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camo viewrange spotting bug

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Darky1029 #21 Posted 31 January 2019 - 09:54 PM

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''Why on earth share this poor YT quality in the first place? Why not simple share the actual replay? Main reason for having a replay is it allows us to play it at a slower speed. As I get the impression the Obj. 430 is revealed just before firing. I do think the tree is attributing to this situation, even if just partially. I suspect it obstructed direct LoS to the side check point. The Obj. 430 is reversing and side scrapping so to speak (or so it appears to me), and I suspect actually gets spotted when the front check point (on the front hull and/or front turret) is exposed. The Obj. 430 clearly knows where the T-10 is so most likely OP was still spotted after recent events not visible in this YT video. I do not believe it was a mere coincidence.''

 

Would you download a replay, watch the complete game to see the crucial 7 seconds? I know i wouldnt.

And no i wasnt spotted, but it was obvious that i was coming, everyone was.

 

"My guess is PEBKAC, insufficient crew training on your side.

Recently retained any crew for duty on T-10 using Credits?"

 

I have stated that i have 425m viewrange, and its visible on the map how far i can see. 42 battles is enough for me to get my crew back to 100%, during this battle my commander was at 115%(vents+food) with stock turret.

 

"Lets assume the foilage of the tree is messed up, how come the opponent could see him?

Does that messed up foilage only work one way?"

 

It could be working both ways, t-10 has crap camo of 8% while stationary, and 5% while moving, and i dont run camo on the tank, because its not worth, especially at 4 crew skills.

 

Some of you here are posting walls of text, but you dont know the game mechanics yourselves.

With 425m viewrange i should be able to spot any non light tank at that range if they are moving, and the obj 430 was obviously moving.

 

The main point of mine here is that the tree hitbox is screwed, and it shouldnt be. The other issue here could be a weird vision tick, but that hasnt been an issue since beta, atleast not at this range. Other thing could of been the viewport location, but the t-10, as far as i am aware, has its top viewport on the left, but that doesnt even matter, since the gun view port had a clear line of sight on the location of the enemy. Which removes the doubt about not having clear line of sight, because tanks have two view ports, one on the top, which could of been obstructed, and the one in the gun, which clearly had a clear line of sight.

XxKuzkina_MatxX  thanks for actually doing the math. Theres no way in hell i couldnt see him unless he got camo from the tree.

 

And yes, commander could of blinked, that would make the most sense.

 

Edited by Darky1029, 31 January 2019 - 10:13 PM.


Nishi_Kinuyo #22 Posted 31 January 2019 - 10:03 PM

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View PostDarky1029, on 31 January 2019 - 09:54 PM, said:

#14

 

Your post.



Darky1029 #23 Posted 31 January 2019 - 10:08 PM

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View PostNishi_Kinuyo, on 31 January 2019 - 11:03 PM, said:

Your post.

 

Ohh, i had to rewrite my whole post because forums are great sometimes.

Edited by Darky1029, 31 January 2019 - 10:14 PM.


Homer_J #24 Posted 31 January 2019 - 10:15 PM

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View PostDarky1029, on 31 January 2019 - 08:54 PM, said:

'

Would you download a replay, watch the complete game to see the crucial 7 seconds? I know i wouldnt.

 

 

A lot of us would.

 

What settings do you have the game on.  I don't know if it's the terrible quality of the video or your game settings that make the foliage look like mush but I would like to see what it looks like on my system.



Darky1029 #25 Posted 31 January 2019 - 10:25 PM

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View PostHomer_J, on 31 January 2019 - 11:15 PM, said:

 

A lot of us would.

 

What settings do you have the game on.  I don't know if it's the terrible quality of the video or your game settings that make the foliage look like mush but I would like to see what it looks like on my system.

I use mixed settings with grass and trees on the lowest to see better.

Spoiler

 



AliceUnchained #26 Posted 31 January 2019 - 10:26 PM

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View PostDarky1029, on 31 January 2019 - 09:54 PM, said:

Would you download a replay, watch the complete game to see the crucial 7 seconds? I know i wouldnt.

And no i wasnt spotted, but it was obvious that i was coming, everyone was.

 

I would simply fast forward to the specific moment. Then after I would check whichever parts I would deem necessary. Also, you can provide a timestamp

 

View PostHomer_J, on 31 January 2019 - 10:15 PM, said:

A lot of us would.

 

What settings do you have the game on.  I don't know if it's the terrible quality of the video or your game settings that make the foliage look like mush but I would like to see what it looks like on my system.

 

Same here.

 

View PostDarky1029, on 31 January 2019 - 09:54 PM, said:

Some of you here are posting walls of text, but you dont know the game mechanics yourselves.

With 425m viewrange i should be able to spot any non light tank at that range if they are moving, and the obj 430 was obviously moving.

