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Premium Shells - The ideal solution


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TheJumpMaster #1 Posted 08 April 2019 - 12:14 AM

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Don't get shot©®™

 

571110994_preview_keep-calm-and-dont-get-shot.png



XxKuzkina_MatxX #2 Posted 08 April 2019 - 12:18 AM

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You're 48 hours late!

TheJumpMaster #3 Posted 08 April 2019 - 12:24 AM

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View PostXxKuzkina_MatxX, on 08 April 2019 - 01:18 AM, said:

You're 48 hours late!

 

I'm sorry, I was at work :ohmy::(

Alabamatick #4 Posted 08 April 2019 - 12:29 AM

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Ib4obvious lock :popcorn:

lnfernaI #5 Posted 08 April 2019 - 05:41 AM

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but they are by no means premium :(

Anymn #6 Posted 08 April 2019 - 10:10 AM

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Ideal solution is no premium ammo allowed in Randoms. End of discussion.

4nt #7 Posted 08 April 2019 - 11:31 AM

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Jumpy plz don't make sense, you've been around enough that you know it doesn't fit here.

DuncaN_101 #8 Posted 08 April 2019 - 11:43 AM

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Jumpy for president... With solutions like this. What could go wrong?

Balc0ra #9 Posted 08 April 2019 - 12:23 PM

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View PostAnymn, on 08 April 2019 - 10:10 AM, said:

Ideal solution is no premium ammo allowed in Randoms. End of discussion.

 

This is when you show us you can keep your 63% WR on the IS-6 with 186 pen alone with the new MM facing Defenders and 250 effective lower plates on a VK 100.01. As removing alone with no other fixes. Only replaces one issue with another.

Anymn #10 Posted 08 April 2019 - 12:33 PM

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View PostBalc0ra, on 08 April 2019 - 12:23 PM, said:

 

This is when you show us you can keep your 63% WR on the IS-6 with 186 pen alone with the new MM facing Defenders and 250 effective lower plates on a VK 100.01. As removing alone with no other fixes. Only replaces one issue with another.

 

Quite happily so. But, that also requires that other players won't shoot premium ammo at my IS-6, or things get imbalanced quickly. Without gold, I've to aim longer and/or flank that Defender.


Edited by Anymn, 08 April 2019 - 12:33 PM.


AliceUnchained #11 Posted 09 April 2019 - 10:02 AM

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View PostAnymn, on 08 April 2019 - 10:10 AM, said:

Ideal solution is no premium ammo allowed in Randoms. End of discussion.

 

It would ruin whatever sliver of balance is left, lower Tiers will become even more useless. 

 

View PostAnymn, on 08 April 2019 - 12:33 PM, said:

Quite happily so. But, that also requires that other players won't shoot premium ammo at my IS-6, or things get imbalanced quickly. Without gold, I've to aim longer and/or flank that Defender.

 

Right, because those nasty Tier VI won't have any trouble penetrating an IS-6 with standard rounds and they're causing a massive imbalance, making the IS-6 armor useless when firing premium rounds at it... You seem to have a rather limited view on the game, one in which only your own situation is considered, and everything should be tailored to your needs and desires. Overall balance be damned.

 

Also hilarious for you to talk about balance, with over 300 games played in a broken PoS like the WT auf E-100...



DA_ZOHAN #12 Posted 09 April 2019 - 10:11 AM

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The only balanced vehicle as far as standard ammo vs. premium ammo is the SU100Y.

Standard round has more pen, less dmg.

Premium round has less pen, more dmg.

 

Thus, a true skill round.

 

If this example is implemented throughout the entire tech tree, with a revamp of the aiming spread to give more accuracy, thus ability to hit weak spots, then people will have something else to whine about.



AliceUnchained #13 Posted 09 April 2019 - 12:05 PM

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View PostDA_ZOHAN, on 09 April 2019 - 10:11 AM, said:

The only balanced vehicle as far as standard ammo vs. premium ammo is the SU100Y.

Standard round has more pen, less dmg.

Premium round has less pen, more dmg.

 

Thus, a true skill round.

 

If this example is implemented throughout the entire tech tree, with a revamp of the aiming spread to give more accuracy, thus ability to hit weak spots, then people will have something else to whine about.

