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My view of WoT 2013-2019


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GentlemansSausage #1 Posted 11 April 2019 - 09:26 PM

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I didn't plan on starting any topic. But today marks the break day for me in "World of Tanks".

 

Before I go further with this "everything that's wront with World of Tanks" post, let me give you a little bit of background. I've joined WoT in 2013. Between then and 2015, I've played some 25k games. Played for the F15 clan, when it was one of the top 5 clans, and was myself among 500 or so best players in Europe. Barely missed world championships - by one loss. In 2015 I've had enough. I was fed up with the game, also had less time to play it. Between 2015 and now I've lost my account, and started new. Not so long ago I've decided to give the game another try.

 

But, in short, I believe that I know what I'm writing and can point at the things that are wrong. Well, I'm not the only one, since many great players are doing the same thing. I'm not doing it in hope to change Wargaming's stance and practices - we're way past that now - but to let off a bit of steam. And, honestly, in hope that at least a couple of players will think about it and perhaps push Wargaming to change things.

 

But well, here I go.

 

Back in 2013, World of Tanks wass skill based game, that required strategic thinking, knowledge of the maps, knowledge of the tanks, quick decision making etc. That was the game that I loved. Nowadays - it isn't skill based anymore. It's more like point and click game, where the only decision you have to make is: do I press "2" now, or wait a bit longer?

Of course, you can still play without using much gold, as I was trying to play. But what's the point? The carefull positioning, sidescraping, going hull down just doesn't matter anymore. All that the player opposing you has to do - is load gold. And so many players are playing like they are having gold diarrhoea, that it's not funny anymore.

Yes, I know. Unskilled players will load gold. They'll kill the enemy, but lose money, so they'll go for premium account and premium vehicles. Business. But for the game experience it's devastating. "You can't get no satisfaction", because you don't win the battle - the gold does. All your skills and knowledge doesn't matter - so you'll get frustrated. I'm happy for Wargaming members that they are swimming in cash right now... But other developers can swim in cash too, without devastating their games (War Thunder can be a great example).

Do not make mistake, that this applies only to World of Tanks. World of Warships is exactly the same.

 

The MatchMaker - well, that's another story. I remember that players never liked it, but nowadays Wargaming (yes, you chaps) have made it so bad, that for me it's unplayable. Years ago you could get 3 draws where you were bottom tier. For the last week, I was bottom tier like 90% of the games I've played - and I'm playing mostly T5 to T7 games. Furthermore, the teams are more unbalanced than ever. And now, after recent changes to MM, it's even worse than it was during "3-5-7 phase".

Of course, you can say that I'm moaning. And I am. But way too often I've found myself in the situations where I couldn't do anything. After 2 minutes of game, in my bottom-tier KV-85, my team was losing like 2 - 8, with 3 top tiers gone. Today that was the case in 4 of 5 games I've played. Yesterday - similarly. The day before yesterday - in about 13 out of 20 games. I was top tier twice.

I don't know what you did there, chaps, but you'll burn in hell for that.

 

The vehicles are unbalanced as f__k. And the artillery is the worst of all. Who came up with the stun mechanics? Whoever it was, he should be fired. Hey, Devs, I'll tell you what you did. Thanks to the stun effect and constant, although lower than before, damage, you've managed to make life more miserable for 12 out of 15 players each game. Years ago the arty was annoying, buy if you got hit, it was probably your fault. You didn't move, reposition fast enough. Now... You can just throw your keyboard away. It doesn't matter what you do. You'll eventualy get stunned. And then again. And again. And you can barely do anything about it, except camping.

All the changes you've promised recently won't change anything. And of course you will not roll the dice back and bring back the artillery like it was or nerf it to hell. Because that way you'd admit that you've made a mistake.

By the way. Artillery on lower tiers - that's the worst kind of overpowered vehicles.

 

The maps - oh yes. They are great too. The new ones are just shite. And the Province map? Whoever thought that it's great and needs to be reinstated, especially on the higher tiers, is just a moron.

 

Those are the worst parts. I know that you won't change anything. Not really. Which is even more sad, since the core of the game is still fun. But all the things you changed or added during recent years, have just ruined my experience. Better graphics, physics and all that stuff, are just of secondary importance.

 

And I'll tell you what. From everything I see, WoT is bleeding players right now. Perhaps you don't care. But if you do... Well, you know what to do.

 

But for now, I'm going back to War Thunder. It has its own faults, many of them too. But at least it's fair. And your skills matters there.



1ucky #2 Posted 12 April 2019 - 12:07 AM

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Doesn't like premium ammo and arty.

But in so many words.

Bye.



seXikanac #3 Posted 12 April 2019 - 12:19 AM

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View PostGentlemansSausage, on 11 April 2019 - 09:26 PM, said:

The vehicles are unbalanced as f__k. And the artillery is the worst of all. Who came up with the stun mechanics? Whoever it was, he should be fired. Hey, Devs, I'll tell you what you did. Thanks to the stun effect and constant, although lower than before, damage, you've managed to make life more miserable for 12 out of 15 players each game. Years ago the arty was annoying, buy if you got hit, it was probably your fault. You didn't move, reposition fast enough. Now... You can just throw your keyboard away. It doesn't matter what you do. You'll eventualy get stunned. And then again. And again. And you can barely do anything about it, except camping.

