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Wargaming platoon logic


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legendkiller16 #1 Posted 07 January 2019 - 02:55 PM

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I recently started playing WoT again after a very long while, and yesterday I tried platooning with a friend to play some games. To my surprise we can't platoon with a tank 1 tier lower or more. I get the idea that Wargaming finally removed the possibility of making fail platoons. But, here is the stupid part of the new platoon system: you can easily get tier 10 matches with a tier 8 tank, and you can also get tier 10 games with your tier 9 tanks. So why the [edited]did Wargaming decide to remove the ability of players to play in a platoon +/- 2 tier??? Yes, more than 3 tiers difference is stupid to do but 2 tier difference is totally doable....Now I cant play with my friend because he doesnt have anything higher than tier 8 and I cant platoon with him in my tier 9's and 10's even though the stupid match maker puts tier 8s with 10s constantly...

 



barison1 #2 Posted 07 January 2019 - 03:23 PM

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ever figured out that would be equal to rigging mm with current system? if you platoon with a tier 8 as a tier x yourself you will always be top tier. this due to the 3/5/7 forced mm

Edited by barison1, 07 January 2019 - 03:24 PM.


Scotviking1968 #3 Posted 07 January 2019 - 03:26 PM

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View Postlegendkiller16, on 07 January 2019 - 02:55 PM, said:

I recently started playing WoT again after a very long while, and yesterday I tried platooning with a friend to play some games. To my surprise we can't platoon with a tank 1 tier lower or more. I get the idea that Wargaming finally removed the possibility of making fail platoons. But, here is the stupid part of the new platoon system: you can easily get tier 10 matches with a tier 8 tank, and you can also get tier 10 games with your tier 9 tanks. So why the [edited]did Wargaming decide to remove the ability of players to play in a platoon +/- 2 tier??? Yes, more than 3 tiers difference is stupid to do but 2 tier difference is totally doable....Now I cant play with my friend because he doesnt have anything higher than tier 8 and I cant platoon with him in my tier 9's and 10's even though the stupid match maker puts tier 8s with 10s constantly...

 

 

 

Think this one through... if you can platoon at +/- 2 then you can get a +/- 4 tier spread... ie a fail platoon.

 

If you are playing T8 and you get into a 3/5/7 game as bottom tier, and you toon with a T6 mate, then your mate is in a T6 tank seeing T10.

 

I suspect it is too complex to have separate rules for T8 when they are 'tooned with T9/10 than when they are 'tooned with 6/7

 

Can you not just use a T8 with him ?



CmdRatScabies #4 Posted 07 January 2019 - 03:27 PM

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View Postbarison1, on 07 January 2019 - 03:23 PM, said:

ever figured out that would be equal to rigging mm with current system? if you platoon with a tier 8 as a tier x yourself you will always be top tier. this due to the 3/5/7 forced mm

 

Tier 10 will tend to be top tier regardless of the match maker.

barison1 #5 Posted 07 January 2019 - 03:29 PM

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View PostCmdRatScabies, on 07 January 2019 - 03:27 PM, said:

 

Tier 10 will tend to be top tier regardless of the match maker.

 

pretty sure you know what i mean.

besides full tier x games happen plenty aswell



laulaur #6 Posted 07 January 2019 - 03:30 PM

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View PostScotviking1968, on 07 January 2019 - 02:26 PM, said:

 

 

Think this one through... if you can platoon at +/- 2 then you can get a +/- 4 tier spread... ie a fail platoon.

 

If you are playing T8 and you get into a 3/5/7 game as bottom tier, and you toon with a T6 mate, then your mate is in a T6 tank seeing T10.

 

I suspect it is too complex to have separate rules for T8 when they are 'tooned with T9/10 than when they are 'tooned with 6/7

 

Can you not just use a T8 with him ?

 

Wrong.

If you platoon with a tier 8 and a tier 6 - the T8 will be always top tier and  T6 always bottom tier.

