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WG, do you even know math? I think you don't.


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YOHIO_BG #1 Posted 19 January 2019 - 05:48 PM

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Here's why: the basic dispersion of the Strv S1's gun is 40 cm per 100 meters which means for 300 meters shot the shell will land in 1.2 meters from the desired point in any direction. Brothers in arms adds 5% improvement (0.02), ventilation adds 5% (0.02). That's 10% of the base dispersion. 10% of 0.4 is 0.04. Therefore the dispersion should become 0.36. If you add a directive (ventilation for 2.5%) that's 0.01, so it should become 0.35. Food gives 10% improvement from the base dispersion which means 0.04. 0.35 minus 0.04 makes 0.31 dispersion.

Instead, with BIA and ventilation the dispersion drops down to 0.38, adding the 2.5% ventilation drops it down to 0.37 and with food it becomes 0.36.

 

And these things don't work properly on camouflage either. The basic camo is 24.05%. Camo net adds 15%, crew skill adds 19.35%, ventilation - 5%, BIA - 5%, additional ventilation - 2.5%, food - 10%. Sum these numbers - they make 80.9. Which means that if you knew math, the camouflage of the Strv S1 should be 80.9% when stationary (in siege mode)!!!

Instead, with BIA and ventilation, the 2.5% ventilation, camo net and food the camo factor is only 66%.

 

The only thing you've done right about this tank is the view range, altough the actual view range ever since game version 1.0.0 is more like 5 meters...

 

P.S. If I check my other tanks, I'm quite sure I'll find the same discrepancies with them too.


Edited by YOHIO_BG, 19 January 2019 - 05:51 PM.


Orkbert #2 Posted 19 January 2019 - 05:52 PM

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The improvement is not a linear but more of a logarithmic relation. Sorry to hear that your education didn't get that far.

UrQuan #3 Posted 19 January 2019 - 05:55 PM

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Error in your calculations, Brothers in arms & Vents each add 5% to crew skills, not tank properties. So no it doesn't give a direct 10% reduction to your gun dispersion, but a gun dispersion reduction by the increased skill of the crew, given by these two bonuses (which is less then 10%)

Edit: food also adds to crew skills, not directly to tank properties.


Edited by UrQuan, 19 January 2019 - 05:59 PM.


ThinGun #4 Posted 19 January 2019 - 05:57 PM

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View PostYOHIO_BG, on 19 January 2019 - 05:48 PM, said:

Some poorly thought out calculations that relate to OP's vision of what HE expects, rather than the WG's published version.

 

Yes.  Or maybe no.

BR33K1_PAWAH #5 Posted 19 January 2019 - 05:59 PM

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5% to crew skill = 2.5% to an actual stat

 

OP, learn how game work first, so you wont embarrass yourself.



SiliconSidewinder #6 Posted 19 January 2019 - 06:01 PM

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red is mod color, please change that.

 



Kartoshkaya #7 Posted 19 January 2019 - 06:03 PM

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View PostYOHIO_BG, on 19 January 2019 - 05:48 PM, said:

Here's why: the basic dispersion of the Strv S1's gun is 40 cm per 100 meters which means for 300 meters shot the shell will land in 1.2 meters from the desired point in any direction. Brothers in arms adds 5% improvement (0.02), ventilation adds 5% (0.02). That's 10% of the base dispersion. 10% of 0.4 is 0.04. Therefore the dispersion should become 0.36. If you add a directive (ventilation for 2.5%) that's 0.01, so it should become 0.35. Food gives 10% improvement from the base dispersion which means 0.04. 0.35 minus 0.04 makes 0.31 dispersion.

Instead, with BIA and ventilation the dispersion drops down to 0.38, adding the 2.5% ventilation drops it down to 0.37 and with food it becomes 0.36.

 

And these things don't work properly on camouflage either. The basic camo is 24.05%. Camo net adds 15%, crew skill adds 19.35%, ventilation - 5%, BIA - 5%, additional ventilation - 2.5%, food - 10%. Sum these numbers - they make 80.9. Which means that if you knew math, the camouflage of the Strv S1 should be 80.9% when stationary (in siege mode)!!!

Instead, with BIA and ventilation, the 2.5% ventilation, camo net and food the camo factor is only 66%.

 

The only thing you've done right about this tank is the view range, altough the actual view range ever since game version 1.0.0 is more like 5 meters...

 

P.S. If I check my other tanks, I'm quite sure I'll find the same discrepancies with them too.

 

Are you going to open a thread about each stats of the strv ?

Homer_J #8 Posted 19 January 2019 - 06:16 PM

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View PostYOHIO_BG, on 19 January 2019 - 04:48 PM, said:

Here's why: the basic dispersion of the Strv S1's gun is 40 cm per 100 meters which means for 300 meters shot the shell will land in 1.2 meters from the desired point in any direction. Brothers in arms adds 5% improvement (0.02), ventilation adds 5% (0.02).