All the changes you've promised recently won't change anything. And of course you will not roll the dice back and bring back the artillery like it was or nerf it to hell. Because that way you'd admit that you've made a mistake.

By the way. Artillery on lower tiers - that's the worst kind of overpowered vehicles.

 

Actually, I have a similar feeling. Years ago, when I first started to play WoT, arty would hit you only if you are camping / not moving or arty player was super lucky. For me, the current state of arty is a downgrade in both fun of playing arty and having it as an opponent.

Homer_J #4 Posted 12 April 2019 - 01:51 AM

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View PostGentlemansSausage, on 11 April 2019 - 09:26 PM, said:

 

Before I go further with this "everything that's wront with World of Tanks" post, let me give you a little bit of background. I've joined WoT in 2013. Between then and 2015, I've played some 25k games. Played for the F15 clan, when it was one of the top 5 clans, and was myself among 500 or so best players in Europe.

 

There's a guy works down the chip shop swears he's Elvis............

 

I don't suppose somewhere in that wall o text there's a clue to your real persona, if you have one of course and aren't just here to plug that other game.



NUKLEAR_SLUG #5 Posted 12 April 2019 - 03:30 AM

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View PostGentlemansSausage, on 11 April 2019 - 09:26 PM, said:

Do not make mistake, that this applies only to World of Tanks. World of Warships is exactly the same.

 

Yes, that torpedo gold spamming is utterly gamebreaking...



TankkiPoju #6 Posted 12 April 2019 - 06:31 AM

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Province map was brought back for the release of Italian tech tree, because the map is "Italian".

 

Not that it makes it any better. Terrible crap map.



Toni112007 #7 Posted 12 April 2019 - 06:53 AM

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Is it as bad as mines tho?

wsatnutter #8 Posted 12 April 2019 - 07:08 AM

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what do you mean you lost your account how did you lose it, also your right about province a dire piece of soggy sprout and some arty are op


 



Frostilicus #9 Posted 12 April 2019 - 07:13 AM

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TLDR

 

Poor quality flounce. Bye

 

767 (really)?


Edited by Frostilicus, 12 April 2019 - 07:13 AM.


Cobra6 #10 Posted 12 April 2019 - 07:36 AM

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I've been saying it for years:

While WoT has greatly increased the amount and quality of content, basic gameplay quality has actually only decreased over the years.

 

Basically the game has been dumbed down and many "features" like "Wet Soapstone Physics( tm)" have only made the overall gameplay experience worse.

 

Cobra 6



Jigabachi #11 Posted 12 April 2019 - 07:51 AM

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He complains about premammo, MM, maps and arty. Not in a very constructive way, but... yeah. Right on most points.

FrantisekBascovansky #12 Posted 12 April 2019 - 09:13 AM

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*yawn*

 

767

 

see you tomorrow



Ullakkomorko #13 Posted 12 April 2019 - 09:31 AM

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I bet here's a good dose of a (formerly) great player's frustration in not doing as good as he used to and making excuses for why that is happening.

Miepie #14 Posted 12 April 2019 - 09:31 AM

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View PostTankkiPoju, on 12 April 2019 - 06:31 AM, said:

Province map was brought back for the release of Italian tech tree, because the map is "Italian".

 

Not that it makes it any better. Terrible crap map.

 

...Oh. I always thought it was meant to represent places like Cannes, Saint-Tropez, Monaco but they just (deliberately or accidentally) misspelled Provence... :amazed:

krazypenguin #15 Posted 12 April 2019 - 09:35 AM

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As someone who recently returned to the game and started grinding 4 new lines from tier 1, on a standard account without using any Free XP to skip stuff, I'll throw in some observations.

 

I think prem ammo is already being addressed in the near future by reducing the amount of damage it will do - that's going to be an interesting change but my worry is that it will actually make highly armoured tanks slightly stronger.  People already spam prem ammo at them now, so in the future all that will happen is that they will take less damage from those shots, effectively making them stronger.

 

Arty stun mechanic is horrible and a big step backwards, IMO and even the upcoming changes won't really help.  Arty feels like it has a bigger area effect now so even misses stun you and take a sizeable chunk of your health at lower tiers - at higher tiers you still take massive damage from them.

 

Biggest issue as a "new player" though is tank balance at lower tiers.  I just reached tier 4 in three of my new lines and it's absolutely horrible.  There are seal clubbers and try-hard platoons in OP tier 4 tanks (Hetzers, Matildas, Luchs, etc...) everywhere and your stock tier 4 tank with a crappy crew cannot do anything - even (mostly) fully understanding the game mechanics I just cannot do anything.  Tier 4 stock guns using premium ammo will still bounce off of most reasonably armoured targets whilst your gun calibre is too small for HE to do anything.  And that's when you get lucky and get a tier 4 only game.  Good luck when you meet tier 5s and even tier 6s (the game where the enemy had an O-I - what was the point of our tier 4s being in that game?)

