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FL-Engineering need nerf asap


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_Conan_Librarian_ #1 Posted 14 February 2019 - 12:45 AM

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Just got 3 battles in a row, 2 as defender, we cant reach cap area and we got caped, fast tanks with maxed engineering just rush and cap fast. Last battle my team done same trick, we rush and cap before enemy show up. Broken skill, so please WG nerf is asap. # tanks with maxed Engi is overkill, no chance to def.

Dava_117 #2 Posted 14 February 2019 - 12:57 AM

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You know that it works on defender side too, don't you?

It increase the cap lock on a tank damage to up to 15 seconds. Slap it on a fast firing tank and enjoy the perma cap lock. Sure, this require you too drop arty or aerial attack...

 

I use it on all my HT to aggressively push or to negate enemy the chance to cap.


Edited by Dava_117, 14 February 2019 - 12:58 AM.


_Conan_Librarian_ #3 Posted 14 February 2019 - 01:02 AM

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View PostDava_117, on 14 February 2019 - 12:57 AM, said:

You know that it works on defender side too, don't you?

It increase the cap lock on a tank damage to up to 15 seconds. Slap it on a fast firing tank and enjoy the perma cap lock. Sure, this require you too drop arty or aerial attack...

 

I use it on all my HT to aggressively push or to negate enemy the chance to cap.

 

Which part you cant get? no tank was able to reach cap zone and we got caped. 

Dava_117 #4 Posted 14 February 2019 - 01:05 AM

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View Post_Conan_Librarian_, on 14 February 2019 - 01:02 AM, said:

 

Which part you cant get? no tank was able to reach cap zone and we got caped. 

 

If they manage to get there and cap for half a minute without being disturbed, maybe your team wasn't that good. But if you think is so strong, use fast tanks too and counter them.

Hedgehog1963 #5 Posted 14 February 2019 - 01:19 AM

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In other threads people complaining about FL being just campers...

Dorander #6 Posted 14 February 2019 - 01:56 AM

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View Post_Conan_Librarian_, on 14 February 2019 - 12:02 AM, said:

 

Which part you cant get? no tank was able to reach cap zone and we got caped. 

 

Wrong. No tank was willing to reach capzone or able to fire on capzone.

 

It is mechanically not possible for a tank to drive to the capzone before it is capped, it's roughly a 30 seconds captime. You can drive any tank from spawnpoint to capzone in that time. The problem is that you very likely wouldn't survive it but that's not a problem of mechanics, it's a playerskill/choice problem.

 

If you spawn to defend A, and you don't have a tank on the west flank to fire at people hiding behind the obvious block-rock, you are defending wrong. If you don't have anyone willing and able to spot cappers, you are defending wrong.

If you spawn to defend B, and you don't have tanks on the east flank to fire at the people hiding behind the buildings and mountain, you are defending wrong.

If you spawn to defend C........... I don't even know what to say here, C is so stupidly easy to defend unless you are being swarmed, you are simply defending wrong. Nearly all of C can be defended from hulldown positions except the position behind the rock which can be defended from center C-map. If people there get fired you don't have east-side control of C in which case you are defending wrong.

 

Point in fact, everyhing about this thread just reveals that you've been involved in teams that have no idea how to defend cappers on the Frontline map. This happens, it sucks, but it does. Learn. Adapt. Improve. Accept that you won't win them all. Frontline is personally very rewarding so if you do well you get good rewards, so take it.



tajj7 #7 Posted 14 February 2019 - 10:13 AM

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I agree with the OP, it makes it near impossible to defend as it stacks on each tank, so 3 people on the cap means you have 15s basically to defend, which is near impossible even if you are right near the cap you'll get 1-2 shots off before they cap.  I've seen whole teams try to rush to defend and they just can't do it, you just can't kill tanks that fast and the cap block thing doesn't work for long enough. 

 

It's too strong, it should either not stack, so it only works for the first person with it on the cap, or it generally needs toning down to maybe max 50% cap rate at level 5, not 100%. 



Dava_117 #8 Posted 14 February 2019 - 10:49 AM

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View Posttajj7, on 14 February 2019 - 10:13 AM, said:

I agree with the OP, it makes it near impossible to defend as it stacks on each tank, so 3 people on the cap means you have 15s basically to defend, which is near impossible even if you are right near the cap you'll get 1-2 shots off before they cap.  I've seen whole teams try to rush to defend and they just can't do it, you just can't kill tanks that fast and the cap block thing doesn't work for long enough. 

 

It's too strong, it should either not stack, so it only works for the first person with it on the cap, or it generally needs toning down to maybe max 50% cap rate at level 5, not 100%. 

