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50 TP prototyp First impressions


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Hechaton #1 Posted 09 August 2018 - 03:06 PM

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50TP Prototyp first impressions

 

I have an ambivalent feeling about this tank. When it’s good, it’s great, but most of the time it’s all crap (read MM and the following thoughts).

 

This is not an «scientific” review, rather a personal. It will not focus on “hard stats” or comparisons but a subjective opinion of the tank. See this in light of me being an average player.  I don’t play premiums to train crews but to earn credits and have fun.

 

 

Firepower

Terrible Bad – decent -good - excellent

Penetration: Bad

Dispersion: Terribe

DPM: Bad

Aiming time: Bad

Accuracy: Terrible

Turret traverse: Terrible

 

 

This gun is probably is decent but has “some” issues but the main one is the penetration: With a standard penetration of 218 mm, It’s not all that bad. The problem is the premium shells of 245mm. Current matchmaking is terrible for tier 8, and WG seems to keep ignoring the problem all together. Forget doing anything to tier 9 and 10 tier heavies. You’ll struggle to go through the lower glacis at most of the tanks. The other day I came up against a tier 6 heavy (KV2) at mid range, and this tank was in fact inferior. Combination of bad penetration and long aimtime didn’t do this tank any favour.

 

Forget taking snapshots, you’ll probably hit your neighbour, and forget hitting anything at long range (200m+). The shell is most likely to miss the whole target even when fully aimed. Save the shell for later.

 

Survivability

Bad

I love the turret. It has the armour a heavy tank should have, capable to bouncing shells all day long. Don’t expose it too long though, or you’ll start taking high explosives.

 

Lower plate

Having an “is”-design of the armour demands a certain playstyle. It’s most effective when facing the opponent head on. The problem with that strategy is the lower plate. It’s terribly weak, and even tier 6 have no problems going through it.

 

Drivers hatch/ the “box” underneath the turret.

Although it’s angled and sloped, it turns out to be a weakpoint when sidescraping out from corners. Be careful you don’t overangle.

 

Turret placement.

The turret is placed approx. in the center (lengthwise) of the tank. This design makes it more difficult to peak out from corners because you’ll expose more of the tank.  

 

These issues will make this tank in my opinion the worst of all the IS-designs (IS3, 110, obj 252U, etc.)

 

Mobility

Bad

This tank is surprisingly slow when comparing to the relatively bad armour. It’s on par with Obj 252U with a forward speed of 35. The only tank I can think of that is slower is the Nutcracker, when comparing the tier 8 prem. Heavies.

 

Concealment

Decent

Even being as low as a Mutz, the concealment is twice as bad. But it’s pretty much in par with with same tier heavis such as is3, 110, 112 etc.

 

Spotting

Bad

A standard view range of 380, isn’t exactly great, but it could have been way worse. Use coated optics and crew skills to improve, and you’ll do fine.

 

Playstyle

It took some time to get the hang of this tank. With this unreliable quirky armour profile and a not-too-great-gun, I often found myself going along with the mediums rather than to fight off opposing heavies (read MM). When staying hull down it can do some impact of the game. The artys are an constant annoyance for this tank (read: Slow).

 

Fun factor

On the right map and the right mm, this tank can be fun. Most of the tank it’s just cannon fodder due to the current mm (WGs statement, not mine). I personally generally rack up more damage in any faster same tier tank than this one, any tank class. That tells me, for my playstyle, this tank should either have a better armour layout or have a better speed.

 

Is it worth the money?

Not sure about this one.

This tank reminded me strongly of the IS 6. Decent armour but terrible penetration. No one plays the IS6 anymore because it’s pretty much useless in the current meta. In my mind, a heavy should be able to go to the “heavy side” of the map and be able to put up some kind of resistance even as a bottom tier. It should be able to be useful in other areas than just being cannon fodder. This tank can’t, it’s that simple.

The recent premium tanks have mixed up the characteristics of the tank classes, making it less intuitive which “role” the tanks have (and confusing the new players in the process). This tank is a strange mix. When matched with same tier opponents it plays like a heavy. When being bottom tier the playstyle should be more like a slow medium.  