 

I really don't understand how new players get past tier 4 without quitting the game completely.


Edited by krazypenguin, 12 April 2019 - 09:37 AM.


Miepie #16 Posted 12 April 2019 - 10:02 AM

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View Postkrazypenguin, on 12 April 2019 - 09:35 AM, said:


 

 

I really don't understand how new players get past tier 4 without quitting the game completely.

 

Really? I quite liked most of the Tier 4 vehicles I played. The PzIIIJ, PzIVD, Hetzer, StuG IIIB, Marder 38T, A-20, T-28, M37...Still have them all, equipped and crewed for the occasional "No time for anything serious, but just enough time for one or two games between coming home from work and my evening plans". I feel optimistic about the unplayed ones in my garage as well: P26-40, Covenanter, Matilda, SU-85B, Birch Gun, AMX40, Pz38 nA… :great:


 

Though I must admit my first tier 4, the M3 Lee was quite dreadful. But that was also because of my lack of map knowledge, running it with a 50% crew and it being my first turretless vehicle. At the end of the grind, I mainly used it to lure tanks into the field of fire of our TDs since most players would lose all forms of tactics and logic when spotting an "easy kill" M3 [1]. Oh, and the DW2 was only acceptable because it was basically a slower PzIII (with even less armour, hahaha). And I skipped the B1 deliberately. :sceptic:

[1] Now that I'm more experienced, I am actually planning to just play through my Grant to get the Sherman III.



krazypenguin #17 Posted 12 April 2019 - 10:13 AM

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View PostMiepie, on 12 April 2019 - 09:02 AM, said:

 

Really?

 

 

 

Yes.  I'm not a hypocrite by the way - I also have several tier 4 tanks that I maintain, with reasonable crews, because I enjoy playing them - and I must be a nightmare for new players to meet when I'm playing my B2, Covenanter or Valentine II.  Ironically, though I haven't kept it, I really enjoyed the M3 Lee, I think it's a very underrated tank!


 

But go play a stock tier 4 Polish, Swedish (medium line), Italian or Czech tank, like a new player would, and see if you find the experience enjoyable.  You won't.  I know all the arguments (all stock tanks suck, tanks that are OP in their own tier are useless against tiers +1 and +2, crews matter, etc... etc...) but that doesn't change anything - if I wasn't an experienced player but a complete newbie, I honeslty don't think I would stick with the game once I hit tier 4.

 

 


Edited by krazypenguin, 12 April 2019 - 10:13 AM.


Miepie #18 Posted 12 April 2019 - 10:53 AM

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View Postkrazypenguin, on 12 April 2019 - 10:13 AM, said:

 

 

 

if I wasn't an experienced player but a complete newbie, I honeslty don't think I would stick with the game once I hit tier 4.

 

 

 

Well, speaking for myself: the light at the end of the tunnel was constantly visible because the grinds to either improve something (anything! Any progress counts for the reward centre of my brain :medal:) or reach a new tank weren't that long. And thanks to the Newbie Missions and first Campaign Missions you constantly get rewarded for things like "driving 100 metres without exploding" or "not disconnecting before the battle timer reaches 0". That's a nice distraction from your actual battle results. The amounts of "statpadding sealclubbers [1]" are high at all low tiers. About half of all players, it usually seems. But I think it says more about a low influx of new players, not necessarily that new players get driven away by it. They certainly are nice to have on your own team. If the are on the other team: ehrrr… my main cause of premature death is me. If I drive out foolishly it doesn't really matter if the tank(s) shooting me are played by newbies or super-Eggplants. :child:

 

[1] ...or just people who decided to drive any tank they feel like without any further dubious motivation.



Anthony_1972 #19 Posted 12 April 2019 - 11:29 AM

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The good thing about tier 4 is that is doesn't take very long to get out of stock configuration.  

 

What is really bad is that because new levels come so quick, your crews suffer a lot.   Either you spend an enormous amount of gold, and silver, or your crews just dwindle down to 50% in no time.   This is really unfair to the new player, who doesn't have much silver.   And asking so much gold to spend on the game is unfair considering that later on, it takes 100x longer for crew to get into a new vehicle, and thus 100x less cost.  



pecopad #20 Posted 12 April 2019 - 11:36 AM

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When was ever WOT a skill game, get a grip...

 

No good WoT player was any good playing anything else..WoT is the Olympics boccia.

Wot Is an old guys game, where by just not wearing any glasses and having full wrist movement you have a major advantage  over the majority of the population. Old guys game with a handful of pretenders that sealclub noobs in OP tanks with OP crews and run food at lower tiers and think they are great at gaming.

 

Go and play a real competitive game.... where they don't outline the targets, where you actually have to spot people and see where they are, where cammo is cammo, where you don't have RNG on everything.

 

And interesting that a former top 500 player is bitching about gold ammo advantage,like having the best tanks in the game has a CW rewards, best equipment,6 skill crews and playing in lower tier is a sign of skill...


Edited by pecopad, 12 April 2019 - 11:44 AM.





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