As @barison1 said in the current mm a +/-2 tier platoon would be a way of rigging to be always top tier so they removed it.



Grand_Moff_Tano #7 Posted 07 January 2019 - 03:38 PM

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View Postlaulaur, on 07 January 2019 - 02:30 PM, said:

 

Wrong.

If you platoon with a tier 8 and a tier 6 - the T8 will be always top tier and  T6 always bottom tier.

As @barison1 said in the current mm a +/-2 tier platoon would be a way of rigging to be always top tier so they removed it.

 

Actually if you platoon with a tier 8 and a tier 6, you have a good chance of it getting into a tier 9 or 10 game, however it still isn't a fail platoon.

ilmavarvas #8 Posted 07 January 2019 - 03:41 PM

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View PostGrand_Moff_Tano, on 07 January 2019 - 03:38 PM, said:

 

Actually if you platoon with a tier 8 and a tier 6, you have a good chance of it getting into a tier 9 or 10 game, however it still isn't a fail platoon.

 

 

It's still a fail platoon.



Grand_Moff_Tano #9 Posted 07 January 2019 - 03:43 PM

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View Postilmavarvas, on 07 January 2019 - 02:41 PM, said:

 

 

It's still a fail platoon.

 

No it isn't, a fail platoon is when you have a tank that has a 3+ tier difference to your own.

laulaur #10 Posted 07 January 2019 - 03:51 PM

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View PostGrand_Moff_Tano, on 07 January 2019 - 02:38 PM, said:

 

Actually if you platoon with a tier 8 and a tier 6, you have a good chance of it getting into a tier 9 or 10 game, however it still isn't a fail platoon.

 

View PostGrand_Moff_Tano, on 07 January 2019 - 02:43 PM, said:

 

No it isn't, a fail platoon is when you have a tank that has a 3+ tier difference to your own.

 

Let's take for example a platoon of 2 T8 and 1 T6:

If the mm takes the biggest tank mm in consideration and disregards the other tanks mm - then yes, you will end in tier 10 with a T6 =  a 'fail platoon' as you have a tank that is 4 tier difference in that battle.

If the mm takes the lower tank mm in consideration and disregards the other tanks mm - then you will end always top tier in T8 in a 3/5/7 teamplate = rigging the mm by the players.

 

Neither of those things are a good thing so WG decided to stick to one tier platoons only, it also makes the job much easier for the mm.



Grand_Moff_Tano #11 Posted 07 January 2019 - 03:55 PM

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View Postlaulaur, on 07 January 2019 - 02:51 PM, said:

 

 

Let's take for example a platoon of 2 T8 and 1 T6:

If the mm takes the biggest tank mm in consideration and disregards the other tanks mm - then yes, you will end in tier 10 with a T6 =  a 'fail platoon' as you have a tank that is 4 tier difference in that battle.

It still isn't a fail platoon however, it only becomes a fail platoon when you bring in a tank of 3+ tiers difference than another in the platoon.



eekeeboo #12 Posted 07 January 2019 - 04:00 PM

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People have an issue with taking a tank with +2 mm difference. Now imagine how your team feels if you end up with a tank 4 tiers below you and you have the current MM system that will simply not allow it and have a different system. I'm sure you know why it was removed. 

laulaur #13 Posted 07 January 2019 - 04:03 PM

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View PostGrand_Moff_Tano, on 07 January 2019 - 02:55 PM, said:

It still isn't a fail platoon however, it only becomes a fail platoon when you bring in a tank of 3+ tiers difference than another in the platoon.

 

Sure, not a fail platoon because a T6 is so damn competitive against T10.... Just 4 tiers difference between them.

 

 



Grand_Moff_Tano #14 Posted 07 January 2019 - 04:07 PM

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View Postlaulaur, on 07 January 2019 - 03:03 PM, said:

 

Sure, not a fail platoon because a T6 is so damn competitive against T10.... Just 4 tiers difference between them.

