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US Wheeled Vehicle line Proposal!

US Wheeled Vehicles Wheeled Vehicles New Tanks Armoured Cars USA Tech tree addition New Mechanic Proposal Tech Tree Proposal Tech Tree

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oneshotraptor #21 Posted 14 April 2019 - 01:20 AM

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View PostBordhaw, on 13 April 2019 - 09:05 PM, said:

*edited*  

*edited*  

00:22 Added after 2 minutes

View Postcrnakoza, on 13 April 2019 - 07:14 PM, said:

Lav 600 was introduced in 1986. Are you serious? What's next? Bradley? Stryker?

That’s one of the problems with the proposal, there are very few US wheeled vehicles that are from the 70’s, 60’s etc that are capable of being the tier 9 and 10.

 

currently it’s what pulls the tree down tbf


Edited by Jahpero, 14 April 2019 - 09:22 AM.
This post has been edited by the moderation team due to off-topic.


7thSyndicate #22 Posted 14 April 2019 - 02:17 AM

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View Postfwhaatpiraat, on 13 April 2019 - 11:17 PM, said:

 

There is a difference between agressive gameplay and the ret4rded play style these (high tier) wheeled vehicles promote.

 

For example this: https://youtu.be/HmuiSm1I2YU?t=301 This guy just kept driving circles and zigzagging in enemy territory, solely relying on the fact that the vehicle is so incredibly hard to hit. Ofcourse this replay is cherrypicked, it actually got sent to me by a friend, but it shows how stupid the gameplay is. Just like SPGs being capable of hitting for 2k+ damage in the past, or the Bobject when it got introduced. It is not player skill ('agressive gameplay;) that determines the outcome.

 

I agree with this. there´s no skill needed to go full speed spot everyone and most of times get away with it because wheels eat shells, they turn full speed, do ridiculous jumps and never flip or slow down. This is just a joke.

_bitter_end_ #23 Posted 14 April 2019 - 07:14 AM

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Please no more wheeled infection in the game.

Jahpero #24 Posted 14 April 2019 - 09:27 AM

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Hello everyone, 

I removed some inappropriate post from this thread. 

Please remain constructive :)

 

I wish you a pleasant Sunday.
Jahpero



VonniVidiVici #25 Posted 14 April 2019 - 03:02 PM

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Considering how much "fun" the French wheeled vehicles bring to the game, I'm gonna go with hell naw.

smokeytheband1t #26 Posted 14 April 2019 - 03:12 PM

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Yes moar cars.. keep adding them until every tank that doesn't do 50-60 km/h minimum with zero ground resistance is rendered @%#@ obsolete

Laur_Balaur_XD #27 Posted 14 April 2019 - 03:27 PM

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View PostJahpero, on 14 April 2019 - 08:27 AM, said:

Hello everyone, 

I removed some inappropriate post from this thread. 

Please remain constructive :)

 

I wish you a pleasant Sunday.
Jahpero

 

Some time ago a topic about the decline in the number of players was removed from 'gameplay' section of the forum because it was referring at a youtube video of a CC (quickybaby). It did not even had the video in the original post, but it got moved to 'streams and videos' - and the explanation of the moderators was that it promoted a youtube channel/video in the wrong section.

 

Did the rules changed? We can post here topics with our youtube videos of how we play? Because that would be more related to 'gameplay' that proposing a new tank line...



Fizzymagic #28 Posted 14 April 2019 - 03:35 PM

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https://youtu.be/5eR8ughiKOQ

oneshotraptor #29 Posted 14 April 2019 - 10:42 PM

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View PostLaur_Balaur_XD, on 14 April 2019 - 02:27 PM, said:

 

Some time ago a topic about the decline in the number of players was removed from 'gameplay' section of the forum because it was referring at a youtube video of a CC (quickybaby). It did not even had the video in the original post, but it got moved to 'streams and videos' - and the explanation of the moderators was that it promoted a youtube channel/video in the wrong section.

 

Did the rules changed? We can post here topics with our youtube videos of how we play? Because that would be more related to 'gameplay' that proposing a new tank line...

 

I see where you are coming from, i posted the tech tree stuff here cos i didnt know where to post it. However, the tech tree stuff seems fine here :P

tajj7 #30 Posted 15 April 2019 - 10:52 AM

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View Postcrnakoza, on 13 April 2019 - 07:14 PM, said:

Lav 600 was introduced in 1986. Are you serious? What's next? Bradley? Stryker?

 

Its date of introduction is pretty irrelevant, its about the technology used, WG has basically drawn the line not at some random point in history but at basically smooth bore guns, composite armour and ATGMs. 

