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winrate is not a reflection of player skill


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cheapbooks_USA #1 Posted 17 April 2019 - 01:06 PM

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if winrate were truly a measure of player skill, then:

 

all AFK tanks would have a 0% winrate. because there is no player skill. but they don't, they have a 38% winrate

all your tanks in your garage would have the exact same winrate. but they don't, because the tank you play impacts your win rate

- there is no reason to use ammo, equipment, module research, consumables, directives, crew skills, or crew training beyond 50%. because these things are not player skill, so they would have no effect on winrate

there would be no such thing as "pay to win" in the game. pay to win is not player skill, so it would have no impact on winrate

- you should not fear gold ammo. if winrate were only player skill, then gold ammo would have 0 affect in the game

- you would never do any spotting damage, and all your damage and kills would only be on tanks that you spot yourself, because otherwise there would be teamwork, which is not individual player skill

- there would be no such thing as passive scouting, because a player with 0 skill is still able to passively scout (such as an AFK player at the base who passively scouts for the team)

access to information in the game, such as the minimap, would have no affect on the game. before any tank on the enemy team is spotted, there is no way to know or accurately predict what the enemy team will do for defense or offense. your player skill would allow you to win the game even without having any knowledge of where the enemy team is.

players in South America would have the same number of unicums as players playing in North America on the NA server, and would not be all tomatoes

- teams of SPGs, such as 15 SPGs, would have a 50% winrate against teams of 15 non-SPGs. teams of 15 LTs would have a 50% winrate against teams of 15 HTs

the matchmaker would always be balanced, because the MM would have no impact on winrate

all maps would always be balanced

- you would be able to play SPG with no minimap, with no radio, because you would not need your team to spot for you

running XVM would not improve your game

 

so if you believe that high winrate means you are a better player, then:

- you never complain about other players using gold rounds

- you don't run XVM because other player skill has no impact on your player skill

- you never complain about OP tanks

- you never complain about being on a fail team

- you never complain about pay to win

- you never research modules

- you never complain about the matchmaker

- you never complain about being bottom tier

- you never complain about losing all day or having 10 losses in a row

- you never complain about a map being unbalanced, or about being on the worse spawn

- you do not complain that your allies need to spot when you are playing SPG

- you never pay for consumables

- you don't use ammo

- you don't buy equipment

- you don't need bonds or directives

- you don't complain that bonds give an unfair advantage allowing the best players to be even better by buying better equipment

- you never call LATAM players tomatos strictly because they play with high ping times

- you never complain that you can't pen an enemy tank

- you never complain that wheeled vehicles are too fast

 

I never complain about any of the things above. 



jabster #2 Posted 17 April 2019 - 01:09 PM

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View Postcheapbooks_USA, on 17 April 2019 - 12:06 PM, said:

if winrate were truly a measure of player skill, then:

 

all AFK tanks would have a 0% winrate. because there is no player skill. but they don't, they have a 38% winrate

all your tanks in your garage would have the exact same winrate. but they don't, because the tank you play impacts your win rate

- there is no reason to use ammo, equipment, module research, consumables, directives, crew skills, or crew training beyond 50%. because these things are not player skill, so they would have no effect on winrate

there would be no such thing as "pay to win" in the game. pay to win is not player skill, so it would have no impact on winrate

- you should not fear gold ammo. if winrate were only player skill, then gold ammo would have 0 affect in the game

- you would never do any spotting damage, and all your damage and kills would only be on tanks that you spot yourself, because otherwise there would be teamwork, which is not individual player skill

- there would be no such thing as passive scouting, because a player with 0 skill is still able to passively scout (such as an AFK player at the base who passively scouts for the team)

access to information in the game, such as the minimap, would have no affect on the game. before any tank on the enemy team is spotted, there is no way to know or accurately predict what the enemy team will do for defense or offense. your player skill would allow you to win the game even without having any knowledge of where the enemy team is.

players in South America would have the same number of unicums as players playing in North America on the NA server, and would not be all tomatoes

