Jump to content


Wheeled Vehicles: Take Them for a Spin!


  • Please log in to reply
168 replies to this topic

kardshake #121 Posted 08 February 2019 - 05:49 AM

    Private

  • Player
  • 15564 battles
  • 1
  • [BM8] BM8
  • Member since:
    03-07-2014

some of the maps are too smal i have had games where i was spoted in 8 seconds of the game start also because the cars have so low pin on the guns most people just spam gold WG may like this but most players hate it 

 



Homer_J #122 Posted 08 February 2019 - 06:39 AM

    Field Marshal

  • Beta Tester
  • 32412 battles
  • 35,412
  • [WJDE] WJDE
  • Member since:
    09-03-2010

View PostSaar_Lion, on 06 February 2019 - 08:05 PM, said:

 

Why are they in the game if they are provably nothing like reality?

 

 

Reality is boring.  That's why.

Kothaar #123 Posted 08 February 2019 - 08:44 AM

    Warrant Officer

  • Beta Tester
  • 62719 battles
  • 502
  • [IGNOR] IGNOR
  • Member since:
    01-05-2011

View PostTheArk_2014, on 07 February 2019 - 03:56 PM, said:

Something strange is happened, a change at the game-play of the Light Tanks ...

... I don't know if it is my imagination, but I think that because of the appearance of the Wheeled Tanks, the Light Tank players started to do that what they supposed to do, they started to scout ...

 

... as an old Light Tanker (before 9.18 patch) the biggest frustration for me was/is to see LTs to camp, even behind the TDs lines and try to snipe ...

... a lot of lost battles, on open maps, because of the noob Light Tank players who leave the team "blind" on try to be "Damage Dealers" ...

... but, the last couple of days, with the appearance of the WTs, all LTs started to try to do "Active Scouting".

 

:B

 

For me too, a big frustration has been heavy tanks that camp. Remember, we have artillery in this game. If you want to sit with a thumb in your behind, play those.

b0d #124 Posted 08 February 2019 - 07:51 PM

    Colonel

  • Player
  • 23827 battles
  • 3,923
  • [-SJA-] -SJA-
  • Member since:
    05-22-2015

View PostHomer_J, on 07 February 2019 - 08:09 PM, said:

 

Reality is boring.  That's why.

 

To which reality are you referring to good Sir?

18:54 Added after 2 minutes

View Postmcpain_surte, on 07 February 2019 - 01:10 PM, said:

Edited

 

 

Sorry could you rephrase that please?

hasan_barzani_2016 #125 Posted 09 February 2019 - 07:31 PM

    Private

  • Player
  • 3620 battles
  • 1
  • [KU_RD] KU_RD
  • Member since:
    10-10-2016
Ok, you say "take them for a spin"

Saar_Lion #126 Posted 10 February 2019 - 08:44 AM

    Private

  • Player
  • 1833 battles
  • 36
  • Member since:
    01-19-2019

View PostHomer_J, on 08 February 2019 - 06:39 AM, said:

 

Reality is boring.  That's why.

 

I can respect your opinion if you want Quake with Tanks, so don't be shy about admitting it 

 

Modelling "Reality" really doesn't have to be boring - it can be a challenge. And being challenged is what makes for immersion, and immersion is what stops a game being boring

 

For instance - in your opinion - would adding a reality like limiting the PoV to a point equal to riding in your tanks cupola, rather than being able to fly up a kite string and see round mountains and buildings make the game less immersive, or more immersive?

 

 



WoT_RU_Doing #127 Posted 10 February 2019 - 12:25 PM

    Lieutenant Сolonel

  • Player
  • 57849 battles
  • 3,344
  • [-GY-] -GY-
  • Member since:
    07-20-2013

View PostSaar_Lion, on 10 February 2019 - 07:44 AM, said:

 

I can respect your opinion if you want Quake with Tanks, so don't be shy about admitting it

 

Modelling "Reality" really doesn't have to be boring - it can be a challenge. And being challenged is what makes for immersion, and immersion is what stops a game being boring

 

For instance - in your opinion - would adding a reality like limiting the PoV to a point equal to riding in your tanks cupola, rather than being able to fly up a kite string and see round mountains and buildings make the game less immersive, or more immersive?

