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XVM 101


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Poll: XVM in WoT (257 members have cast votes)

You have to complete 250 battles in order to participate this poll.

Should XVM be banned ?

  1. Yes (170 votes [66.15%])

    Percentage of vote: 66.15%

  2. No (87 votes [33.85%])

    Percentage of vote: 33.85%

If you said yes, then why (few options i could thnk of)?

  1. I got stat-shamed. (9 votes [3.50%])

    Percentage of vote: 3.50%

  2. I'm a purplecum who gets focused 24/7 (38 votes [14.79%])

    Percentage of vote: 14.79%

  3. It gives somehow an unfair advantage (86 votes [33.46%])

    Percentage of vote: 33.46%

  4. ??? (31 votes [12.06%])

    Percentage of vote: 12.06%

  5. I said NO! (93 votes [36.19%])

    Percentage of vote: 36.19%

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_Boujee_ #41 Posted 14 February 2019 - 03:42 PM

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View PostIsharial, on 14 February 2019 - 03:30 PM, said:

 

why do you believe its acceptable to use 3rd party things that not everyone knows about? these things are not known by everyone, and therefore is an advantage regardless of whether *you* and 14 other's in that battle know about it or not... there's still 15 other players who don't. why do you think its acceptable to basically ruin their game?

if you have to go outside of the official client to get said information, then its an advantage over others, does not matter where.

 

that information, as you've said, allows you to make decisions you would not otherwise make. that, to me, sounds very much like its going against a few of the rules laid out in the EULA....

 

 

You also can use the official WG site to find players statistics. Go to community>players> and then type his nickname. Stats are widely accesable, and finding them is not some kind of black magick.

Edited by _Boujee_, 14 February 2019 - 03:43 PM.


ThinGun #42 Posted 14 February 2019 - 03:56 PM

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View PostRati_Festa, on 14 February 2019 - 03:19 PM, said:

 

Yes and that claim is true.... as not everyone knows XVM even exists. So its not available to everyone as they play blissfully ignorant to the fact that a percentage of the player base is playing with an advantage.

 

So you are in the wrong to disagree with that statement.

 

I played 10k games without knowing it existed..... I was playing at a disadvantage unknowingly. 

 

By the same token, I didn't know anything about crew training and perks like 6th Sense when I first started playing.  Was I playing at a disadvantage?  Yes.  Should crew perks be banned because I couldn't be bothered to do any research?  Hmmmm.

G01ngToxicCommand0 #43 Posted 14 February 2019 - 04:02 PM

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Mods should be banned altogether so that everyone is on a level playing field.

 



SlyMeerkat #44 Posted 14 February 2019 - 04:03 PM

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Its a cheat and those who say otherwise clearly defends cheaters 

Signal11th #45 Posted 14 February 2019 - 04:07 PM

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View PostThinGun, on 14 February 2019 - 02:56 PM, said:

 

By the same token, I didn't know anything about crew training and perks like 6th Sense when I first started playing.  Was I playing at a disadvantage?  Yes.  Should crew perks be banned because I couldn't be bothered to do any research?  Hmmmm.

 

One is in game one is out of game different argument and cant be used, if you're not investigating the inside of a game then yes your at fault but not to investigate "3rd party" apps outside of the game is what.... normal.. The way certain people defend it when really people are only asking for it to be removed from "in battle" you have to suspect they either rely on it or get an advantage from it both of which is bad for them in the long run and bad for the players who don't use it. As far as I'm concerned it's a legitimised cheat.

Edited by signal11th, 14 February 2019 - 04:12 PM.


Komarovsky1970 #46 Posted 14 February 2019 - 04:07 PM

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Stats should not be visible in battle and my stats should only be available to sites or apps to which I have explicitly supplied an API key. Somewhat surprising they have not already implemented this due to GDPR.

Evilier_than_Skeletor #47 Posted 14 February 2019 - 04:13 PM

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View PostCobra6, on 14 February 2019 - 03:41 PM, said:

XVM only promotes unhealthy focus on individual players because of a colour rather then the direct threat they pose to you team in a certain map location/area.

Well, not only. It also gives an idea what you can expect from your team mates. For example a good player will probably support a push, while a very bad one will patiently wait behind his precious rock for you to die so he can snipe. A good player will provide more valuable information in chat and on the map than a bad one. 

 

Is it unfair that some players have such an advantage? Probably. Then again anyone can get xvm for free at any time. Using bond equipment, directives, food, large kits, 5 skill crews and strong premiums are also advantages and not available to all for free at any time.



