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[POLL ADDED] Tier 9 tanks that are just not worth it?


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Poll: Which Tier 9 tanks are NOT worth grinding to / keeping / etc? (29 members have cast votes)

You have to complete 250 battles in order to participate this poll.

Which Tier 9 LTs are NOT worth it?

  1. AMX 13 90 (2 votes [4.17%])

    Percentage of vote: 4.17%

  2. Spähpanzer Ru 251 (21 votes [43.75%])

    Percentage of vote: 43.75%

  3. T49 (3 votes [6.25%])

    Percentage of vote: 6.25%

  4. T-54 ltwt. (1 vote [2.08%])

    Percentage of vote: 2.08%

  5. WZ-132A (21 votes [43.75%])

    Percentage of vote: 43.75%

Which Tier 9 MTs are NOT worth it?

  1. AMX 30 1er prototype (3 votes [3.23%])

    Percentage of vote: 3.23%

  2. Bat.-Châtillon 25 t AP (4 votes [4.30%])

    Percentage of vote: 4.30%

  3. Centurion Mk. 7/1 (3 votes [3.23%])

    Percentage of vote: 3.23%

  4. E 50 (1 vote [1.08%])

    Percentage of vote: 1.08%

  5. Leopard Prototyp A (12 votes [12.90%])

    Percentage of vote: 12.90%

  6. M46 Patton (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  7. Object 430 (1 vote [1.08%])

    Percentage of vote: 1.08%

  8. Object 430 Version II (15 votes [16.13%])

    Percentage of vote: 16.13%

  9. Prototipo Standard B (1 vote [1.08%])

    Percentage of vote: 1.08%

  10. Škoda T 50 (2 votes [2.15%])

    Percentage of vote: 2.15%

  11. T-54 (1 vote [1.08%])

    Percentage of vote: 1.08%

  12. T54E1 (13 votes [13.98%])

    Percentage of vote: 13.98%

  13. Type 61 (18 votes [19.35%])

    Percentage of vote: 19.35%

  14. WZ-120 (19 votes [20.43%])

    Percentage of vote: 20.43%

Which Tier 9 HTs are NOT worth it?

  1. 50TP Tyszkiewicza (4 votes [4.21%])

    Percentage of vote: 4.21%

  2. AMX 50 120 (18 votes [18.95%])

    Percentage of vote: 18.95%

  3. AMX M4 mle. 51 (9 votes [9.47%])

    Percentage of vote: 9.47%

  4. Conqueror (1 vote [1.05%])

    Percentage of vote: 1.05%

  5. E 75 (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  6. Emil II (13 votes [13.68%])

    Percentage of vote: 13.68%

  7. M103 (18 votes [18.95%])

    Percentage of vote: 18.95%

  8. Mäuschen (9 votes [9.47%])

    Percentage of vote: 9.47%

  9. Object 257 (3 votes [3.16%])

    Percentage of vote: 3.16%

  10. Object 705 (7 votes [7.37%])

    Percentage of vote: 7.37%

  11. ST-I (1 vote [1.05%])

    Percentage of vote: 1.05%

  12. T-10 (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  13. Type 4 Heavy (4 votes [4.21%])

    Percentage of vote: 4.21%

  14. VK 45.02 (P) Ausf. B (7 votes [7.37%])

    Percentage of vote: 7.37%

  15. WZ-111 model 1-4 (1 vote [1.05%])

    Percentage of vote: 1.05%

Which Tier 9 TDs are NOT worth it?

  1. AMX 50 Foch (15 votes [21.13%])

    Percentage of vote: 21.13%

  2. FV4004 Conway (11 votes [15.49%])

    Percentage of vote: 15.49%

  3. Jagdtiger (9 votes [12.68%])

    Percentage of vote: 12.68%

  4. Object 263 (2 votes [2.82%])

    Percentage of vote: 2.82%

  5. Object 704 (6 votes [8.45%])

    Percentage of vote: 8.45%

  6. Strv 103-0 (7 votes [9.86%])

    Percentage of vote: 9.86%

  7. T30 (1 vote [1.41%])

    Percentage of vote: 1.41%

  8. T95 (1 vote [1.41%])

    Percentage of vote: 1.41%

  9. Tortoise (1 vote [1.41%])

    Percentage of vote: 1.41%

  10. Waffenträger auf Pz. IV (5 votes [7.04%])

    Percentage of vote: 7.04%

  11. WZ-111G FT (13 votes [18.31%])

    Percentage of vote: 18.31%

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undutchable80 #1 Posted 16 January 2019 - 02:07 PM

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Hiya tankers,

 

We have plenty of topics on the state of T8 MM and how many T8 tanks because of it are "(currently) not worth it" even though there are a couple that hold up well enough (depending on your own skill level and playstyle preference of course). I see plenty of YT vids on which T10 tanks are great and which not so great, and there are also several posts on the state of T10 gameplay. However, since a lot of you consider T9 to be the sweetspot due to +1/-2 MM, it got me wondering: which tier 9 tanks are NOT worth it (=grinding to / keeping / etc).