 

Walls of texts or not, we're simply trying to find an explanation. Which would be far easier with the actual replay at hand. Now as you clearly did not spot the Obj. 430 sooner, the most logical explanation is that the check points were obstructed. In other words, no direct LoS. Or to put it in your words, you clearly did not spot the Obj. 430 sooner so clearly there was no LoS as clearly the Obj. 430 was at a distance, which can be seen clearly, where you clearly should spot it if there had been LoS.


Edited by AliceUnchained, 31 January 2019 - 10:29 PM.


Homer_J #27 Posted 01 February 2019 - 12:02 AM

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View PostAliceUnchained, on 31 January 2019 - 09:26 PM, said:

 

I would simply fast forward to the specific moment. Then after I would check whichever parts I would deem necessary. Also, you can provide a timestamp

 

09:20 if I'm reading the smudge correctly.

 

@Darky1029

Not questioning mechanics, if you have clear LOS then you should have spotted him.  What I am questioning is the extent of the tree and I know the visuals can differ in size with different settings.  I guess I can rig up a training room tomorrow and see what it looks like if you don't want to share the replay.

 

It may well turn out that the visuals don't line up with the invisible box which the game uses to set the camo.  Which would be a bug.


Edited by Homer_J, 01 February 2019 - 12:03 AM.


seXikanac #28 Posted 01 February 2019 - 12:23 AM

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View PostAliceUnchained, on 31 January 2019 - 08:47 PM, said:

 

Why on earth share this poor YT quality in the first place? Why not simple share the actual replay? Main reason for having a replay is it allows us to play it at a slower speed. As I get the impression the Obj. 430 is revealed just before firing. I do think the tree is attributing to this situation, even if just partially. I suspect it obstructed direct LoS to the side check point. The Obj. 430 is reversing and side scrapping so to speak (or so it appears to me), and I suspect actually gets spotted when the front check point (on the front hull and/or front turret) is exposed. The Obj. 430 clearly knows where the T-10 is so most likely OP was still spotted after recent events not visible in this YT video. I do not believe it was a mere coincidence.

 

 

 

Because like 99% of the forumites that commented would not download replay and comment?

Slyspy #29 Posted 01 February 2019 - 08:36 AM

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View PostseXikanac, on 01 February 2019 - 12:23 AM, said:

 

Because like 99% of the forumites that commented would not download replay and comment?

 

Who cares about the 99%? It is the 1% who know what they are talking about which counts. 

LordMuffin #30 Posted 01 February 2019 - 09:16 AM

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View PostDarky1029, on 31 January 2019 - 04:29 PM, said:

I usually dont have a beef with the game, something goes wrong - okay, sh*t happens.

But this is just dumb.

Spoiler

 

i have 425m viewrange, target is 202m away and theres not a single bush in the way, so tell me, what the hell?

My best bet is that the tree was counting as camo, but thats silly, if thats the case, the hitbox of said tree should be fixed.

Yes,  trees count as camo.

But just like you, I have also experienced these kind of 'questionable' things regarding camo.

 

I really think that a lot of camo hit-boxes are off the mark compared to the in-game visual.



Homer_J #31 Posted 01 February 2019 - 09:29 AM

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View PostLordMuffin, on 01 February 2019 - 08:16 AM, said:

 

I really think that a lot of camo hit-boxes are off the mark compared to the in-game visual.

 

That is entirely possible.

 

There is another thing which has just occurred to me.

 

Some time ago someone did some tests which determined that you only have one vision point on your tank (yadayada wiki has some out of date graphic still) and that is situated on the commanders hatch.  That should be above and slightly to the left of the gunsight but as we saw, WG can somehow manage to move the gunsight view so it could be possible they also accidentally relocated the commanders vision port.  And given they once completely dislocated the M53/55 turret from the hull that could be a big difference.



pecopad #32 Posted 01 February 2019 - 11:40 AM

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View Postazakow, on 31 January 2019 - 07:15 PM, said:

Loosing camo after shooting is the no brainer here!

 

What is the range between the 430 and the T-10?

 

The OP has 42 matches on T-10.

Worst crew training after retraining crew is 80%.

Lets assume this to be the case.

 

What is the spotting distance of a T-10 with a commander at 80% primary skill?

 

Lets assume the foilage of the tree is messed up, how come the opponent could see him?

Does that messed up foilage only work one way?

 

What the hell is your problem, not even with a video showing something strange you will admit anything. Do you have severe psychological problems that prevent you from admitting anything?

 

You can see the range between the tanks, you can see its impossible to happen in normal conditions. Actually you don't see anything because you just simply do not want to see, but that is your problem.



azakow #33 Posted 01 February 2019 - 12:25 PM

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View Postpecopad, on 01 February 2019 - 11:40 AM, said:

What the hell is your problem, not even with a video showing something strange you will admit anything. Do you have severe psychological problems that prevent you from admitting anything?

 

You can see the range between the tanks, you can see its impossible to happen in normal conditions. Actually you don't see anything because you just simply do not want to see, but that is your problem.

I do not have a problem at all.

Everybody interprets the video with his own knowledge of game mechanics and battle experinence, don't we?