Spiceck #48 Posted 14 February 2019 - 04:14 PM

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XVM-focus is not a problem of XVM but of arty. Even without XVM they will click at TRVST, FAME and SHEKL.They will still discourage agressive gameplay, which is done by better players. So nerf arty, limit arty or remove arty.

About Non-Arty focus i have a clear opinion. It rarely happens. And when people focus on it it rather hurts their gameplay. And wenn they actually do it it usually results in retarded moves that will also hurt them.


Edited by Spiceck, 14 February 2019 - 04:18 PM.


Signal11th #49 Posted 14 February 2019 - 04:16 PM

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View PostEvilier_than_Skeletor, on 14 February 2019 - 03:13 PM, said:

Well, not only. It also gives an idea what you can expect from your team mates. For example a good player will probably support a push, while a very bad one will patiently wait behind his precious rock for you to die so he can snipe. A good player will provide more valuable information in chat and on the map than a bad one. 

 

Is it unfair that some players have such an advantage? Probably. Then again anyone can get xvm for free at any time. Using bond equipment, directives, food, large kits, 5 skill crews and strong premiums are also advantages and not available to all for free at any time.

 

One has nothing to do with the other, I cannot see in the game if they have these things so no tactical advantage for me at all, stats I can see so I get a tactical advantage I shouldn't...  Shouldn't really have to point this stuff

out.. 


Edited by signal11th, 14 February 2019 - 04:22 PM.


Rati_Festa #50 Posted 14 February 2019 - 04:21 PM

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View Post_Boujee_, on 14 February 2019 - 03:38 PM, said:

 

And this is where we cannot take this discussion any further, as mine (not only mine tho) opinion is contrary. In my eyes, the mere information of how good others are wont make you suddenly preform any better. 

 

What gives you a tremendous preformance boost are mods like tundra , destroyed objects on minimap etc.

 

I still disagree with arguments you wrote in favor of banning XVM, and I prolly never will, unless you come up with something really good.

 

 

 

So in my example where the 3 arty gang up on the enemy unicum and we win as he is literally removed from game due to the fact that he is purple and they have XVM. That didn't give the arty players a better chance of winning? Which we did and therefore we "performed" better as our WR went up. Kind of makes your statement look silly doesn't it, when you read what I wrote and then read your ill thought out responses.

 

So you can have your deluded opinion and I'll have my factual proven opinion.

 


Edited by Rati_Festa, 14 February 2019 - 04:23 PM.


Evilier_than_Skeletor #51 Posted 14 February 2019 - 04:22 PM

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View Postsignal11th, on 14 February 2019 - 04:16 PM, said:

 

One has nothing to do with the other, I cannot see in the game if they have these things so no tactical advantage for me at all, stats I can see so I get a tactical advantage I shouldn't...  Shouldn't really have to point this stuff out..

I'm not sure I understand. A tank that has all the things listed above performs better than one that doesn't. But that doesn't matter, because you can't see what setups tanks are running?



Cobra6 #52 Posted 14 February 2019 - 04:22 PM

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View Post_Boujee_, on 14 February 2019 - 02:42 PM, said:

 

You also can use the official WG site to find players statistics. Go to community>players> and then type his nickname. Stats are widely accesable, and finding them is not some kind of black magick.

 

There is a big difference between looking them up in the garage and having them available in a simple/clear/visual way in the battle.

 

One thing you can do in the vanilla game, one thing you can't.

 

Cobra 6



_Boujee_ #53 Posted 14 February 2019 - 04:25 PM

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View PostCobra6, on 14 February 2019 - 04:22 PM, said:

 

There is a big difference between looking them up in the garage and having them available in a simple/clear/visual way in the battle.

 

One thing you can do in the vanilla game, one thing you can't.

 

Cobra 6

Before the battle starts you can also use that 30+ seconds to look up players (if you are playing on prohorovka you prolly will have 10 mins :trollface:


Edited by _Boujee_, 14 February 2019 - 04:25 PM.


ThinGun #54 Posted 14 February 2019 - 04:25 PM

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View Postsignal11th, on 14 February 2019 - 04:07 PM, said:

 

One is in game one is out of game different argument and cant be used, if you're not investigating the inside of a game then yes your at fault but not to investigate "3rd party" apps outside of the game is what.... normal.. The way certain people defend it when really people are only asking for it to be removed from "in battle" you have to suspect they either rely on it or get an advantage from it both of which is bad for them in the long run and bad for the players who don't use it. As far as I'm concerned it's a legitimised cheat.

