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Self-propelled artillery


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Ntinos75Eordaia #1 Posted 28 August 2018 - 09:08 AM

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Hello again, at real wars the command officers had a radio to call for support and was very unlikely to be an ally to the zero point off the strike even by mistake. At this game all and I mean all even and all you broadcasting live from twich and youtube who have not idea what  self-propelled artillery is, just have them active at your garage ignore and hate all those who like to play with artillery. In this game the clients with self-propelled gun who has reach and bought the tier tanks IX-X are not bad, but when inform the team for ready fire and all you run at zero point to eliminate the target because you had 100hp or 1% or full hp because you play so much safe, suddenly you write at your old shoes the client with ready to fire and enter at fire zone like cowboys take the damage accuse the client for bad player and all seems to agree with you positive. And at the end of the story WG inform the self-propelled artillery client that he damage allies and took credits and experience penalty for his/her action. Please if you are so incompetent and selfish  don't blame us. Sorry again if you don't understand my English, but all I think you know what I mean, I will not take a part with your insults again because I see you in game how you react like that guy at USA recently who murder in cold blood two innocent people during an internet tournament. And that other thing you doing and really do not like, you play defense with three self-propelled artillery behind you and the only you accomplish is to spot the self-propelled guns the enemy team and at the end blame the self-propelled guns and another issue when all lost and at field remain a self-propelled gun and a tank destroyer the td try to take cover near spg, how you think a slow spg in close range will protect you? Most unlikely again but you don't care because will spot spg and hit that instead of you. I will answer to a very popular client of World of Tanks, is not bad WG gave you all those experimental tanks  at your account but spg's if you let them will help you in game after all spg's are part of this game, if you do not want self-propelled guns in this game fix a poll so decide all, "to be or not to be".-

NUKLEAR_SLUG #2 Posted 28 August 2018 - 09:10 AM

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I agree completely. Or maybe I don't. It's hard to say.

cragarion #3 Posted 28 August 2018 - 09:22 AM

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View PostNtinos75Eordaia, on 28 August 2018 - 09:08 AM, said:

Hello again, at real wars the command officers had a radio to call for support and was very unlikely to be an ally to the zero point off the strike even by mistake.................................................

 

Stopped reading after your very first sentence was wrong, for a start apart from preemptive strikes all artillery and nearly all airstrikes are called in by the troops on the ground, sometimes at predesignated coordinates sometimes at map references the troops on the ground provide, Blue on blue or friendly fire was so common that some units refused to use artillery and air strikes until they put artillery spotters and air spotters in the forward units with the troops to call in the strikes, that way if they got it wrong they stood a good chance of being killed along with the troops, even today there are still friendly fire incidents or blue on blue which ever you prefer to call them, 

during the first and second gulf wars and the afghan conflict until America "officially called the conflicts over", more coalition troops were killed by US friendly fire than by the enemy.


Edited by cragarion, 28 August 2018 - 09:23 AM.


Ntinos75Eordaia #4 Posted 28 August 2018 - 09:27 AM

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Thank you for your answer, Stopped reading after your very first sentence was wrong

DarkPacifist #5 Posted 28 August 2018 - 09:28 AM

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Whether people like or not spgs, I must say that the OP has a point: when an artillery player marks a target, it is a nonsense to rush him and take the shot. At the end of the game and to kill steal...secure sorry, why not (moreover if it is to make the spg player angry :trollface:) but then one should assume the responsibility to do so and not blame the spg player.

However, when the spg player does not show that he is going to fire at the target it is leggit for me that the spg player is responsible.

On the question of credits and xp loss...well that's not a lot so I do not see any problem at it.


Edited by DarkPacifist, 28 August 2018 - 09:31 AM.


Ntinos75Eordaia #6 Posted 28 August 2018 - 09:31 AM

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Thank you for your answer


Jigabachi #7 Posted 28 August 2018 - 10:51 AM

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It's really simple: If you don't have a clear shot, you don't shoot. Sometimes dumb people rush in for the kill and get killed by the enemy, while arty would have been able to destroy the target very easily, but apart from those situations it really doesn't matter much. And you also have to remember that arty has high RNG, so there is always the chance that you don't kill the target, which could then damage your teammates.

Sooo... again: If you can't shoot, find another target. Simples.

