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Question about twitch stream and GDPR

Twitch GDPR

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malachi6 #41 Posted 10 January 2019 - 12:12 AM

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Using this mind set, simply having player names on display is a breach of GDPR.  After all I can see data that is related to the individual.  There is a  reason why WG tells you not to use your real name.

 

If a WG employee with access and who  is prepared to lose their job and face jail is prepared to look you up.  They can, with or without twitch showing your name.  Thre are obviously protections in place at WG to prevent and mitigate just this kind of behavior.

 

Also, is this not moot, given you have uploaded replays to WoTReplays and have therefore released your own data to the wider world?


Edited by malachi6, 10 January 2019 - 12:22 AM.


Dorander #42 Posted 10 January 2019 - 12:28 AM

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View PostJoggaman, on 09 January 2019 - 10:46 PM, said:

 

Fixed anonymised that for you :B



SuperOlsson #43 Posted 10 January 2019 - 07:11 AM

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Recital 30 from https://gdpr-info.eu/recitals/no-30/ :

 

"Natural persons may be associated with online identifiers provided by their devices, applications, tools and protocols, such as internet protocol addresses, cookie identifiers or other identifiers such as radio frequency identification tags. 2This may leave traces which, in particular when combined with unique identifiers and other information received by the servers, may be used to create profiles of the natural persons and identify them."


 

Interesting discussion, though from the text above i have my doubts that a nickname in a video stream can be used to create a profile of you and identify you. And twitch certainly can not track your IP adress and via all those murky pixels everyone seems to use to track your search- and webpage history via a nickname in a video. If they really go for it i guess thy could use some image processing software or just a person to extract your nickname and check your forum profile for information you have freely shared for everyone to see, as you have already mentioned. But it will still be hard for anyone to create an ad profile for you because they don't have your IP adress. I also doubt that your in-game stats count as personal information, as winrate, amount of games played in arty or wn8 can hardly be used to identify you as a person.


Edited by SuperOlsson, 10 January 2019 - 07:11 AM.


slitth #44 Posted 10 January 2019 - 07:40 AM

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View PostDorander, on 09 January 2019 - 10:22 PM, said:

 

That is not the reason this scenario is subject to the GDPR, the reason is that data related to EU citizens is being processed. This is also applicable to companies outside of the EU, because they are selling their services or products to EU citizens and are thus liable under EU law. And yes, the EU can and does take companies to court, and these companies take that seriously. They fight these laws in court (which is its own financial investment), they don't ignore them because they're US based companies. Just ask Google. And I don't mean google it (though you can).

 

 

However it's a mistake to see the GDPR as a list of restrictions, it is a list of conditions. Some of these conditions result in something being forbidden, some conditions involve acquiring consent, and some conditions involve anonymisation of the individual in question. You cannot be identified merely by an online handle unless there is a registered link between your online handle and your identity as a natural or legal person. Since no such link is displayed in a Twitch stream it's difficult to see how this would be forbidden under the GDPR, which has articles concerning online identifiers that go beyond the initial definition that these identifiers may be considered personal information.

 

You could post your actual personal information in chat of course but since you're then volunteering it that'd be implicit permission since you know the person in question is streaming. It'd also be a really bad idea generally.

 

 

 

That smells a bit fishy, honestly, I'm not a lawyer but here's my understanding of it. Under the GDPR your privacy should be protected by any third party who processes your data (including companies located outside of the EU). Twitch, as the provider of the streaming service, handles the data through their serves and is thus defined as a processor under the GDPR. If this data then contains personal information, they have to treat it according to the GDPR. This includes needing your consent to store it, adhering to your requests to delete it, etc.. They can't just put this responsibility on the streamer.

 

At the very least it would be their responsibility to deny their service to any streamer who uses their streaming services to spread people's personal information without consent. There are probably details about it in the EULA for any streamer who wants to use their services, stating that Twitch isn't culpable if a streamer uses their service to process personal information and a serious EULA violation typically results in the agreement between the user and the provider being terminated after which Twitch deletes (one would hope) any stored material that potentially contains personal information generated by that user. When Twitch says they are not responsible, they probably mean you can't sue them over it, which MAY be true if they handle such a situation properly. However as far as I know GDPR enforcement is still somewhat unchartered waters.

 

First off, I want to praise the quality of your post. Well written.

