Jump to content


It's 2019 it's time to rebalance SPGS

Rebalancing

  • Please log in to reply
189 replies to this topic

satakuua #21 Posted 23 January 2019 - 08:18 AM

    Staff Sergeant

  • Player
  • 12204 battles
  • 318
  • [HKI] HKI
  • Member since:
    04-08-2013

View Poststokescj, on 23 January 2019 - 03:50 AM, said:

I know its mainly a retention tool for bad players

 

Interesting. How do you know this?


Edited by satakuua, 23 January 2019 - 08:18 AM.


FrantisekBascovansky #22 Posted 23 January 2019 - 09:39 AM

    Staff Sergeant

  • Player
  • 19216 battles
  • 379
  • Member since:
    03-26-2018

I agree SPGs are unbalanced nowadays.

What needs to be done:

 

- get rid of stun mechanic

- buff alpha or improve RoF

- buff accuracy and reduce splash

- improve traverse speed

- bring back AP and rework gold ammo (current state of premium HE doing just +1m splash, without higher pen or dmg is just laughable)

 

Make SPGs great again :justwait:



Element6 #23 Posted 23 January 2019 - 09:42 AM

    Field Marshal

  • Player
  • 30854 battles
  • 11,066
  • [T-D-U] T-D-U
  • Member since:
    01-06-2013
One man's nerf is another man's buff. 8.6 waves and says hello.

gpalsson #24 Posted 23 January 2019 - 09:50 AM

    General

  • Player
  • 24349 battles
  • 8,813
  • [-MM] -MM
  • Member since:
    04-13-2013
It will be reworked, but we don't know when. Keep posting regularly about it, and don't let the people who would rather everyone bury their heads in the sand deter you from expressing your frustration.

SuperOlsson #25 Posted 23 January 2019 - 10:07 AM

    Second Lieutenant

  • Player
  • 22765 battles
  • 1,068
  • [E-5OM] E-5OM
  • Member since:
    08-07-2012

View PostHomer_J, on 23 January 2019 - 07:37 AM, said:

It's not an argument.  It's a statement of fact.

 

You might not find it fun but I do.

 

If you think that's how you avoid arty then there is no wonder you have a problem with it.

Nope that is the only way to stay artysafe, camping in artysafe locations and letting the enemy come to you. If you try to make any kind of aggressive play you are subject to artyfire, you can do some things to minimize their impact, such as camp until arty fired before peeking. But in majority of cases you can’t stay safe from arty if you try to make a play. You just have to take some hits from the hardest class to play and smile.



DantePerez #26 Posted 23 January 2019 - 10:11 AM

    Sergeant

  • Player
  • 12903 battles
  • 212
  • [GOT] GOT
  • Member since:
    01-25-2013

View PostHomer_J, on 23 January 2019 - 07:37 AM, said:

It's not an argument.  It's a statement of fact.

 

 

 

Statement of fact, how so?

 

View PostHomer_J, on 23 January 2019 - 07:47 AM, said:

So what you are saying is it's good to have arty on your team.

 

No .. that's not what i'm saying .. at all

I meant it in the way like they make you camp because playing this game the way it was meant to be played will get you killed , with this i'm talking about matters like flanking for example. 

View PostHomer_J, on 23 January 2019 - 07:49 AM, said:

I see, run out of arguments so it's on to the personal attacks.

 

I have a different opinion to yours, you will find that happens quite a lot in life.

 

I apologize , i must admit i completely disagree with every other argument you come up with and find it frustrating to see , but you're right about this one thing here.

 


Edited by DantePerez, 23 January 2019 - 10:14 AM.


Signal11th #27 Posted 23 January 2019 - 10:14 AM

    Lieutenant General

  • Player
  • 40725 battles
  • 6,265
  • [S3AL] S3AL
  • Member since:
    07-14-2011

View Postjuonimies, on 23 January 2019 - 12:53 AM, said:

Players who don't understand the point of indirect fire, please play rather pacman. 

 

From what I see 90% of the playerbase seems to understand indirect fire completely as they never seem to hit anything.

Cobra6 #28 Posted 23 January 2019 - 10:27 AM

    Field Marshal

  • Beta Tester
  • 16463 battles
  • 16,703
  • [RGT] RGT
  • Member since:
    09-17-2010

All key map areas are in direct line of fire for arty from the safety of the spawn circle, so there really is no "getting safe" unless you want to have close to 0 impact on the match and only occupy positions which can not be used to actually engage the enemy.

