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BAD Players | a few questions about them

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GotMommysCreditCardYay #41 Posted 21 January 2019 - 11:13 AM

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View PostOIias_of_Sunhillow, on 21 January 2019 - 10:59 AM, said:

Does the OP consider himself a bad player, or a good player ?

 

irrelevant, it's about toxicity.

and since im not toxic - my account is irrelevant

View PostWoT_RU_Doing, on 21 January 2019 - 10:58 AM, said:

 

That depends on why the player is playing - without knowing the answer to that you can't actually tell that they are bad. For example, even good players when attempting blocked damage missions often achieve less damage than they might normally. Equally, for genuinely bad players, there are still many incentives to play. It could be that they just want to get the XP for the next module or tank, or it could be a personal mission for example. In the case of the latter it is well known that some missions positively encourage YOLO plays. They may also be chasing a personal goal. When I first started playing, I decided I wanted to get the medals for killing every type of tech tree tank in the game. Mostly I did this tier by tier, though some rarely played tanks were on my list for a long time. This dictated what tiers I played, and HOW I played - if a tank on my kill list appeared in battle, that was it, all thoughts of winning, teamplay, etc were thrown out the window without checking that it was open first.- the only important thing was locate that tank and get the final shot on it. If I got one shot in the  whole battle, for 3 HP, but killed the tank, I'd have been happy.

So, like I say,,it's impossible to judge anyone's performance in this game based on even a few battles unless you know what they are measuring themselves against.

 

As pointed out in one of the previous posts, the majority of players are below average according to XVM, so most of the toxicity will be there - I  don't believe toxicity has any relationship to the stats at all, but reflects their frustration. Again, we can't know the cause of the frustration without knowing what they want out of the game. Unfortunately the anonymity of the game, and the existing toxicity levels, breed further toxicity. WG has recently taken some steps to reduce it, but they'll need to really work hard to bring the game toxicity permanently down.

   .

 

very true, al though i think i found the missing piece of the puzzle right now by reading your post.

lets say (just an example, im not using accurate numbers) 70% of players are bad, and 30% of players are good.

and lets say 50% of gamers are toxic. (this would indicate 35% of the bad players are toxic and 15% of the good players are toxic)

and what everyone previously stated is that obviously i will encounter the 35% toxic bad players more than the 15% toxic good players right?

BUTTTTTTTTTT consider this: refusing to become a better player and learn from your mistakes = more immature. So we can conclude that ''bad'' players are more immature than good players right? because they dont want to improve and dont even try. (i know there are a lot of variables for why people play and this might dictate why they are bad etc though, al though this can also be the opposite for being a variable for why there are good players, so lets exclude these variables because i think they might even out in the long-term.) 

So: if bad players = more immature than good players, then they will also actually be more toxic because of their immaturity !!!! ok im actually glad i figured this out with you guys' help now :)



SABAOTH #42 Posted 21 January 2019 - 11:14 AM

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I love Internet because you can find any sort of things.

 

You might even find people bragging about behaving like garbage if you got faith. :coin:



Rati_Festa #43 Posted 21 January 2019 - 11:17 AM

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View PostGotMommysCreditCardYay, on 21 January 2019 - 10:50 AM, said:

 

well yes but again: i was trying to find the thought process behind the toxicity of the bad players are part of the problem

 

 

Frustration, at the game and probably unknowingly frustrated with themselves for being bad at it, would be my best guess. I have a 9 yo who plays Fortnight, he has little strops when he doesn't win :) and blames everything/one other than himself. My 13 yo also plays it but is more mature and reflective, she doesn't have strops :) . It would appear we have a vast amount of players with the mental attributes of the average 9 yo.

 

I posted recently about being vented at by players with orange stats... calling me a noob, I have green stats. When I explain to them logically that in fact there is only one "noob" in the conversation they then usually start insulting female members of my family. I have great fun poking proverbial wasps nests :)

 

The negative I take from this is that I like a game that attracts a vast number of the mentally immature also like.