So is it worth the money to get a marginally improved IS6?



Azazel_and_chill #2 Posted 09 August 2018 - 03:13 PM

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Yea, whatever. This tank is simply wonderful Defender v2. Amazing firepower with golden rounds, hard af, good gun handling, swift (not fast). I, after 30 battles, have an average of 1100 XP per game and 60% + winr8.

Azgabast #3 Posted 09 August 2018 - 03:15 PM

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Thanks for sharing your opinion. I've already seen QB and Dez's videos on this tank and they weren't too impressed about it, however they did mention its strong points (aim time, dpm, view range, turret armor).

If you feel the penetration is bad though, try playing the T32. I do so love it, but its 198 standard pen is letting me down sometimes (while having the same premium pen as the 50TP).

I guess in the end people will simply say "buy the 50TP if you wanna train your Polish crews and if you don't already have too many T8 premiums for making cash".

 

Have a good day.



Azazel_and_chill #4 Posted 09 August 2018 - 03:19 PM

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Also, how can you even compare 175 mm pen of IS6 to 218 mm going up to 245 of 50TP.

_Sensation_ #5 Posted 09 August 2018 - 03:30 PM

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Tbh, the tank isn't that impressive but you make it seem like it's worse than the IS-6 lmao

kaneloon #6 Posted 09 August 2018 - 03:32 PM

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I don't see how you can have "mixed feelings" when your average notation is "bad".

All I can say is that I had many bounce on an angled 50 tp at medium range with my Emil I (which has a good pen), when you can't really aim weak spots. So the armor is not "bad".



ManMaker #7 Posted 13 August 2018 - 03:52 PM

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I don't mind the dispersion, aim time, or pen of this tank. The armor is just useless. People seem to pen the turret often and almost everywhere on the front.

 

So yes the armor is bad on this tank and that is the biggest problem with it. 

 

Turret ring is a big weak spot on the front and 2 spots on viewport 

If you angle it the lower plate is a big weak spot and again the turret ring and the viewport on the front.


Edited by ManMaker, 13 August 2018 - 03:58 PM.


Karasu_Hidesuke #8 Posted 13 August 2018 - 05:44 PM

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View PostManMaker, on 13 August 2018 - 02:52 PM, said:

I don't mind the dispersion, aim time, or pen of this tank. The armor is just useless. People seem to pen the turret often and almost everywhere on the front.

 

So yes the armor is bad on this tank and that is the biggest problem with it. 

 

Turret ring is a big weak spot on the front and 2 spots on viewport 

If you angle it the lower plate is a big weak spot and again the turret ring and the viewport on the front.

 

When being top tier or bottom tier?

KillerKumba #9 Posted 13 August 2018 - 07:08 PM

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After having 81 battles, with a 54% WR (average Xp - 750) So not great but enough.

The tank is generally bad. 
Its turret bounces, as long as its facing opponent but a slight tilt and your getting penned by tier 6, same thing with lower part of turret. The hull doesn't have 170 amour as WG suggested... well it does but only on the drivers hatch, every where else your going to get penned by tier 6's. So the front is one huge weak spot, unless a tomato is shooting at you, or you very lucky. And the turret has enough weak spots to getting penned is a regularity. Also T9 will make short work of your turret.

 

hes like a med and heavy, has the speed of heavy and the amour of a med.

The gun is decent, slow to reload but decent.

 

If the amour was better all round, id be a decent tank, but as is its a waist of money. And regret buying it.
 



Robbie_T #10 Posted 14 August 2018 - 05:23 AM

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I like the tank

it was what i was looking for :)

i think its one of the best tier 8 premiums at the moment.

i love every little bump on the field to hide behind it..its a verry low tank so i can hide that lower plate behind anything.

and with the gun depression its epic on the ridge lines.

 

 it can even stand up against tier 10's if played right.

i think its a better tank than the Defender yeah Defender got the armor but what a crapgun...aiming takes ages thats why the armor.....only +Defender has is in a city map on the flat grounds.



pihip #11 Posted 14 August 2018 - 08:03 AM

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I was probably influenced by the 'Defender 2.0' hype sorrounding this tank when I bought it, and to be honest I regret the purchase.