 

And I agree that GDPR is not something that list of restriction, but more of what data a customer might have a say in.

 

Take the username, as some at is can be used to identify a person or is linked to data that can be identity a person it becomes personal information and i protected by the GDPR.

But that does not mean that it must be restricted information.

After all a fixed username it made to allow company staff and friends to identify your.

Its a form of personal information that you have consented that is available to others, so it might identify you without giving others access to personal information you would like to have hidden.

 

Now having username as personal information is a good thing, as it can help users to hide from unwanted attention if need be.

Let say that someone is being harassed on this forum, then changing the username will not hide the user from new attacks and you can see the username change on old posts.

Now with the GDPR you can use the right to be forgotten with the old user name and then change it to continue playing without the harassment.

 

View Postmalachi6, on 09 January 2019 - 11:12 PM, said:

Using this mind set, simply having player names on display is a breach of GDPR.  After all I can see data that is related to the individual.  There is a  reason why WG tells you not to use your real name.

 

If a WG employee with access and who  is prepared to lose their job and face jail is prepared to look you up.  They can, with or without twitch showing your name.  Thre are obviously protections in place at WG to prevent and mitigate just this kind of behavior.

 

Also, is this not moot, given you have uploaded replays to WoTReplays and have therefore released your own data to the wider world?

 

No it not a breach of GDPR because there is consent that username may be used in specific ways.

It will only be a breach if you withdraw consent and WG fails to comply.



slitth #45 Posted 10 January 2019 - 07:57 AM

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View PostSuperOlsson, on 10 January 2019 - 06:11 AM, said:

Recital 30 from https://gdpr-info.eu/recitals/no-30/ :

 

"Natural persons may be associated with online identifiers provided by their devices, applications, tools and protocols, such as internet protocol addresses, cookie identifiers or other identifiers such as radio frequency identification tags. 2This may leave traces which, in particular when combined with unique identifiers and other information received by the servers, may be used to create profiles of the natural persons and identify them."


 

Interesting discussion, though from the text above i have my doubts that a nickname in a video stream can be used to create a profile of you and identify you. And twitch certainly can not track your IP adress and via all those murky pixels everyone seems to use to track your search- and webpage history via a nickname in a video. If they really go for it i guess thy could use some image processing software or just a person to extract your nickname and check your forum profile for information you have freely shared for everyone to see, as you have already mentioned. But it will still be hard for anyone to create an ad profile for you because they don't have your IP adress. I also doubt that your in-game stats count as personal information, as winrate, amount of games played in arty or wn8 can hardly be used to identify you as a person.

Again is must praise the quality of a post. Well written.

 

Now I agree that the username in and of itself would not be part of the GDPR

In theory it could be a WG bot, a randomly assigned name for that match or some other kind of one-time-use name.

But this is not the case in WoT, the username is unique to a player

And because it linked to other information it can be the first piece of a puzzle that may give a more in-dept picture of the person behind the username

 



Gixxer66 #46 Posted 10 January 2019 - 08:54 AM

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View Postslitth, on 09 January 2019 - 06:39 PM, said:

If I am playing a match and someone is Twitch streaming or any other streaming of the match can I remove my consent be a part of the stream?

Or does the stream just have to blur out the usernames?

 

There is a certain irony in your question .... should you also be asking for your username to be masked on the forum too? Here i can click on it and potentially get a lot more info than you ever could from a moving video image on a live stream. See below for the information you have freely shared in your profile, if you are that concerned about your Privacy you might want to remove some it.

 

  • Group: Player
  • Active Posts
  • Profile Views
  • Member
  • Age
  • Birthday
  • Battles
  • Profile in World of Tanks
  • Gender
  • Location 

Edited by Gixxer66, 10 January 2019 - 09:01 AM.


Dorander #47 Posted 10 January 2019 - 02:15 PM

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View Postslitth, on 10 January 2019 - 06:40 AM, said:

 

First off, I want to praise the quality of your post. Well written.

 

And I agree that GDPR is not something that list of restriction, but more of what data a customer might have a say in.

 

 

Thank you :).

 

View Postslitth, on 10 January 2019 - 06:40 AM, said:

 

Take the username, as some at is can be used to identify a person or is linked to data that can be identity a person it becomes personal information and i protected by the GDPR.

But that does not mean that it must be restricted information.

After all a fixed username it made to allow company staff and friends to identify your.