WoT_RU_Doing #44 Posted 21 January 2019 - 11:20 AM

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View PostGotMommysCreditCardYay, on 21 January 2019 - 10:13 AM, said:

 

BUTTTTTTTTTT consider this: refusing to become a better player and learn from your mistakes = more immature. So we can conclude that ''bad'' players are more immature than good players right? because they dont want to improve and dont even try. (i know there are a lot of variables for why people play and this might dictate why they are bad etc though, al though this can also be the opposite for being a variable for why there are good players, so lets exclude these variables because i think they might even out in the long-term.) 

So: if bad players = more immature than good players, then they will also actually be more toxic because of their immaturity !!!! ok im actually glad i figured this out with you guys' help now :)

 

I don't believe anyone does that - they might claim it but most often that is a cover up for their own perception of inadequacy. Now consider this, if everyone improves at the same rate, no-one gets relatively better. In real terms, this means that overtime, some-one who is actually gradually improving their skills will drop in stats because so many better players are improving faster, regardless of how many new players come in below them.

I also don't believe maturity and skill are especially related, especially in this game. I'm "mature", but quite capable of toxicity on occasion


Edited by WoT_RU_Doing, 21 January 2019 - 11:22 AM.


GotMommysCreditCardYay #45 Posted 21 January 2019 - 11:25 AM

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View PostRati_Festa, on 21 January 2019 - 11:17 AM, said:

 

Frustration, at the game and probably unknowingly frustrated with themselves for being bad at it, would be my best guess. I have a 9 yo who plays Fortnight, he has little strops when he doesn't win :) and blames everything/one other than himself. My 13 yo also plays it but is more mature and reflective, she doesn't have strops :) . It would appear we have a vast amount of players with the mental attributes of the average 9 yo.

 

I posted recently about being vented at by players with orange stats... calling me a noob, I have green stats. When I explain to them logically that in fact there is only one "noob" in the conversation they then usually start insulting female members of my family. I have great fun poking proverbial wasps nests :)

 

The negative I take from this is that I like a game that attracts a vast number of the mentally immature also like.

 

yeah, dont know if u read my previous post, but i came to a satisfying conclusion :)

OIias_of_Sunhillow #46 Posted 21 January 2019 - 11:25 AM

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View PostGotMommysCreditCardYay, on 21 January 2019 - 10:13 AM, said:

 

irrelevant, it's about toxicity.

 

 

 

The title of this thread, 'Bad Players, A Few Questions'.

 

How is my question irrelevant ?


Edited by OIias_of_Sunhillow, 21 January 2019 - 11:28 AM.


Babbet_1 #47 Posted 21 January 2019 - 11:27 AM

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View PostGotMommysCreditCardYay, on 21 January 2019 - 08:43 AM, said:

 Theoretically lets say there are 2 ways to play this game, trying to be good and trying to be average/very bad.

 

Well, I know which way I play (admittedly not with a huge amount of success), but which way do you play? (Considering that both of us have a pretty poor WR)  :sceptic:



GotMommysCreditCardYay #48 Posted 21 January 2019 - 11:48 AM

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View PostOIias_of_Sunhillow, on 21 January 2019 - 11:25 AM, said:

 

 

The title of this thread, 'Bad Players, A Few Questions'.

 

How is my question irrelevant ?

 

and my questions was surrounding toxicity and if someone plays badly on purpose. i guess your question is sort of relevant but at the same time irrelevant, it's a 50-50 xD

and to answer your question: well my stats are HORRRRRRRRRRRRIIIIIBLEEEEE but... /EndsSentence

 

View PostBabbet_1, on 21 January 2019 - 11:27 AM, said:

 

Well, I know which way I play (admittedly not with a huge amount of success), but which way do you play? (Considering that both of us have a pretty poor WR)  :sceptic:

 

actually i was wrong sorry, there are 3 categories, 1. trying to be good, 2. trying to be average, 3. trying to be bad, i put #2 and #3 in the same category but there is actually a huge difference, im just playing at the #2 category sometimes... i dont really enjoy the defender/is3a/e25/lefh, i really dislike all these tiers, im just getting enough free exp to get to a tier9 before i will consistently try and play good. and i'll admit that there has been times where i've fallen within all 3 categories comfortably, al though if i am in category #3 it is for ''valid'' reasons in my eyes, for example each team has 5 heavies on Overlord and then all our heavies decide to go beach, the chances of winning such a game is like 0.01% and then it feels pointless to even attempt to win a game so in times like that; i just try get to the next battle :| 

also if i see it is a 100% loss for sure, or a 100% win for sure, i actually try to do 0 damage because this destroys my stats and i wont receive xvm focus because of it, im NOT throwing the games by doing this though, it is extremely obvious if a game will be a win or a lose in many cases, sometimes the enemy takes such bad positions that it is instantly a win, so i dont play to my full capabilities when the result is certain.