 

What about the Centurion 7/1?

 

And your example would make higher Tiers even more imbalanced when facing lower Tiers, as given sufficient penetration on those higher damage rounds, they can increase their damage output while the lower Tiers are even more screwed. You lot really don't ever see the bigger picture do you?



LordMuffin #14 Posted 09 April 2019 - 12:15 PM

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View PostBalc0ra, on 08 April 2019 - 12:23 PM, said:

 

This is when you show us you can keep your 63% WR on the IS-6 with 186 pen alone with the new MM facing Defenders and 250 effective lower plates on a VK 100.01. As removing alone with no other fixes. Only replaces one issue with another.

The IS-6 is extremely well armoured and weakspot free aswell. So it could be the case that it benefits more from having no premium ammo shot compared the disadvantage of not having premium ammo.

Every gun with below like 200-230mm of Penetration will have a very hard time penning the IS-6 after the armour buffs.



Bucifel #15 Posted 09 April 2019 - 12:16 PM

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View PostTheJumpMaster, on 08 April 2019 - 12:14 AM, said:

Don't get shot©®™

 

571110994_preview_keep-calm-and-dont-get-shot.png

 

with other words....just dont play that game.

LordMuffin #16 Posted 09 April 2019 - 12:17 PM

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View PostBucifel, on 09 April 2019 - 12:16 PM, said:

 

with other words....just dont play that game.

You can play arty.

 

Shoot enemies from safety and then drown. 



Bucifel #17 Posted 09 April 2019 - 12:20 PM

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View PostLordMuffin, on 09 April 2019 - 12:17 PM, said:

You can play arty.

 

Shoot enemies from safety and then drown. 

 

yes...but not on all maps...

not all contain water to offer you this honorable death...:(

so even with fartys is not possible to completely avoid this...



DA_ZOHAN #18 Posted 09 April 2019 - 12:22 PM

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View PostAliceUnchained, on 09 April 2019 - 01:05 PM, said:

 

What about the Centurion 7/1?

 

And your example would make higher Tiers even more imbalanced when facing lower Tiers, as given sufficient penetration on those higher damage rounds, they can increase their damage output while the lower Tiers are even more screwed. You lot really don't ever see the bigger picture do you?

 

Well, I agree that it creates a new problem.

Which is why the solution is a fluid one rather then fixed.

When you are bottom tier in a tier 6-7-8, you are screwed to begin with.

Maybe a solution would be variable pen.  When a Tier 6 shoots a tier 8, it gets the +25% RNG on the spot.  When a tier 8 shoots a tier 6, it gets the -25% RNG on the spot ( for pen)



AliceUnchained #19 Posted 09 April 2019 - 01:03 PM

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View PostDA_ZOHAN, on 09 April 2019 - 12:22 PM, said:

Well, I agree that it creates a new problem.

Which is why the solution is a fluid one rather then fixed.

When you are bottom tier in a tier 6-7-8, you are screwed to begin with.

Maybe a solution would be variable pen.  When a Tier 6 shoots a tier 8, it gets the +25% RNG on the spot.  When a tier 8 shoots a tier 6, it gets the -25% RNG on the spot ( for pen)

 

Substituting one problem for another, really isn't the way to go in my opinion. In order to address, fix, the issues, you need to understand the root causes first. And in order to do so with premium ammo usage (which is an effect, a symptom far more than a cause, or problem) you'd need to analyze, understand in great detail the situations in which it is used. In other words, figure out the main motivators (the 'need' ) as to why players choose to use it. 


Edited by AliceUnchained, 09 April 2019 - 01:03 PM.


DA_ZOHAN #20 Posted 09 April 2019 - 01:24 PM

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View PostAliceUnchained, on 09 April 2019 - 02:03 PM, said:

 

Substituting one problem for another, really isn't the way to go in my opinion. In order to address, fix, the issues, you need to understand the root causes first. And in order to do so with premium ammo usage (which is an effect, a symptom far more than a cause, or problem) you'd need to analyze, understand in great detail the situations in which it is used. In other words, figure out the main motivators (the 'need' ) as to why players choose to use it. 

 

The short version of your reply is this:

The reason why people use premium ammo is that it has more penetration.






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