 

In part I ask this question out of sheer curiosity given the lack of topics on this particular subject, and also for myself personally. I only have 3 Tier 9 tanks so far and 0 Tier 10 tanks. Even though I am enjoying myself, I do struggle enough with T8-9 gameplay and so I dont have plans to play TX anytime soon even though there are a couple I want to get in my garage for when I do feel I am ready (M48 Patton, IS7, Super Conqueror, etc)

 

Given my limited experience, the only T9 tank up front I can think of is the M103 (also since the T110E5 is also meh), but which (other) T9 tanks are not worth getting in your opinion and why? Is the Tier 10 that follows it also not worth it, or maybe it is? Looking forward to reading your opinions!

 

Cheers,

~Dutch

 

EDIT: Due to the number of responses I decided to add a poll for better overview. Even if you commented below, please take 20 secs of your time and use the voting buttons. :great:


Edited by undutchable80, 18 January 2019 - 08:39 AM.


Black_Coyote #2 Posted 16 January 2019 - 02:26 PM

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M46 Patton ... Imo.

kaneloon #3 Posted 16 January 2019 - 02:33 PM

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The question is pretty difficult as one will like what the other hate, and some difficult tanks for beginners are magic in certain hands.

For instance I like the Type 61, but lots of players will tell you it's a poor tank.

 

Besides t9 is an easy tiers : tiers 10 gun vs tiers 7 ...

 

I would say : any tiers 9 which you don't want the tiers 10.



FluffyRedFox #4 Posted 16 January 2019 - 02:33 PM

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Obviously subjected to my own opinion but -

Conway

Type 61

M4 51

Were all really unfun to play for me that I wanted to get rid off asap.



Dava_117 #5 Posted 16 January 2019 - 02:35 PM

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Tier 9 is quite balanced, but if I have to say a tank that feels meh, would say it's the M103. As soon as I discovered the armour models the M103 stopped to scare me even on tier 7 tanks. 

bstb3 #6 Posted 16 January 2019 - 02:39 PM

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Foch TD, all day long. Painful to grind to, painful to play, nothing special to look forward too at tier 10 either, apart from more of the same but with 2 extra shells. 

 

edit to add, will suck even harder with its poor aim time, bad bloom and limited gun traverse once wheeled vehicles show up. Truly a horror.


Edited by bstb3, 16 January 2019 - 02:44 PM.


OMG_Abaddon #7 Posted 16 January 2019 - 02:42 PM

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I recently got M103 and can't believe that after all the line playing hull down strong and confident I get a T9 with 25mm turret armor. What kind of sick joke is this?

 

The top turret doesn't even patch the top, I can be pen'd above and below the gun by everyone, with a massive worthless hull that seldom bounces, and an ammo rack that usually gets hit on every single shot.

And yeah, the top gun is overexpensive compared to the cost to research the next tank directly, and only adds minimal stats.


Edited by OMG_Abaddon, 16 January 2019 - 02:46 PM.


Simeon85 #8 Posted 16 January 2019 - 03:10 PM

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From my experience -

 

Competitive + Fun/versatile - M46 Patton, E50, Obj. 430, Conqueror, AMX M4 51, E75, 13-90, Skoda T50, AMX 30, Bat Chat AP, T-55A, 

 

Competitive but may not be fun/versatile depending on playstyle/taste - T95, Tortoise, Type 4, Obj. 263, Mauschen, VKB, 705, T30, T-54

 

Average - T-10, T-54 ltw, T49, Cent 7/1, Standard B, 50TP, Emil 2, ST-I, WZ-111 1-4, Jagdtiger, 704, Waffle IV, Leopard PTA. 

 

Probably average but I didn't like -  WZ-132A, WZ-120, Foch, Strv 103, 257

 

Just bad - RU 251, 430 v2, T54E1, Type 61, 50 120, M103, Conway. 

 

Don't play arty, but if you have to play a tier 9 we all know the M53/M55 is one of the best tier for tier in the game.

 

All my opinions of course, not played every tank live (almost though), others on test and if you want a particular reason as to why a tank is in whatever category just ask, but can't be bothered to explain it for so many tanks.