 

Basically stuff that 3rd generation MBTs had. 

 

So this WV basically ticks all the boxes to be in the game, the gun is basically the same gun the M48 Patton has, it has completely paper armour, no ATGMs. 

 

More wheeled vehicles would be good, but the bobs of the playerbase make too much fuss about it.

 

-----------------------------

 

View Postfwhaatpiraat, on 13 April 2019 - 11:17 PM, said:

View PostPervyPastryPuffer, on 13 April 2019 - 11:50 PM, said:

 

You just described aggressive gameplay, something I'm quite partial to.

 

There is a difference between agressive gameplay and the ret4rded play style these (high tier) wheeled vehicles promote.

 

For example this: https://youtu.be/HmuiSm1I2YU?t=301 This guy just kept driving circles and zigzagging in enemy territory, solely relying on the fact that the vehicle is so incredibly hard to hit. Ofcourse this replay is cherrypicked, it actually got sent to me by a friend, but it shows how stupid the gameplay is. Just like SPGs being capable of hitting for 2k+ damage in the past, or the Bobject when it got introduced. It is not player skill ('agressive gameplay' ) that determines the outcome.

 

 

But the T-100 lt replays like this (there is one with like the same spotting), where it basically sits in a bush for most of the game and then does the same ridgeline driving the EBR does in that game and gets absurd spotting, that is 'skill'?

 

Sitting in broken bushes is apparently 'skill'

 

But driving around using terrain and awareness, active spotting, that is not 'skill'? He takes advantage of an opportunity, two terrible teams there, but if the enemy team literally had anyone in the middle, he would have died easily. 

 

All your video highlights is dumb enemy players, which is what the wheeled vehicles generally exploit, good players counter these things hard, plus its on a map that massively suits it. Says very little about the actual class at all, which takes IMO a lot of skill to do consistently well in. Not top mention it just highlights how broken the concealment on the 1 line is that team's can surrender map control like that and don't suffer for it. 

 

I mean I still find hilarious that passive spotting is held up as some sort of beacon of good play, when I remember Foch went AFK in the Malinovka field and did 11k spotting whilst answering the door.

 

Literally any dumb player can sit in the OP bushes with binos and camo net in the current meta and his team's dumb players farm the enemy teams's even dumber players, but that is apparently not broken? But driving around in something fast, always being spotted, with bad view range, that is always at risk, that is someone broken?

 

Logic fail.  Wheeled vehicles are new, so of course they are broken, but because lights have passively sat close to afk for years in a bush farming huge assistance damage with little effort, that is all fine and dandy. 

 

Its literally two sides of the same coin. I find it weird people complain about the one they can actually see and shoot most of the time, instead of the one where they just get farmed by an invisible spotter they can do far less about.  

 


Edited by tajj7, 15 April 2019 - 11:03 AM.


adameitas #31 Posted 15 April 2019 - 11:36 AM

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View Postfwhaatpiraat, on 13 April 2019 - 11:17 PM, said:

 

There is a difference between agressive gameplay and the ret4rded play style these (high tier) wheeled vehicles promote.

 

For example this: https://youtu.be/HmuiSm1I2YU?t=301 This guy just kept driving circles and zigzagging in enemy territory, solely relying on the fact that the vehicle is so incredibly hard to hit. Ofcourse this replay is cherrypicked, it actually got sent to me by a friend, but it shows how stupid the gameplay is. Just like SPGs being capable of hitting for 2k+ damage in the past, or the Bobject when it got introduced. It is not player skill ('agressive gameplay' ) that determines the outcome.

 

but if it is the case why i see ebr 105 so rarely? And i usually play t8-10. Like already many times was said wheeled tanks are extreme hard to play and they dont have rng factor (apart very few open maps) like fv4005. Thats why we see then rarely and with time will see even more rarely. Sure in open maps like procho or campinovka you can have extreme good games and extreme annoy enemy but how often it happends? And to get those maps you need to "pass" maps like ensk or himmy. In general i dont think those tanks brake MM, i see them as tanks that can be played just for fun (like kv-2 or fv4005), we dont have many of those. But also i think  we dont need more wheeled tanks in game. We already have way too many lights in game. It is common thing to have like 5 scouts per team and thats bad. Most maps dont have place for more then 2-3 scouts to be useful also those tanks have low hp so not so rewarding. I still think wg did a mistake by adding t10 tds and lights game quality wise.

Robbie_T #32 Posted 15 April 2019 - 11:45 AM

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Looks nice but no....1 wheely is enough or already to much.