 

I don't think there's any question about whether people rely on it or get an advantage from it - of course they do, otherwise, why use it?

 

The only debate is whether such advantage is unfair or not.  You say it is, I say it isn't.  There's no science or empirical evidence to support either opinion - the grown up thing to do is "agree to differ".



Signal11th #55 Posted 14 February 2019 - 04:30 PM

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View PostEvilier_than_Skeletor, on 14 February 2019 - 03:22 PM, said:

I'm not sure I understand. A tank that has all the things listed above performs better than one that doesn't. But that doesn't matter, because you can't see what setups tanks are running?

Seriously? Right, I have XVM and can see all of the players and potentially how good they are, Take one other player on the same team who doesn't have XVM, we both have exactly the same tanks with exactly the same setups. Who has an advantage the other doesn't???

Just because one person or multiple people in the game have advantages they have got "in the game" which everyone can get doesn't mean it's ok to offset that by giving people another advantage that's got from outside the game. Take your assumption, would you be happy if you have played this game for say 1 year for a one day old player to get exactly the same as you when you are playing?

15:32 Added after 2 minutes

View PostThinGun, on 14 February 2019 - 03:25 PM, said:

 

I don't think there's any question about whether people rely on it or get an advantage from it - of course they do, otherwise, why use it?

 

The only debate is whether such advantage is unfair or not.  You say it is, I say it isn't.  There's no science or empirical evidence to support either opinion - the grown up thing to do is "agree to differ".

 

Don't really think any kind of "evidence" would be needed to answer such an easy question.. One person has a gun one person doesn't... is one person at more of an advantage than the other. The answer is pretty obvious of course it's unfair. If WG put it into the game themselves then I would have to accept it the fact they don't means I don't have to.

Edited by signal11th, 14 February 2019 - 04:35 PM.


HaZardeur #56 Posted 14 February 2019 - 04:32 PM

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I voted yes but OP missed most critical why in his vote: Its creates toxicity!

Edited by HaZardeur, 14 February 2019 - 04:33 PM.


ThinGun #57 Posted 14 February 2019 - 04:34 PM

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View Postsignal11th, on 14 February 2019 - 04:30 PM, said:

 

Don't really think any kind of "evidence" would be needed to answer such an easy question.. One person has a gun one person doesn't... is one person at more of an advantage than the other. The answer is pretty obvious.

 

You missed the point.   Re-read and answer properly.

15:35 Added after 1 minute

View PostHaZardeur, on 14 February 2019 - 04:32 PM, said:

I voted yes but OP missed most critical why in his vote: Its creates toxicity!

 

Balderdash.  The toxicity exists anyway.  XVM is just a way it can be focused.  Take this forum as an example ... as toxic as hell, and yet we don't have XVM ....

Signal11th #58 Posted 14 February 2019 - 04:36 PM

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View PostThinGun, on 14 February 2019 - 03:34 PM, said:

 

You missed the point.   Re-read and answer properly.

15:35 Added after 1 minute

 

Balderdash.  The toxicity exists anyway.  XVM is just a way it can be focused.  Take this forum as an example ... as toxic as hell, and yet we don't have XVM ....

 

I did but you're wrong :-P and yes we do have xvm on the forums because as soon as anyone makes a ridiculous post or assumption most people check their stats but we do it manually and not have a nice friendly app to give it us.

Edited by signal11th, 14 February 2019 - 04:37 PM.


ThinGun #59 Posted 14 February 2019 - 04:38 PM

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View Postsignal11th, on 14 February 2019 - 04:36 PM, said:

 

I did but you're wrong :-P and yes we do have xvm on the forums because as soon as anyone makes a ridiculous post or assumption most people check their stats but we do it manually and not have a nice friendly app to give it us.

 

You didn't.  I said that XVM DOES provide an advantage.  The only issue is ... is the advantage fair or not?

You can't provide any evidence for either opinion, though ... I'd suggest that the very fact that WG allow it in game implies that they consider it to be fair.

tajj7 #60 Posted 14 February 2019 - 04:41 PM

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View PostThinGun, on 14 February 2019 - 03:25 PM, said:

 I say it isn't. 

 

And you are wrong, there is no discussion here and no evidence is needed because its based on the literal definition of the word 'fair'. 

 

Fair means access for everyone, external mods are not accessible to everyone who plays the game for various reasons (many may not even know about them, some might not want to download non certified/verified stuff etc, etc.), stuff in game IS, therefore is fair.  Just because you were unable to find crew training even though it is right in front of you does not make it fair, it just makes you blind. 

 

If you want to argue, take it up with the dictionary. 






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