 

(btw going afk for 3~ hours so i wont reply soon)



Captain_Kremen0 #49 Posted 21 January 2019 - 11:58 AM

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What are you trying to be OP.

You have about 5 tanks - all of which are sealclubbers. And you can't even do that.

But obviously that has to be someone elses fault right?



Unangwata #50 Posted 21 January 2019 - 12:06 PM

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I think you should play this game instead of trying being good or bad player. That's when people lose it and go stat chase, creating different accounts, scolding other players, fixed gameplay, endless circle.

Edited by Unangwata, 21 January 2019 - 12:09 PM.


GotMommysCreditCardYay #51 Posted 21 January 2019 - 12:08 PM

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View PostCaptain_Kremen0, on 21 January 2019 - 11:58 AM, said:

What are you trying to be OP.

You have about 5 tanks - all of which are sealclubbers. And you can't even do that.

But obviously that has to be someone elses fault right?

You are funny. Would u like to platoon later today/tonight so u can see what a bad player i am first hand? Or are u going to come up with an excuse of "i already know the truth" or "i dont have time to waste... " or whatever, im sure theres gonna be some lame excuse, i look forward to a potential platoon just so u can stop bothering me



WindSpIitter1 #52 Posted 21 January 2019 - 12:11 PM

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View PostGotMommysCreditCardYay, on 21 January 2019 - 08:43 AM, said:

(...)
and btw i already know there will be someone that say ''LOSING BATTLES ON PURPOSE IS AGAINST THE RULES, YOU WILL GET BANNED'' etc. Guess what? There is literally no way to prove if someone is playing bad on purpose or if they are actually just really bad, even if this person openly admits that he is losing games on purpose, it would need to get reported maaaaaaaaaany times and he would have to admit it countless times in numerous battles, and still then customer support can just think ''maybe he is just lying about breaking the rules''
(...)

 

Strictly speaking it isn't. The rules are mainly centered about 'actively' losing battles, which from experience is dealt with on a case-per-case basis. Bans for 'Unsportsmanlike conduct' aren't really report-based anymore, since people started to report particular players (or classes, clans) that they didn't like. It remains as a nice, satisfying button to press and likely as a support system (earning a lot of reports wouldn't help your case if there was an accident).

 

However, unlike the team damage system there's no real system to deal with repeat offenders. Bans for team damage are rapidly increasing in length, but unsportsmanlike conduct won't. Maybe you'd get a month if you happened to get multiple penalties at once, but it's unlikely that they'd extend an existing ban. Funnily enough, I know players who've gotten week-long bans for sole offenses and others who've gotten three-four days after obviously pushing and blocking on purpose - while also being very clearly repeat offenders.

 

The most likely reason is that 'antisocial' behaviour isn't common enough to warrant a rule and policy change. Alternatively that it'd require too much work and/or that it's too hard to distinguish your common idiot from someone being a troll.



aleksot #53 Posted 21 January 2019 - 12:58 PM

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If you want to improve your game, ask for better player to help you to platoon and ask him what to do in battle. This helped me a lot and im willing to find one more good player that could teach me.

Discontinued #54 Posted 21 January 2019 - 01:01 PM

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View Postchubbysnake, on 21 January 2019 - 09:49 AM, said:

People play the game for different reasons. Some play to win or have good stats. Some play to grind new tanks and progress through the tech trees. Some play just to kill some free time.
It’s like playing a footy game with your mates. There’s always one person who will do everything to try an win and one person who turns up purely for some fitness who doesn’t care about getting better at the game or even winning

 

Probably the most sensible answer given. +1

 

Others may have already said this but, it could be that some of these accounts are internet cafe's or shared accounts between housemates families, kids,letting you're drunk mate have a game or two after the pub on Friday....etc etc

 

To the OP rather than sounding like questions it seems more like statements, Yes people are bad, throw games, etc that's called human nature.