 

Rememver that this perk also allows to totally stop the cap if you get inside the cap circle. I saved some almost lost cap by driving inside the circle in my KV-4 and holding up untill back up tanks arrived and wiped out the attackers. In some cap this can be done by lightly armoured tanks too (A, E and F in example) if you have a TD covering your back.

tajj7 #9 Posted 14 February 2019 - 11:11 AM

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View PostDava_117, on 14 February 2019 - 09:49 AM, said:

 

Rememver that this perk also allows to totally stop the cap if you get inside the cap circle. I saved some almost lost cap by driving inside the circle in my KV-4 and holding up untill back up tanks arrived and wiped out the attackers. In some cap this can be done by lightly armoured tanks too (A, E and F in example) if you have a TD covering your back.

 

Yes but its far less effective in a defensive role and you have to have it AND have a the right tank (lightly armoured tanks won't last, if there are 3 capping then 80% of your health is gone form their first shots) as well to have any chance of a defence and even then you need that + the whole team to bundle on + good focus fire to even have a slight chance.

 

You shouldn't need that to counter just one perk and someone yoloing into a cap IMO. There needs to be better balance between attacking and defending, winning on attack should not just be about rushing with a magic consumable and you are done. 

 

Game already favours attack more than defence IMO and I feel like the engineering perk has swayed it more, its noticeable the amount of fast caps now happening as people have progressed the levels and have maxed out most of their perks, first day or so these fast caps didn't happen and attacking teams had to work a bit more to get the capture which I think was more balanced.

 

It needs toning down IMO or like I said it shouldn't stack, reducing it to 50% effectiveness would still mean 3 people with it would cap in 30s, but at least then defenders have more of a chance to react. 

 

15s is a just a joke IMO and the perk is unabalanced. 



Balc0ra #10 Posted 14 February 2019 - 11:33 AM

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View Post_Conan_Librarian_, on 14 February 2019 - 01:02 AM, said:

 

Which part you cant get? no tank was able to reach cap zone and we got caped. 

 

It's why I never start with a HT. They are to slow. Frontline is all about crowd control. Thus you need a fast tank to reach all the "fires" fast if you will. Progetto with engineer does that rather well when defending. Vs a slower HT like the Lowe or Defender.

Dava_117 #11 Posted 14 February 2019 - 11:35 AM

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View Posttajj7, on 14 February 2019 - 11:11 AM, said:

 

Yes but its far less effective in a defensive role and you have to have it AND have a the right tank (lightly armoured tanks won't last, if there are 3 capping then 80% of your health is gone form their first shots) as well to have any chance of a defence and even then you need that + the whole team to bundle on + good focus fire to even have a slight chance.

 

You shouldn't need that to counter just one perk and someone yoloing into a cap IMO. There needs to be better balance between attacking and defending, winning on attack should not just be about rushing with a magic consumable and you are done. 

 

Game already favours attack more than defence IMO and I feel like the engineering perk has swayed it more, its noticeable the amount of fast caps now happening as people have progressed the levels and have maxed out most of their perks, first day or so these fast caps didn't happen and attacking teams had to work a bit more to get the capture which I think was more balanced.

 

It needs toning down IMO or like I said it shouldn't stack, reducing it to 50% effectiveness would still mean 3 people with it would cap in 30s, but at least then defenders have more of a chance to react. 

 

15s is a just a joke IMO and the perk is unabalanced. 

 

I agree that this time FL looks more on attackers side but, to be fair, I had the feeling that defending the objectives became harder more than defending caps. Didn't get a single 15 seec cap so far, but more than one time I lost a good chunk of some objective HP because a LT sneacked behind the line. While this is probably a good play for LTs, there are no real counter to this, because even if you abandon your tank, frequently there is not aa spawn close enought to effectively defend.

In example, yesterday I had a game in wich the enemy managed to push quite quickly trought A and D, while we hold B and C for long. Few minutes after the enemy unlocked the objectives area, objective 5 started to get damaged. We had no choice than drive for 2.5km to 5 because there wasn't any closer spawn.



EllemennT #12 Posted 14 February 2019 - 11:55 AM

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Yesterday I had a few games as defender where A & B was capped within first 1 minute of the game. I initially blamed incompetency of the team (defending C), but it seems it was just people with engineering rushing cap. Not fun, cause it substantially decreases chances of the defending team and shortens the battle, basically preventing you from reaching general rank.

 

When will people learn that capping fast/not allowing cap and resolving the battle in 10 minutes is not good for anyone?



tajj7 #13 Posted 14 February 2019 - 12:08 PM

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View PostDava_117, on 14 February 2019 - 10:35 AM, said:

 

I agree that this time FL looks more on attackers side but, to be fair, I had the feeling that defending the objectives became harder more than defending caps. Didn't get a single 15 seec cap so far, but more than one time I lost a good chunk of some objective HP because a LT sneacked behind the line. While this is probably a good play for LTs, there are no real counter to this, because even if you abandon your tank, frequently there is not aa spawn close enought to effectively defend.