- teams of SPGs, such as 15 SPGs, would have a 50% winrate against teams of 15 non-SPGs. teams of 15 LTs would have a 50% winrate against teams of 15 HTs

the matchmaker would always be balanced, because the MM would have no impact on winrate

all maps would always be balanced

- you would be able to play SPG with no minimap, with no radio, because you would not need your team to spot for you

running XVM would not improve your game

 

so if you believe that high winrate means you are a better player, then:

- you never complain about other players using gold rounds

- you don't run XVM because other player skill has no impact on your player skill

- you never complain about OP tanks

- you never complain about being on a fail team

- you never complain about pay to win

- you never research modules

- you never complain about the matchmaker

- you never complain about being bottom tier

- you never complain about losing all day or having 10 losses in a row

- you never complain about a map being unbalanced, or about being on the worse spawn

- you do not complain that your allies need to spot when you are playing SPG

- you never pay for consumables

- you don't use ammo

- you don't buy equipment

- you don't need bonds or directives

- you don't complain that bonds give an unfair advantage allowing the best players to be even better by buying better equipment

- you never call LATAM players tomatos strictly because they play with high ping times

- you never complain that you can't pen an enemy tank

- you never complain that wheeled vehicles are too fast

 

I never complain about any of the things above. 

 

And the point you’re trying to make is?

MeetriX #3 Posted 17 April 2019 - 01:13 PM

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Spam account on every server is a true skill measure.

Jauhesammutin #4 Posted 17 April 2019 - 01:14 PM

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View Postcheapbooks_USA, on 17 April 2019 - 12:06 PM, said:

if winrate were truly a measure of player skill, then:

 

all AFK tanks would have a 0% winrate. because there is no player skill. but they don't, they have a 38% winrate

all your tanks in your garage would have the exact same winrate. but they don't, because the tank you play impacts your win rate

- there is no reason to use ammo, equipment, module research, consumables, directives, crew skills, or crew training beyond 50%. because these things are not player skill, so they would have no effect on winrate

there would be no such thing as "pay to win" in the game. pay to win is not player skill, so it would have no impact on winrate

- you should not fear gold ammo. if winrate were only player skill, then gold ammo would have 0 affect in the game

- you would never do any spotting damage, and all your damage and kills would only be on tanks that you spot yourself, because otherwise there would be teamwork, which is not individual player skill

- there would be no such thing as passive scouting, because a player with 0 skill is still able to passively scout (such as an AFK player at the base who passively scouts for the team)

access to information in the game, such as the minimap, would have no affect on the game. before any tank on the enemy team is spotted, there is no way to know or accurately predict what the enemy team will do for defense or offense. your player skill would allow you to win the game even without having any knowledge of where the enemy team is.

players in South America would have the same number of unicums as players playing in North America on the NA server, and would not be all tomatoes

- teams of SPGs, such as 15 SPGs, would have a 50% winrate against teams of 15 non-SPGs. teams of 15 LTs would have a 50% winrate against teams of 15 HTs

the matchmaker would always be balanced, because the MM would have no impact on winrate

all maps would always be balanced

- you would be able to play SPG with no minimap, with no radio, because you would not need your team to spot for you

running XVM would not improve your game

 

so if you believe that high winrate means you are a better player, then:

- you never complain about other players using gold rounds

- you don't run XVM because other player skill has no impact on your player skill

- you never complain about OP tanks

- you never complain about being on a fail team

- you never complain about pay to win

- you never research modules

- you never complain about the matchmaker

- you never complain about being bottom tier

- you never complain about losing all day or having 10 losses in a row

- you never complain about a map being unbalanced, or about being on the worse spawn

- you do not complain that your allies need to spot when you are playing SPG

- you never pay for consumables

- you don't use ammo

- you don't buy equipment

- you don't need bonds or directives

- you don't complain that bonds give an unfair advantage allowing the best players to be even better by buying better equipment

- you never call LATAM players tomatos strictly because they play with high ping times

- you never complain that you can't pen an enemy tank

- you never complain that wheeled vehicles are too fast

 

I never complain about any of the things above. 