 

Cobra 6



qpranger #29 Posted 23 January 2019 - 10:31 AM

    Major General

  • Player
  • 35972 battles
  • 5,933
  • [HAMMY] HAMMY
  • Member since:
    12-25-2013


VeryRisky #30 Posted 23 January 2019 - 10:32 AM

    General

  • Player
  • 18427 battles
  • 8,868
  • [WJDE] WJDE
  • Member since:
    10-11-2012

View Postdark_dumah, on 23 January 2019 - 12:45 AM, said:

Happy new year Wargaming. It's time to get to work and do something about this 3 spg per game format. Even at tier 10 there are lots of paper tanks and when 3 of these bastards focus fire you ( and they also get premium HE shock!!!) it's over. It's very frustrating that there is a group of vehicles in the game ( SPG ) that suffer no consequences when firing and can sit in cover relaxed almost throughout the game in relative safety except in the case when your team is losing and you get hunted down. 

 

Um, those paper tanks the SPGs focus would be the high alpha campy TDs, right.   Which of course wouldn't sit in the corner shooting while safe until their team folds..............

 

But at least you are accurate about one bit.   Sensible SPG players do focus fire on TDs, particularly paper ones with huge guns.



gpalsson #31 Posted 23 January 2019 - 10:39 AM

    General

  • Player
  • 24349 battles
  • 8,813
  • [-MM] -MM
  • Member since:
    04-13-2013

View PostVeryRisky, on 23 January 2019 - 09:32 AM, said:

 

Um, those paper tanks the SPGs focus would be the high alpha campy TDs, right.   Which of course wouldn't sit in the corner shooting while safe until their team folds..............

 

But at least you are accurate about one bit.   Sensible SPG players do focus fire on TDs, particularly paper ones with huge guns.

 

There is no "focus fire" from SPGs except maybe if they have a choice of clicking on red or purple if they are near each other. Most often they simply click on the thing that is spotted without too much thought. Playing arty is almost a singleplayer game. In random battles arty being useful is extremely rare. If that is because sensible SPG players are equally extremely rare or because is simply is not very profitable for an SPG to sit and patiently wait until that paper TD is spotted while many other clicking targets presents itself, I don't know. But that is the way it works.

qpranger #32 Posted 23 January 2019 - 10:48 AM

    Major General

  • Player
  • 35972 battles
  • 5,933
  • [HAMMY] HAMMY
  • Member since:
    12-25-2013

View Postgpalsson, on 23 January 2019 - 11:39 AM, said:

 

There is no "focus fire" from SPGs except maybe if they have a choice of clicking on red or purple if they are near each other. Most often they simply click on the thing that is spotted without too much thought. Playing arty is almost a singleplayer game. In random battles arty being useful is extremely rare. If that is because sensible SPG players are equally extremely rare or because is simply is not very profitable for an SPG to sit and patiently wait until that paper TD is spotted while many other clicking targets presents itself, I don't know. But that is the way it works.

 

I just shoot at priority targets using common sense. No XVM, so do not focus unicums. Pay most attention to volatile flanks, always try to undermine a cheeky scout, foil an enemy push or support our own push. Sometimes even knowing that you will not hit the tank, but merely splash it with very little damage, is enough to take that shot just to scare them off for a while and give my team mates a chance to react to the threat. I NEVER prioritise my own damage, I am dedicated to making the RIGHT shots so that my team wins.

krismorgan #33 Posted 23 January 2019 - 10:49 AM

    Staff Sergeant

  • Player
  • 34762 battles
  • 494
  • [UKT] UKT
  • Member since:
    10-18-2013
I never got to fire AP from my obj261-i feel like i missed out on so much fun :arta:

Discontinued #34 Posted 23 January 2019 - 10:49 AM

    Warrant Officer

  • Player
  • 3644 battles
  • 799
  • Member since:
    11-02-2015

Yet another artillery whine thread, like we havent seen this 1000's of times.

 

Simply play it, if it annoys you that much tell me there is  no skill involved when you have a 3-4 second flight time as QPR said and you have to estimate enemy vehicles movements...oh and if anyone is camping, well they desver to

 

either put up, or shut up...