 

Well I've already spotted where the problem is and it's not Wargaming's maths.

 

You really need to do a bit of research on game mechanics.

 

5% skill isn't 5% improvement, it depends on what the initial level was but at 100% it's around 2.5%, the higher you go the less you get for every %age point.


Edited by Homer_J, 19 January 2019 - 06:19 PM.


QPoszto #9 Posted 19 January 2019 - 06:22 PM

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View PostYOHIO_BG, on 19 January 2019 - 05:48 PM, said:

Here's why: the basic dispersion of the Strv S1's gun is 40 cm per 100 meters which means for 300 meters shot the shell will land in 1.2 meters from the desired point in any direction. Brothers in arms adds 5% improvement (0.02), ventilation adds 5% (0.02). That's 10% of the base dispersion. 10% of 0.4 is 0.04. Therefore the dispersion should become 0.36. If you add a directive (ventilation for 2.5%) that's 0.01, so it should become 0.35. Food gives 10% improvement from the base dispersion which means 0.04. 0.35 minus 0.04 makes 0.31 dispersion.

Instead, with BIA and ventilation the dispersion drops down to 0.38, adding the 2.5% ventilation drops it down to 0.37 and with food it becomes 0.36.

 

And these things don't work properly on camouflage either. The basic camo is 24.05%. Camo net adds 15%, crew skill adds 19.35%, ventilation - 5%, BIA - 5%, additional ventilation - 2.5%, food - 10%. Sum these numbers - they make 80.9. Which means that if you knew math, the camouflage of the Strv S1 should be 80.9% when stationary (in siege mode)!!!

Instead, with BIA and ventilation, the 2.5% ventilation, camo net and food the camo factor is only 66%.

 

The only thing you've done right about this tank is the view range, altough the actual view range ever since game version 1.0.0 is more like 5 meters...

 

P.S. If I check my other tanks, I'm quite sure I'll find the same discrepancies with them too.

U do it wrong bro. Try to count in bugjects u will have higher result as it have to be i think. But these are just numbers.. i dont have any trust in this trash company. Grille 15 0.24 accuracy is the best example of it.



PervyPastryPuffer #10 Posted 19 January 2019 - 06:26 PM

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This is why players with 363 battles should stick to the newcomers' forum section.

YOHIO_BG #11 Posted 19 January 2019 - 06:39 PM

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View PostUrQuan, on 19 January 2019 - 05:55 PM, said:

Error in your calculations, Brothers in arms & Vents each add 5% to crew skills, not tank properties. So no it doesn't give a direct 10% reduction to your gun dispersion, but a gun dispersion reduction by the increased skill of the crew, given by these two bonuses (which is less then 10%)

Edit: food also adds to crew skills, not directly to tank properties.

 

Tell that to the game - when BIA reaches 100%, the dispersion improves, so yes, BIA does improve tank stats.
17:40 Added after 0 minutes

View PostPervyPastryPuffer, on 19 January 2019 - 06:26 PM, said:

This is why players with 363 battles should stick to the newcomers' forum section.

 

You know where to stick that statement, do you? Especially when you're blind like a bat and don't even care to read my signature.

Balc0ra #12 Posted 19 January 2019 - 06:49 PM

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View PostYOHIO_BG, on 19 January 2019 - 05:48 PM, said:

The only thing you've done right about this tank is the view range, altough the actual view range ever since game version 1.0.0 is more like 5 meters...

 

They know math about as much as you know mechanics. So let's just call it a draw. 



arthurwellsley #13 Posted 19 January 2019 - 07:05 PM

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View PostYOHIO_BG, on 19 January 2019 - 04:48 PM, said:

Here's why: the basic dispersion of the Strv S1's gun is 40 cm per 100 meters which means for 300 meters shot the shell will land in 1.2 meters from the desired point in any direction.

Brothers in arms adds 5% improvement (0.02), No it is not that simple. BIA adds 5% to the training level of the crew man in his major qualification. Thus it makes the gunner 5% more effective. He will therefore Aim a little faster, he will be a little more accurate, and if a tank has a turret the turret will turn slightly quicker.

 

ventilation adds 5% (0.02). No it is not that simple. Vents also adds to the crew skill in the way that BIA does.

 

That's 10% of the base dispersion. 10% of 0.4 is 0.04.  This is therefore straight up wrong the two 5%'s do not get added to base dispersion in a calculation in the way that you have done it.

 

Therefore the dispersion should become 0.36. No that figure is wrong.

 

If you add a directive (ventilation for 2.5%) that's 0.01, so it should become 0.35.  No that is a misunderstanding of how directives work and your figure is wrong.