Its a form of personal information that you have consented that is available to others, so it might identify you without giving others access to personal information you would like to have hidden.

 

 

This, I think, is the gist of it. Wargaming obviously has a responsibility to protect the personal information they have on us and are linked to our usernames from anyone who might have access to our usernames. As long as that information is protected, a link cannot be made to our personal data and the username is not an identifier.

 

An example of where I think it would be is the "verified user" tags that social media have. I might be wrong about this since I don't use social media myself, but as I understand it these tags exist to prove that the people who use these online handles are the people they claim to be in real life. If my real life name was Dorander, and I'd use the online identifier "therealDorander", and I'd get my username verified, this would create a link between that online identifier and my identity as Dorander. The online identifier is now part of my personal information.



eldrak #48 Posted 10 January 2019 - 03:29 PM

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A username doesn't allow a second party to identify personal information linked to that username unless the owner itself provides that information (by posting details, telling people about the username etc).

Keyanu #49 Posted 10 January 2019 - 03:48 PM

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View Postslitth, on 09 January 2019 - 06:39 PM, said:

If I am playing a match and someone is Twitch streaming or any other streaming of the match can I remove my consent be a part of the stream?

Or does the stream just have to blur out the usernames?

 

Are you serious?

 

Next you'll be wanting to shut down some person in a pub because he said your name and someone else heard it.

 

It's just an in-game username. You cannot actually get all your personal details from it can you?

 

Snowflake.



Homer_J #50 Posted 10 January 2019 - 05:32 PM

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View Postslitth, on 09 January 2019 - 09:53 PM, said:

 

It some want to ask me to steam my bad games, feel free to do so. Some one might even laugh over my bad gameplay.

It they want to steam me without asking for informing me about it. Got ahead.

If they spam my game chat with "watch me on Twitch" over and over. I would ask them not to steam that game.

 

 

Well the GDPR discussion will go on and on and round and round in circles because nobody here is an expert and if they were nobody would believe them anyway.

 

But the spam is easy to fix.  Press CTRL and move your cursor to the spam, and click.

 

It could be that the streamer wants to make sure everyone is aware and give them a chance to object though.  Not everyone notices every bit of chat.  I may have missed it but did you try to object at the time?

16:40 Added after 8 minutes

View PostKeyanu, on 10 January 2019 - 02:48 PM, said:

 

It's just an in-game username. You cannot actually get all your personal details from it can you?

In some cases you can.  Not everyone is as good at you at keeping their Twitch, Twitter, Youtube, Gmail, Paetron, etc... gaming life separate from their real life.



ThinGun #51 Posted 10 January 2019 - 06:19 PM

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The bottom line with all this snowflake GDPR bollards is ... if a company can show a legitimate reason for holding your PII, then they can do so. So, WG have a legitimate need to validate that you are an actual person.  

You may ask them to delete your data ... but only if you can also show that they have no need to have it ... good luck with that one.

Knight_Zao #52 Posted 10 January 2019 - 06:40 PM

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This seems to be a case of your one and only time being on someone's stream and it just so happens that you had a bad game, and due to this you dont want people to see either you died stupidly or did no damage and now you want to stop that game being viewed by the WoT public.....well my friend im going to let you into a little secret.....ready for it....

 

 

NO ONE CARES !!!!

 

honestly, not one person other than YOU !!!

 


Edited by Knight_Zao, 10 January 2019 - 06:41 PM.


slitth #53 Posted 10 January 2019 - 07:11 PM

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View Posteldrak, on 10 January 2019 - 02:29 PM, said:

A username doesn't allow a second party to identify personal information linked to that username unless the owner itself provides that information (by posting details, telling people about the username etc).


Well, by username you are able to learn by gender by login to the forum.

With is not a breach as I have chosen to share it it registered users of the forum.

 

But is still personal information because link the data has, its accessibility has no bearing on this part.

A good way to show this is by doing this in reverse.

If someone contact WG with the name and address can WE give any information about account that matches the address and name?

The answer is no, not even the username. Why because the username is linked to other user data and therefore protected.

 

View PostKeyanu, on 10 January 2019 - 02:48 PM, said:

 

Are you serious?

 

Next you'll be wanting to shut down some person in a pub because he said your name and someone else heard it.

 

It's just an in-game username. You cannot actually get all your personal details from it can you?

 

Snowflake.