 

 

 

Definitely less immersive. You'd quickly lose a lot of the player base I think if we lost arcade view. Many of the improvements that could be made would have a similar effect. The game is just that, it's not a simulator. If you want more reality, turn the in game interfaces off so that you have no mini-map and no indicators hovering above the tanks.  

Saar_Lion #128 Posted 10 February 2019 - 10:09 PM

    Private

  • Player
  • 1833 battles
  • 36
  • Member since:
    01-19-2019

View PostWoT_RU_Doing, on 10 February 2019 - 12:25 PM, said:

 

You'd quickly lose a lot of the player base I think if we lost arcade view. Many of the improvements that could be made would have a similar effect. 

 

No need to lose players - you simply reward those who operate with the realistic view system by upping their score by X% at the end of the game.

 

The same with clearly "over-modelled" items like the Pz1 and some of the indestructible Russian armour.

 

Let people drive them. Reward those who can't kill them because they are porked.  


Edited by Saar_Lion, 10 February 2019 - 10:09 PM.


WoT_RU_Doing #129 Posted 10 February 2019 - 11:40 PM

    Lieutenant Сolonel

  • Player
  • 57849 battles
  • 3,344
  • [-GY-] -GY-
  • Member since:
    07-20-2013

View PostSaar_Lion, on 10 February 2019 - 09:09 PM, said:

 

No need to lose players - you simply reward those who operate with the realistic view system by upping their score by X% at the end of the game.

 

The same with clearly "over-modelled" items like the Pz1 and some of the indestructible Russian armour.

 

Let people drive them. Reward those who can't kill them because they are porked. 

 

Most players use arcade view either full time, or at least when they are driving. I suppose you could reward players who drive around in sniper view, but it would be rather an unfair disadvantage compared to all the players who use the game features. As I said, if you want a fair realistic game, you need a simulator where realism is the first priority, and that way you've got all players on an equal footing. The problem there is where do you draw the line...full realism means 2 or more players to operate a tank depending on tank type.

TheArk_2014 #130 Posted 11 February 2019 - 04:57 PM

    Lieutenant

  • Player
  • 67188 battles
  • 1,557
  • [_ARK_] _ARK_
  • Member since:
    01-03-2014

Just today ... I played my first 13 battles with my first wheeled vehicle and ...

 

I'm very exciting


Edited by TheArk_2014, 11 February 2019 - 04:57 PM.


Saar_Lion #131 Posted 11 February 2019 - 06:24 PM

    Private

  • Player
  • 1833 battles
  • 36
  • Member since:
    01-19-2019

View PostWoT_RU_Doing, on 10 February 2019 - 11:40 PM, said:

 

Most players use arcade view either full time, or at least when they are driving. I suppose you could reward players who drive around in sniper view, 

 

Cupola view is not "sniper view".

 

Cupola view is available now - just don't wheel out so much with the mouse, stop when you can see the top of the turret in front of you. That is what the Commander would use most of the time when travelling or on recce - he'd only shut the hatch when in action - when as a player you would be using the sight.

 

You could add a further legitimate view - slightly higher, standing on the turret with binoculars - only available when stopped. 

 

But fair enough, if you don't think you could handle it, you shouldn't be penalised - but the player who did choose realism should be rewarded.


Edited by Saar_Lion, 11 February 2019 - 06:25 PM.


eekeeboo #132 Posted 11 February 2019 - 07:19 PM

    EU Video Content Manager

  • WG Staff
  • 47034 battles
  • 2,489
  • Member since:
    07-25-2010

View PostSaar_Lion, on 10 February 2019 - 07:44 AM, said:

 

I can respect your opinion if you want Quake with Tanks, so don't be shy about admitting it 

 

Modelling "Reality" really doesn't have to be boring - it can be a challenge. And being challenged is what makes for immersion, and immersion is what stops a game being boring

 

For instance - in your opinion - would adding a reality like limiting the PoV to a point equal to riding in your tanks cupola, rather than being able to fly up a kite string and see round mountains and buildings make the game less immersive, or more immersive?