In example, yesterday I had a game in wich the enemy managed to push quite quickly trought A and D, while we hold B and C for long. Few minutes after the enemy unlocked the objectives area, objective 5 started to get damaged. We had no choice than drive for 2.5km to 5 because there wasn't any closer spawn.

 

Yeh but that is pointless and people will soon work that out, you are better off sneaking through the lines and flanking the enemy, killing arty, causing players to come back from flags rather than go for the guns. I did over 6k damage to 3 guns in one game yesterday and didn't even go up a rank, the XP gains from killing the guns makes it a waste of time and there is no real bonus to winning.

 

We also had a game yesterday where about 6 meds/lights with engineering rushed B, took it instantly, we had to fall back and they then rushed E with the same tactic, it was basically unstoppable because you have to kill 4 or 5 tanks within 15s. 

 

And as said above, this just leads to fast games where no one really achieves anything. IMO Engineering is OP. 



fwhaatpiraat #14 Posted 14 February 2019 - 12:13 PM

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:trollface:

SuedKAT #15 Posted 14 February 2019 - 03:03 PM

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Played FL for 6 hours yesterday, won every match I attacked in and lost every one but one when I was defending, FL got more issues than this if you want to take it for something other than a farming simulator.

Dorander #16 Posted 14 February 2019 - 04:09 PM

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The good news is that once the first rush is over even if you lose A, B and/or C, you then have solid fighting positions before people reach the other three caps, which aren't similarly rushable. If your team is actually the better team, you can even push them back to the original zones because once the airstrike is over they are accessible again.

 

Though kudos to fwhaat for that positioning, that's just good tactics :teethhappy:

 

Thing is capping leads to longer Frontline games. Longer Frontline games benefit everyone as there'll be more time to rank up and thus earn more Frontline rank and Prestige rewards, improves XP gains by higher rank and improves credit earnings because your repair costs are capped. Those quick victories where people never make it out the first zones hardly have any earnings and they're pretty boring in terms of fighting.



pecopad #17 Posted 14 February 2019 - 04:28 PM

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Who cares... this marathon is a joke,like the last ones WG did...

 

Impossible to get the rewards for the average players, and no advantage whatsoever for the one ones who are actually supporting the game by paying...

 

I do not think there is a company that treats the paying customers so bad has WG does....

 

 

Better play APEX, already got some legendary skins and had to pay nothing for them

 

 


Edited by pecopad, 14 February 2019 - 04:29 PM.


mjs_89 #18 Posted 14 February 2019 - 04:31 PM

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View Postfwhaatpiraat, on 14 February 2019 - 12:13 PM, said:

:trollface:

 

I was so hyped when I found out they kept that wall... On day 1 I managed to sneak in there unspotted in my LTTB, the enemy Defender who sat in the northern part of the cap didn't have a clue what was going on. To add insult to injury I also airstriked that poor guy while capping. Pure joy right there.

:great:

 

Edit: If defending, driving over that wall is one of my top priorities as well.


Edited by mjs_89, 14 February 2019 - 04:33 PM.


fwhaatpiraat #19 Posted 14 February 2019 - 04:50 PM

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View Postpecopad, on 14 February 2019 - 04:28 PM, said:

Who cares... this marathon is a joke,like the last ones WG did...

 

Impossible to get the rewards for the average players, and no advantage whatsoever for the one ones who are actually supporting the game by paying...

 

I do not think there is a company that treats the paying customers so bad has WG does....

 

 

Better play APEX, already got some legendary skins and had to pay nothing for them

 

 

 

"no advantage whatsoever for the one ones who are actually supporting the game by paying..." How about no? Let's see, what are advantages you can get by paying (in FL): much more credits (because of premium account) (factor 2 or so?), way more xp and crew xp, vehicles like T-44-100, Skorpion G, Progetto 46, Elc even (really suited for this game mode), M41 GF and maybe stuff like Defender, Liberté or Chysler can be uselul. 

You can get the rewards like everybody else. If you cannot get to level 30 in this week, you will start at the level you're now at, in March. So it might take a little longer than the most dedicated players. In the end the most dedicated players will get the 'shiniest' rewards (the Swedish one and the unknown vehicle), but with less commitment, time or skill you can get vehicles like STA-2 (which has had really big buffs in the past) and the WZ.

However, if you want to get 'pride and accomplishment' by paying, maybe you should consider playing games from EA.


Edited by fwhaatpiraat, 14 February 2019 - 05:02 PM.


Igor_BL #20 Posted 14 February 2019 - 05:03 PM

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agree with OP.
I have engineering on all my tanks. In attack it is far more usefull then defending the cap.

Rush to cap and then farm them as they retreat... Got 5 Generals yesterday in a row on that tactic (4 attacks + 1 defence)

 

P.S. lets say 3 scouts in platoon with maxed engineering... impossible to defend, simply impossible.


Edited by Igor_BL, 14 February 2019 - 05:04 PM.





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