 

Go back to NA servers, you're drunk.

cheapbooks_USA #5 Posted 17 April 2019 - 01:19 PM

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you said: "And the point you’re trying to make is? "

 

my point is: "winrate is not a reflection of player skill"

 

thankyou



Miepie #6 Posted 17 April 2019 - 01:19 PM

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View Postjabster, on 17 April 2019 - 01:09 PM, said:

 

And the point you’re trying to make is?

 

"so if you believe that high winrate means you are a better player, then: you never complain about [things].

I never complain about any of the things above."

 

There's his point: he believes high WR means you are a better player.

 

Though to be fair, I had expected this profoundness to have at the very least included a link to a YouTube or Twitch channel of the OP.



ThinGun #7 Posted 17 April 2019 - 01:21 PM

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He makes a number of reasonable points.  I feel the same way - I measure my progress by WN8, not WR.

 

But, it goes against the current meta of the forum, so it is therefore an invalid opinion.



Nishi_Kinuyo #8 Posted 17 April 2019 - 01:22 PM

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All I can say is this:



LittleLara #9 Posted 17 April 2019 - 01:26 PM

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So winning games doesn't need skill? Alright then. Guess it's all just random who wins and not who played the best, but rather who has the best tanks or whatever point you were trying to make.

vasilinhorulezz #10 Posted 17 April 2019 - 01:27 PM

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View Postcheapbooks_USA, on 17 April 2019 - 01:06 PM, said:

if winrate were truly a measure of player skill, then:

 

all AFK tanks would have a 0% winrate. because there is no player skill. but they don't, they have a 38% winrate

all your tanks in your garage would have the exact same winrate. but they don't, because the tank you play impacts your win rate

- there is no reason to use ammo, equipment, module research, consumables, directives, crew skills, or crew training beyond 50%. because these things are not player skill, so they would have no effect on winrate

there would be no such thing as "pay to win" in the game. pay to win is not player skill, so it would have no impact on winrate

- you should not fear gold ammo. if winrate were only player skill, then gold ammo would have 0 affect in the game

- you would never do any spotting damage, and all your damage and kills would only be on tanks that you spot yourself, because otherwise there would be teamwork, which is not individual player skill

- there would be no such thing as passive scouting, because a player with 0 skill is still able to passively scout (such as an AFK player at the base who passively scouts for the team)

access to information in the game, such as the minimap, would have no affect on the game. before any tank on the enemy team is spotted, there is no way to know or accurately predict what the enemy team will do for defense or offense. your player skill would allow you to win the game even without having any knowledge of where the enemy team is.

players in South America would have the same number of unicums as players playing in North America on the NA server, and would not be all tomatoes

- teams of SPGs, such as 15 SPGs, would have a 50% winrate against teams of 15 non-SPGs. teams of 15 LTs would have a 50% winrate against teams of 15 HTs

the matchmaker would always be balanced, because the MM would have no impact on winrate

all maps would always be balanced

- you would be able to play SPG with no minimap, with no radio, because you would not need your team to spot for you

running XVM would not improve your game

 

so if you believe that high winrate means you are a better player, then:

- you never complain about other players using gold rounds

- you don't run XVM because other player skill has no impact on your player skill

- you never complain about OP tanks

- you never complain about being on a fail team

- you never complain about pay to win

- you never research modules

- you never complain about the matchmaker

- you never complain about being bottom tier

- you never complain about losing all day or having 10 losses in a row

- you never complain about a map being unbalanced, or about being on the worse spawn

- you do not complain that your allies need to spot when you are playing SPG

- you never pay for consumables

- you don't use ammo

- you don't buy equipment

- you don't need bonds or directives

- you don't complain that bonds give an unfair advantage allowing the best players to be even better by buying better equipment

- you never call LATAM players tomatos strictly because they play with high ping times

- you never complain that you can't pen an enemy tank

- you never complain that wheeled vehicles are too fast

 

I never complain about any of the things above. 

 

Re-roll ain't going as expected?