 

btw: At real wars the command officers had paragraphs.



Simeon85 #8 Posted 28 August 2018 - 11:07 AM

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There is no excuse for hitting allies in arty, you have all the time in world to assess the situation around the target and decide when to shoot (that is ALL you have to do in arty, nothing else), tanks are not magic, they cannot teleport into spots, so if there is an ally moving near the target YOU CAN SEE IT AND YOU DON'T SHOOT.

 

Considering you pretty much have sub 48% win rates in all your artillery, it shows that the problem is you and more often than not you are a hindrance to your team not a help to your team. 


Edited by Simeon85, 28 August 2018 - 11:07 AM.


mpf1959 #9 Posted 28 August 2018 - 11:10 AM

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:arta::B

FizzleMcSnizzle #10 Posted 28 August 2018 - 11:11 AM

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I miss punctuation.

RamRaid90 #11 Posted 28 August 2018 - 11:19 AM

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First off, go and post in your own language forum. It's tiresome trying to decipher broken English.

 

Secondly, you should not fire in your SPG if there is an ally within that enormous circle which constitutes your aim. Evenwhen fully aimed RNG for SPGs is horrible and more likely than not you will end up damaging an allied tank.

 

Finally, team damage sanctions should be far HARSHER for SPG players, not more lenient as they currently are. Not only would this make the idiots in allied SPGs more careful about where they spam shells, it would also provide players with an opportunity to avoid enemy artillery fire by simply being in close proximity to enemy tanks. After all, SPGs were introduced to prevent camping NOT to punish active, aggressive play.


Edited by RamRaid90, 28 August 2018 - 11:24 AM.


xtrem3x #12 Posted 28 August 2018 - 11:49 AM

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I sometimes drive back across the map and kill my "friendly" arty player if he shoots me while trying to steal an easy kill. If he marked the target then it's my fault too, but if he doesn't mark it and hits me there is a good chance I will retaliate. I used to play a lot of arty before the stun mechanic was introduced and I never hit team mates just to try and steal a kill. It's that kind of play by arty that loses games.

Edited by xtrem3x, 28 August 2018 - 11:49 AM.


PervyPastryPuffer #13 Posted 28 August 2018 - 12:29 PM

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Let me show you a real self-propelled artillery. :trollface:

 



_6i6_ #14 Posted 28 August 2018 - 12:48 PM

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View PostSimeon85, on 28 August 2018 - 12:07 PM, said:

There is no excuse for hitting allies in arty, you have all the time in world to assess the situation around the target and decide when to shoot (that is ALL you have to do in arty, nothing else), tanks are not magic, they cannot teleport into spots, so if there is an ally moving near the target YOU CAN SEE IT AND YOU DON'T SHOOT.

 

Considering you pretty much have sub 48% win rates in all your artillery, it shows that the problem is you and more often than not you are a hindrance to your team not a help to your team. 

 

Actually if you read further down what 2 other members wrote it is not exactly like that.

Firstly, due to massive RNG of artilleries in general.

Secondly, due to flight time of arty shell. It is not uncommon that within those 1,0 - 4,0 secs of flight time an ally pops around the marked area either for a kill steal or because he forgot you marked the area and gets shot instead or even to a terrible RNG instance.

So you should try and see cases individually.

Im not a dedicated arty player - on the contrary -  i actually played arty to finish the campaign missions and just play hummel now and then and i think only twice have i hit(indirectly) an ally.One of them was only a stun because the shell did not go over the rock and hit the side of it and on the other side of the rock was the ally so he got stunned due to rng.

Also, i think i have been hit by a friendly artillery only 2-3 times indirectly - So it is also whether you have some actual awareness of the game - where your arty is aiming at and whether your arty player is experienced or not.(He may also be an idiot ofcourse :P)

 



Simeon85 #15 Posted 28 August 2018 - 01:06 PM

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View Post_6i6_, on 28 August 2018 - 12:48 PM, said:

 

Actually if you read further down what 2 other members wrote it is not exactly like that.

Firstly, due to massive RNG of artilleries in general.

Secondly, due to flight time of arty shell. It is not uncommon that within those 1,0 - 4,0 secs of flight time an ally pops around the marked area either for a kill steal or because he forgot you marked the area and gets shot instead or even to a terrible RNG instance.