VeryRisky #35 Posted 23 January 2019 - 10:49 AM

    General

  • Player
  • 18427 battles
  • 8,868
  • [WJDE] WJDE
  • Member since:
    10-11-2012

View Postgpalsson, on 23 January 2019 - 09:39 AM, said:

 

There is no "focus fire" from SPGs except maybe if they have a choice of clicking on red or purple if they are near each other. Most often they simply click on the thing that is spotted without too much thought. Playing arty is almost a singleplayer game. In random battles arty being useful is extremely rare. If that is because sensible SPG players are equally extremely rare or because is simply is not very profitable for an SPG to sit and patiently wait until that paper TD is spotted while many other clicking targets presents itself, I don't know. But that is the way it works.

 

I play arty with mostly good solo win-rate and no XVM.   You can affect the battle results when you shoot the right targets at the right time.

 

And yes my style is to shoot whatever is spotted rather than hold fire for the perfect target.   But you do pick where you aim at and given a choice, I'd rather aim to shoot at a nice slow bush camping TD that try and hit a fast moving med even if I though the med player might have fancy-coloured stats.   But it could be that I need to shoot the med, or a bottom tier HT playing hull-down on a ridgeline that's popping up to spot my team and not getting killed.   Hell if the entire enemy team is hiding behind rocks or unspotted at the back I'll keep shooting at that 70kph LT that's whizzing around.



DeadLecter #36 Posted 23 January 2019 - 10:57 AM

    Second Lieutenant

  • Player
  • 28804 battles
  • 1,384
  • Member since:
    05-28-2016

View PostBalc0ra, on 23 January 2019 - 05:14 AM, said:

WG already said they have plans for an SPG change and nerf in 2019. When and what? Who knows. 

 

Like they balanced it with stun mechanic.

What most folks here don't get is bad players are less likely to get focused by arty and this was proven in a post on this forum I just don't remember the name of the guy. Most SPG players have XVM and they all focus on the players with good rating and also those who are top tier. So for bad players which is the majority of the player base arty is not a problem because they may get shot 1 or 2 times in a match. But for better players who get shot 3~5 times in every minute, and are the the main target, arty is a real problem. If they limited arty to 1 per team but every battle had 1 arty, it would be better than now. Right now almost 70% of battles have 2 or 3 arties and 20~25% have 1 arty and that last 5% has no arty. And as it has pointed out before, back in the day arty could one shot a tank but they were less accurate and had way worse splash radius but now they can switch targets across the map and fire without aiming and at the very least they stun you and your tank will be useless for the next 20~30 seconds and that is the exact moment you need your tank the most because some guy just poked around the corned and is gonna rape you. When a tank gets stunned, the gun can't hit a lake from 20 meters so that is like being a punching bag for that time.

We all know WG and their level of competence. Let's just wait for a more annoying arty update.



SuperOlsson #37 Posted 23 January 2019 - 10:58 AM

    Second Lieutenant

  • Player
  • 22765 battles
  • 1,068
  • [E-5OM] E-5OM
  • Member since:
    08-07-2012

View PostDiscontinued, on 23 January 2019 - 10:49 AM, said:

Yet another artillery whine thread, like we havent seen this 1000's of times.

 

Simply play it, if it annoys you that much tell me there is  no skill involved when you have a 3-4 second flight time as QPR said and you have to estimate enemy vehicles movements...oh and if anyone is camping, well they desver to

 

either put up, or shut up...

Played American tier 8-9’s for 240 games and compared to other players pretty much already mastered SPGs, there is no skill involved. I even consider leading targets in arties being simpler than in a real tank, thanks to not having to need to stress and the godview. You just take some position and wait for a target to pop up, click and voila! 1700 dpg just like that!



sgtYester #38 Posted 23 January 2019 - 10:58 AM

    Lieutenant

  • Player
  • 55289 battles
  • 1,734
  • [RANGF] RANGF
  • Member since:
    04-10-2011

why can a SUPPORT class do the same and even more damage than regular tanks???

 

if u want to keep this trash class in the game, make the the proper support class.  not a damage dealer but helping the team by making the enemy less effective trough stun and detracking them,

knocking out a module/crew.  

 

but right now...   to much damage.  you cant find proper cover thanks to all the map reworks were all the tops op cliffs are shaven off to allow arty to hit you.  