Baldrickk #11 Posted 17 April 2019 - 01:27 PM

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Let's start from the beginning

View Postcheapbooks_USA, on 17 April 2019 - 01:06 PM, said:

if winrate were truly a measure of player skill, then:

 

all AFK tanks would have a 0% winrate. because there is no player skill. but they don't, they have a 38% winrate

 

And that's as far as I'm willing to read this wall of text. 

 

If someone can't see that having 14 other people on your team affects your win rate, well, fail at the first hurdle. 

 

 

 


jabster #12 Posted 17 April 2019 - 01:29 PM

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View PostMiepie, on 17 April 2019 - 12:19 PM, said:

 

"so if you believe that high winrate means you are a better player, then: you never complain about [things].

I never complain about any of the things above."

 

There's his point: he believes high WR means you are a better player.

 

Though to be fair, I had expected this profoundness to have at the very least included a link to a YouTube or Twitch channel of the OP.

 

I was also somewhat surprised that there wasn’t a YT link.
12:31 Added after 1 minute

View PostBaldrickk, on 17 April 2019 - 12:27 PM, said:

Let's start from the beginning

And that's as far as I'm willing to read this wall of text. 

 

If someone can't see that having 14 other people on your team affects your win rate, well, fail at the first hurdle. 

 

 

 

I did get to point two before just skim reading.

SuedKAT #13 Posted 17 April 2019 - 01:31 PM

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View Postcheapbooks_USA, on 17 April 2019 - 01:19 PM, said:

you said: "And the point you’re trying to make is? "

 

my point is: "winrate is not a reflection of player skill"

 

thankyou

 

So is that why all players with low overall stats also have a low win rate and all players with high overall stats have a high win rate, ohh no wait, since that's the case it must be that the ones that are more skilled win more, ohh who would have guessed that.

duijm #14 Posted 17 April 2019 - 01:32 PM

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View Postcheapbooks_USA, on 17 April 2019 - 12:06 PM, said:

if winrate were truly a measure of player skill, then:

 

all AFK tanks would have a 0% winrate. because there is no player skill. but they don't, they have a 38% winrate .   Well no...it is a 15 vs 15 game.  So even AFK players get carried by the rest of there team.

all your tanks in your garage would have the exact same winrate. but they don't, because the tank you play impacts your win rate No. Because we are not playing the same in different tanks. We also dont play 1000+ battles in every tank. Also some tanks are more OP.  Example: I am bad in arty and good in mediums.

- there is no reason to use ammo, equipment, module research, consumables, directives, crew skills, or crew training beyond 50%. because these things are not player skill, so they would have no effect on winrate Wrong again.  All these things makes your tank better and so your winrate.

there would be no such thing as "pay to win" in the game. pay to win is not player skill, so it would have no impact on winrate Well I agree on this point. Only OP premium tanks are pay to win.

- you should not fear gold ammo. if winrate were only player skill, then gold ammo would have 0 affect in the game Premium ammo has some (little) inpact.

- you would never do any spotting damage, and all your damage and kills would only be on tanks that you spot yourself, because otherwise there would be teamwork, which is not individual player skill. No...spotting damage wins games!!

- there would be no such thing as passive scouting, because a player with 0 skill is still able to passively scout (such as an AFK player at the base who passively scouts for the team) Wrong. Passive scouting is not done by camping in base.

access to information in the game, such as the minimap, would have no affect on the game. before any tank on the enemy team is spotted, there is no way to know or accurately predict what the enemy team will do for defense or offense. your player skill would allow you to win the game even without having any knowledge of where the enemy team is. Wrong. Minimap is most important!  Because any good player bases his actions on info from the minimap.

players in South America would have the same number of unicums as players playing in North America on the NA server, and would not be all tomatoes. ???????

- teams of SPGs, such as 15 SPGs, would have a 50% winrate against teams of 15 non-SPGs. teams of 15 LTs would have a 50% winrate against teams of 15 HTs Complete nonsence

the matchmaker would always be balanced, because the MM would have no impact on winrate. No it wont. Balancing teams would make everybody win 49%. Over 1000 battles we do all get the same teams and does our influence count.

all maps would always be balanced Well that is impossible if you want some variantion in maps....and not exact mirror maps.