 

 

 

Never said it was competitive, just said it isn't classed a fail platoon. 

 

And remember, 2 can play at the game of "posting a gif"



KillingJoker #15 Posted 07 January 2019 - 04:10 PM

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I used love to platoon with someone playing tier 8 in my ELC amx (before they nerf) because i felt more adrenaline playing the tank against upper tiers...

 



Homer_J #16 Posted 07 January 2019 - 04:24 PM

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View Postlegendkiller16, on 07 January 2019 - 01:55 PM, said:

I recently started playing WoT again after a very long while, and yesterday I tried platooning with a friend to play some games. To my surprise we can't platoon with a tank 1 tier lower or more. I get the idea that Wargaming finally removed the possibility of making fail platoons. But, here is the stupid part of the new platoon system: you can easily get tier 10 matches with a tier 8 tank, and you can also get tier 10 games with your tier 9 tanks. So why the [edited]did Wargaming decide to remove the ability of players to play in a platoon +/- 2 tier??? Yes, more than 3 tiers difference is stupid to do but 2 tier difference is totally doable....Now I cant play with my friend because he doesnt have anything higher than tier 8 and I cant platoon with him in my tier 9's and 10's even though the stupid match maker puts tier 8s with 10s constantly...

 

 

Because of the template system.  If you platoon a tier X and a tier XI then there has to be tier XI tanks on the other team so you have guaranteed you won't get an all tier X battle.

 

The daft thing is you can still make a fail platoon by putting a tier IV heavy with a tier IV medium.  The tier IV medium can see tier VI but the heavy can't normally.

 

But if you have a friend you will do what I do and get a tank with the same mm as your friend.  It's what friends do for each other.



The_Naa #17 Posted 07 January 2019 - 05:33 PM

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I do remember the old platoons and they were kinda fun, taking a SU-18 in platoon with my friend that had a tier 7 tank and ending up in a tier 7/8/9 MM and killing a ISU-152 :).

And Marder 2 also saw action against tier 5/6/7 tanks because it was fun to fight against T-34/85's and IS's, like the tank did in real life :rolleyes:

Too bad I cant do it anymore... :( WG plz buff Marder 2 to tier 5 so I can enjoy the tank like I used to.

Tier limit is OK but I would not mind to see some fail platoons from time to time, older players trolling New players and some other players just having fun. 



Nishi_Kinuyo #18 Posted 07 January 2019 - 06:38 PM

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View Postlaulaur, on 07 January 2019 - 04:03 PM, said:

View PostGrand_Moff_Tano, on 07 January 2019 - 02:55 PM, said:

It still isn't a fail platoon however, it only becomes a fail platoon when you bring in a tank of 3+ tiers difference than another in the platoon.

 

Sure, not a fail platoon because a T6 is so damn competitive against T10.... Just 4 tiers difference between them.

I can think of exactly two tier 6 tanks who don't care for that MM: KV-2 and O-I.

All others are smegged.

 

*edit*

And no, smeg arta.


Edited by Nishi_Kinuyo, 07 January 2019 - 06:39 PM.


Dorander #19 Posted 07 January 2019 - 07:41 PM

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View Postlaulaur, on 07 January 2019 - 02:30 PM, said:

 

Wrong.

If you platoon with a tier 8 and a tier 6 - the T8 will be always top tier and  T6 always bottom tier.

As @barison1 said in the current mm a +/-2 tier platoon would be a way of rigging to be always top tier so they removed it.

 

I take occasional long breaks so I might have simply missed this; I once returned to the game and found a template MM system in place as well as the current platoon rules. So the question: has it actually been the case that we had the current template MM but it was possible to platoon tanks of different tiers, or did these changes come simultaneously?

Archaean #20 Posted 07 January 2019 - 07:50 PM

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View Postilmavarvas, on 07 January 2019 - 03:41 PM, said:

 

 

You must think very highly of yourself






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