 

I'd also say the difference between bad and good is not as far apart as it is on most tiers, there is for example not really a tier 9 Bobject or Defender, nor a tier 9 Rhm. Panzerwagon or CDC etc.

 

EDIT Missed PTA & 257

 


Edited by Simeon85, 16 January 2019 - 04:10 PM.


tank276 #9 Posted 16 January 2019 - 03:24 PM

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WZ 120 chinese tier 9 med, it is just too bad.

pathed91 #10 Posted 16 January 2019 - 03:33 PM

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View PostSimeon85, on 16 January 2019 - 03:10 PM, said:

From my experience -

 

Average - T-10

 

 

The T-10 is just average? I thought that it was seen by the community as one of the better tanks at tier 9. Is it still worth getting if you are not interested in the tier 10? I just started grinding towards it and I wouldn't want to continue if it has been powercrept to be just mediocre. 



MeNoobTank #11 Posted 16 January 2019 - 03:34 PM

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Tier 9 is in general very good and balanced. Even there though there are some tanks that need a slightly buff (on some even a bigger buff). Only from my experience:

 

-WZ-120 (really bad grind and after all the pain you get a meh tank,

-T54E1 is a very hard to play T9, it need some love too, but sometimes you can get 5k - 6k damage games with the help of that x4 clip 390 alpha gun.

-Strv 103 I do not find a big imporvement from UDES, the tank is meh (all the Swedish TDs are very map and team dependent but this one feels just like an up tiered UDES with nothing more.

 

Other than those I find tier 9 a good tier. Maybe Emil II needs some gun handling buff, same to WZ-111 1-4 because the combo of low pen guns with very bad aim and accuracy is just not working.

14:35 Added after 0 minutes

View Postpathed91, on 16 January 2019 - 03:33 PM, said:

 

The T-10 is just average? I thought that it was seen by the community as one of the better tanks at tier 9. Is it still worth getting if you are not interested in the tier 10? I just started grinding towards it and I wouldn't want to continue if it has been powercrept to be just mediocre. 

 

IDK why he say that. T-10 is a very good T9 tank. Same for T-54.

kaneloon #12 Posted 16 January 2019 - 03:36 PM

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View PostSimeon85, on 16 January 2019 - 02:10 PM, said:

Average - T-10, T-54 ltw, T49, Cent 7/1, Standard B, 50TP, Emil 2, ST-I, WZ-111 1-4, Jagdtiger, 704, Waffle IV, 

 

Just bad - RU 251, 430 v2, T54E1, Type 61, 50 120, M103, Conway, Type 61.

 

T10, Emil 2, ST-1 : I  found them quite good.

And I heard good things about Standard B

 

Poor type 61, bad twice ...



Grimmx #13 Posted 16 January 2019 - 03:46 PM

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Any tank i need to spam gold in is a no-no for me.

 

Sure i always bring a few but thats it.

I love tanks like the M46 Patton and E50 but dont play them because basic pen sucks.

 

But thats me.

 



Soup_Potato #14 Posted 16 January 2019 - 03:47 PM

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View PostSimeon85, on 16 January 2019 - 03:10 PM, said:

Just bad - 430 v2, T54E1, 50 120, Conway

 

The complete list seems weird from my personal point of view, which of course shines light to the fact that we all have our preferences.

 

The ones I left there are actually my current favorites and I wonder what makes them so bad for you. Is it the usual ones people say? I wonder have you played said tanks recently or base your dislikes to the old memories (I used to hate T30 but now it's a fun tank to play even with a no-skill crew)? 403V2 for sure is worse in some aspects than the previous iteration but it still is enjoyable to play. 50 120 and T54E1 are just brilliant autoloaders. I've played maybe 20-30 battles recently with the T54E1 and just once I was crippled with the pen it has. I had to fight a Type 5 frontally. Decided to load gold and managed to pen 1/4 in the cuppola and then gave up. Other than that the tank has been very smooth and works through the enemies nicely, with that high alpha autoloader. 50 120 the same thing, it's just deadly. Conway with the derp gun is like miniature sh*tbarn.

 

In short I'm actually surprised you listed those tanks as the bottom of the list and if you haven't played them recently, I do recommend you to try them.


Edited by Soup_Potato, 16 January 2019 - 03:48 PM.


Simeon85 #15 Posted 16 January 2019 - 03:48 PM

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View Postpathed91, on 16 January 2019 - 03:33 PM, said:

 

The T-10 is just average? I thought that it was seen by the community as one of the better tanks at tier 9. Is it still worth getting if you are not interested in the tier 10? I just started grinding towards it and I wouldn't want to continue if it has been powercrept to be just mediocre. 