 

Food gives 10% improvement from the base dispersion which means 0.04. 0.35 minus 0.04 makes 0.31 dispersion.  No that is not how food works and again your figure is wrong.

 

Instead, with BIA and ventilation the dispersion drops down to 0.38, adding the 2.5% ventilation drops it down to 0.37 and with food it becomes 0.36. No it does not your figure is wrong.

 

To see your errors read the wiki as a starting point. Here = http://wiki.wargamin...t/en/Crew#Perks

 

And these things don't work properly on camouflage either. Thats because you have failed to work out how camo works, possibly because you have failed to read the wiki.

 

Try reading http://wiki.wargamin...ics#Visibility  before making even more errors and spreading even more false information.

 

The basic camo equation is = camoFactor = baseCamo * (0.00375 * camoSkill + 0.5) * camoAtShot + camoPattern + camoNet + environmentCamo

 

The basic camo is 24.05%.

 

Camo net adds 15%, crew skill adds 19.35%, ventilation - 5%, BIA - 5%, additional ventilation - 2.5%, food - 10%.  Wrong equation!

 

Sum these numbers - they make 80.9. Wrong!

 

Which means that if you knew math, the camouflage of the Strv S1 should be 80.9% when stationary (in siege mode)!!!  Wrong

 

Instead, with BIA and ventilation, the 2.5% ventilation, camo net and food the camo factor is only 66%. Because you used the wrong figures

 

Let's look at an example to see how it all comes together;

Say our spotting target has a baseCamo coefficient of 25% or 0.25 while standing still and 15% or 0.15 while moving the hull. The camoAtShot factor is 25% or 0.25 as well. The entire crew of 5 has 100% Camouflage skill level and the Commander has 100% primary skill level. Improved Ventilation equipment is installed. Our tank is sitting completely inside of a dense bush and has not been moving for more than 3 seconds.

The effective camouflage skill is:

(100 + 5 + (100 + 5 + (100 + 5) * 0.1) * 4) / 5 = 113.4

Should this calculation be confusing to you, remember that you need to factor in both the bonus from Improved Ventilation equipment as well as the Commander bonus. It would, however, be understandable if the calculation above still seems confusing, because there's no way to tell what those figures relate to unless you spend some minutes figuring out the equation. To make things easier for you, here's the above numbers explained:

(CommanderSkill + VentBonus + (CrewSkill + VentBonus + (CommanderSkill + VentBonus) * 0.1) * NumberOfNonCommanderCrewMembers)) / TotalNumberOfCrewMembersIncludingCommander = X

Now we can calculate the camouflage factor using the value for the effective camouflage factor:

0.25 * (0.00375 * 113.4 + 0.5) + 0.64 = 0.8713125 (87.13%)

As soon as our tank starts moving out of the bush, the camouflage factor is as follows:

0.15 * (0.00375 * 113.4 + 0.5) = 0.1387875 (13.88%)

 

The only thing you've done right about this tank is the view range, altough the actual view range ever since game version 1.0.0 is more like 5 meters  No proof given, wild allegation

 

P.S. If I check my other tanks, I'm quite sure I'll find the same discrepancies with them too. If you do the maths correctly there will be no discrepancies. If you do made up maths like yours without reading the wiki first and doing the equations wrong then you will find that your fake figures are different from the games calculations.

 

WG maths confirmed satisfactory.

 

OP either has difficulties with reading or comprehension because his posted figures are so very wrong.


Edited by arthurwellsley, 19 January 2019 - 07:10 PM.


Bordhaw #14 Posted 19 January 2019 - 07:20 PM

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View PostYOHIO_BG, on 19 January 2019 - 04:48 PM, said:

Here's why: the basic dispersion of the Strv S1's gun is 40 cm per 100 meters which means for 300 meters shot the shell will land in 1.2 meters from the desired point in any direction. Brothers in arms adds 5% improvement (0.02), ventilation adds 5% (0.02). That's 10% of the base dispersion. 10% of 0.4 is 0.04. Therefore the dispersion should become 0.36. If you add a directive (ventilation for 2.5%) that's 0.01, so it should become 0.35. Food gives 10% improvement from the base dispersion which means 0.04. 0.35 minus 0.04 makes 0.31 dispersion.

Instead, with BIA and ventilation the dispersion drops down to 0.38, adding the 2.5% ventilation drops it down to 0.37 and with food it becomes 0.36.

 

And these things don't work properly on camouflage either. The basic camo is 24.05%. Camo net adds 15%, crew skill adds 19.35%, ventilation - 5%, BIA - 5%, additional ventilation - 2.5%, food - 10%. Sum these numbers - they make 80.9. Which means that if you knew math, the camouflage of the Strv S1 should be 80.9% when stationary (in siege mode)!!!