 

I have no problem steamers in general, they can steam me playing WoT all day long if they ask me nicely.

It would be really boring and would attract -1 views.

And steaming battles with me with or asking or making me aware of it. Again not problem.

 

But I am serious about asking players to stopping steaming me if they annoy me.

It would to this in the hopes that they would stop shoving their streaming channel in my face while I am playing.

But the person would really have to go to great lengths to make me actually act on it

 

 

Now there is also a far more important aspect of my question. That of the streamer's position.

It would bad if a polite steamer got banned because a player ask him to stop steaming and did act accordingly.

So it would be nice to know for steamers if they can continue steaming as nothing has happen or they have to do some kind of effort.

The simplest thing would just be to block the players name from view, but is that enough.

 

View PostThinGun, on 10 January 2019 - 05:19 PM, said:

The bottom line with all this snowflake GDPR bollards is ... if a company can show a legitimate reason for holding your PII, then they can do so. So, WG have a legitimate need to validate that you are an actual person.  

You may ask them to delete your data ... but only if you can also show that they have no need to have it ... good luck with that one.

 

Like the data is of such players are so valuable to try and keep storing without a really good legal reason.

It much safer to dump the date, than risk the big fine



CmdRatScabies #54 Posted 10 January 2019 - 07:17 PM

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View Postslitth, on 10 January 2019 - 07:11 PM, said:


Well, by username you are able to learn by gender by login to the forum.

 

we only know:

  • Age [very] years old
  • Birthday xx xx, xxxx
  • Gender Male Male
  • Location Denmark

Because you filled it in & we don't actually know it's true. 


Edited by CmdRatScabies, 10 January 2019 - 11:18 PM.


slitth #55 Posted 10 January 2019 - 07:25 PM

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View PostCmdRatScabies, on 10 January 2019 - 06:17 PM, said:

 

we only know:

  • Age
  • Birthday
  • Gender
  • Location

Because you filled it in & we don't actually know it's true. 

 

True, but now you are also sharing that information with non registered forum users.

 

Edit: might be a good idea to remove the actual information, I do not know how the admin would react to you reposting the information in a more open setting


Edited by slitth, 10 January 2019 - 07:32 PM.


CmdRatScabies #56 Posted 10 January 2019 - 08:38 PM

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View Postslitth, on 10 January 2019 - 07:25 PM, said:

 

True, but now you are also sharing that information with non registered forum users.

 

Edit: might be a good idea to remove the actual information, I do not know how the admin would react to you reposting the information in a more open setting

 

   Don't see what registered vs registered matters since registration is free and available to all.  If you don't want it known, remove it from your profile.

slitth #57 Posted 10 January 2019 - 08:52 PM

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View PostCmdRatScabies, on 10 January 2019 - 07:38 PM, said:

 

   Don't see what registered vs registered matters since registration is free and available to all.  If you don't want it known, remove it from your profile.

 

Because WG can see who is looking at a user profile. 

When you post like this anyone that looks at the topic can see the info


Edited by slitth, 10 January 2019 - 09:22 PM.


jabster #58 Posted 10 January 2019 - 09:21 PM

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View Postslitth, on 10 January 2019 - 07:52 PM, said:

 

Because WG can see who is looking at a user profile. 

When you post like this any one look at the topic can see the info

 

Serioulsy?

slitth #59 Posted 10 January 2019 - 09:28 PM

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View Postjabster, on 10 January 2019 - 08:21 PM, said:

 

Serioulsy?

 

Sure if you look at my profile you can see the Latest Visitors.

WG can probably see more.

 

Now if you log out and look at this topic again you can still the the info.

And if you look a my profile you can see I have remove Age and Birthday.

But the info remains in the topic.

 

Now I have no problem with this, but WG might have.

And I would prefer that CmdRatScabies is not affected by posting the info.



jabster #60 Posted 10 January 2019 - 09:39 PM

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View Postslitth, on 10 January 2019 - 08:28 PM, said:

 

Sure if you look at my profile you can see the Latest Visitors.

WG can probably see more.

 

Now if you log out and look at this topic again you can still the the info.

And if you look a my profile you can see I have remove Age and Birthday.

But the info remains in the topic.

 

Now I have no problem with this, but WG might have.

And I would prefer that CmdRatScabies is not affected by posting the info.

 

Yes the information you choose to put there. Do you also need to be told when to brush your teeth?





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