IF they make a wheely battleground/mode okay but not in the normal random games.

 


Edited by Robbie_T, 15 April 2019 - 11:45 AM.


etody77 #33 Posted 15 April 2019 - 11:51 AM

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Guys, if the game has cars, they must be german....

I want Puma in the game, old one, from WW2...

that cat dont require new game mechanics,

The germans have no cars in the game because they where russian bad dream in the past, maybe?

And...if we have cars, why not...Wheeled SPG too?

Like Ktzusha or Möbelwagen?



fwhaatpiraat #34 Posted 15 April 2019 - 02:37 PM

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View Posttajj7, on 15 April 2019 - 10:52 AM, said:

 

But the T-100 lt replays like this (there is one with like the same spotting), where it basically sits in a bush for most of the game and then does the same ridgeline driving the EBR does in that game and gets absurd spotting, that is 'skill'?

 

Sitting in broken bushes is apparently 'skill'

 

But driving around using terrain and awareness, active spotting, that is not 'skill'? He takes advantage of an opportunity, two terrible teams there, but if the enemy team literally had anyone in the middle, he would have died easily. 

 

All your video highlights is dumb enemy players, which is what the wheeled vehicles generally exploit, good players counter these things hard, plus its on a map that massively suits it. Says very little about the actual class at all, which takes IMO a lot of skill to do consistently well in. Not top mention it just highlights how broken the concealment on the 1 line is that team's can surrender map control like that and don't suffer for it. 

 

I mean I still find hilarious that passive spotting is held up as some sort of beacon of good play, when I remember Foch went AFK in the Malinovka field and did 11k spotting whilst answering the door.

 

Literally any dumb player can sit in the OP bushes with binos and camo net in the current meta and his team's dumb players farm the enemy teams's even dumber players, but that is apparently not broken? But driving around in something fast, always being spotted, with bad view range, that is always at risk, that is someone broken?

 

Logic fail.  Wheeled vehicles are new, so of course they are broken, but because lights have passively sat close to afk for years in a bush farming huge assistance damage with little effort, that is all fine and dandy. 

 

Its literally two sides of the same coin. I find it weird people complain about the one they can actually see and shoot most of the time, instead of the one where they just get farmed by an invisible spotter they can do far less about.  

 

 

I never said that sitting in a bush is 'skill' and I never will. Because it's not. Also, the 'OP bushes' from the past (like E1 on prok, mid bushes on malinovka and so on) are so well known nowadays, it gets blind fired alot. "Driving around, using the terrain and awareness" is one thing, the way the high tier wheelers behave is just way beyond that. The problem isn't straight line speed, it's the speed of zigzagging and turning. They (ebr 90 and 105) can do a tight 360 degree turn in less than half a second. You don't need to be good to avoid getting hit in those things, which is shown all the time in battles. Ofcourse often they die also die uselessly, just like SPGs do, or FV4005s. It's a hit and miss, literally.

 

If it is possible to drive around behind enemy lines, always spotted, without getting killed, something just is wrong. Just play elc even 90, t92 or stuff like that in Frontlines, those wheelers destroy such tanks easily, while hitting them is really hard while they just go 'davai' with HE shells, there is a reason why those wheelers are so popular in FL, and it's not hard to see they replaced many light tanks. At the same time they also face many tanks like lt-432, progetto and other strong tanks, so balance is a myth anyway.

 

Another example, me playing the Rhm pzw (great tank lol) and the amx 13-105. The way these tanks get stomped by an ebr 105 is insane, the difference in gun handling and mobility ruin it totally for the regular tier x light tanks (maybe not for the russian one, don't know). Getting a full 13-105 clip into an ebr is very rare. In 5.5 seconds they can get away so quickly and the bad gun handling and shell velocity make it even more unlikely to shoot him.

 

Stop the stuff about passive spotting please, I never mentioned that. I just mentioned that the insane mobility ruins the fun for other players. Just like arty does for example. I have to admit, many occasions in my light tanks, I just don't care anymore when some wheeled vehicle rushes me. I just shrug and go to the next battle basically Just like when the Bobject got into the game. Edit: or platoons of 430Us or 907s going 'w mode', hull down super conquerors locking maps down, Type 5 heavies in choke points, etc. It is not fun to face them because they cannot be countered properly.