 

Gun hits hard and pen is adequate (gold pen is made bad by those retarded superheavies) but the gun is also very moody and unaimed shots might as well fly to the next map, same with long range shots. There's also the tendency of getting low damage rolls and weird bounces which applies to every high damage gun.

Mobility is average, nothing to say here.

 

Viewrange is actually good for this kind of tank, like the Chinese, for those complaining remember that we have IS-3 with 350 metres viewrange.

 

Armor is well, that is probably the poorest aspect of the tank. The turret being small and right in the middle of the hull forces to expose part of the hull when poking from ridges, the lower plate is pathetic and barring low pen rolls or low pen guns anyone tier 7 or above will be able to pen there with standard ammo, and the driver's hatch is a prominent SHOOT ME weakspot, though it is well-armored for one (230+ effective armor).

If Defender were not a thing and superheavies were a rare sight, 50TP would've been a welcome addition to the game and a strong contender in the tier 8 arena. As things are now (also thanks to the thrice accursed 3/5/7 garbage) it's just a poor bootleg copy of the mighty russki.

 

tl;dr If you have Defender, there is no need nor reason to get 50TP.



NoobySkooby #12 Posted 14 August 2018 - 08:05 AM

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View PostAzazel_and_chill, on 09 August 2018 - 03:13 PM, said:

Yea, whatever. This tank is simply wonderful Defender v2. Amazing firepower with golden rounds, hard af, good gun handling, swift (not fast). I, after 30 battles, have an average of 1100 XP per game and 60% + winr8.

 

But it isn't the Defender v2, that tank is supposed to to be idiot proof, such a shame then that WG keeps denying me a decent tank, :D

 

 

Apparently the Defender has very bouncy armour and no weak points, 'cough' Lower Front Plate 'cough'

 

Where as the 50 TP has a whole bunch of them, and sidescraping just seems to allow shots to enter your tank uninvited, that said as I mentioned earlier I do not have the Defender so I cannot make a proper comparison.



Simeon85 #13 Posted 14 August 2018 - 08:42 AM

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View PostHechaton, on 09 August 2018 - 03:06 PM, said:

50TP Prototyp first impressions

 

Firepower

Terrible Bad – decent -good - excellent

Penetration: Bad

Dispersion: Terribe

DPM: Bad

Aiming time: Bad

Accuracy: Terrible

Turret traverse: Terrible

 

Survivability

Bad

 

 

Mobility

Bad

 

Concealment

Decent

 

Spotting

Bad

A standard view range of 380, isn’t exactly great, but it could have been way worse. Use coated optics and crew skills to improve, and you’ll do fine.

 

 

Your assessment is just weird and way off. 

 

'Marginally better than an IS6'? It's way better than an IS6. 

 

 

Block Quote

 

Firepower

Terrible – Bad – decent -good - excellent

Penetration: Bad

Dispersion: Terribe

DPM: Bad

Aiming time: Bad

Accuracy: Terrible

Turret traverse: Terrible

 

No 440 alpha gun on tier 8 is remotely bad. For the alpha the gun handling is actually very good, much superior to the Defender and slightly better than the VK 1001P. If you want truly bad gun handling go play a T34 and then tell me how 'bad' the 50TP is. 

 

Penetration is average for tier 8, slightly lower than the 225 on the IS3 or Defender but in reality 7mm is not going to change much, the premium round is not great though.

 

DPM is good, especially for a high alpha gun, it's over 1.9k which is higher than several meds with 240 alpha and again is higher than stuff like the Defender, IS3, VK 1001 P etc. even higher than the T32 and Tiger 2 which have 320 alpha guns. 

 

0.38 accuracy is again decent for that alpha, way better than the likes of the Defender for example.

 

It is just nonsense to suggest this tank has 'terrible' firepower and flat out incorrect.