So you should try and see cases individually.

Im not a dedicated arty player - on the contrary -  i actually played arty to finish the campaign missions and just play hummel now and then and i think only twice have i hit(indirectly) an ally.One of them was only a stun because the shell did not go over the rock and hit the side of it and on the other side of the rock was the ally so he got stunned due to rng.

Also, i think i have been hit by a friendly artillery only 2-3 times indirectly - So it is also whether you have some actual awareness of the game - where your arty is aiming at and whether your arty player is experienced or not.(He may also be an idiot ofcourse :P)

 

 

Even a tank moving at 60kph, which is way above average for most tanks, is only moving at around 16 m/s, that means in 2-3s they can only move 32 -46m, which means they are easily visible to the arty player in their top down view, hence why I said tanks are not magic and they cannot teleport across the map.

 

Arty players have a very clear, high overview of what is going on, they can easily see multiple map squares at once, so they can see any allied tanks in the area. They are also under no pressure as they are not getting shot at, the ONLY thing they have to deal with and make a decision over is what to shoot at and when to fire, that is basically it. This means you can easily account for nearby allies and you should never hit them.

 

Tanks have a much more restricted view, they have way more to worry about, there is a lot more going on for them as they are probably getting shot at, driving, shooting etc. so it's very easy for them to miss the marker.

 

There are no excuses in my opinion, when all you have to worry about is basically aiming,  you are under no pressure and you have a very clear view of the battle then you should not be hitting allies and if you do you have been careless. Which is why I agree with the above, arty should have higher penalties for damaging allies and should get fined for friendly stun as well.  



_6i6_ #16 Posted 28 August 2018 - 01:09 PM

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View PostSimeon85, on 28 August 2018 - 02:06 PM, said:

 

Even a tank moving at 60kph, which is way above average for most tanks, is only moving at around 16 m/s, that means in 2-3s they can only move 32 -46m, which means they are easily visible to the arty player in their top down view, hence why I said tanks are not magic and they cannot teleport across the map.

 

Arty players have a very clear, high overview of what is going on, they can easily see multiple map squares at once, so they can see any allied tanks in the area. They are also under no pressure as they are not getting shot at, the ONLY thing they have to deal with and make a decision over is what to shoot at and when to fire, that is basically it. This means you can easily account for nearby allies and you should never hit them.

 

Tanks have a much more restricted view, they have way more to worry about, there is a lot more going on for them as they are probably getting shot at, driving, shooting etc. so it's very easy for them to miss the marker.

 

There are no excuses in my opinion, when all you have to worry about is basically aiming,  you are under no pressure and you have a very clear view of the battle then you should not be hitting allies and if you do you have been careless. Which is why I agree with the above, arty should have higher penalties for damaging allies and should get fined for friendly stun as well.  

 

Thats why i added the idiot option at the end :P

Balc0ra #17 Posted 28 August 2018 - 01:18 PM

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So what you are saying is that if you did fire when someone was in your aim circle. Is it their fault you hit them? 

KillingJoker #18 Posted 28 August 2018 - 01:22 PM

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This is what a World War II self-propelled gun look like...

 

They worked in war, mostly to counter infantry strong camping positions, such a trenches, or heavy gun nests / emplacements... 

Because they used a indirect line of fire, it was needed a calculation and coordinates to actually hit the desired zone, making it literally very hard for Artillery to actually work as an anti-tank on the move, they would only be effective against static targets...

 

Now, what is artillery in world of tanks literally?  you have the looks of WW2 SPG machines... but in fact... 

Artillery in world of tanks works mostly like this...

 

 

A Satellite equipped with large guns using a top-down view that when assisted with in-game statistics also known as xvm allow 45% players to cure their frustration from hours of failure in the game by chasing and trying to take down players who bravely try to carry their teams to victory. 

 

A completely stupid mechanic that no competitive player miss when they are not in the game...



vixu #19 Posted 28 August 2018 - 01:56 PM

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malachi6 #20 Posted 28 August 2018 - 02:04 PM

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View PostTankyouverymuch2, on 28 August 2018 - 12:29 PM, said:

Let me show you a real self-propelled artillery. :trollface:

 

 

 

 

It could barely hit a large factory.

 

Machines like this were arty:

 






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