 

View Postkaneloon, on 16 January 2019 - 03:36 PM, said:

 

 

T10, Emil 2, ST-1 : I  found them quite good.

And I heard good things about Standard B

 

Poor type 61, bad twice ...

 

T-10 IMO has been power crept.

 

It comes from an era when there were few 'heaviums' where generally mediums were mediums and heavies were heavies, and something that was a bit of crossover was different and that gave it value, despite it being weaker in armour to heavies and less agile/mobile with worse gun handling than meds. Now we have stuff like the 430U or the buffed IS7 etc. that seem to have the best attributes of heavies and meds in one package with little weakness. 

 

Now I'd say the 430 pretty much does a better job in this role, it's pretty much got as good armour, its more mobile, more agile, has better gun handling and more camo.

 

It's not a bad tank though.

 

ST-I IMO has very solid armour but its slow and has a bad gun, AMX M4 51 basically does the same thing but is faster with better gun handling, Conqueror has a way better gun, has similar mobility and is stronger hull down, just has a worst hull. 

 

Emil 2 is situational, the clip speed and DPM combo makes it hard to keep up with the fast paces snowlball games to actually do anything and to me instead of making a fun and unique tier 10, they pretty much just took the tier 10, made it 10% worse in every way and called it a tier 9. 

 

View PostSoup_Potato, on 16 January 2019 - 03:47 PM, said:

The complete list seems weird from my personal point of view, which of course shines light to the fact that we all have our preferences.

 

The ones I left there are actually my current favorites and I wonder what makes them so bad for you. I wonder have you played said tanks recently? 403V2 for sure is worse in some aspects than the previous iteration but it still is enjoyable to play. 50 120 and T54E1 are just brilliant autoloaders. I've played maybe 20-30 battles recently with the T54E1 and just once I was crippled with the pen it has. I had to fight a Type 5 frontally. Decided to load gold and managed to pen 1/4 in the cuppola and then gave up. Other than that the tank has been very smooth and works through the enemies nicely, with that high alpha autoloader. 50 120 the same thing, it's just deadly. Conway with the derp gun is like miniature sh*tbarn.

 

In short I'm actually surprised you listed those tanks as the bottom of the list and if you haven't played them recently, I do recommend you to try them.

 

 

Haven't played the 50120 recently, but considering the 50b, which tier for tier is much better, is struggling in the current meta I don't see how the 50120 is any good compared to when I played it (when the 50b was a lot stronger and considered good). IIRC the only thing they have changed with the 50120 is the gun depression.

 

Which means the large size, bad gun elevation, no armour and very slow intra-clip are still massive weaknesses. I don;t particularly see the point of an autoloader that takes over 3s to fire the next shot, it just means your clip exposure is too long (and you are huge and weak) and it means more often then not people get away.

 

Played both the 430v2 and Conway recently, both are bad IMO. 430v2 is a completely pointless tank and they ruined a unique and strong tank IMO. It has an awkward rear turret, bad gun depression and all the problems those two aspects cause, but has nothing compensatory for it, there is nothing particularly good about its gun handling, DPM, penetration etc. (unlike the K-91 for example which also gets good gun depression to the sides) and its lost its armour, it used to be a sidescraping monster and that turned the rear turret weakness into something of a strength, which has now gone.

 

Conway is just meh, with the 120mm you are a bad Conqueror that trades almost everything for DPM, with the 5.5 inch gun you are bad T30. You have no higher pen to deal with all the OP armour and the HESH shell is completely unreliable, costs an absolute fortune and still does barely anymore damage than the 750 alpha tier 9 TDs that actually have pen. Then it generally has horrible gun handling, huge size, not great camo and no armour. 

 

T54E1 has IIRC had no buffs for years so is what it always was, a slow medium, with poor gun handling, bad pen, no real armour and just that clip. I mean compare it to a Skoda T50 and thus you'll see why its bad. 

 


Edited by Simeon85, 16 January 2019 - 03:58 PM.


TungstenHitman #16 Posted 16 January 2019 - 03:53 PM

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View PostMeNoobTank, on 16 January 2019 - 02:34 PM, said:

 

-Strv 103 I do not find a big imporvement from UDES, the tank is meh (all the Swedish TDs are very map and team dependent but this one feels just like an up tiered UDES with nothing more.