 

Block Quote

 

Survivability

Bad

 

Again utter rubbish, according to vbaddict it's bouncing about 2% less than the Defender - http://www.vbaddict.net/statistics.php?tier=8&tanktype=0&nation=0&premium=0&modeid=0&team=0&battles=1000&groupby=0&fieldname=nodamageshotsratio&server=

 

With over 42% of shots fired at it bouncing, this is much higher than tanks like the Patriot, IS3, Liberte, KV-4, Lowe, Chrysler K GF etc. so again to call the survivability 'bad' is just flat out incorrect.

 

It has good frontal armour, very good for a tier 8 heavy, but it requires a brain to use correctly as the tank has weakspots. 

 

Block Quote

 

Mobility

Bad

 

Again no it isn't, for such a well armoured tank with a big gun the tank is mobile enough. It has decent hp/ton and good traverse rates making it agile for a heavy tank and difficult to circle. 35kph top speed is not the fastest but pretty standard for properly armoured heavy tanks. 

 

'Bad' mobility is something like a T28 or VK 1001P that barely go 20kph and have terrible engine power.

 

Block Quote

 

Concealment

Decent

 

Spotting

Bad

 

Concealment is irrelevant for a heavy tank and I have to laugh that the only thing you have rated 'decent' is one of the most useless skills for a heavy and pretty much all heavies have bad concealment compared to other classes.

 

View range is also clearly decent at 380m, there are like 14 or 15 tier 8 heavies with worse view range than 380m.

 

This 'review' is awful.

 

People clearly had some over the top expectations of this tank but it's a very solid tier 8 heavy and is very strong if you know what you are doing. 

 

440 alpha + -8 gun depression + good frontal armour is a very powerful combo, especially as this tank has much better gun handling than the Defender meaning it is more rewarding to play for me. Not to mention the gun depression and view range advantages it has over the Defender, making it more versatile and comfortable.

 

The Defender is all about BS broken armour, the 50TP IMO offers a better all round package for decent players, I find the tank more comfortable and less frustrating to play than the Defender. But importantly it's a well balanced tank unlike the Defender. 

 

 

 

 



KillingJoker #14 Posted 14 August 2018 - 09:22 AM

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For me the equation is very simple: 

 

- strong turret armor check

- good gun depression check

- high alpha damage check

 

these 3 conditions, are enough for any above average player get extreme results with this tank

everything else is meaningless...

 

- you can claim the tank penetration is poor with AP, well a good player wont use AP vs well armored enemies

- you can claim the tank is slow, a good player will adapt its gameplay to the tank features

- you can even claim the armor is not that good (false... its pretty decent the hull as well) 

 

So overall is it a bad premium? 

 

Its have extreme features and extreme weaknesses, and what that means? this tank have a high ceiling of skill... it may seem useless in the hands of most players

and extremely good in the hands of players who actually understand how to increase the capabilities of the tank by just exploring the best features to its maximum...

low dpm? bad gun handling? its simple, you trade with it... you don't need to snapshot, you don't need to snipe, you just need to be smart... 

 

Its pretty much the same tank as the 50TP that will be tier IX on the Polish techtree, but with a different gun, everything else its pretty much the same tank, i tested the tier IX on the CT server, and its a very decent tank, so i doubt the tier VIII premium is a bad tank one tier lower, even if the gun have less alpha and penetration, it doesn't matter.

 

People were trying to compare this thing to a defender weeks ago, now i read people saying this tank is rubbish, ffs, can you please be reasonable? a defender have a better hull armor than an Is-7, its completely overpowered for tier VIII. still, there are many situations that i would prefer 8 degree's of gun depression and good turret armor over a defender with only 5 degree's, so... its just different. 



Hechaton #15 Posted 14 August 2018 - 08:55 PM

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This tank is nowere near the defender (the comparison keeps turing up) In comparizin the Defender will be pretty much immune to the 50TP, whereas the 50TP never can.

This review is made after 200 battles in random mode. Do your 200 and let me know if this armour and gun is any good against tix IX and X.



AzoreanOutkast #16 Posted 16 August 2018 - 12:49 AM

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Bought it today, not happy...

Really hype was off...

This thing for now really doesnt cutt it...

Will still give it a go and see... Still learning it...

But a heavy that gets overmatched by pratically all?! nah!!!!






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