 

 

 

View Postadameitas, on 15 April 2019 - 11:36 AM, said:

 

but if it is the case why i see ebr 105 so rarely? And i usually play t8-10. Like already many times was said wheeled tanks are extreme hard to play and they dont have rng factor (apart very few open maps) like fv4005. Thats why we see then rarely and with time will see even more rarely. Sure in open maps like procho or campinovka you can have extreme good games and extreme annoy enemy but how often it happends? And to get those maps you need to "pass" maps like ensk or himmy. In general i dont think those tanks brake MM, i see them as tanks that can be played just for fun (like kv-2 or fv4005), we dont have many of those. But also i think  we dont need more wheeled tanks in game. We already have way too many lights in game. It is common thing to have like 5 scouts per team and thats bad. Most maps dont have place for more then 2-3 scouts to be useful also those tanks have low hp so not so rewarding. I still think wg did a mistake by adding t10 tds and lights game quality wise.

Maybe because it still is new, in the game for like 2 months or so? Also you don't need to have 5 of those to ruin the game for the other side by driving between all enemy spg's, td's, not even mentioning how they can screw over light tanks.


Edited by fwhaatpiraat, 15 April 2019 - 02:45 PM.


tajj7 #35 Posted 15 April 2019 - 03:06 PM

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View Postfwhaatpiraat, on 15 April 2019 - 01:37 PM, said:

 

I never said that sitting in a bush is 'skill' and I never will. Because it's not. Also, the 'OP bushes' from the past (like E1 on prok, mid bushes on malinovka and so on) are so well known nowadays, it gets blind fired alot. "Driving around, using the terrain and awareness" is one thing, the way the high tier wheelers behave is just way beyond that. The problem isn't straight line speed, it's the speed of zigzagging and turning. They (ebr 90 and 105) can do a tight 360 degree turn in less than half a second. You don't need to be good to avoid getting hit in those things, which is shown all the time in battles. Ofcourse often they die also die uselessly, just like SPGs do, or FV4005s. It's a hit and miss, literally.

 

If it is possible to drive around behind enemy lines, always spotted, without getting killed, something just is wrong. Just play elc even 90, t92 or stuff like that in Frontlines, those wheelers destroy such tanks easily, while hitting them is really hard while they just go 'davai' with HE shells, there is a reason why those wheelers are so popular in FL, and it's not hard to see they replaced many light tanks. At the same time they also face many tanks like lt-432, progetto and other strong tanks, so balance is a myth anyway.

 

Another example, me playing the Rhm pzw (great tank lol) and the amx 13-105. The way these tanks get stomped by an ebr 105 is insane, the difference in gun handling and mobility ruin it totally for the regular tier x light tanks (maybe not for the russian one, don't know). Getting a full 13-105 clip into an ebr is very rare. In 5.5 seconds they can get away so quickly and the bad gun handling and shell velocity make it even more unlikely to shoot him.

 

 

Maybe because it still is new, in the game for like 2 months or so? Also you don't need to have 5 of those to ruin the game for the other side by driving between all enemy spg's, td's, not even mentioning how they can screw over light tanks.

 

I didn't say you did, but you highlighted a massive spotting game on Prohk, and yet the exact same thing can be done on Prohk with lights, often passive spotting, or even active spotting if the enemy team is dumb enough. Your replay showed very little about WV, it just highlighted bad players being farmed and how bad the 1 line is on Prohk for digging out campers.

 

I just find it a funny comparison that 23k spotting damage by driving about fast and using terrain against two dumb teams is 'broken' but a light basically doing the same just with more passive play and less active play, no one blinks an eye, I have seen multiple massive T-100 lt spotting games on Prohk, I see no one claiming its broken or game breaking. 

 

Block Quote

  "Driving around, using the terrain and awareness" is one thing, the way the high tier wheelers behave is just way beyond that. The problem isn't straight line speed, it's the speed of zigzagging and turning. They (ebr 90 and 105) can do a tight 360 degree turn in less than half a second. You don't need to be good to avoid getting hit in those things, which is shown all the time in battles

 

 

Yes you do, trust me as I have played the tier 10 and you can't just drive around in the open hoping to not get hit, especially at tier 10m where everyone has 1,500 m/s APCR and half the tanks have virtually zero turret bloom. You have to plan your routes, you have to pop up at the right moments unexpected and limit your exposure as much as possible. 

 

Block Quote

 If it is possible to drive around behind enemy lines, always spotted, without getting killed, something just is wrong. Just play elc even 90, t92 or stuff like that in Frontlines, those wheelers destroy such tanks easily,

 

 

 

We have had lights for years drive into bases and shoot at arty and 1 in 100 get away it for more than about 30s, WVs generally doing the same, might last slightly longer, but generally don't get away with it.

 

Pretty much all I play in frontlines is LT-432, HWK-30 and M41D, I find they are more effective than the EBR and I don't have much issue with WVs.