 

 

What you gain over the UDES is that classic Swedish wedge armor, a massive 50% jump in hp so you can basically tank more shots and last longer, a noticeably big gain in reload time which feels really slow with the UDES when a flank is being pushed and u just badly need to put shots down field, 20 more standard pen, a nice boost to shell sped(though the UDES is plenty fast), more ammo and it switches from siege mode to travel mode quicker which means that when that 6th sense goes off, you don't have to bite your bottom lip or grit your teeth in anticipation of eating a monster shot for as long as you would with the UDES. For that, it loses a lot of mobility, a lot of top speed and for some reason that lazer accurate gun is no longer as sharp and reliable as it is on the UDES which sort of makes no sense since the ONLY reason you take on these highly situational, very limited tanks that suck at everything else, is for that reliable sniper rifle ability so... ya, strange decision that one. 



BlackBloodBandit #17 Posted 16 January 2019 - 03:55 PM

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Very strange replies here..

 

View PostBlack_Coyote, on 16 January 2019 - 02:26 PM, said:

M46 Patton ... Imo.

It's considered to be one of the best, also from own experience. It's a dpm monster and gun handling is great.

View PostFluffyRedFox, on 16 January 2019 - 02:33 PM, said:

Obviously subjected to my own opinion but -

Conway

Type 61

M4 51

Were all really unfun to play for me that I wanted to get rid off asap.

Type 61 and M4 51 are also pretty good. M4 51 is also considered the best tank in the line and a lot better then the tier 10 version.

 

WZ 111 1-4, T-10 and ST-1 are also considered good tanks and I have to agree to that. T-10: good mobility, gun handling, pen and dpm. ST-1 might have bad gun handling, but it can still dash out consistent damage, while having good armor to hold enemies off, even against high tier premium shells.

WZ 1-4 has pretty good gun handling, awesome damage per shot and good mobility. Personally I find this one better then T-10, simply because of having better damage per shot.

 

 

View PostMeNoobTank, on 16 January 2019 - 03:34 PM, said:

-Strv 103 I do not find a big imporvement from UDES, the tank is meh (all the Swedish TDs are very map and team dependent but this one feels just like an up tiered UDES with nothing more.

 

Other than those I find tier 9 a good tier. Maybe Emil II needs some gun handling buff, same to WZ-111 1-4 because the combo of low pen guns with very bad aim and accuracy is just not working.

Also I don't get why you describe WZ-111 having a low pen gun? 244 is fine.

Haven't played STRV 103, but from what I've heard and own knowledge, it is for sure an improvement. It doesn't get over matched by guns as easily as the Udes does. Pen goes up with over 300mm (308), 2 shots per min more, base dpm increase with 750.

 

The ones I don't find competitive enough and partly a big part of the community (read in other topics and speaking with other players)

Leopard PTA, gun handling is meh as well as the reload.

T54E1, bad gun handling and a very long reload.

 

AMX 50 120, it's a fun tank to play, but you have to keep in mind: gun handling isn't the best. Long reload (also between the shots), but high damage per clip.



Laatikkomafia #18 Posted 16 January 2019 - 04:02 PM

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Sadly, the M103. I think the E75, ST-1, some mediums and some TDs are obsolete as well, in different ways.

BlackBloodBandit #19 Posted 16 January 2019 - 04:02 PM

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View PostSimeon85, on 16 January 2019 - 03:48 PM, said:

T-10 IMO has been power crept. I doubt that players who do good in it, agree with you.

 

It comes from an era when there were few 'heaviums' where generally mediums were mediums and heavies were heavies, and something that was a bit of crossover was different and that gave it value, despite it being weaker in armour to heavies and less agile/mobile with worse gun handling than meds. Now we have stuff like the 430U or the buffed IS7 etc. that seem to have the best attributes of heavies and meds in one package with little weakness. IS-7 is not bad, but it certainly is a lot different from T-10. Mobility is a lot worse (traverse speed especially and ground resistances), so it loses more speed when turning. Gun handling is a LOT worse then on T-10.

 

ST-I IMO has very solid armour but its slow and has a bad gun, AMX M4 51 basically does the same thing but is faster with better gun handling, Conqueror has a way better gun, has similar mobility and is stronger hull down, just has a worst hull. ST-1 has a smaller profile and cupola is not that much of a weak spot, compared to AMX. Gun handling is only good on the 120mm gun, as the 127mm gun doesn't have good soft gun stats. Conqueror is also very strong, but much more vulnerable to artillery fire (bad top armor and bigger profile) and 2nd on the list is AMX M4 (high profile and bad top armor).

 



ValkyrionX #20 Posted 16 January 2019 - 04:06 PM

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tier 9 obj705..the most stupid tier 9 in the game..and the Type 4 too 




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