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Could this make Prokhorovka playable for super heavy tanks?


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panzer_war #1 Posted 07 April 2019 - 07:00 PM

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So yeah this map, open and wide without a single cover, usually super heavy players tend to go in the center and do stuff, to get then eaten slowly by the enemy artillery, or they camp at the back wating for spotters to do something, or even yoloing on the field next to the center hoping to spot before dying, i personally never liked this map but i got this idea recently and i thought about sharing it with you. I will use a map image for reference:

05_prohorovka.jpg

so as you can see there is a small village next to the tracks at the base of the hill, In a battle whitout artillery i tried to go there with my Maus (NoOb u dOn'T hAvE MaUs In YoUr gArAgE) yeah in fact i tried this on test server, anyway going there i was able to block a lot of damage and provide spotting for my team on the tanks that were on the hill and in the center of the map, though this village is made of destroyable buildings, which sooner or later, the enemy team will destroy.

 

So the idea is: make the village a bit bigger and add some non destroyable buildings so heavy tanks can go there and angle/sidescrape, whatever you like. (this even at the cost of making the map itself a bit bigger on that side)

This would be interesting as if the enemy team doesn't have the map control of both the hill and the center, heavy tanks could do a better job supporting the flank instaed of camping at the back in the bushes or getting massacred by the arty/tds/meds in the center.

 

Your opinions?



krazypenguin #2 Posted 07 April 2019 - 07:06 PM

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My opinion is that it's pretty much the ONLY decent map for light tanks to really scout properly (Malinovka is dicey IMO), whereas almost every map feels designed for heavies to brawl and LTs to have a mostly horrible time.  As such, I think heavy tank drivers should take this one map that really allows LTs to shines with good grace and deal with it.

 

P.S finally completed LT-14 for T55a on Prok today in my T-54 LWT.  Has taken me years.  One LT per team, no WVs and enemy LT was super passive.  10,380 spotting damage.


Edited by krazypenguin, 07 April 2019 - 07:11 PM.


MeNoobTank #3 Posted 07 April 2019 - 07:09 PM

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Imo the map is fine, super heavies should always go mid near the rail tracks and provide support for the hill guys. 

Dorander #4 Posted 07 April 2019 - 07:10 PM

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Artillery can hit pretty much anyone who's spotted on that map no matter where they are, but TDs and meds can't so if you have all of those murdering you, you need to reconsider your position. I suggest not trying to peek over the 3-4 line when you have a bunch of unspotted TDs on the enemy side.

 

What you can do as a superheavy is fire at the hill from the center/left of center. If you're top tier and the TD count isn't too high you can actually push the 1-2 line effectively. You can also go play in the village where you should have enough cover from the center, assuming you have people on the hill and somebody in mid who spot the location next to the track so those enemies can't fire at you with impunity.

 

People think of (super)heavies too linearly, like all they can and must do is cornerfight somewhere in hard cover and if they can't they're useless. This isn't true, and a map like Prok just means you can't press W to the dedicated heavy-fighting spot and do your thing. I don't see the need for the change at all.



Balc0ra #5 Posted 07 April 2019 - 07:17 PM

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That will only help head on pushing that lane that not many do in randoms. Nor do I think many would if they had solid cover there. But it won't help much vs the flank fire, or arty on the A1 or A0. Unless you place buildings to cover the flanks and block those too. But then agian if you can't destroy the bulldings, it might block the north fire on hill in the middle. As it's already doing, but you can shoot those away now.

TungstenHitman #6 Posted 07 April 2019 - 07:27 PM

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With so many maps(majority of maps actually) tailored to play into the hands of heavily armored tanks in which they get to have battles fought on their terms, I don't really sympathize too much for those same heavily armored tanks when they get drawn on an open map or more fast paced multi-choice(playstyle option) map more suitable for well, faster tanks. 



Shad0wize #7 Posted 07 April 2019 - 07:28 PM

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The complaint is absolutely ludicrous. I cannot possibly fathom why you would even want to go there aside from getting shot in the side from two different angles instead of just holding mid and taking albeit minimal damage from artillery in regards to the overall damage output and output capacity.

 

The village in there can and is indeed sometimes used by heavy tanks with sufficient experience, quite rarely though. The reasons are simple and many. Just as many as there are reasons to not add superheavies in the game or at the very least not make them impossible to pen forward by more than 60% of the tanks they engage with (frontally) on maps were they cannot use bush mechanics and flank.

 

You cannot be outflanked on that map if your team is somewhat aware of where the 'w' key is, you can probably kill the entire forest just by pressing 'w' through it after the first 3-4 minutes and just going through it and an angle, you can damage any tank you see, you cannot be damaged by most tanks that are shooting at you (frontally) and now you want a 'speshal' spot where you can get shots in instead of just relying on your scouts and mediums?!!!!

 

This is utterly ridiculous and completely unbelievable.



Noo_Noo #8 Posted 07 April 2019 - 07:49 PM

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Best map int he game IMO.

 

It's one of few maps that has viable flanking options. 

But you need to have patience on it. 



Nishi_Kinuyo #9 Posted 07 April 2019 - 08:32 PM

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Map should just be removed from randoms instead.

Noo_Noo #10 Posted 07 April 2019 - 08:43 PM

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View PostNishi_Kinuyo, on 07 April 2019 - 08:32 PM, said:

Map should just be removed from randoms instead.

 

Why? Best map in the game

Edited by Noo_Noo, 07 April 2019 - 08:44 PM.


panzer_war #11 Posted 07 April 2019 - 08:48 PM

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View PostShad0wize, on 07 April 2019 - 06:28 PM, said:

The complaint is absolutely ludicrous. I cannot possibly fathom why you would even want to go there aside from getting shot in the side from two different angles instead of just holding mid and taking albeit minimal damage from artillery in regards to the overall damage output and output capacity.