- you would be able to play SPG with no minimap, with no radio, because you would not need your team to spot for you Complete nonsence

running XVM would not improve your game. Nonsence.  Every info you can get can improve your winrate if you use it correctly.

 

so if you believe that high winrate means you are a better player, then:

- you never complain about other players using gold rounds  I dont

- you don't run XVM because other player skill has no impact on your player skill. Nonsence because XVM gives an advantage.

- you never complain about OP tanks Nonsence....Op tanks boost your winrate.

- you never complain about being on a fail team I dont

- you never complain about pay to win I dont

- you never research modules Nonsence

- you never complain about the matchmaker I dont

- you never complain about being bottom tier I dont

- you never complain about losing all day or having 10 losses in a row I dont

- you never complain about a map being unbalanced, or about being on the worse spawn I dont

- you do not complain that your allies need to spot when you are playing SPG Nonsence

- you never pay for consumables Nonsence

- you don't use ammo Nonsence

- you don't buy equipment Nonsence

- you don't need bonds or directives I dont

- you don't complain that bonds give an unfair advantage allowing the best players to be even better by buying better equipment I dont

- you never call LATAM players tomatos strictly because they play with high ping times Or are just real noobs?!

- you never complain that you can't pen an enemy tank I dont

- you never complain that wheeled vehicles are too fast I dont

 

I never complain about any of the things above.  I dont believe you because why else this silly topic?

 

A lot of nonsence.

jimbobjammybob #15 Posted 17 April 2019 - 01:42 PM

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This is why the wall is taking so long.

_PanzerBitterbal_ #16 Posted 17 April 2019 - 01:57 PM

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View Postcheapbooks_USA, on 17 April 2019 - 01:19 PM, said:

you said: "And the point you’re trying to make is? "

 

my point is: "winrate is not a reflection of player skill"

 

thankyou

 

Says the man with 250 battles..........:child:

barison1 #17 Posted 17 April 2019 - 02:01 PM

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45%ers are as skilled as 60%ers confirmed

Bora_BOOM #18 Posted 17 April 2019 - 02:03 PM

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View Postcheapbooks_USA, on 17 April 2019 - 12:19 PM, said:

you said: "And the point you’re trying to make is? "

 

my point is: "winrate is not a reflection of player skill"

 

thankyou

 

Yeah, it does not! You are damn right!

 

 

He is better than you 3x, I will repeat it in writing - THREE TIMES! .... In everything he does.

It has nothing to do with skill, he is just lucky. He is so lucky that he does more alone than 3 average players every battle.

Basically, his team always has "2 players more" and that is not enough 4 times out of 10. You are right, it does not reflect. It only shows how majority of players suck in this game.

 

And his winrate is only 1,2x higher than yours!

Yes, it does not reflect, you are right.

He should have 150% wr.

 

:facepalm:


Edited by Bora_BOOM, 17 April 2019 - 02:18 PM.


FrantisekBascovansky #19 Posted 17 April 2019 - 02:19 PM

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View Post_PanzerBitterbal_, on 17 April 2019 - 01:57 PM, said:

 

Says the man with 250 battles..........:child:

 

Guy has 38k battles on NA server and posted exact same topic to NA forums, receiving almost same replies as here.

 

http://forum.worldof...f-player-skill/



mpf1959 #20 Posted 17 April 2019 - 02:22 PM

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winrate is not a reflection of player skill

 

I agree, and unless you are a player that can guarantee to kill many enemies in every game, your win-rate is in the hands of many other people each game, a.k.a your "team". And surely only the most spectacularly demented individuals can believe it is a team in the real sense of the word.

 

Also, more evidentially (for me anyway) is this, I have tanks where my win-rate is 60%, but my performance in them, as indicated in the average exp per game, is mediocre at best. They are what I call "lucky tanks". I also have "unlucky tanks" tanks where my performance is much better, as indicated in the average exp per game, that can have a win-rate of around 40%.

 

To the professional forum casuist, this will likely be anathema! :teethhappy:


Edited by mpf1959, 17 April 2019 - 02:24 PM.





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