Instead, with BIA and ventilation, the 2.5% ventilation, camo net and food the camo factor is only 66%.

 

The only thing you've done right about this tank is the view range, altough the actual view range ever since game version 1.0.0 is more like 5 meters...

 

P.S. If I check my other tanks, I'm quite sure I'll find the same discrepancies with them too.

 



wsatnutter #15 Posted 19 January 2019 - 07:29 PM

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View PostYOHIO_BG, on 19 January 2019 - 04:48 PM, said:

Here's why: the basic dispersion of the Strv S1's gun is 40 cm per 100 meters which means for 300 meters shot the shell will land in 1.2 meters from the desired point in any direction. Brothers in arms adds 5% improvement (0.02), ventilation adds 5% (0.02). That's 10% of the base dispersion. 10% of 0.4 is 0.04. Therefore the dispersion should become 0.36. If you add a directive (ventilation for 2.5%) that's 0.01, so it should become 0.35. Food gives 10% improvement from the base dispersion which means 0.04. 0.35 minus 0.04 makes 0.31 dispersion.

Instead, with BIA and ventilation the dispersion drops down to 0.38, adding the 2.5% ventilation drops it down to 0.37 and with food it becomes 0.36.

 

And these things don't work properly on camouflage either. The basic camo is 24.05%. Camo net adds 15%, crew skill adds 19.35%, ventilation - 5%, BIA - 5%, additional ventilation - 2.5%, food - 10%. Sum these numbers - they make 80.9. Which means that if you knew math, the camouflage of the Strv S1 should be 80.9% when stationary (in siege mode)!!!

Instead, with BIA and ventilation, the 2.5% ventilation, camo net and food the camo factor is only 66%.

 

The only thing you've done right about this tank is the view range, altough the actual view range ever since game version 1.0.0 is more like 5 meters...

 

P.S. If I check my other tanks, I'm quite sure I'll find the same discrepancies with them too.

 

THE CLUE IS IN THE LIKE

_6i6_ #16 Posted 19 January 2019 - 07:38 PM

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View Postwsatnutter, on 19 January 2019 - 08:29 PM, said:

 

THE CLUE IS IN THE LIKE

 

they should add a "like if qpranger likes this"

FatigueGalaxy #17 Posted 19 January 2019 - 07:40 PM

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View PostBR33K1_PAWAH, on 19 January 2019 - 05:59 PM, said:

5% to crew skill = 2.5% to an actual stat

 

OP, learn how game work first, so you wont embarrass yourself.

 

Actually, it's 3%, because of you get +1% from commander's bonus (so vents give +5% to a commander but +6% to all other crewmen).

BR33K1_PAWAH #18 Posted 19 January 2019 - 07:42 PM

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View PostFatigueGalaxy, on 19 January 2019 - 09:40 PM, said:

 

Actually, it's 3%, because of you get +1% from commander's bonus (so vents give +5% to a commander but +6% to all other crewmen).

 

:great:

AliceUnchained #19 Posted 19 January 2019 - 11:03 PM

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View PostBR33K1_PAWAH, on 19 January 2019 - 05:59 PM, said:

5% to crew skill = 2.5% to an actual stat

 

OP, learn how game work first, so you wont embarrass yourself.

 

Not exactly, as it depends on the original value. I've done extensive testing on view range enhancements some time ago, it's how I discovered that Situational Awareness at 0% actually gives +1 meter view range already (at least on vehicles with 310 m view range and up) when the Commander does not double as Radio Operator. Here's the table with % increase starting from 100%:

 

100% > 105% 2,143%
100% > 110% 4,286%
100% > 115% 6,429%
100% > 120% 8,571%
105% > 110% 2,098%
105% > 115% 4,196%
105% > 120% 6,294%
110% > 115% 2,055%
110% > 120% 4,110%
115% > 120% 2,013%

 

View PostFatigueGalaxy, on 19 January 2019 - 07:40 PM, said:

Actually, it's 3%, because of you get +1% from commander's bonus (so vents give +5% to a commander but +6% to all other crewmen).

 

Actually, it's not. See the above table. I could add 110% > 115,5% as that is what would happen with a 100% crew in a vehicle after Vents are installed, but it won't be much more. Same for 115,5% > 121%, 121% > 126,5%, and 126,5% > 132%

 


Edited by AliceUnchained, 19 January 2019 - 11:13 PM.


Soup_Potato #20 Posted 19 January 2019 - 11:37 PM

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View Postwsatnutter, on 19 January 2019 - 07:29 PM, said:

 

THE CLUE IS IN THE LIKE

 

I'm just wondering here do people try to be a qpranger or did they actually agree with this kind of posts... Often there is other people liking along with the hamster.




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