 

 

And to the many other people on here decrying those they see as bad players or losers and that somehow translates into real life...I would say that's a lot of projection!

 

Dunning Kruger has to be said here!

 

I used to hold 52% on my old account due to being a horrible seal clubber, I decided not to do that anymore as I don't want to ruin the game for newcomers.also

I stopped giving a crap about stats!

 

The real life mates I have that play this game are truly appalling they make me look good:)

 

Not one of them is above 45% wins, when we toon, I  have to work extra hard to compensate..Are these guys losers?

 

Nope they are high flying career types with over £50k salaries and families that simply do not have the time to commit to WOT.

 

Do they care about stats nope, they just want to wind down after a hard days work.They of course, want and try to win games but their lifestyles do not permit them to play wot to a level that makes them "good" players. and somehow lesser human beings in the  eyes of a select few of player who have devoted far to much time to this game and take it way to seriously.

 

I too am pretty bad at this game by some peoples standards, but then I toon with absolute tomatoes, but they are my real life friends and colleagues, I would rather play with my real life friends than care about some meaningless stat. Anyway its good to have XVM cammo!

 

The one simple fact that motivates so many of these cry/whine posts is this

 

STATS, STATS, STATS

 

if people didnt care for stats I seriously doubt anyone would bother to flame or be toxic. does anyone else think that stats obsession is kind of playing into WG's hands and fuelling this Toxicity and the BS idea that its pay to win?

 

We cannot control other people we do not have the power to do so, the moment you accept this you start to act like an adult.

 

It seems so ironic that people call someone who is not good at a game a loser! take a look in the mirror guys!

 

 

In 5 years who's gonna give a shoot about wot stats?

 

 

 

Nobody 

 


Edited by Discontinued, 21 January 2019 - 01:18 PM.


OIias_of_Sunhillow #55 Posted 21 January 2019 - 01:08 PM

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IT's the FB generation, desperate for likes.

Robbie_T #56 Posted 21 January 2019 - 01:25 PM

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I can be Toxic at times

But they deserve it....like this week examples.

60TP camping the redline in a tier 8/10 battle did do 0 0 0 0 (luckely we won thanx to a awesome LT and Med) think the whole team contacted that 60 tp afterwards.

Obj260 playing my conquerer going to the heavy spot ...with the obj 260...we get there i spot 7 tanks all kinds of crap....so i take a hull down posistion.and shoot.

At that moment the obj 260 comes past me full speed  stand uncovered against 7 tanks ..off course gets totally wrecked in seconds.....than he comes to me you [edited]noob help.

Its 7 vs 2  1 min in to the battle and you go Yolo and than blame me ....well him and i had a nice discussion after wards.

That was a bought account never seen someone in a Obj260 see do something that dumb. and his overalll and last month stats where HUUUGGEEEE difference.

But if someone played good i contact them after the battle too with thanx mate or well played ect.

 

But who i really really hate are the holiday special event players..

you only see them when theres a special event going on and totally totally  ruin the game .

Every Fing time theres a special event its gets ruined by them....and than they blame the MM .

The MM cant do crapagainst that kind of [edited].

 

 

 


Edited by Robbie_T, 21 January 2019 - 01:58 PM.


Kartoshkaya #57 Posted 21 January 2019 - 01:26 PM

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You're mistaken for one thing. Bad players with high playcount are not guilty of refusing to learn, they think 100% they actually playing good and their win rate is only a result of bad luck. Most of them will probably never learn cause 'they already know'.

 

Most of the people crying in chat and post game pm are high playcount low winrate players. I check everytime and this is the mostcommon toxic profile in the game.

 

They, most of the time, don't understand the moves of good players, thinking they are the one playing good. In reality they help their team to loose and that's the good part about them, when they are in the ennemy team it's a pleasure to farm them.

 



Robbie_T #58 Posted 21 January 2019 - 01:30 PM

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View PostKartoshkaya, on 21 January 2019 - 01:26 PM, said:

You're mistaken for one thing. Bad players with high playcount are not guilty of refusing to learn, they think 100% they actually playing good and their win rate is only a result of bad luck. Most of them will probably never learn cause 'they already know'.