 

Complaint? where did i even say this was a complaint? This is simply a suggestion. Also i said it depends on map control of the team, you are saying that like the heavies should go in a specific spot each time there is a prokhorovka battle.

View PostShad0wize, on 07 April 2019 - 06:28 PM, said:

The reasons are simple and many. Just as many as there are reasons to not add superheavies in the game or at the very least not make them impossible to pen forward by more than 60% of the tanks they engage with (frontally) on maps were they cannot use bush mechanics and flank.

Yeah, better allow then to let any other thing pen them (FRONTALLY) with the balanced premium ammo, even light tanks, LOL.

View PostShad0wize, on 07 April 2019 - 06:28 PM, said:

You cannot be outflanked on that map if your team is somewhat aware of where the 'w' key is, you can probably kill the entire forest just by pressing 'w' through it after the first 3-4 minutes and just going through it and an angle, you can damage any tank you see, you cannot be damaged by most tanks that are shooting at you (frontally) and now you want a 'speshal' spot where you can get shots in instead of just relying on your scouts and mediums?!!!!

 

 Go through the forest and angle? spot? you mean go through the forest and DIE by anything camping with the 2 key pressed (once again, heavies are useless because gold ammo), i also never said i want a "speshal" spot for the heavies, i saw heavies go suicide spot through the forest just to get back to garage and change tank, and as i repeat again this isn't a complaint or something i want, just a SUGGESTION.

Also LOL relying on scouts and mediums, like in every game there was super pro players who play that role.

 

I don't care if for you think it's ridicolous, my idea isn't even that harmful thing for the map, just making the god damn village bigger with some non destroyable buildings wouldn't ruin the gameplay, because as you said "who would go there unless you want to get shot by crossfire", right? 

 


Edited by panzer_war, 07 April 2019 - 08:52 PM.


SuedKAT #12 Posted 07 April 2019 - 08:58 PM

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I have no issues playing Proko in my SHT, however it's one of the few maps in the game that's not designed around brawling and actually grants all classes a valid chance to influence the battle, if anything other maps should take after Proko a lot more than Proko should be turned into yet another slug fest of a brawl.

Edited by SuedKAT, 07 April 2019 - 08:59 PM.


CyberRage #13 Posted 07 April 2019 - 09:07 PM

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I like the map a lot but that is probably because I mainly play lights. I completely agree they should add some non-destructive houses to the village. It doesn't provide any real cover at all from arty or campers.

Laur_Balaur_XD #14 Posted 07 April 2019 - 09:14 PM

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Please leave this map alone, is one of the few good maps that we have.

Nishi_Kinuyo #15 Posted 07 April 2019 - 09:25 PM

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View PostNoo_Noo, on 07 April 2019 - 08:43 PM, said:

 

Why? Best map in the game

Because it doesn't matter where I go on that map, I get zero ffing support from my team since they're all too busy wanking that bush.



lnfernaI #16 Posted 07 April 2019 - 09:35 PM

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I like the concept,but this map is generally the best for LTs and MTs,and TDs. Literally 90% of the maps are already catered to HTs. Just do not fix what isn't broken. Deal with it.

View PostNishi_Kinuyo, on 07 April 2019 - 10:25 PM, said:

Because it doesn't matter where I go on that map, I get zero ffing support from my team since they're all too busy wanking that bush.

 

you need to share the love with your fellow weebs toonmates,otherwise there is no pushing. i've learned this the hard way.

1ncompetenc3 #17 Posted 07 April 2019 - 09:51 PM

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I like the idea of making a few of the buildings non-destructible (though I thought there already were some that couldn't be completely wrecked), but knowing WG if they were to start adding buildings it would end up being Stalingrad 2.0.

Edited by 1ncompetenc3, 07 April 2019 - 09:52 PM.


kubawt112 #18 Posted 07 April 2019 - 10:04 PM

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I reckon you could make the case for more cover without even mentioning heavy tanks. It certainly wouldn't hurt to have some way of gaining control of the eastern side, and let the campers steep in their bushes on the 1/2-line.

 

Outright catering to all classes on one map makes it harder to make the map more interesting. Take some cues from Murovanka and, to some degree, Redshire if you need to figure out how.



Nishi_Kinuyo #19 Posted 07 April 2019 - 10:08 PM

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View PostlnfernaI, on 07 April 2019 - 09:35 PM, said:

you need to share the love with your fellow weebs toonmates,otherwise there is no pushing. i've learned this the hard way.

When I do that it is in skirmishes, so my arguement still stands: remove it from randoms.

Since, you know, the map is actually fine when you have a team you can rely on.

As in: skirmishes or team battles.



DeadLecter #20 Posted 07 April 2019 - 10:46 PM

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View Postkrazypenguin, on 07 April 2019 - 09:36 PM, said:

My opinion is that it's pretty much the ONLY decent map for light tanks to really scout properly (Malinovka is dicey IMO), whereas almost every map feels designed for heavies to brawl and LTs to have a mostly horrible time.  As such, I think heavy tank drivers should take this one map that really allows LTs to shines with good grace and deal with it.

 

P.S finally completed LT-14 for T55a on Prok today in my T-54 LWT.  Has taken me years.  One LT per team, no WVs and enemy LT was super passive.  10,380 spotting damage.

 

Funniest part is, play LTs for 1000 battles you never get Prok. Play one battle in your Maus, it will be Prok.




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