belts and make them stop, you can't just turn front and kill'em.

Yes, but that is the T-44's speciality. Due to it's poor penetration (T-44 is 144/175, Panther is 203, IS-3 is 225, Ferdi is 246, ISU-152 is 284) it's a lot less dangerous to more well armoured opponents than other tier 8 vehicles.

ZiggyDeath #54 Posted 27 August 2010 - 10:46 PM

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You know, a fully upgraded Panther has repair costs in excess of 13k... a stock Panther hits about 12.3k fully destroyed.

As an infighter, the Panther is a poor platform for fighting; given it's speed an maneuverability with the upgraded gun, a Tiger using hull rotation can track a Panther with no problem (assuming they don't suffer some sort of mechanical failure). The higher profile also means that a side shot is less likely to skip off the top hull section due to a shallow shot. Essentially any gun with 140mm of penetration or greater will sink a hole into a Panther pretty much every time: fact, the German medium line does not get any armor improvements (pretty much) after the Panzer III/IV. Also, while I am not familiar with the hitboxes of the T-44, I can assure you that any turret penetration in the stock DB turret will almost certainly detonate ammunition due to it's tiny size. Also the Panther's ammo stores are situated as such that 1/3rd of the side profile will render a Panther unable to fire effectively.

Both DB and Panther, with their stock turrets, has comparable tracking rates with the T-44, but once upgraded are between 32-34degrees per second.

From experience I have deduced (whether this is true or not is another matter) that he profile of the T-44 allows guns with close to 140mm of penetration to skip off on poorly angled shots, which can be a factor sometimes in a close range turn-out; this of course can be somewhat mitigated by manually aiming at the ground instead of the tank, but it means that if a T-44 gets under 20meters, the 75mm L70 and the 88mm L56 are likely to skip off as they cannot depress far enough. Also the problem with this method is that given the small profile of the T-44, this can simply lead to shots penetrating the tracks and hitting the dirt beneath instead of a proper side penetration.

I'm not saying that T-44's invincible, the 88mm is a far cheaper gun to use, cheap ammunition, faster, more accurate and packs sufficient punch to blow away T-44s. But as an infighter, the Panther is pretty much Tiger sized and will walk away with a pretty bloodied nose even if victorious. If one does not upgun the Panther, fully upgraded elsewhere, I feel that it can match a T-44 terms of combat maneuvering, however the 75mm L70 is what I'd call a "just good enough gun", and just good enough is no match for most varieties of the 122mm. Due to the performance drop when equipping a Panther with the 88mm L56, I consider the DB a better infighter due to a greater underload of the suspension as well as the suspension having a naturally faster traverse; to exacerbate the Panther's performance issues, the DB posses more hp/ton than even a 75mm equipped Panther. For these reasons, the Panther is an inadequate tank if mounting anything besides the 88mm L71.

The Panther is a good stable mobile gun platform. But as an infighter it only possesses enough agility to fight effectively against heavy tanks, which it does extremely well.

Just my 2 cents regarding DB/Panther versus T-44s.

Sue #55 Posted 27 August 2010 - 11:34 PM

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View PostSirMoric, on 27 August 2010 - 12:56 PM, said:

I've been thinking about the T-44.

Now, I've only been in a PzKfpw IV, so I really haven't driven it, but I've been killed by it plenty of times.

To me the T-44 seems like a overpowered light tank, it's fast, it accelerates fast, it's small, just like light tanks/scouts. Furthermore it has armour and firepower, something a light tank/scout doesn't have.

So what you get is a really fast vehicle zooming around, like light tanks, only difference is that these buggers are actually a helluva lot more dangerous, cause they're not the annoying small buggers chipping away your tank, these things actually kill you fast, and if you rip off their belts and make them stop, you can't just turn front and kill'em.

I can handle the Panther, DB and other high level mediums, cause they actually drive and act like mediums, but the T-44's, with their speed/acceleration just make them seem overpowered, on open battlefields at least.

I suppose people who like driving Leopards and alike, would love the T-44.

I know T-44 drivers complain about ammo detonation and bounces, but honestly, I don't know if they're more prone to it? I experience a lot more moduledamage, fire, crewknockouts and detracks in the Pz IV than I did in the Pz III, I feel that's because the Pz III would often just get killed by a projectile than sustain damage, so a tank with a higher HP, would also get more of these module/crew/fire damages, which kind of even the equation compared to lower tier tanks getting one-shot?

rgds

I can see where you are coming from. However, you began your post saying that you have PIV. I do not want to sound mean and you are entitled to your opinion, but you do not drive a T44 (or pay the repair bills, or deal with your loader/ammo getting blown up or damaged every other round). Nor do you drive a tier 7/8 tank. Of course a tier 8 tank is going to look really good to you (maybe even OP). You just need to drive one for 100 battles and then come back and see if you are singing the same tune.  :P

MrKristensen #56 Posted 28 August 2010 - 01:26 AM

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You're right, but I didn't exactely say it WAS overpowered, I said it seemed overpowered, cause it acted like a scout, but contrary to other scouts, it's able to bite, and bite hard.

And to earlier reply, I know the PIV was of an older design than the T44, and I didn't really want to argue that the PIV should beat the T44, did I?

My PIV does get a lot of module/crew/fire damage..... when I get hit..... what I try not to, cause it's a PIV. I just don't know if the T44 gets'em more often, cause it gets hit more before dying. But that's mere speculation founded in the fact that people complaining about it are the ones in higher tier tanks.

But the server is shortly starting up again, then I could go for one.... I suppose.

rgds

Rooster2 #57 Posted 28 August 2010 - 01:31 AM

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I had a t44 for quite a while in the beta,long enough to have all my crew 50% into there second secondarys :). I found it to be a very nice tank but not overpowered in any way.just lucky lol. It can barely pay for its self,need to have at least 50k credits to start a play session using it exclusively.

I kinda did feel sorry for Panthers that I met solo though,if anything I think its the panther thats underpowered

TempSGK #58 Posted 28 August 2010 - 01:39 AM

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I don't know but what's the Repair cost for the T44?

Rooster2 #59 Posted 28 August 2010 - 02:00 AM

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View PostHojieko, on 28 August 2010 - 01:39 AM, said:

I don't know but what's the Repair cost for the T44?
Mine was consistantly 11500 -14000 and even if I got lucky and killed 3 or 4 people if my team lost it was mostly likely less than my repairs,and my ammo costs were always 2-5k depending if i used he shells or not. Think the most I ever made was 23k in a battle in malavokia where I drove all the way across too there side around the lake and back to my side wher i beat off a couple of attackers b4 once agin rushing there side where I finished off a few more  I got 3 medals scout warrior and sharpshooter

TempSGK #60 Posted 28 August 2010 - 02:10 AM

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wow 11.500 is quite alot to me, My T34-85 repair cost is about 3.000 to 3.500 I can't imagine T43 or T44 big jump.




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