 

 

 

 ​Immersion only works for a set style of game and audience. When you introduce some of the things you propose, you don't get immersion, you get simulation, simulation isn't always immersion. 

Saar_Lion #133 Posted 12 February 2019 - 06:43 PM

    Private

  • Player
  • 1833 battles
  • 36
  • Member since:
    01-19-2019

View Posteekeeboo, on 11 February 2019 - 07:19 PM, said:

 

 ​Immersion only works for a set style of game and audience. When you introduce some of the things you propose, you don't get immersion, you get simulation, simulation isn't always immersion. 

 

 

To some people it is.

 

To some people being able to stalk other vehicles as is possible in real life is more immersive than arcade play. To others Quake with Tanks is where it's at.

 

But there's no need for either to lose out.

 

It would be simple to take the arcade out of the game and not harm it. Just give players the choice between Arcade and Realism in the Garage before they click Battle.

 

They tick a box and only get put into games with players who've ticked the same box and want to play the same game as them.



eekeeboo #134 Posted 12 February 2019 - 07:04 PM

    EU Video Content Manager

  • WG Staff
  • 47034 battles
  • 2,489
  • Member since:
    07-25-2010

View PostSaar_Lion, on 12 February 2019 - 05:43 PM, said:

 

 

To some people it is.

 

To some people being able to stalk other vehicles as is possible in real life is more immersive than arcade play. To others Quake with Tanks is where it's at.

 

But there's no need for either to lose out.

 

It would be simple to take the arcade out of the game and not harm it. Just give players the choice between Arcade and Realism in the Garage before they click Battle.

 

They tick a box and only get put into games with players who've ticked the same box and want to play the same game as them.

 

And for those people, how many form part of your player base? How many make up your whole player base and are they a sustainable part of the player base who will spend enough to maintain the game? Simulator games are a niche market at the best of times, and even then they have some elements of compromise because true simulation is simply not engaging enough for most people. You can see some breaks in this trend with games like Eurotruck simulator, but if you compare the element of an actual simulator and how much arcade is in there, you can see just how much even simulator games don't go too hardcore. 

 

If you take the arcade out of the game, you definitely harm the game style, play style, and tank/map balance etc. Creating multiple queues is how you damage your player base and divide it, further increasing queue time above what you would with other suggestions to the point you can wait minutes (in the double digits) for a game. There is a reason the games that have this are nowhere near the size WoT is, even with the natural decline from the age of the game, the game is still far bigger than even the closest competition. 



RockyRoller #135 Posted 12 February 2019 - 07:44 PM

    Lieutenant

  • Player
  • 37975 battles
  • 1,575
  • [NR-NS] NR-NS
  • Member since:
    06-15-2016

How do you describe these?

there are the campers and here comes Fenton


Edited by RockyRoller, 12 February 2019 - 07:46 PM.


wolfman292 #136 Posted 13 February 2019 - 04:01 PM

    Corporal

  • Player
  • 23216 battles
  • 190
  • Member since:
    02-26-2013
Thought this game was called World of Tanks. I can understand arty being in the game even though the maps are too small but Armoured Cars. We have LT tanks for scouting so why now after how many years do we have to have Armoured Cars, and why only French other nations designed and built them as well.

Gremlin182 #137 Posted 13 February 2019 - 05:21 PM

    General

  • Player
  • 57947 battles
  • 9,532
  • Member since:
    04-18-2012

They make an interesting change to the game and I expect more Armoured Cars for other nations.

I was really surprised that they managed to push it all the way to tier 10 I felt sure we would get a few lower tiers maybe getting to tier 5 for most with a couple of nations going higher.

 

They will not replace light tanks in the passive scouting roll and its tricky for them to do well as active scouts.

It takes the right map. in most cases a Light tank set up for active scouting will do better.

 

The AMX 12t at tier 6 has 360 view range with my crew and equipment I could race around at 60kph with 437 view range and 36 camo

With the AMD 178B I have 364 view range and a speed of 65.

Maneuverability as in tank traverse is better for the French light tanks at tiers 6-10.