 

Which is the problem I have with all this hysteria about them, I play lights, I have no trouble with WVs, I don't see this 'dance through the whole enemy team' thing happen, I play WVs, lights don't often have issues dealing with me and I when I try to dance through fire, I die.

 

So what people are claiming is not my experience from both sides. 

 

Block Quote

 Another example, me playing the Rhm pzw (great tank lol) and the amx 13-105. The way these tanks get stomped by an ebr 105 is insane, the difference in gun handling and mobility ruin it totally for the regular tier x light tanks (maybe not for the russian one, don't know). Getting a full 13-105 clip into an ebr is very rare. In 5.5 seconds they can get away so quickly and the bad gun handling and shell velocity make it even more unlikely to shoot him.

 

Rhm. is awful and 13-105 is not much better, but again, even Claus Kellerman managed to outplay an EBR played a by a good player in his RHm. just through adjusting his tactics. 

 

EBRs don't fight 13-105s or RHms. games are not decided by that, you have to fight IS7s, 430Us, Type5 s, Progettos, Obj. 260s, 4005s, arty that hit you at 95kph with their 3 mile splash radius, tanks you either cant ever pen or that have guns that one shot you or easily hit you, or all 3. 

 

Tier 10 lights are in a bad spot generally, but hardly the EBRs fault, just because they are bad, the EBR shouldn't have to be, plus the T-100 can easily outplay an EBR.

 

Block Quote

 Stop the stuff about passive spotting please, I never mentioned that. I just mentioned that the insane mobility ruins the fun for other players. Just like arty does for example. I have to admit, many occasions in my light tanks, I just don't care anymore when some wheeled vehicle rushes me. I just shrug and go to the next battle basically Just like when the Bobject got into the game. It is not fun to face them.

 

 

My comment about the passive spotting was in relation to your video, pointing out that its just as easily done if not easily done in light tanks at much lower risk.

 

You think it ruins the fun, well IMO they don't, they are IMO hard to play, they bring something different to the game, they break camps which are a bane of high tier play right now, they get arty killed early which is great as well and they are easily outplayable.

 

Point is my practical experience with them and against them does not reflect what people claim about them. 



SoupFork #36 Posted 16 April 2019 - 04:17 AM

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What we really need is wheeled heavies. Like a Maus doing 70kp/h.

This will make heavies very hard to hit by arty, so there’ll be less crying on the forums.

This will make heavies very hard to hit by TDs, so there’ll be less crying on the forums.

This will make heavies very hard to flank, so there’ll be less crying on the forums.

This will make heavies very easy to Yolo, so there’ll be a lot more crying In game.



MeetriX #37 Posted 16 April 2019 - 08:04 AM

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View PostWindSplitter1, on 13 April 2019 - 09:31 PM, said:

 

Lots of tanks slap you for 750 HP. How is it OK to have vehicles that shoot under 240HP? They are broken and ruin the game.

Lots of tanks have 250mm+ Armour. How is it OK to have vehicles with under 25mm? They are broken and ruin the game.

Lots of tanks shoot over cover. How is it OK to have vehicles that don't? They are broken and ruin the game.

Lots of tanks have 3 shell types. How is it OK to have vehicles with 2 or lower? They are broken and ruin the game.

Lots of tanks have ventilation access. How is it OK to have vehicles that don't? They are broken and ruin the game.

Lots of tanks have standard penetration below 300mm. How is it OK to have vehicles that do? They are broken and ruin the game.

Lots of tanks have poor camo. How is it OK for others have it above average? They are broken and ruin the game.

Lots of tanks have low HP. How is it OK for others have twice of theirs? They are broken and ruin the game.

 

You see where this is going? :rolleyes:

You can still counter them somehow, but cars are different.

Their main thing is speed. How you counter speed? If you are lucky (good) you can hit them but not stop them. Wheels might wobble but they can still drive slowly 60km/h to safety.



ValkyrionX #38 Posted 16 April 2019 - 08:11 AM

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how about no? 

WindSplitter1 #39 Posted 16 April 2019 - 09:00 PM

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View PostMeetriX, on 16 April 2019 - 07:04 AM, said:

You can still counter them somehow, but cars are different.

Their main thing is speed. How you counter speed? If you are lucky (good) you can hit them but not stop them. Wheels might wobble but they can still drive slowly 60km/h to safety.

 

Speed is their main selling point.

 

I can tell you, as I have played with and against them, I have no issues hitting and damaging them, as players also don't have any issues knocking me down when I'm playing one. They do have counters. Plenty of them.






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