 

also.. thanks to to fast reload.. any game with more than 1 arty is trash.. u get foccused by them.. u can just go back to garage.



tajj7 #39 Posted 23 January 2019 - 11:00 AM

    Field Marshal

  • Player
  • 27067 battles
  • 14,651
  • [RGT] RGT
  • Member since:
    03-30-2014

View PostElement6, on 23 January 2019 - 08:42 AM, said:

One man's nerf is another man's buff. 8.6 waves and says hello.

 

8.6 was a nerf, arty accuracy got nerfed, their reloads got nerfed, their shell velocities got nerfed, their penetrations on HEAT/AP got nerfed, tier 8 arties pre-8.6 were more powerful than the tier 10 arties post 8.6.

 

So whoever this 'another man' is, he is wrong. 

 

View PostHomer_J, on 23 January 2019 - 06:37 AM, said:

If you think that's how you avoid arty then there is no wonder you have a problem with it.

 

That is realistically how you avoid arty and its a view shared by almost all of the good players in the game, it's also why we why have issues with it, because it punishes active play and causes camping/passive play. 

 

View Postgpalsson, on 23 January 2019 - 08:50 AM, said:

Don't let the people who would rather everyone bury their heads in the sand deter you from expressing your frustration.

 

Agree, we see the same small minority regurgitating the same arty defending claims that were debunked years ago. 

 

But the issue is still clearly there and still causing player frustration, toxicity, bad balance and bad gameplay.  WG know this, we know this, so it doesn't really matter what a few die hard clicker fans say. 

--------------------------------------------

 

Hopefully we some more movement from WG to further rebalance arties in 2019 and improve the game for the majority of players bar the small minority of dedicated clickers. 

 

Personally I'd like to see -

 

  • One per side max in all game modes. 

 

  • HE penetration nerf, basically HE penetration set to zero so that arties cannot pen any tank, thus this removes the arty players who currently chase lightly armoured stuff round the map instead of supporting their team with hard to dislodge armoured tanks.  Also remove damage down a bit more, especially for lower tier arties which still have too much alpha for their tier. Compensate with slightly faster reload. 

 

  • Move stun/debuff shell to a separate shell. So your choices are debuff or damage/splash, adjust reloads accordingly.

 

  • Reduce splash radius down, especially on higher tier vehicles, probably by about 20%

 

  • Make all arties a bit more mobile. 

 

  • Give them a little more HP, like maybe 900 - 1k for tier 10 ones. scale down from there. 

 

  • Give them AP or HEAT rounds back, but not with the stupid pen or alpha that had previously, but make them only available to be used in a direct fire mode (also give arties the ability to switch between modes like siege mode), so they can become pseudo-TDs and defend themselves better/be more flexible, this also compensates their damage reduction. 

 

  • Give them different shell options, like smoke to cover team mates, illumination shells to spot areas, some sort of heal/buff shell to help team mates, stuff like this. You could also use these different shells to add national 'flavours' to make the different arty lines more unique from one or the other.  Also give these shells better accuracy aim/time, and also ability to quickly switch between shell types, but then have cooldowns so you can't spam smoke or spots etc.  This very much shifts their focus from damage to team support. 

 

  • Add a proper counter battery mechanic, the arty 'red ball' cheat mod would be a pretty easy one to implement, but I'd have the indicator sent to all enemy players so everyone knows where arty has just fired from, thus putting more importance on relocating after shots (hence the mobility buffs).

 

  • Add an arty is aiming at you warning indicator like AW had. 

 

Thus overall you'd shift the focus from damage to team support, give people playing arty more tactical options, up the skill floor of the class and generally make it less frustrating to play against. 

 

Players who just want to farm damage safely from the back of the map in safety through indirect fire would through the nerfs to penetration, damage and splash, plus the counter battery mechanic and warning indicator, would do very little, proportional to the level of risk they have. Very low risk = very low reward.

 

Players who use all the tactical options, at the right times, moving about, using their different shell types etc. can have a big impact on their team and also have the direct fire/TD mode and extra health to defend themselves, provide extra support fire when needed. 

 



Wintermute_1 #40 Posted 23 January 2019 - 11:15 AM

    Lieutenant

  • Player
  • 47425 battles
  • 1,892
  • Member since:
    11-25-2013

View PostDeadLecter, on 23 January 2019 - 10:57 AM, said:

Most SPG players have XVM

 

Total rubbish. About 80% of arty doesn't have XVM.







Also tagged with Rebalancing

1 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users