Track armour for those tanks is 20 for the tracked ones but only 5 for the wheeled.

 

They have the advantage of being much faster from tier 8 and up and are way faster in reverse than other tanks.

At the expense of being much worse in view range and ability to take damage,

 



Saar_Lion #138 Posted 13 February 2019 - 06:12 PM

    Private

  • Player
  • 1833 battles
  • 36
  • Member since:
    01-19-2019

View Posteekeeboo, on 12 February 2019 - 07:04 PM, said:

 

And for those people, how many form part of your player base? How many make up your whole player base and are they a sustainable part of the player base who will spend enough to maintain the game? Simulator games are a niche market at the best of times, and even then they have some elements of compromise because true simulation is simply not engaging enough for most people. You can see some breaks in this trend with games like Eurotruck simulator, but if you compare the element of an actual simulator and how much arcade is in there, you can see just how much even simulator games don't go too hardcore. 

 

If you take the arcade out of the game, you definitely harm the game style, play style, and tank/map balance etc. Creating multiple queues is how you damage your player base and divide it, further increasing queue time above what you would with other suggestions to the point you can wait minutes (in the double digits) for a game. There is a reason the games that have this are nowhere near the size WoT is, even with the natural decline from the age of the game, the game is still far bigger than even the closest competition. 

 

You are over-egging the pudding of course. You like arcade, and think nobody else would like anything else.

 

Block Quote

"Creating multiple queues is how you damage your player base and divide it"

 

 

This is of course nonsense.

 

What it does is enable the game to attract both types of player, rather than cheesing one or the other off.

 

It also allows someone who has gone as far as they can with arcade play to reach for new challenges within the same game rather than getting bored and drifting away.

 

With the greatest respect, I get the impression you feel you're on a bit of a mission over this, but you're fundamentally thinking wrongly.

 

There is no need for this game or any other to alienate those who want Quake with Tanks, or those who want realism - and the hard core angle is where games get their kudos and reputations from - not by dumbing down and being just another arcade game. They're ten-a-penny in every genre.

 

 



eekeeboo #139 Posted 13 February 2019 - 07:29 PM

    EU Video Content Manager

  • WG Staff
  • 47034 battles
  • 2,489
  • Member since:
    07-25-2010

View PostSaar_Lion, on 13 February 2019 - 05:12 PM, said:

 

You are over-egging the pudding of course. You like arcade, and think nobody else would like anything else.

 

 

 

This is of course nonsense.

 

What it does is enable the game to attract both types of player, rather than cheesing one or the other off.

 

It also allows someone who has gone as far as they can with arcade play to reach for new challenges within the same game rather than getting bored and drifting away.

 

With the greatest respect, I get the impression you feel you're on a bit of a mission over this, but you're fundamentally thinking wrongly.

 

There is no need for this game or any other to alienate those who want Quake with Tanks, or those who want realism - and the hard core angle is where games get their kudos and reputations from - not by dumbing down and being just another arcade game. They're ten-a-penny in every genre.

 

 

 

It's not about liking arcade or not, it's about a simple fact. Arcade games are popular, simulator games are niche. That's how these games are demographically in the games industry and you can see this for yourself. When you design, develop and continue to evolve a game you keep it to the target audience you select, you do not try to branch out into other player segmentation and then alienate all your other audience, this is how games end up making a lot of content but produce very little actual depth and content people enjoy. 

 

You say I'm thinking wrongly because you don't agree with me. One of us is thinking as a game as a product designed to make money, marketed and developed to suit the target audience. The other is thinking of a product to be developed to suit their own personal needs and goals, by creating a product that is no different to a competitor. 



Saar_Lion #140 Posted 14 February 2019 - 06:21 PM

    Private

  • Player
  • 1833 battles
  • 36
  • Member since:
    01-19-2019

View Posteekeeboo, on 13 February 2019 - 07:29 PM, said:

 

One of us is thinking as a game as a product designed to make money, marketed and developed to suit the target audience.

 

Are you in advertising? Serious question. You don't discuss, you (try to) spin. 

 

Straight question: How do you know how many people would choose to tick the realism box? 






1 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 1 guests, 0 anonymous users