 

I simply ask questions in order to get a different view on the facts presented in the video.

My questions seem to upset you alot.

 

Here some more questions for you:

Am I not allowed to ask questions?

Are my questions invaild?

:P

 

Spoiler

 



SaintMaddenus #34 Posted 01 February 2019 - 04:56 PM

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Spotting mechanics bug me too.

 

Can someone tell me and show me where and how a tank can remain invisible, in the open unspotted. 

 

For example I have a view range in tank A of 380.    My white circle of being spotted is about equal as I have camo on the tank , ½ of the crew at 100 training for camo and optics  (this is just a rough example I cant get my actual figures here)

 

I am shot at by a tank that is spotting me yet I cannot see him.   So I assume his camo is better than mine.   That pretty much is given.    I keep moving forward.    He shoots again and kills me, but this time he is revealed  Roughly a ½ way of my circle of spotting.

 

In this case it was a spic.   I could not see him at 165m   until he fired.    So my max view range is 380 I get that. 

 

What camo value would he have so I can’t see him.   Remember he is in the open.  There were no bushes. 



pecopad #35 Posted 01 February 2019 - 05:40 PM

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View Postazakow, on 01 February 2019 - 12:25 PM, said:

I do not have a problem at all.

Everybody interprets the video with his own knowledge of game mechanics and battle experinence, don't we?

 

I simply ask questions in order to get a different view on the facts presented in the video.

My questions seem to upset you alot.

 

Here some more questions for you:

Am I not allowed to ask questions?

Are my questions invaild?

:P

 

Spoiler

 

 

Its not the questions that are annoying, its the refusal to accept something so simple has that WoT is not a perfect game, so there are bugs and some hitbox problems, and other strange behaviors, like in all games out there.

 

The OP video was one of those videos. Clearly he should have spoted the tank before it fired, he was well within view range.

 

Posters are always claiming for videos but when they are presented they act has nothing happened, and remain in the same corner.

 

Now, you may ask why do I think this is very annoying, and this is because in online gaming, and IMHO, the worst thing there are, even worst than cheaters and hackers, are the white knights.


Edited by pecopad, 01 February 2019 - 05:42 PM.


AliceUnchained #36 Posted 01 February 2019 - 07:35 PM

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View PostHomer_J, on 01 February 2019 - 12:02 AM, said:

09:20 if I'm reading the smudge correctly.

 

Oh I meant when sharing the replay. I watched the YT video several times and I am convinced having the replay would be so much more useful.

 

View PostseXikanac, on 01 February 2019 - 12:23 AM, said:

Because like 99% of the forumites that commented would not download replay and comment?

 

Made up numbers never go well with trying to get even a somewhat decent argument across, let alone an actual proper one. And ultimately it would be better to have that 1% do a proper analysis of the actual replay, than have let's say 10% or more post some vague, or even nonsensical, explanation.



Homer_J #37 Posted 01 February 2019 - 07:53 PM

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View PostSaintMaddenus, on 01 February 2019 - 03:56 PM, said:

 

What camo value would he have so I can’t see him.   Remember he is in the open.  There were no bushes. 

 

Someone already linked the camo calculator.  Why not just set up your hypothetical situation there.
19:01 Added after 7 minutes

View PostSaintMaddenus, on 01 February 2019 - 03:56 PM, said:

In this case it was a spic.   I could not see him at 165m   until he fired.    So my max view range is 380 I get that. 

 

What camo value would he have so I can’t see him.   Remember he is in the open.  There were no bushes. 

I set up a T29 to have 380 view range (tank is actually irrelevant) and a SP1C with everything to boost camo and it should be spotted at 232m stationary and 344 firing.

 

So.

 

Replay?



SuNo_TeSLa #38 Posted 10 February 2019 - 01:17 PM

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Just lost a game due to spotting bug, T44 roughly 300 m away, disappears and reappears like 10 secs later behind cover, much wow...

Me playing the M41D with 470+ WR

Edited by SuNo_TeSLa, 10 February 2019 - 01:25 PM.


azakow #39 Posted 10 February 2019 - 01:25 PM

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View PostSuNo_TeSLa, on 10 February 2019 - 01:17 PM, said:

Just lost a game due to spotting bug, T44 roughly 300 m away, disappears and reappears like 10 secs later behind cover, much wow...

Would you care to provide a replay.

:honoring:


Edited by azakow, 10 February 2019 - 01:25 PM.


SuNo_TeSLa #40 Posted 10 February 2019 - 01:43 PM

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View Postazakow, on 10 February 2019 - 12:25 PM, said:

Would you care to provide a replay.

:honoring:

 

Of course, be warned includes some toxic behaviour on my part, you'll probably see why and what.
 

Edit: I'm of course not entirely fact-resistant, so if you can explain it, please do :)

http://wotreplays.eu...e/4774269#stats


Edited by SuNo_TeSLa, 10 February 2019 - 01:54 PM.






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