 

Most of the people crying in chat and post game pm are high playcount low winrate players. I check everytime and this is the mostcommon toxic profile in the game.

 

They, most of the time, don't understand the moves of good players, thinking they are the one playing good. In reality they help their team to loose and that's the good part about them, when they are in the ennemy team it's a pleasure to farm them.

 

 

And most of them are in a platoon.......And they always the top tiers...

option 1 they camp the redline option 2 they die 1 min into the game.



Isharial #59 Posted 21 January 2019 - 01:39 PM

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View PostGotMommysCreditCardYay, on 21 January 2019 - 08:43 AM, said:

1st Question

I've seen some really really bad players in WoT even when they have 20k (or even 120k) battles. How many players do you guys think are actually bad ON PURPOSE? Theoretically lets say there are 2 ways to play this game, trying to be good and trying to be average/very bad. So what happens when u try to play this game as well as u can = you get punished by artys who uses xvm, or people rush u, or u take stats slightly too serious and have minimum fun when your team is really bad, or if map rotation is bad, or if enemy has ridiculous OP tanks, etc etc etc etc.

So what happens when you actually try to be very average and bad on purpose? = you don't care about stats, you basically just rush and do whatever the hell you want, you don't have to think during battles, you see childish people rage at you and because of them raging at you: you decide to make sure that you lose the battle so the toxic people lose the battle as well, since they actually care about winning the battle while you don't.

and btw i already know there will be someone that say ''LOSING BATTLES ON PURPOSE IS AGAINST THE RULES, YOU WILL GET BANNED'' etc. Guess what? There is literally no way to prove if someone is playing bad on purpose or if they are actually just really bad, even if this person openly admits that he is losing games on purpose, it would need to get reported maaaaaaaaaany times and he would have to admit it countless times in numerous battles, and still then customer support can just think ''maybe he is just lying about breaking the rules''

 

2nd Question

Everyone knows the stereotype of unicums being toxic right? and unicums are (insert insult here)... etc whatever.

Ok but, since i've made this new account (i deleted my previous account 5 months ago), i have decided to turn my in-game chat on again, just to see how childish people rage, i find it funny, anyways: literally EVERY single person that has been insulting/crying in the chat, has been a BAD player, they are actually really really bad, every single one of them. I haven't even seen one good player being toxic, is it because good players simply dont play the game anymore so i dont see them?

so far it is: the longer you have been a really bad player = the more toxic u get for some reason even though u are almost always the most useless player on the team

 

this game is rather more complex than most of the posters here, and good players in general really believe. for those who are used to "point + click" shooters like cod etc.. this game is a huge leap in terms of complexity so there will always be people who just cant get it right. 

does that mean the majority of them are doing it purposely? well, I doubt it and I don't even think there are that many who would purposely be bad.. what would be the point? a few rage messages and eventually the same old few terms of "git gud scrub" would get old

 

on to the second question, most of the playerbase is bad. there are some good players about but majority of the time they wont be playing random matches, they'll most likely be in clan wars etc.. which would impact how many you see.

beyond that, bad players get a lot of stick themselves, so I guess a lot of them resort to it as well. good players will inevitably be toxic because they want to play the game, the stupid behaviour of a teammate pushing an arty to the frontline to get it killed isn't helping the team win or fun, so obviously, what do you think they'll say?

 

I work on the lines of "treat others how you want to be treated". had a guy raging at me the other day who wasn't the best of players, did just 300 odd in a Jumbo, but once you get through the hate to the actual reasons behind their toxic behaviour, you realise its not quite what they really act like. everyone has an off day, doesn't mean their toxic all the time



OMG_Abaddon #60 Posted 21 January 2019 - 02:06 PM

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View Postpudelikael, on 21 January 2019 - 01:51 PM, said:

 

Why wot dont have the levels? Avg exp 236 and he play tier X tank.OK BUT Why he will not play against beginners?

 

One penetrating shot in an FV4005 gives enough XP to make up for 10 tier 1 wins. How is that OK? You want to classify games into sealclubbers/crew grinders/seals?







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